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Old 2013-05-15, 18:27   Link #21
Jazzrat
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Didn't know having a female protagonist = games for girl. Beside the futuristic setting, the rest of the game haven't got much interest out of me, atleast from what they have shown so far.
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Old 2013-05-15, 20:52   Link #22
synaesthetic
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The early word is that this game is very "meh." Lots of style, very little substance. From the gameplay videos I'm inclined to believe these assessments.

This really frustrates me. Why can't we make a kickass game with a female protagonist? Remember Me could have ended up a model case--"see, stupid publishers, you CAN make money from an awesome game with a female protagonist!"

But no. Unfortunately it's very generic and ordinary, albeit stylish and very, very French.

Which probably means the unbroken stream of brown-haired bearded hyper-muscular dudebros will continue unabated.

...

I'm sad now.
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Old 2013-05-16, 02:38   Link #23
Dirty_Harry
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I think it's best to wait before making pre-judgments.
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Old 2013-05-16, 06:15   Link #24
Jazzrat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
The early word is that this game is very "meh." Lots of style, very little substance. From the gameplay videos I'm inclined to believe these assessments.

This really frustrates me. Why can't we make a kickass game with a female protagonist? Remember Me could have ended up a model case--"see, stupid publishers, you CAN make money from an awesome game with a female protagonist!"

But no. Unfortunately it's very generic and ordinary, albeit stylish and very, very French.

Which probably means the unbroken stream of brown-haired bearded hyper-muscular dudebros will continue unabated.

...

I'm sad now.
There are kickass games with strong female lead, just look at NOLF, beyond good and evil, Dreamfall, Starcraft Brood War and Bayonetta.

Just having a strong female lead isn't going to sell just like having a strong male lead. Dudebro shooters like CoD/Gears sell well because of the genre and platform, not because character gender.

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I think it's best to wait before making pre-judgments.
Not saying it's going to be a bad game or not, just saying they haven't really done much to generate hype for it.
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Old 2013-05-16, 12:21   Link #25
Vexx
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Just a note ... "Bayonetta" isn't exactly a character I'd advise using as an example of a "strong female lead" The highly sexualized outfits tend to put a dent in that. It is a murky line - there's nothing against a strong character looking stylish while being practical.
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Old 2013-05-16, 14:17   Link #26
Jazzrat
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Just a note ... "Bayonetta" isn't exactly a character I'd advise using as an example of a "strong female lead" The highly sexualized outfits tend to put a dent in that. It is a murky line - there's nothing against a strong character looking stylish while being practical.
Let's not judge a book by it's cover and there is nothing stopping a sexualized character as being strong as well. It's like saying beautiful women can't be smart. People should stop thinking that a sexy character can't be serious as well because that's just plain sexist in a different way.

Plus in bayonetta's case, it's a japanese game, practicality got fed to the dogs when they strapped guns to high heels.
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Old 2013-05-16, 15:33   Link #27
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Let's not forget all the sexualized finisher and the dodging lol her entire look is a fetish that it's a parody game.
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Old 2013-05-16, 15:38   Link #28
synaesthetic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Just a note ... "Bayonetta" isn't exactly a character I'd advise using as an example of a "strong female lead" The highly sexualized outfits tend to put a dent in that. It is a murky line - there's nothing against a strong character looking stylish while being practical.
Bayonetta's character was designed by a female character designer, Mari Shimazaki, who designed her to be a "female power fantasy." She's sexualized, very much so, but in a strange way that tends to uncanny-valley some men more than turn them on.

Shimazaki intended Bayonetta to be the female equivalent of the stereotypical male power fantasy so commonly found in video games--the hyper-muscular brown haired beefcake with the scratchy intimidating voice; she's supposed to be the gender inversion of that.

It makes sense, too, if you consider odd things like the length of her limbs. They're too long... her neck is also too long. She's freakishly tall, even without the high-high-heels. And then consider how she attacks enemies--using her hair, and the guns built into her high heels. She's using stereotypical symbols of femininity (pretty hair, high heels) as means to deal death.

To be honest I don't like the art direction either, but for different reasons. I've never been a fan of power fantasies--which is probably why I don't like superheroes. Bayonetta is just as much a superhero as Superman, Wonder Woman and so forth.

And yeah, the marketing team TOTALLY missed the point and marketed Bayonetta as the sexiest badass ever; it starts to become obvious when you watch her massacre scores of enemies using stereotypical symbols of "female oppression."
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Old 2013-05-16, 15:47   Link #29
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I agree there's nothing wrong with a strong character being attractive/hot/whatever. There's just the murky line of, say, Red Sonja - a very strong character who wears flimsy chain bikini in her comic books (though she dressed more practically in her written fiction). There's even a rationale for it (touched by the gods after being touched by villains) but it makes her an easy target for ridicule.

TL;DR…
practical stylist versus comic boom
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Old 2013-05-16, 16:10   Link #30
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Originally Posted by Jazzrat View Post
Didn't know having a female protagonist = games for girl. Beside the futuristic setting, the rest of the game haven't got much interest out of me, atleast from what they have shown so far.
Yeah... this is pretty much what I was going to post. Though, futuristic settings don't really do anything for me.
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Old 2013-05-16, 16:35   Link #31
Jazzrat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I agree there's nothing wrong with a strong character being attractive/hot/whatever. There's just the murky line of, say, Red Sonja - a very strong character who wears flimsy chain bikini in her comic books (though she dressed more practically in her written fiction). There's even a rationale for it (touched by the gods after being touched by villains) but it makes her an easy target for ridicule.

TL;DR…
practical stylist versus comic boom
Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?
I think before judging female character attire/armor ridiculous or not is the theme and setting. If a game is built around a realism then you can't have women in bikini plate and expect people to not get disconnected from the immersion.

Where else high fantasy stuff gets away with it better because it's crazy enough that trying to apply logic in design is like yelling at kids for being kids.

An easy example (atleast what i could think of right now) of bad design choice is Motoko Kusanagi's original attire in the early GitS episodes where she was running around in a bikini and a jacket while everyone else is dress normally. Later on, they fix it by putting a pant on her and the 2nd SAC had her in normal clothing that fits into the world she's in.
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Old 2013-05-16, 16:40   Link #32
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzrat View Post
I think before judging female character attire/armor ridiculous or not is the theme and setting. If a game is built around a realism then you can't have women in bikini plate and expect people to not get disconnected from the immersion.

Where else high fantasy stuff gets away with it better because it's crazy enough that trying to apply logic in design is like yelling at kids for being kids.

An easy example (atleast what i could think of right now) of bad design choice is Motoko Kusanagi's original attire in the early GitS episodes where she was running around in a bikini and a jacket while everyone else is dress normally. Later on, they fix it by putting a pant on her and the 2nd SAC had her in normal clothing that fits into the world she's in.
Yup, agree with that - context is important. If you're doing something caricature-ish, cartoonish, satirical, comedic, or whatever (like the new Wildstar game), then all bets are off
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Old 2013-08-13, 08:50   Link #33
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Not that long ago, Capcom had a contest to see who could come up with the most interesting remixes for this game's music. The submissions, and a free 'best of' album download, can be found here.
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Old 2013-08-13, 11:36   Link #34
risingstar3110
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Remember Me is reminding me ALOT about this game. I prob couldn't play that game again, but I greatly enjoyed it as my 2nd ps2 game =03. Hopefully this might give a similar impression.
Wha, wha, same here. I immediately think of Oni (despite forgot its name) when i watched the trailer of Remember Me.

One of the more memorial game of my childhood. Still remember that loading screen, when she fell into the acid pool, and only her clothes were deteriorated
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