AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Current Series > Fate/ Series

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2013-06-11, 10:33   Link #261
Kanon
Kana Hanazawa ♥
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 27
Chapter 6 & 7 are translated! Bazett and Kuro return.

I found it rather interesting that Illya has access to fragments of the memory of heroic spirits when she installs a card. Too bad she can't possibly install the Archer card since Kuro is fused with it. It would have been quite a shock for her to find out who Archer was.

Tanaka remains very mysterious. She managed to tank an attack from Mjolnir. She suffered injuries but they healed very quickly. She's definitely no normal human. She's most likely a homunculus, but created by whom?
__________________
Mikan & Yami
Kanon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-11, 19:45   Link #262
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Good couple of chapters. Not really sure if it'll be possible to beat Beatrice without killing her. Oh well, who cares, just include Lancer and Gae Bolg her. Don't worry Illya, you suffer enough that including Lancer should be any worse... right?
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 09:22   Link #263
Sasukeuzi
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Chapter 6 & 7 are translated! Bazett and Kuro return.

I found it rather interesting that Illya has access to fragments of the memory of heroic spirits when she installs a card. Too bad she can't possibly install the Archer card since Kuro is fused with it. It would have been quite a shock for her to find out who Archer was.

Tanaka remains very mysterious. She managed to tank an attack from Mjolnir. She suffered injuries but they healed very quickly. She's definitely no normal human. She's most likely a homunculus, but created by whom?
Man i was thinking this the whole time throughout that chapter. I'd look forward to Kuro finding out for a good exchange but i cant see it happening. I can also imagine Tanaka being created by the Ainsworth since they seem to be the Einzberns of their world, but they can also be made by an opposing faction. Hard to tell where everything is placed in that world. It's also hard to see whose side Kotomine and Gil are actually on too.

Also when Illya is just whining about being in another world it just irked me little lol. How can she say that when Miyu's been through that the whole series?
Sasukeuzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 09:28   Link #264
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
To be fair, Miyu had amnesia. Illya doesn't, so the full brunt of "everyone you know and care about is gone" can sink in.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 09:57   Link #265
Sasukeuzi
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
To be fair, Miyu had amnesia. Illya doesn't, so the full brunt of "everyone you know and care about is gone" can sink in.
had amnesia? i think that was a lie though since she wanted to keep a secret that she was from another world. That fact was acknowledged when she was talking Karen, Kuro, and that episode from the beach on how she wanted to keep her secrets to herself. Especially when she looked at Shirou for the first time, that fact was strengthened even more
Sasukeuzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 10:08   Link #266
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
I thought she was surprised at the revelation that she was from another world? Like, she probably had an inkling of it, and definitely recognized Shirou, but still.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 10:51   Link #267
Kanon
Kana Hanazawa ♥
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 27
Miyu never had amnesia. She knew exactly who she was and where she came from and tried her best to hide it from the others. She attempted to stop Gil when he was about to spill the beans.
__________________
Mikan & Yami
Kanon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-14, 11:05   Link #268
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
I'll have to re-read at some point then (unfortunately not now... don't think it'd be a good idea to read this series at work and all). I could've sworn she had forgotten until around the time she saw Shirou, and then I figured it started coming back to her.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-15, 01:16   Link #269
Random Wanderer
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
I don't think Miyu ever forgot who she was or where she came from. She just lied, because she didn't know what people would do if they knew the truth about who and what she was, but she'd had an inkling from what people in her own world wanted to do to her. She certainly would have been isolated (or attempted to be isolated) by the Mage Assocation, like the cards, for being a "powerful magical artifact" from another world. That would have rendered her unable to grant Shirou's wish that she live freely.

Now then, yes, in a sense Miyu went through what Illya is going through. But I would like to remind folks that suffering is not a contest. Just because what happened to Miyu may have been strange and frightening, that doesn't mean that what's happened to Illya isn't also strange and frightening. She's shaken, and she has a right to be shaken. This is some seriously screwed up stuff she's dealing with here. Just because someone else has suffered something like it before doesn't stop this situation from being frightening now. Ease off her a bit. She'll deal with it, she just needs to work her way through it.

