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Old 2013-04-07, 10:34   Link #41
Kyero Fox
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What's to say the new Xbox won't have a awesome wireless internet connection built in? ......./snicker yea right.
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Old 2013-04-07, 10:44   Link #42
GDB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Please, do tell me what PS4 can't do that Always online Durango can?
Prevent the sale of used games, duh!
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Old 2013-04-07, 13:46   Link #43
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Prevent the sale of used games, duh!
PS4 can still do that too, it would just depend on the game developer enforcing it via software.
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Old 2013-04-07, 14:08   Link #44
GDB
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The PS4 merely mitigates the sale of used games! The Durango takes it out back and shoots it in the face!

[/sarcasm]
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Old 2013-04-07, 14:13   Link #45
Sides
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Hoe does that make any sense? If a game studio wants online components essential for their games, PS4 isn't going to stop them. You are completely missing the difference between "online-capable" and "online-requirement".

Please, do tell me what PS4 can't do that Always online Durango can?
Ehh?
If a studio wants their game only able to run, only if a connection is present, sony/ps4 won't stop them. My point is that, both consoles will end up being the same, for the western market.
Obviously most people will think, why develop for the xbox in the first place, if the ps4 is a better alternative for consumers. If MS can offer those publishers, no secondhand/resell of software on the consumer side, forwarding of personal information for marketing purpose and help with advertising, those simple moneyhatting offers, will be good enough reason for some to use the xbox as a main platform. Of course some titles will be make there way to the ps4 as well, but those studios will likely ask sony for similar features. They can either play ball or get sidelined, like what is happening to nintendo and to sega/dreamcast in the past. You can offer third parties open systems, but if you cannot offer them support as the competitor do, they will just leave.

Japan on the other hand is different, I don't think an always on console/games will be tolerated, as the secondhand market is huge over there, as far as in know. But then again is not like MS will be able to break into the japanese market anyways.
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Old 2013-04-07, 14:27   Link #46
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Originally Posted by Sides View Post
Ehh?
If a studio wants their game only able to run, only if a connection is present, sony/ps4 won't stop them. My point is that, both consoles will end up being the same, for the western market.
Obviously most people will think, why develop for the xbox in the first place, if the ps4 is a better alternative for consumers. If MS can offer those publishers, no secondhand/resell of software on the consumer side, forwarding of personal information for marketing purpose and help with advertising, those simple moneyhatting offers, will be good enough reason for some to use the xbox as a main platform. Of course some titles will be make there way to the ps4 as well, but those studios will likely ask sony for similar features. They can either play ball or get sidelined, like what is happening to nintendo and to sega/dreamcast in the past. You can offer third parties open systems, but if you cannot offer them support as the competitor do, they will just leave.

Japan on the other hand is different, I don't think an always on console/games will be tolerated, as the secondhand market is huge over there, as far as in know. But then again is not like MS will be able to break into the japanese market anyways.
You are skipping the much bigger issue of adoption rate. A console developer's ability to bargain is based on how many people having it in their homes. It doesn't matter if a console blocks resale of games, if it doesn't have a big enough group of users.

Durango having less sales than PS4 = PS4 have more gamers to sell games to.

It is very easy to have no 2nd hand sales of a game, if no one is buying your game to begin with due to not willing to buy the console.
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Old 2013-04-07, 15:10   Link #47
Sides
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
You are skipping the much bigger issue of adoption rate. A console developer's ability to bargain is based on how many people having it in their homes. It doesn't matter if a console blocks resale of games, if it doesn't have a big enough group of users.
But it doesn't matter what the adoption rate of the next xbox is, if one consoles introduces these anti-consumer methods and gets away, the other ones will follow. For example if FIFA is being release on the xbox, the ps4 version will have either an EA developed online always DRM or sony will introduce one for them. So in the end both consoles will be the same, and the people who lose out, are the gamers.
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Old 2013-04-07, 15:49   Link #48
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Originally Posted by Sides View Post
But it doesn't matter what the adoption rate of the next xbox is, if one consoles introduces these anti-consumer methods and gets away, the other ones will follow. For example if FIFA is being release on the xbox, the ps4 version will have either an EA developed online always DRM or sony will introduce one for them. So in the end both consoles will be the same, and the people who lose out, are the gamers.
"Get away with it" requires a high adoption rate. If you don't get high adoption rates then by definition, you do NOT get away with it. Adoption rate is the very measure of success for a console.

