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Old 2014-03-28, 20:06   Link #5961
Nakama
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
Compared to how many master's Kenichi has learned from? Oh wait, it's more like should have...
Kajima's two masters are better then the Ryou masters.

Every time a big fight is coming up Hayato trains him and teaches him a new technique, or skill. That technique usually ends up being one of kenichi's most spammed technique's and the reason he can he survive against opponents who are much stronger then him.

Without Ryuusui Seikuken and Korui Nuki Kenichi is significantly weaker, and would have died a long time ago(especially with Ryuusui Seikuken).

1 Hayato level fighter > 5 Ryou master level people

Saiga is approaching, if not already Hayato level. Even if he's weaker, he's still got to be stronger then any of the Ryou masters.

And Senzui is apparently the strongest martial artist among the Kuremisago. The Kuremisago are a bunch of martial freaks with god level genes, and he's the strongest among them. Meaning there a good chance he's Hayato level too.

Miu who is the strongest disciple we've seen up until this point uses furinji style and Kuremisago techniques.

Kajima uses both as well.

2 Hayato level fighters who probably use the 2 strongest marital arts style on earth > 1 Hayato level fighter and 5 Ryou masters

Quality > Quantity

It makes sense Kajima is stronger. His masters are better.
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Old 2014-03-28, 20:44   Link #5962
bludvein
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I wouldn't say his masters are better. It hardly matters who is stronger, but who has better training methods. Kenichi has Akisame and Elder on his side.

It's just a matter of time spent and basic specs. