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Old 2013-08-17, 11:59   Link #11701
Randrak42
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Originally Posted by ellifeedn View Post
You can still be a spirit mage with silver keys.
It's not about gold or silver keys, I believe Yukino was the one who said that she and Lucy were the only two spirit mages left (thus why they ended up being so important later on).
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Old 2013-08-17, 13:14   Link #11702
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Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
^ I'd say Lucy is easily the top mage of her type, just based on the number of keys and magical capacity she possesses. Wendy really has a lot of room for improvement though, especially with the other dragon slayers' recent achievements...but hey, she's only twelve
Like Randrak said they've pretty well all been wiped out she's pretty much number 1 by default at this point. Also being number 1 at a type of magic that is very frequently presented as being weak in combat really doesn't make you look tough.

As for Wendy I'd she really has shown some very good growth and it's kind of nice for now at least that her moves are all adaptation's of Natsu's fire ds spells.
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Old 2013-08-17, 13:48   Link #11703
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You know, all this talk of celestial wizards has gotten me thinking: since Cobra said he'll be busting Oracion Seis out of prison, we may see Angel again. What kinds of spirits would she have, if she's still a celestial wizard? In the anime, she switched from celestial magic to, well, angel magic (which I doubt she'll be using again, considering what it did to her).

Well, it doesn't matter what magic she has. I just want Angel to meet Yukino, since I'm 99% positive they're sisters (same magic, same hair color, same voice actress; plus Yukino's sister shared Angel's "-zo" tic). It'd be futile to avoid it after bringing up the possibility.

Furthermore, which members will be in Oracion Seis in the likely event they return? The anime didn't bring back Brain/Zero (is he dead or something?) or Hoteye (he's good now). My guess is they could get Erigor to fill in a spot again, which just leaves one more...unless they want to call themselves Oracion Cinco...
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Old 2013-08-17, 13:59   Link #11704
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@ Ellifeedn, the majority of the celestial mages was wiped out with the zentopia incident, so Randrak is right on his claim. Still, I wouldn't say celestial mages have been regarded as weak, unless it's Lucy - sounds a bit contradictory, but still: Aquarius and Sagittarius lost (and tied) for the first time only recently, while Taurus' character has been overused to set his strength aside. It's just that Lucy -has to- fill the damsel in distress role so often that it makes her seem weaker than she actually is, with a lot of her fights having been against opponents with gimmicky magic that is based around control (Sherry, Vidaldus, Bixlow, Hughes, Zoldeo, Kain).
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Old 2013-08-17, 14:01   Link #11705
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Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
@ Ellifeedn, the majority of the celestial mages was wiped out with the zentopia incident, so Randrak is right on his claim. Still, I wouldn't say celestial mages have been regarded as weak, unless it's Lucy - sounds a bit contradictory, but still: Aquarius and Sagittarius lost (and tied) for the first time only recently, while Taurus' character has been overused to set his strength aside. It's just that Lucy -has to- fill the damsel in distress role so often that it makes her seem weaker than she actually is, with a lot of her fights having been against opponents with gimmicky magic that is based around control (Sherry, Vidaldus, Bixlow, Hughes, Zoldeo, Kain).
it has been said before, Lucy isn't weak just the people she is working is too strong.
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Old 2013-08-17, 14:28   Link #11706
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Celestial Spirit Magic isn't really weak...hell, if used right it can be pretty damn OP.
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Old 2013-08-17, 14:58   Link #11707
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
It's not about gold or silver keys, I believe Yukino was the one who said that she and Lucy were the only two spirit mages left (thus why they ended up being so important later on).
Only two left in the kingdom. There may be others elsewhere in the kingdom, there may be plenty out of the kingdom, but the number of them in Fiore has dropped drastically to the point where Yukino doesn't know of any others active in the kingdom.
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Old 2013-08-17, 15:26   Link #11708
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I wonder if Lucy will ever get the King's key, to summon him.
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Old 2013-08-17, 16:02   Link #11709
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Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
@ Ellifeedn, the majority of the celestial mages was wiped out with the zentopia incident, so Randrak is right on his claim. Still, I wouldn't say celestial mages have been regarded as weak, unless it's Lucy - sounds a bit contradictory, but still: Aquarius and Sagittarius lost (and tied) for the first time only recently, while Taurus' character has been overused to set his strength aside. It's just that Lucy -has to- fill the damsel in distress role so often that it makes her seem weaker than she actually is, with a lot of her fights having been against opponents with gimmicky magic that is based around control (Sherry, Vidaldus, Bixlow, Hughes, Zoldeo, Kain).
Well your wrong about Sagittarius his first lose really would have been against Bixlow back in chapter 114 and Sagittarius really has proven to be pretty useless usually getting taken out before he accomplish anything. And Aquarius she does seem to have a bit of power but it's next to impossible to really gauge her abilities because her tendency to leave shortly after being summoned.