And now that that's been said... Bazett giving back the other cards is good, but aside from hoping for an insta-kill with Lancer, I still think their best bet is with the Beserker card Illya already has. I don't want to place bets on how well Excalibur can hold up against Mjolnir, and besides the enemy already has Gil's card too, plus an unknown number of others. Leaving that doll aside for the moment, for a head-to-head with Thor, I think Illya's best chance is to use Hercules.
__________________
<img src=http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/5491/girlsundpanzermakoxsodo.png border=0 alt= />
Random Wanderer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-15, 11:03   Link #270
Kanon
Kana Hanazawa ♥
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 27
I agree the Berserker card is probably her best chance to defeat Beatrice, depending on what kind of abilities this card grants. I'm hoping she'll be able to use nine lives.

The other match-up I want to see is Kuro vs Angelica, in a remake of the final battle of the UBW route. This would be the perfect opportunity for Kuro to finally use UBW, assuming she can. Gil can act as support.
__________________
Mikan & Yami
Kanon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-15, 11:49   Link #271
Random Wanderer
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
I agree the Berserker card is probably her best chance to defeat Beatrice, depending on what kind of abilities this card grants. I'm hoping she'll be able to use nine lives.
As far as I can tell, based on all previous experiences, INSTALLing the cards gives the user the Servant's full line-up: Illya would get every power and weapon the Servant had. INCLUDEing the cards is the thing that only gives you one tool from the arsenal.

Quote:
The other match-up I want to see is Kuro vs Angelica, in a remake of the final battle of the UBW route. This would be the perfect opportunity for Kuro to finally use UBW, assuming she can. Gil can act as support.
That would be pretty tough on her. Kuro can't regenerate prana on her own. She's essentially in the position Saber was in as Shirou's Servant, in FSN. Every fight Kuro gets into drains the power she needs to stay alive. Creating a reality marble might kill her.
__________________
<img src=http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/5491/girlsundpanzermakoxsodo.png border=0 alt= />
Random Wanderer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-15, 18:09   Link #272
Kanon
Kana Hanazawa ♥
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 27
She simply needs to charge up on prana beforehand just like Shirou did. She should be able to use it if she's at full power. Not saying it wouldn't be tough on her, but it should be possible.
__________________
Mikan & Yami
Kanon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-15, 23:24   Link #273
Sasukeuzi
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
She simply needs to charge up on prana beforehand just like Shirou did. She should be able to use it if she's at full power. Not saying it wouldn't be tough on her, but it should be possible.
but the thing is with Unlimited Blade Works is since the Rreality Marble belongs to Archer, the difference in ideals between Kuro and Archer may differ and cause repercussions. Im not sure if the author will go too in depth with it and i cant see Kuro doing it unless she sees memories of who Archer really was. One of the main points of the story is to not involve Shirou to the main plot at all since it'd just turn it into some Fate/Stay Night fanfic.
Sasukeuzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 08:24   Link #274
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Since the discussion in the anime thread is getting too close to spoiler territory (seriously people, it's the anime thread and you're trying to bring up shit from 2wei, which won't even be animated in this first season), I'm responding here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ukulelembo View Post
No, they aren't younger (Illya at least from time perspective). What I wanted to say is that basic setting is the same. What I said above is related to this.
No, it's not the same. FSN has all three routes with the same base, and Fate/Zero applies to all of them. FKP, however, does not. Its differences begin 200 years ago and carry forward to the present.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ukulelembo View Post
Basically, Shirou is more or less same. He still goes to high school as in F/SN and also was adopted by Kiritsugu ten years ago (although there is not clear why). Illya she goes to elementary school
This much is true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ukulelembo View Post
She is the younger from mental and physical perspective, so in the context of her role here yes, she IS younger. But this does not change her age from the time perspective (which is still the same as in F/SN).
What the hell does this even mean? How can she be both physically and mentally younger, but still be older? No, she's very much only 10 or so years old (I guess she turns 11 in 2wei). 10 years ago she was an infant, which you yourself have stated. So how, then, does she age 18 years in 10 years? She doesn't, because she's not the same as in FSN. The very fact that she was born 10 years ago, which would've been just before the start of the 4th Grail War if this were the original FZ/FSN universe, shows that this is different, as she was already 8 years old by the time that war started.