Low Adoption = unsuccessful console. High adoption = successful console.
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Old 2013-04-07, 16:38   Link #49
Chaos2Frozen
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Rumor: Next Xbox to be revealed on May 21, cost $500 for base or $300 for subscription model, and launch in November


Quote:
“Durango is going to be expensive [laughs], you know $500, $300 for the subscription, that kind of thing, but you know, Blu-ray, blah blah blah,” said Thurrott in his latest podcast. “But the thing that interests me, going back and looking at some of the stuff I got a long time ago, it actually says ‘must be internet-connected to use’ in the notes. And that’s all I have, but it does say that.
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Old 2013-04-07, 17:13   Link #50
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I'm curious what a "subscription model" is. Is this implying that, not only must you be online to use any game, but you must also pay a monthly fee to Microsoft to be online?
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Old 2013-04-07, 17:48   Link #51
Tong
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In the end, we'll all be forced to buy either because of some blockbuster/exclusive title.
Namely GTA 6, MGS6, next-gen fighting games (important)...

Afterall I've bought a PS2 just because of GTA:Vice City lol

The only hope would be PC games, but they're far from having iconic exclusives like consoles.
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Old 2013-04-07, 17:55   Link #52
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tong View Post
In the end, we'll all be forced to buy either because of some blockbuster/exclusive title.
Namely GTA 6, MGS6, next-gen fighting games (important)...

Afterall I've bought a PS2 just because of GTA:Vice City lol

The only hope would be PC games, but they're far from having iconic exclusives like consoles.
I don't see what's to worry about with PS4. It appears to be a relatively normal console.
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Old 2013-04-07, 18:56   Link #53
Chaos2Frozen
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What other Xbox exclusives are must buy? I've already outgrew Gears....

Oh God, I hope not Alan Wake
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Old 2013-04-07, 19:19   Link #54
GDB
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In the end, we'll all be forced to buy either because of some blockbuster/exclusive title.
Are they putting a gun to my head? Because I hope they don't start that, since I haven't bought any Microsoft console. And I don't see any title that'd be worth dropping $560 on.
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Old 2013-04-07, 19:50   Link #55
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Now that one I reaaallly don't believe. They could not possibly be that retarded.
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Old 2013-04-07, 20:01   Link #56
Tong
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That's true... 360 lost 98% of its exclusives on sequels. And being the first console to come at that time, it had promising titles! Remember: PS3 HAS(had) NO GAME. And the Five Hundred Ninety Nine US Dollars pricetag for the PS3 didn't help either. However, time's passed and...

PS3 now has great exclusives, like Disgaea, Metal Gear, J-RPGs, Gow (maybe)... and many others I probably don't know/remember haha

So there's not really a reason to get a 360 over a PS3.
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Old 2013-04-07, 20:25   Link #57
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Now that one I reaaallly don't believe. They could not possibly be that retarded.
Simcity showed how anything is possible.
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Old 2013-04-07, 20:33   Link #58
creb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tong View Post
So there's not really a reason to get a 360 over a PS3.
The reason is that Xbox Live is generally far better than the PS network (yea, I realize this is asking for fanboy rage, but whatever).

The only reason I have both systems is because there were a few PS 3 exclusives I wanted to play, but when it comes to multi-player games, most of the action is on Xbox Live, hate-filled trolls notwithstanding. The entire online experience, from UI down, is just better there. The PSN has attempted to make improvements (finally improving its UI a few months ago; a few years later), but it's still pretty bad compared to Xbox Live.

Microsoft understood the draw of being online years ago, and it shows. Sony appears to only now be waking up to it. I don't know if it's a cultural thing (maybe in Japan, it just wasn't a big draw), but I really felt MS separated itself significantly from Sony over this last generation.

I'm a PC gamer first, Xbox gamer second, and PS 3 gamer when it's a single player PS 3 exclusive.

As far as the price rumors, $300-500 doesn't sound far off target. Sure, the PS 3 probably shot itself in the foot when it released for that all those years ago, key part being all those years ago, second key part being the Xbox was noticeably cheaper. I don't believe the PS 4 pricing has been said yet, but does anyone believe it isn't going to be at LEAST $300?
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Old 2013-04-07, 20:43   Link #59
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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"Being online" is not the same as "mandatory online".

Do I like a car, fridge or toaster that can go online? Sure. Do I want a car, fridge or toaster than can only WORK if they are online? No way.

Able to go online is a benefit. To not able to use something unless it is online is NOT a benefit.
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Old 2013-04-07, 20:53   Link #60
Xagzan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Simcity showed how anything is possible.
B-but that was just one game! We're talking about a whole console of games here! Surely they couldn't be--ahh, who am I kidding
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