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Old 2013-06-16, 19:23   Link #1461
Goldzero
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if you want an example of a bad pole for mikoto and kuroko here you go http://seventhstyle.com/2013/04/30/t...f-spring-2013/

heres another one for touma http://sgcafe.com/2013/06/animedia-r...poll-rankings/ he was ranked 26(hes rank seems to be alright) but i noticed that some of the most well liked and popular characters are rank low and a number of the most hated ones are ranked pretty high(not a legit poll in my opinion but it does seem to have quite a number of voters) but great to see mikoto ranked so high and my fav male character gintoki.

http://sgcafe.com/2013/06/animedia-r...me-series-are/ TAMNI was ranked 19 here where railgun S is ranked 30.

http://thekingofhate.com/forums/Thre...ed-Number-1-is TAMNI was ranked 4th as best light novel adaption.


i don't know how i keep finding these polls
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Old 2013-06-16, 20:04   Link #1462
dniv
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Originally Posted by Goldzero View Post
if you want an example of a bad pole for mikoto and kuroko here you go http://seventhstyle.com/2013/04/30/t...f-spring-2013/

heres another one for touma http://sgcafe.com/2013/06/animedia-r...poll-rankings/ he was ranked 26(hes rank seems to be alright) but i noticed that some of the most well liked and popular characters are rank low and a number of the most hated ones are ranked pretty high(not a legit poll in my opinion but it does seem to have quite a number of voters) but great to see mikoto ranked so high and my fav male character gintoki.

http://sgcafe.com/2013/06/animedia-r...me-series-are/ TAMNI was ranked 19 here where railgun S is ranked 30.

http://thekingofhate.com/forums/Thre...ed-Number-1-is TAMNI was ranked 4th as best light novel adaption.


i don't know how i keep finding these polls
I can help

It's a good thing I'm a mathematician and I know a tiny bit of statistics.

This is the most likely scenario:

What's happening here is called response bias. There are four major types of bias seen in statistics that completely invalidate polls. This is one perfect example that you need to consider when you see any poll.

(In terms of 2ch... its 2ch... its determing who's more Moe... not just anime heroine... given that... how would Mikoto win lol... she's not that Moe... Uiharu is voiced by Yui so that actually makes sense... you could call Misaki moe as well... see you have to read the details... I learned all of this in high school stats and owe my teacher... she said... remember these things if you take anything from this class... because it will help you later in life, you have to be critical of what you are reading). (The comments also say here that it is about Moeness and they even say that 2ch usually has bad taste when it comes to these things in general...) my point exactly.

(BTW: the 4th poll was about anime adaptations of light novels... go to the link where the actual poll is; it's not about which light novel is best. They mis-quoted what the poll was about. Checking sources is another common error in polls, which it's your responsibility to see through ) In terms of adaptations, Index only has 2 seasons... and Railgun S just came out and not that many people have seen it yet... and Index anime is certainly not complete, not even the first part is complete. Most importantly, the page says do not add any anime from this season. Therefore, Railgun S wasn't factored into the decision... that obviously makes a difference I guess... Also, the original place this poll source was taken from has a lot of complaining comments that all disagree with this list. None of them are happy with it. That might be saying something important Lolz...

(BTW: 2nd and 3rd poll Animedia is a spanish search engine and reflects the opinions of the hispanic world. That might be accurate, but only in that world which doesn't see as much Japanese anime/LNs and which has different cultural values anyways from wikipedia: animedia was the first search engine dedicated to anime and manga in Spanish, most Spanish anime web pages are now based on the services that animedia gives, in 2002 they offered the first oekaki service and the first IRC chat service dedicated to Spanish-speaking anime fans, also in 2002 they did the first Spanish translation of the very Famous webcomic Megatokyo made by Fred Ghallagher, most services like "add your link", Forum, Live Radio, ecards, mail lists, and even free webmail where the first ever offered for the Spanish anime fans, the way Animedia got many users because of its "help the fans" policy...... like I said population bias
Considering how much more catholic/Christian/Protestant the Spanish-speaking world is: this could greatly account for the skewedness of those two poles in terms of the popularity of Index... who wants their religion being portrayed in the way Index is portraying it?)

Consider this: the people who respond to these polls are either on those particular websites, or are the people who are into tons of different anime enough, don't represent the majority of people you would talk to, you would know, or you are considering when you are thinking about this poll.

I'm pretty sure a lot of Railgun S and Index fans didn't participate in this poll; otherwise, the results would have been completely different.