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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
Celestial Spirit Magic isn't really weak...hell, if used right it can be pretty damn OP.
Keep telling yourself that too bad we haven't seen anyone who is powerful. And I mean actually powerful name me one celestial mage could take on someone like Laxus or even Gajeel on head no tricks no sneaky methods.
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Old 2013-08-17, 16:09   Link #11710
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As for Wendy I'd she really has shown some very good growth and it's kind of nice for now at least that her moves are all adaptation's of Natsu's fire ds spells.
To be frank that's not saying much after all Wendy's only had what 4 battles in the manga the entire show before this point. and she's got plenty to grow although her real role is support im surprised nobody's curious what the next chapter is about Return of the demon that seems pretty interesting.
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Old 2013-08-17, 16:10   Link #11711
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Originally Posted by GundamFan View Post
Keep telling yourself that too bad we haven't seen anyone who is powerful. And I mean actually powerful name me one celestial mage could take on someone like Laxus or even Gajeel on head no tricks no sneaky methods.
So far we've only really seen 3 Celestial Mages...just because we haven't seen any so far doesn't mean there aren't any (outside the kingdom).

And it CAN be pretty powerful magic if used right, if Lucy summoned Capricorn, Gemini and Leo for example she'd be calling 3 quite powerful fighters to the field. She just doesn't because Mashima likes to make her a damsel in distress more often than give her fights without a gimmicky enemy or something. Again, I said it COULD be a powerful magic, not that Lucy has or will use it effectively.
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Old 2013-08-17, 16:58   Link #11712
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
So far we've only really seen 3 Celestial Mages...just because we haven't seen any so far doesn't mean there aren't any (outside the kingdom).

And it CAN be pretty powerful magic if used right, if Lucy summoned Capricorn, Gemini and Leo for example she'd be calling 3 quite powerful fighters to the field. She just doesn't because Mashima likes to make her a damsel in distress more often than give her fights without a gimmicky enemy or something. Again, I said it COULD be a powerful magic, not that Lucy has or will use it effectively.
Actually we don't know if those two are all that strong Capricorn has done next to nothing 1 good punch to Hades face who didn't even realize he wasn't still possessed and Leo he's done alright in his fights but he is also been absent during most of the really tough ones like Kain Hikaru.
And yes Celestial Magic is weak because Mashima wants it that way but so what every single character and ability they have in any work of fiction strength or lack there of are defined by the author. Heck the author could start having Romeo come one shot the main villain and save the day if he wanted to doesn't mean it's going to happen and that only seems slightly less likely then us seeing a strong Celestial Mage.

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Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190 View Post
To be frank that's not saying much after all Wendy's only had what 4 battles in the manga the entire show before this point. and she's got plenty to grow although her real role is support im surprised nobody's curious what the next chapter is about Return of the demon that seems pretty interesting.
Actaully it would be 5 battles and a match against Chelia that's she's fought in. Personally I'm hoping they have start having her use moves similar to Erigor wind blades.

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Old 2013-08-17, 17:14   Link #11713
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
So far we've only really seen 3 Celestial Mages...just because we haven't seen any so far doesn't mean there aren't any (outside the kingdom).

And it CAN be pretty powerful magic if used right, if Lucy summoned Capricorn, Gemini and Leo for example she'd be calling 3 quite powerful fighters to the field. She just doesn't because Mashima likes to make her a damsel in distress more often than give her fights without a gimmicky enemy or something. Again, I said it COULD be a powerful magic, not that Lucy has or will use it effectively.
But doesn't she have all but one of the Zodiac keys which are considered the most powerful summonings? I guess its possible that there is a key for the Celestial King, but from what we've been shown, Lucy has the majority of the best keys.

