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Old 2013-07-24, 16:43   Link #3721
SummeryDreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zakoo View Post
There's really something I don't manage to catch, it's the double negation, for example :

時間がないじゃないか

more or less translated as "we don't have any time". Not only I don't remember seeing such a sentence in english but I don't even understand the path of translation.

I would have been jikan ga nai desu. I would have understood "we have no time" but with the double negation it becomes weird.

Tasuketeeee
It's not a double negation, the meaning of that is, We have no time, isn't it? japanese words are used with different meanings depending on the situation, with regards to that phrase, janai and desu was used as a substitute for the word deshou.. Though, it will be a wrong grammar if you will take away ka in there, I believe Japanese don't use double negation just like in English, not 100% sure though as I haven't seen a source. xD
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Old 2013-07-24, 17:59   Link #3722
Avatar of Dreams
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No, you can drop the ka if you want.

Also "We have no time, isn't it?" isn't correct English.
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Old 2013-07-25, 03:59   Link #3723
Kafriel
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^ 'Isn't it?' is indeed wrong, 'no?' would be a better substitute to seek confirmation through interrogative negation, but in that case it would be proper to say 'we are out of time' so as to avoid using 'no' in its original form, i.e. negation.
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Old 2013-07-25, 15:28   Link #3724
Malkuth
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I don't think one should drop the "ka" at the end when speaking, but I could be wrong... In any case, like when using english equivelant, it's better to avoid such manner of speech that lacks logical interpretation, it's very likely to confuse non-native speakers, as well as much more likely to say something unintended as one.
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Old 2013-07-25, 17:43   Link #3725
Avatar of Dreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
I don't think one should drop the "ka" at the end when speaking, but I could be wrong...
いいじゃない

Adding the ka is more of a male thing though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
In any case, like when using english equivelant, it's better to avoid such manner of speech that lacks logical interpretation, it's very likely to confuse non-native speakers, as well as much more likely to say something unintended as one.
Agreed. I wouldn't even bother translating じゃない unless it's clear that's it more of an interrogative rather than just an assertion.
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Old 2013-07-25, 18:14   Link #3726
TwilightsCall
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Dropping 'ka' is fine. As it is, the sentence is fairly rigid as far as interpretation is concerned, so dropping the question particle doesn't change the meaning of the sentence. The reason being, with almost any intonational nuance you give it, the overall meaning doesn't change (the flavour will change, but it still boils down to 'we don't have time.')

Spoiler for Unnecessary and barely related:




Quote:
Originally Posted by erneiz_hyde
I guess it's similar to the English "isn't it?". Only, afaik in Japanese there's no hard rule you have to end with "isn't it?" for positive sentences or vice versa like in English (btw what do you call this in English again? stressing?)
This is called a 'Tag Question' in English.
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Old 2013-07-28, 14:52   Link #3727
Dextro
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I've been trying to get back into learning Japanese and recently found this website called WaniKani that helps with learning Kanji. I've been enjoying it quite a bit. It gives you radicals and Kanji to learn and then tests you and won't let you go forward until you get them right a set number of times. It also tries to tie them into mnemonics but I find that to be the weaker part of the site (I've been a tripped by them a couple of times already. I think the fact that I'm not a native English speaker renders some of them useless for me since they depend on similar sounding English words to make the connection).
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Old 2013-07-28, 17:13   Link #3728
SummeryDreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dextro View Post
I've been trying to get back into learning Japanese and recently found this website called WaniKani that helps with learning Kanji. I've been enjoying it quite a bit. It gives you radicals and Kanji to learn and then tests you and won't let you go forward until you get them right a set number of times. It also tries to tie them into mnemonics but I find that to be the weaker part of the site (I've been a tripped by them a couple of times already. I think the fact that I'm not a native English speaker renders some of them useless for me since they depend on similar sounding English words to make the connection).
Then I guess it is a bad idea as not all people are native English speakers.. I want to improve my Japanese as well, but because of my everyday routine, I can't seem to learn fast, rather slowly.
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Old 2013-07-28, 17:33   Link #3729
Zakoo
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I use japaneseclass.jp/ personally, it's quite well done, especially the practice part that resets each days and force you to do it. ( or more like you force yourself to do it everydays)

I'm at level 5, the kanji given are between JPLT 2 and 1.

And since I spend more or less 2 hours in train everydays, I use the obenkyo application for androids, this one is badass as hell, grammar lessons, kanji quizz ( find the meaning from the kanji, the opposite, or draw the kanji from the kun and on readings) and vocabulary. The tests can be random, random weighted. Really if it wasn't for this app, I would have never learnt all the kyoiku kanjis.
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Old 2013-07-28, 20:30   Link #3730
Mystique
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時間がないじゃないか

If I had to translate it from an anime or some drama, depending on the scene, it'd roughly translate into:

But we don't have any time, right?
But we don't have any time, do we?
But there's no time left.