For that reason, a lot of famous series/characters are downplayed from where they should be. The truly great characters i.e. those from Gintama and other such series that are really really popular and that have been really popular will score high because people "know" those are the best and will gravitate towards them. They don't want to pick "side characters" that other people won't support as well.

The main problem as I see it is that most people don't know about these things in time or just aren't interested. If we polled all of the viewers of these different animes that are released and the different characters in a while after everyone is told about this via T.V. commercials, news articles, and lots of other things, we would most likely see different results.

If the general public voted for example, Goku would most likely be #1 and like usual Pikachu would probably be #2. It just depends on who is willing to stay updated and who will respond to the poll and who else people think is actually responding to the poll.

You have to be in the loop to respond.

That's why most internet polls are useless when it comes to determining the importance of a character unless they involve at least millions of people and are publicized well in advance and widely and ask from a wide variety of sources for their opinion, not the same group of people

Hope this helps. There are still a lot of people who love TAMNI and Railgun more than other series. It's just that with so little Index stuff going on lately, most samples taken from the anime population or general population won't rate Index first because it's not fresh on their minds. As soon as part 1 is complete, the series will be legendary enough for people to think of it as one of those top-notch top quality series. Right now, at the end of season 2, the Index anime is at a point where it doesn't compare to those other series. The LN's are different, but only by getting an anime will the opinions of a lot of people change in contrast to the 5,000-10,000 extra new readers who join with each Light Novel that is released (accounting for internet readers).

I hope this helped at all.

Me ranting like usual... I need to stop this...

Last edited by dniv; 2013-06-16 at 21:45.
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Old 2013-06-18, 00:19   Link #1463
Goldzero
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http://anime.biglobe.ne.jp/userranking/chara/42538/ votes closed.

Last edited by Goldzero; 2013-06-25 at 17:47.
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Old 2013-06-29, 00:17   Link #1464
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i have watched all index animes but I didn't read the light novels yet

so I want to ask if Touma is still as dense as not to realize Misaka likes him
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Old 2013-06-29, 01:37   Link #1465
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let just say he's to busy being drag around . Breaking someone's illusion and saving the world form world destroying spell/angels or demons/curses/cyborg/ etc etc ... BTW be busy making breakfast/lunch/ dinner to certain nun that has 103,000 deadly girmore in her mind ..... thats in a span of THREE MONTHS
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Old 2013-06-29, 01:56   Link #1466
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Quote:
let just say he's to busy being drag around . Breaking someone's illusion and saving the world form world destroying spell/angels or demons/curses/cyborg/ etc etc ... BTW be busy making breakfast/lunch/ dinner to certain nun that has 103,000 deadly girmore in her mind ..... thats in a span of THREE MONTHS
Loosely Translated: He's just busy.
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Old 2013-06-29, 01:59   Link #1467
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Looser translated: Positive.
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Old 2013-06-29, 02:44   Link #1468
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In other words when he's not busy, he will just realize he has been drawn in a harem and also realize misaka's feelings for him,

yare yare
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Old 2013-06-29, 05:04   Link #1469
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Um....I don't know about anyone else but...being the subject of several women's interest is not all its cracked up to be. You'd think it would be, but it aint; plain and simple.

Trust me on this (Serious Business)

And its not just Misaka who has feelings for him; there's a slew of other people who feel the same way towards him. Sure, I like Misaka too, but as soon as Touma realizes she likes him, he'll also realize that so does Index, and Kaori, and Itsawa, and nearly 10,000 Misaka clones, and Komoe, and Fukiyose, and Accelerator, and Aisa.

(The list is long, so I recommend skipping this part)

My point is, it'll be a domino effect; once one is known then so are all the rest.

That + His misfortune = Your screwed kid.
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Old 2013-06-29, 06:57   Link #1470
kaizerknight01
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just watched the latest Railgun S .... in this timeline Touma just saved Himegami form the deep blood arc , I think Aureolus is as dangerous or more dangerous than accel

I think this became what ever you do don't cut Kamijou's right arm or suffer the consequences

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Old 2013-06-29, 07:15   Link #1471
SmokinFerret88
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As the comments on YouTube regarding this video have already stated:

"You know your screwed when the protagonist has a more evil sounding laugh than the antagonist."
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Old 2013-06-29, 07:44   Link #1472
dniv
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Originally Posted by SmokinFerret88 View Post
As the comments on YouTube regarding this video have already stated:

"You know your screwed when the protagonist has a more evil sounding laugh than the antagonist."
Lol. I like that comment. And your earlier comment about the harem. I never considered that... But then again, he ignored Index's confession near the beginning... So I'm not really sure if he just forgot about it or doesn't want to acknowledge it. If he still remembers it... this could mean he might not figure out for everyone else if he were told. Granted: he had just lost his memory. I feel like Touma could use some more plot development. We don't really know that much about him.

We know a lot about how he interacts with others. We know somewhat about his past and about IB. We know Aleister's and other characters' interests in him. He know of his philosophy. We don't know that much about him really though. We know about everything and everyone around him (something distinct). Maybe it's supposed to be that way. But I wish he had a core as a character, like Sagara Sosuke. If he got one, he'd replace Sosuke as my favorite character ever.
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Old 2013-06-29, 10:34   Link #1473
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we need a Kamijou SS.
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Old 2013-06-30, 00:43   Link #1474
dniv
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we need a Kamijou SS.
Yes we do. You have the best ideas
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Old 2013-06-30, 06:59   Link #1475
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I've heard...

Spoiler:


I guess, the most important point we have to learn about Touma is, how he got Imagine Breaker.


By the way, does someone here know the Dresden Files RPG. I was playing around with the character creation of that game and found out, that you could use it to recreate the characters of To Aru.

It also justifies plot armour. An important part of the game are Aspects, attributes of the characters or enviroment. This aspects can be used in three ways: You can "invoke" them to improve your roll or to create a fact for your advantage. But they can be used to "compel" you, however that way you get Fate points which you need to activate the first two options.

For example, let's say Touma has the Aspect "My life is a bad Dating Sim". The player of Touma or the GM can use this aspect to compel Touma to accidently run into Kanzaki, who just happened to change her clothes. Now the player has to decide if he pays one fate point to avoid the beating (Kanzaki hasn't noticed Touma) or if he instead plays out that scene, but recieves one Fate point, that for example he can use to "invoke" Touma's "I will crush your illusions" Aspect later in a fight with a dangerous esper.
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Old 2013-06-30, 07:09   Link #1476
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
I've heard...

Spoiler:
That one is pure speculation.

There's no doubt that she knows him from before- but before when? That's still a mystery.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
I guess, the most important point we have to learn about Touma is, how he got Imagine Breaker.


By the way, does someone here know the Dresden Files RPG. I was playing around with the character creation of that game and found out, that you could use it to recreate the characters of To Aru.

It also justifies plot armour. An important part of the game are Aspects, attributes of the characters or enviroment. This aspects can be used in three ways: You can "invoke" them to improve your roll or to create a fact for your advantage. But they can be used to "compel" you, however that way you get Fate points which you need to activate the first two options.

For example, let's say Touma has the Aspect "My life is a bad Dating Sim". The player of Touma or the GM can use this aspect to compel Touma to accidently run into Kanzaki, who just happened to change her clothes. Now the player has to decide if he pays one fate point to avoid the beating (Kanzaki hasn't noticed Touma) or if he instead plays out that scene, but recieves one Fate point, that for example he can use to "invoke" Touma's "I will crush your illusions" Aspect later in a fight with a dangerous esper.

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with table top RPGs But I'll help in whatever way I can regarding the Raildex side of things.
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Old 2013-06-30, 11:33   Link #1477
Doc Astaroth
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Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Unfortunately I'm not familiar with table top RPGs But I'll help in whatever way I can regarding the Raildex side of things.
Alright, then...

For the character creation in Dresden Files RPG, you have to determine seven Aspects of your characters:

1. The High Concept of the Character. Something that describes what he does or his special role in this world, etc. Basically, if it fit into the sentence "Oh, that girl/boy. She/ he is noun" and everyone understands immediately who it is, you have done it right. Even better, when it leads to some reaction like "WHAT!? OH, CR... WE'RE ARE F**KED!"

For example:

"Oh, he is the The One that purifies God and cleanses the Devil!"


2. The Trouble Aspect: Basically, the main problem of that character. Something that pressures him/her all the time and creates a long-lasting conflict for him/her.

Examples for above:

"The power to negate even God's miracles"



After these come the aspect of the life phases of the character:

3. "Where did you come from?": Basically, try to describe the origin/childhood of the character with one phrase, significant person or object.

"God of Plague / The lonely Jinx"

4. "What shaped you?": At which point did you know, which role you will play in this world.