Further, she wasn't "sent away" from the Einzbern family. Kiritsugu slaughtered them all to protect her, and the three of them left together. He and Iri just aren't home often due to work, but they do live there.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 15:25   Link #275
ukulelembo
Detective
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
No, it's not the same. FSN has all three routes with the same base, and Fate/Zero applies to all of them. FKP, however, does not. Its differences begin 200 years ago and carry forward to the present.
Oh, you mean it this way. Well then yes. There are a lot of differences. However I think it otherwise. Basically it's alternate reality in the same universe. And in the base there applies that what is not stated differently is probably still the same. And this I mean. (For example Shirou has still the same the past, although there is no reason why he should be an orphan in F/KL reality.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
What the hell does this even mean? How can she be both physically and mentally younger, but still be older?
How? Very simply. Firstly she is homunculus and even in the original F/SN, her body grew differently. And here her mind was sealed. So, when Kiritsugu and Irisviel get her away from Einzberns, she began to grow with basically resetting mind. Which resulted in that she is now in basically ten years old in body and soul although her ​​real age is different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
10 years ago she was an infant, which you yourself have stated. So how, then, does she age 18 years in 10 years?
....
The very fact that she was born 10 years ago...
There is a little confusion because whole past in manga is not explained. I looked at it in manga rather once again. And the truth is that there is not exactly established when Kiritsugu and Irisviel got her away from Einzberns. Or when she was born. It's only stated that Einzberns vanished ten years ago. But it's not clear why.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Further, she wasn't "sent away" from the Einzbern family. Kiritsugu slaughtered them all to protect her, and the three of them left together. He and Iri just aren't home often due to work, but they do live there.
Same thing. Nothing of this is not directly stated. There is only mentioned by Irisviel that Kiritsugu is "working hard right now" to make sure that the holy grail war has not happen again.

So we can only speculate about how exactly it is. Which I think is unnecessary. The point is that this is still Nasuverse and how I said above. What is not stated differently is probably still the same. And if not, then is pointless guess about something that is not confirmed.
ukulelembo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 15:42   Link #276
Ithekro
Space Battleship
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 36
The thing is, there seems to have never been a Holy Grail War in this timeline. The three houses never got together to start it. The Einzbern seem to have been working on things alone. The way they got things is likely the same, but the timing and reasoning is different. Going on Kuro's memory and Iris's story, Illya is basically 11 years old and the Holy Grail was sealed in her when she was eight months old, which was ten years ago in the story. Kiritsugu has basically been working to destroy the rest of the Einzbern to keep Illya safe. Iris and Illya's caretakers are still what they have always been, but they are free of the Einzbern family.

Of the other two familes we've only really seen Rin, though Sakura exists. The other familes seem to have not been able to make a Holy Grail War. Though the summoning cards had to come from someplace. Possibly from another dimention.
__________________
Dessler Soto, Banzai!
Ithekro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 16:23   Link #277
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Not everything needs to be outright stated, some things can be inferred. Especially Illya's age. Nothing you've said has shown that she's anything but 10-11 years old, depending on the time in the story. In FSN, she's 18. That right there is the crux of the difference. How her body develops is irrelevant to the discussion, only her age. Besides, a lot of the damage to her body in FSN was done to facilitate her as Berserker's Master, which obviously wasn't done in FKP. At worst, she's actually 11-12 using your logic, but that's still a FAR cry from 18.

Same for Kiritsugu slaughtering the Einzbern. Nothing else would've made them be "no more" as Irisviel states, and have them not make a move for 10 years. There'd have been no other way to prevent them from going after Illya. They're still only two people, and the Einzbern have many homunculus. It's far more likely that he slaughtered the Einzbern, and is now basically doing what he did before they found him: going to war zones to protect people.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 17:49   Link #278
ukulelembo
Detective
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Not everything needs to be outright stated, some things can be inferred.
Well if you start inferring you can infer a lot of things. That cannot be denied. But here starts to play the role your own interpretations and about that is no point in arguing.
ukulelembo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 18:16   Link #279
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Well, you also inferred that "nothing changed unless it specifically stated it did", when there's more than enough evidence that things did change.
GDB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-07-02, 18:47   Link #280
ukulelembo
Detective
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Well, you also inferred that "nothing changed unless it specifically stated it did", when there's more than enough evidence that things did change.
Well, I take it in terms of other Type-Moon's works, where this is more or less true. But maybe you're right. We think about it too hard.
ukulelembo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:59.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.