(the tag 'じゃないか') doesn't always have to be translated in English but makes the sentence in Japanese softer.

Yes, these are called 'Tag Questions' as someone mentioned above, to be honest we don't use them that often in daily conversation as much as Japanese people do (to always seek affirmation or mutual (group) agreement)

In the West, we're more happy to proclaim our individual thoughts and disagree with another opinion for healthy discussion, lol
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Old 2013-08-19, 15:53   Link #3731
Gundamx
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I guess it something like
we don't have any time don't we?
or
that not to say we don't have anytime
or
it's not possible we don't have anytime right?

anyway, it's easier if you copy the line before it and the one after it

By the way... why Japanese like to use more than one word for same think?
sometime almost in same page...
example 独り and 一人

some time they use 3-4 word with same meaning but different kanji reading close to each other... do they enjoy making my life harder or something?
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Old 2013-08-19, 17:32   Link #3732
Avatar of Dreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gundamx View Post
By the way... why Japanese like to use more than one word for same think?
sometime almost in same page...
example 独り and 一人

some time they use 3-4 word with same meaning but different kanji reading close to each other... do they enjoy making my life harder or something?
The kanji 独 is used in words that carry a sense of solitude or isolation like in 独学, 孤独, etc.
This nuance transfers over to 独り, giving it a feeling of loneliness.

In contrast 一人 lacks suck emotion and merely expresses singularity.

Because their pronunciation is the same the only time you will see one used over the other is when they are written. In that case the author may make a stylistic decision depending on what he/she wishes to convey. This is one of the many nuances in Japanese that gets lost when translated into English. So no, it is not only there to make your life harder.
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Old 2013-08-20, 16:04   Link #3733
Gundamx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams View Post
The kanji 独 is used in words that carry a sense of solitude or isolation like in 独学, 孤独, etc.
This nuance transfers over to 独り, giving it a feeling of loneliness.

In contrast 一人 lacks suck emotion and merely expresses singularity.

Because their pronunciation is the same the only time you will see one used over the other is when they are written. In that case the author may make a stylistic decision depending on what he/she wishes to convey. This is one of the many nuances in Japanese that gets lost when translated into English. So no, it is not only there to make your life harder.
I see... Thanks

I guess I really need to start moving from Japanese-English dictionary to Japanese-Japanese dictionary
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Old 2013-12-13, 06:59   Link #3734
Yu Ominae
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Been trying to get back to making sure my Japanese isn't dead.

I need to double check on how to check on which reading to use when reading kanji (I can read a few just fine). I'm not sure if it's through the kun'yomi or the on'yomi.
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Old 2014-01-21, 20:26   Link #3735
Seitsuki
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So I was reading something totally innocuous and came across something interesting: the girl referred to herself as ウチ and spoke in a particular way saying stuff like 気持ええ. Is this the fabled Kansai/Osakan dialect I've heard about?
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Old 2014-03-24, 00:53   Link #3736
Yu Ominae
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Old man decided to make me take a Japanese assessment test and I found out that I failed.

Didn't help that I haven't taken any follow up course for long that he told me to take an online course for now until I can find classes in Manila before going to Waseda.
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Old 2014-03-25, 23:51   Link #3737
kuroishinigami
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seitsuki View Post
So I was reading something totally innocuous and came across something interesting: the girl referred to herself as ウチ and spoke in a particular way saying stuff like 気持ええ. Is this the fabled Kansai/Osakan dialect I've heard about?
Yep, that's the fabled Osakan dialect.
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Old 2014-04-01, 15:40   Link #3738
Dopplegeist
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How do you write "ten thousand lifetimes" in Japanese?

I know the phrase "banzai" which is 10,000 years, but that's not quite the same.

What I came up with is 万生 - 10,000 and a counter for lifetimes. However, there's some question as to whether a Japanese audience would recognize it as "ten thousand lifetimes" because the counter appears to not be in routine use?

DG
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Old 2014-04-01, 21:53   Link #3739
erneiz_hyde
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万世 is the term you're looking for.

I'm not sure if 万生 is an actual proper term, but it sounds closer to "all living being".
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Old 2014-04-01, 22:28   Link #3740
Avatar of Dreams
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万世 is just a colloquialism for "eternity."

I think Dopplegeist just wants to say 10,000 lifetimes exactly which in case I guess you could attach 生 (should be 一万生 by the way) like the well known proverb, 猫に九生有り.

生 is technically not a counter though and I could see it causing some confusion if you just say 一万生. I would just say 一万の生涯 to be more clear.

Last edited by Avatar of Dreams; 2014-04-01 at 22:53.
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