"My life is a bad dating sim"

5. "What was your first Adventure?": Basically, if you would write a series about this character, it would be his first story as protagonist.

"My memories for her memories"

6. + 7. "Whose path have you crossed": An aspect, that plays a big role in your first adventure with another player character.

"I'll destroy that screwed up illusion of yours!" (Index)

"Who cares who saved who?" (Misaka)



It is important that all aspects can be interpreted both positive and negative, as an advantage and as a disadvantage.

For example, "Who cares who saved who?". The positive interpretation is, that Touma is always ready to help other people. The negative interpretation on the other hand would be, that he isoften all too ready to save someone, even on the expense of his own life.

Well, what do you think. Does these aspect fit Touma? I have some trouble with good ideas for the first three.

Last edited by Doc Astaroth; 2013-06-30 at 11:49.
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Old 2013-06-30, 21:53   Link #1478
Chaos2Frozen
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Sounds interesting... Lets see...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post

1. The High Concept of the Character. Something that describes what he does or his special role in this world, etc. Basically, if it fit into the sentence "Oh, that girl/boy. She/ he is noun" and everyone understands immediately who it is, you have done it right. Even better, when it leads to some reaction like "WHAT!? OH, CR... WE'RE ARE F**KED!"

For example:

"Oh, he is the The One that purifies God and cleanses the Devil!"
If there's one thing that invoke respect and/or fear is that he is someone who would get involved even when there is no reason for him to do so. And it's not just that, he also has the results to back him up, giving him a sort of mythical superhero reputation.

To be exact, they don't fear him the same way they would fear someone like Accelerator. But he does make them hesitate. This was very apparent in NT4 where we view the story through the eyes of people who are unfamiliar with him personally.

This normal teenage boy can save you if you find him.

This normal teenage boy would disrupt our plans in the most unexpected way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
2. The Trouble Aspect: Basically, the main problem of that character. Something that pressures him/her all the time and creates a long-lasting conflict for him/her.

Examples for above:

"The power to negate even God's miracles"
The guilt of saving people, but as an indirect result causes more people to get hurt elsewhere down the line.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
After these come the aspect of the life phases of the character:

3. "Where did you come from?": Basically, try to describe the origin/childhood of the character with one phrase, significant person or object.

"God of Plague / The lonely Jinx"
Those are good if you want to take it literally his origins. But we really don't know much about his childhood aside from that.

The very first time we see Kamijou was in volume 1. At that time, he was a character that wants to be a hero, but didn't have the confidence to do so. Whether it's because of his past or his bad luck, he thinks of himself as powerless.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
4. "What shaped you?": At which point did you know, which role you will play in this world.

"My life is a bad dating sim"
His memory lost, when he 'died' once.

I don't think he actually knew what role he would play in this world, but he threw away his fear and hesitation at that point.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Astaroth View Post
5. "What was your first Adventure?": Basically, if you would write a series about this character, it would be his first story as protagonist.

"My memories for her memories"
Obviously the first volume.
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Old 2013-07-06, 12:15   Link #1479
Ilidsor
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Discussion moved from another thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suryce
Touma's preaching is annoying because he does it everytime he faces someone, and even though he is a 16 years old kid making naive speech to religious extremists or people with strong convictions, Touma always win the argument. Not because what he said was relevant, but because he is the main character and he has to win. That's exactly why he is considered to be a Gary-Sue character.

Quote:
I would love for you to enlighten me. My point of view has few chances to change just by re-watching Index anime by myself.
Well for starters I don't think any character who loses as often as Touma does can be called a Gary Stu. He's just too weak. Sure he beats a lot of very strong opponents but every now and then he just runs into one that's too much for him and gets his ass kicked.

As for the arguments he has with his villains; I don't really see how that makes him a Gary Stu. Sure it's kind of annoying in the anime (it works well in the original LNs) but it's not that big of a deal.

As for why he always wins the arguments well two things 1. Do you really expect people who are trying to kill lots of people (or whatever the villain of the week is doing at the time) to be on the logical side of things? And 2. It's not like the villains accept that he wins the argument and give up.
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Old 2013-07-06, 18:14   Link #1480
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suryce View Post
I would love for you to enlighten me. My point of view has few chances to change just by re-watching Index anime by myself.
I'm not even certain if you did watch the Index Anime to begin with- You lost all credibility the moment you said that they weren't relevant.

And it's hilarious that you think Mikoto is the better protagonist because... She more simple minded ? LOLZ...
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