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Old 2013-07-12, 10:37   Link #81
mystogan
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whatever Madara's trump card might be i think it does not include bringing him back to life, the only two live people with rinnegan are obito and Madara, seeing that obito-rinnegan-reviving plan of madara failed, there is no way to revive madara unless a new jutsu or power is introduced

with that i wonder how are they going to stop madara, the only way is to seal him but i doubt there is a sealing jutsu powerfull enough for that
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Old 2013-07-12, 11:43   Link #82
itachi-san314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster0 View Post
Things made out of chakra,

Clones
Logs
Elements
Bijuu
Meteors

Not made out of chakra but with a gravity ball made of chakra

the Moon
i'm pretty sure the logs and meteors are not chakra. the logs are actual logs used for replacement escape techniques. and the meteors are actual rock formations from space

and to clarify for people who can't resist dropping scientific terms into a magical story about impossible things: meteoroids travel around the sun in their own orbits. meteors are what they become when they enter earth's atmosphere. and meteorites are what they become if they hit the earth's surface

i'm not sure what their scientific term is when they are stopped by an old flying ninja in mid-air though...
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Old 2013-07-12, 13:00   Link #83
DJ*
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Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
i'm pretty sure the logs and meteors are not chakra. the logs are actual logs used for replacement escape techniques. and the meteors are actual rock formations from space

and to clarify for people who can't resist dropping scientific terms into a magical story about impossible things: meteoroids travel around the sun in their own orbits. meteors are what they become when they enter earth's atmosphere. and meteorites are what they become if they hit the earth's surface

i'm not sure what their scientific term is when they are stopped by an old flying ninja in mid-air though...
A rock, probably.
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Old 2013-07-12, 13:21   Link #84
itachi-san314
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A rock, probably.
haha, that or a hemroid
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Old 2013-07-12, 13:35   Link #85
Ero-Senn1n
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Originally Posted by DJ* View Post
A rock, probably.
It sure was not a meteor since those have huge speeds and that is what is much more important than it's size and weight. The thing that was stopped by the old man was just a gaint rock falling down after Madara summoned it above the alliance. If it were a real meteor at that huge size being already so close to the ground then it's effect would have been much more devastating than a huge chakra bomb of the 10-tails that we already saw. It's effect would be something like the tunguska event or this. I'm not sure how large the rock was but i'm sure it did not have a 6 km. radius which would destroy most of intelligent life on the planet. So the jutsu was far weaker than the power levels in DBZ when they wiped out planets But if it was a real meteorite it would have wiped out the entire alliance force before they even realized it's coming. So it was just a huge rock Of course one could say that he summoned the meteor itself but without it's space speed relative to earth But then another who's geek enough should debate that such a meteor should be very cold, for example -200 degrees cold, so the tsuchikage's arms should be frozen when he touches it Or maybe very hot? But then it should burn his hands. An educated geek will probably know this

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Originally Posted by Alchemist007 View Post
Wasn't the moon created when the original Sage did the same thing that Nagato did, making it also an earthly creation?
If i remember correctly he created it after he divided the 10-tail's soul/chakra into the 9 tailed beasts and then sealed it's empty body into the moon. The moon itself is not the body but a huge prison for the body, but Madara somehow managed to summon the body from inside the moon and called it Gedo Mazo.
So i always assumed that normal humans can't create the moon because it would require too much chakra. Not even the Sage of 6 paths. That's why Nagato commented that his version is nothing compared to the moon. Therefore i assumed that the sage could create this *after* he sealed in himself the 10-tails and he actually used the huge chakra of the 10-tails to do this. If i remember correctly Madara explained at the kage summit that after the Sage sealed the 10-tails in himself he was more than a human, he was like a god. When the 10-tails is sealed in a person it's body is also inside that person, so it makes sense that the Sage created the moon only shortly before he died. But as we see he was talking to the 9 chibi-tailed beasts so it seems the Sage could unseal the 10-tails from his own body while using for this the chakra of the 10-tails itself and survive the whole thing (BTW that would also make it more likely that he was from the Uzumaki bloodline since normal people die when the tailed beast is removed). Unless i'm wrong and the Sage had a huge chakra of his own to do this, but in that case why would he want to seal the tailed beast into himself, in that case he could have just done all this sealing into the moon from the start and not using his own body as a prison.

Last edited by Ero-Senn1n; 2013-07-12 at 13:57.
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Old 2013-07-12, 14:18   Link #86
Vindi89
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Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n View Post
It sure was not a meteor since those have huge speeds and that is what is much more important than it's size and weight. The thing that was stopped by the old man was just a gaint rock falling down after Madara summoned it above the alliance. If it were a real meteor at that huge size being already so close to the ground then it's effect would have been much more devastating than a huge chakra bomb of the 10-tails that we already saw.
You sum up my thoughts exactly regarding that summoning. I previously mentioned it could have been a stationary asteroid that was summoned but I think its more likely a huge land mass that was summoned from the planet itself and dropped onto the alliance. This still fits the definition of a meteor (falling celestial object). After all the Earth is part of the cosmos.

Then again it could all be irrelevant because we can't assume their universe is like ours. After all their moon didn't form the same way ours was, what's to say there aren't other glaring differences.
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Old 2013-07-12, 14:52   Link #87
itachi-san314
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Then again it could all be irrelevant because we can't assume their universe is like ours. After all their moon didn't form the same way ours was, what's to say there aren't other glaring differences.
could be irrelevant? why would anyone assume their universe is like ours? that notion should have been tossed aside since chapter 1

also, in the narutoverse, i dont think the meteor was a summoning of earth from the planet. we saw how nagato used the rinnegan to form giant spheres of rock and madara didn't do that. he also wouldn't have had time to make one and leave it around in wait for him to summon it since his edo revival. which only leaves him making it after achieving rinnegan when he was very old and before he died. i for one, don't think a giant rock sphere he made in the past has been laying around since his death, but it is possible i suppose. i think it's more likely that kishi didn't put any scientific thought into the technique (which is the correct way to go about things if you've been following naruto for any period of time since nothing is bound by our scientific laws) and just had madara pull down a meteor from space. i would prefer techniques like this never happened in naruto since they should be well beyond what a ninja could and should do imho, but it's there and it happened and i wouldn't worry about the physics. might as well try to explain why alice shrank and grew, or why a beanstalk would grow so high, or why wearing a ring would turn the wearer invisible, etc...
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Old 2013-07-12, 19:08   Link #88
Moeterum
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Tobi is the main villain, NOT Madara...

You do know that, right, everyone?
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Old 2013-07-12, 22:35   Link #89
Artimus_Prime
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Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
haha, that or a hemroid
LOL!!! ha! this is exactly what pooped into my mind! cuz kishi pulled that one right out his ass...
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Old 2013-07-13, 03:28   Link #90
itachi-san314
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^touché

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Originally Posted by Moeterum View Post
Tobi is the main villain, NOT Madara...

You do know that, right, everyone?
i beg to differ and would like to remind you of orochimaru he's just letting obito and madara fizzle out before he makes his triumphant return as ultimate series villain
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Old 2013-07-13, 16:24   Link #91
JustRob
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Originally Posted by Moeterum View Post
Tobi is the main villain, NOT Madara...

You do know that, right, everyone?
Does that matter? Right now, in terms of power, Madara is dangerous enough to be called a main villain, just like Obito.

Orochimaru now is nothing more then a sidekick of Sasuke, he's never going evil again.

As for the rest, since Obito has essentially attained the power of the Sage, he should still be able to cast Rinne Tensei on Madara. Ofcourse, for that to happen I believe Madara would need to release the Edo Tensei on him first. Somehow I think that gap is going to be crucial to defeating Madara.
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Old 2013-07-14, 06:05   Link #92
Ero-Senn1n
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Tobi is the main villain, NOT Madara...

You do know that, right, everyone?
I don't think so. The guy is connected to Kakashi and is mentally broken because of a teenage girl, has randomly become part of Madara's plan instead of dying, tries to prove his point by making Naruto suffer instead of just executing his plan. Madara seems to be a better final villain now.

Or Orochimaru as some suggest, but i think Orochimaru won't be a villain in this arc, if he becomes then it will be in a next arc, which means that the story will continue beyond this war, which is what a naruto-fan would like, so i'm ok with Orochi being the next evil boss But i think the role of advisor of Sasuke would be a more fitting role for him, since the current generation (Naruto and Sasuke) are now taking the lead so the sannin and kage generation are put back into advisor/support/secondary roles. I assume there will be a final clash between two ideologies (of the 2 sons of the sage of 6 paths) between Naruto and Sasuke, and Orochi will support Sasuke.
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Old 2013-07-14, 09:59   Link #93
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Orochimaru is an allusive character indeed and any guess as to what he might do in future events is viable.I think he takes somewhat of a neutral stance,like a mad scientist.Whatever his goal ultimately is specifically, i don't know, but it's probably along the lines of Dr.Frankenstein,who wanted to have the power of life.The reference he made to Tsunade about letting others put things in motion is along the line of what he said to the 3rd Hokage,something like"i like to put things in motion".This kind of thing makes me feel he might be behind everything going on right now.
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Old 2013-07-14, 16:57   Link #94
Sakuranbo
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Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post