As for being powerful, Celestial does have the potential to be powerful and her last two defeats had nothing to do with the effectiveness of her summons. She had her power sucked out with Flare and her keys got swiped with Minerva. To be an effective Celestial Mage requires more tactical skill than pure brute force, she somewhat demonstrated that in her fight against Flare, but beyond that I don't find Lucy to be much of a tactician. At this time all she really does in a standard fight is just toss out whatever summoning she thinks is best for a given situation then let them handle what they need to do themselves. She definitely has room for improvement. I can't say she'd ever compare to Natsu or any other dragonslayer. He is the main character for one and two, that magic does seem to be the most powerful in regards to pure brute force. However that doesn't mean she couldn't defeat him, if she would be smart and approach the fight tactically using his weaknesses against him.
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Old 2013-08-17, 18:01   Link #11714
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Actually we don't know if those two are all that strong Capricorn has done next to nothing 1 good punch to Hades face who didn't even realize he wasn't still possessed and Leo he's done alright in his fights but he is also been absent during most of the really tough ones like Kain Hikaru.
And yes Celestial Magic is weak because Mashima wants it that way but so what every single character and ability they have in any work of fiction strength or lack there of are defined by the author. Heck the author could start having Romeo come one shot the main villain and save the day if he wanted to doesn't mean it's going to happen and that only seems slightly less likely then us seeing a strong Celestial Mage.
Correction, Mashima is making LUCY (and Yukino as well) look weak...he's not making Celestial Spirit Magic weak. How good or bad a character is at using a certain type of magic means nothing about that type's potential.
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Old 2013-08-17, 18:45   Link #11715
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
Correction, Mashima is making LUCY (and Yukino as well) look weak...he's not making Celestial Spirit Magic weak. How good or bad a character is at using a certain type of magic means nothing about that type's potential.
And I don't see much potential there either the spirits themselves seem to be designed for comic relief for the most part and frequently used for fodder. That's not to say that it couldn't change we could see some new sets of rare keys or some descent silver ones if the author wanted. Of course the new rare keys there would need to be more then 1 of each because that's another problem with the magic the only Spirits we have seen with any real independent combat capabilities there is only 1 of each.
I'd say Angel proves it's pretty weak when it comes to direct combat at least she seemed to be quite skilled with it and also the sort who would be massacred if she ever tried to take a strong mage head on.
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Old 2013-08-17, 19:39   Link #11716
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Fine, as you wish...it's a crappy magic type, what a shame.
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Old 2013-08-18, 17:57   Link #11717
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Heh, Lucy/Summoner-type magic sucks because she/they can't tank bosses... Sounds like every MMORPG I've been on that had summoner-type classes. Duh, of course they suck for that sort of thing - That's what the tanks are for (Erza, Elfman, etc).

The top twenty in Fairy Tail all are capable of taking on entire guilds now - yes, even Lucy. She took out Naked Mummy on her own, in canon no less. Fairy Tail's power scheme is NOT the norm for the average power of a guild - they are waaay above it, along with Lamia, Pegasus, and the others. If you want to say that the Celestial magic sucks, that's cool. Just because it doesn't score as highly in mook kills and boss kills as Erza's 'The Knight' or 'Dragon Slayer', or even 'Ice Alchemy, it doesn't make it a 'strong' magic. I mean, who in their right mind would race an SUV, or even a truck, against a Camero...? So...what's the use of bashing SUVs in a racing environment?

Long and short of it all - Celestial magic wasn't made for taking down Guild Master-lvl or Saint-lvl opponents, so it's pretty useless to compare it to magic that can. You're going outside the scope of its intended usage and for Lucy's intention in using her Celestial Spirits in the first place. I bet a fair number of people knew this already.
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Old 2013-08-19, 19:16   Link #11718
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Every magic has its ups and downs, there is no better or worse than, here. Granted some of the characters who have used these magics have gotten the short end of the stick when it comes to fights, this should not be used as a comparison to what magic is best, at least for the good guy side. It's better if you flat out admit that you hate the character more than said character's magic.
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Old 2013-08-21, 00:53   Link #11719
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I just realized: what if the next chapter will see the return of the remnants of Grimoire Heart? I wouldn't be surprised if it was, since the Japanese title uses the word "Akuma", just like how Grimoire Heart's name is written in kanji (Akuma no Shinzou, or "Devil's Heart"), and it's been known since the beginning of the last arc that such remnants are still at large. I'd bet that they'd be members of Succubus Eye, or are in league with them. If that's the case, then this arc really would be a breath of fresh air, because villains of a specific arc usually end up coming back as good guys in this series. Minerva already deviates from that pattern by seeking revenge (seriously, how many villains in this series have come back for revenge?), and this would be a nice continuation of that.
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Old 2013-08-21, 17:14   Link #11720
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Grimoire Heart...? The Seven Kin coming back?

Lessee...

Ultear - Retired (Granny) >.>

Meredy - New life and new Onii-san

Kain - Got Zeref'ed (dead...?)

Rusty Rose - Zeref'ed (same as Kain)

Asuma - New Tenroujima

Zancrow - Zeref'ed (dead - confirmed)

Bluenote - Blasted off (most likely alive)
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