i beg to differ and would like to remind you of orochimaru he's just letting obito and madara fizzle out before he makes his triumphant return as ultimate series villain
I would love to see this happen
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Old 2013-07-14, 17:20   Link #95
itachi-san314
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This kind of thing makes me feel he might be behind everything going on right now.
he very well might be, at least to an extent since obito is primarily madara's doing. i at least find it easier to believe that orochimaru acquired madara's dna instead of kabuto. and kabuto merely knew where orochimaru stored it and then used it for his edo tensei. and we already know that he's behind the hokages being there. sasuke didn't force him to resurrect them. he wanted to free everything from the reaper's belly and get his arms back.

i highly suspect at some point we will see a complete juubi and new true So6P and i think obito will be finished before then, which leaves orochi, madara, naruto and/or sasuke. even though madara has been around for a lot of chapters now, he's still a very new villain time-wise so i can't place him as ultimate villain of the series. it's either orochi or possibly sasuke
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Old 2013-07-15, 03:20   Link #96
JustRob
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Why is everyone so anxious about Orochimaru? The guy has been killed / sealed three or four times already, and besides there are lots of people right now who outclass him in power and technique, namely Naruto and Killer Bee.

But honestly, I don't even want to see Orochimaru go evil again. Then what the hell was that emotional scene with Tsunade for? They're finally building Orochimaru up to be a good dramatic character, why would they ruin that with "Lol just trollin I'm evil after all"?

In the end, both Sasuke and Orochimaru have redeemed themselves. Orochimaru even seemed a bit sad about Jiraiya's death. I think it's great this way.
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Old 2013-07-15, 08:41   Link #97
Monster0
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Orochimaru is that type of character that's like "I let you kill me and seal me so i could obtain a secret,and i knew you would betray me". Orochimaru was never pure evil in my opinion,just the ultimate ninja. I would imagine from a lab rats perspective the scientist searching for a cure is the ultimate evil.

Last edited by Monster0; 2013-07-15 at 09:30.
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Old 2013-07-15, 11:47   Link #98
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Hmm.. Think Naruto Manga will actually end after this arc is finally over?

Very worried at the lack of closure for anyone that isn't named Naruto.
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Old 2013-07-15, 19:30   Link #99
SoloPanda
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Originally Posted by Monster0 View Post
Orochimaru is that type of character that's like "I let you kill me and seal me so i could obtain a secret,and i knew you would betray me". Orochimaru was never pure evil in my opinion,just the ultimate ninja. I would imagine from a lab rats perspective the scientist searching for a cure is the ultimate evil.
I like this. I've always suspected that Orochimaru is attempting to do the same thing as naruto, jiraya, nagato, and everyone else that has attempted to do anything meaningful in this manga. I get the feeling that he's attempting to do something for the greater good, even if it means being evil or cruel himself. Ofcourse I could be completely wrong but that guy is one of my favorite characters for some reason so maybe i'm biased. One thing that I am sure of is that everyone talking about Orochimaru getting owned by second rate ninja are forgetting that he had his arms and therefore most of his jutsu stolen from him by the third. now that he's whole again we will probably find out that he has a lot more power than earlier estimated.
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Old 2013-07-16, 22:10   Link #100
Artimus_Prime
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I like this. I've always suspected that Orochimaru is attempting to do the same thing as naruto, jiraya, nagato, and everyone else that has attempted to do anything meaningful in this manga. I get the feeling that he's attempting to do something for the greater good, even if it means being evil or cruel himself. Ofcourse I could be completely wrong but that guy is one of my favorite characters for some reason so maybe i'm biased. One thing that I am sure of is that everyone talking about Orochimaru getting owned by second rate ninja are forgetting that he had his arms and therefore most of his jutsu stolen from him by the third. now that he's whole again we will probably find out that he has a lot more power than earlier estimated.
yeah, orochimaru has stated as least twice that he is folllowing sasuke. and i personally believe sasuke has made his decision to be good and will stay that way. by association, so will oro. in fact, im rethinking my stance on sasuke talking about being hokage as way to get under narutos skin, and beginning to think he may actually challenge naruto for the position. perhaps he finally understands the responsibility that comes with the power he has attained..

as for obito, he maybe stronger than the already dead kages, but as long as they are in the field of play they will be formidable soldiers. hell, minato alone did away with most powerful bijuu dama while the rest of the alliance was busy putting up wallpaper...

madaras trump card.............sage mode
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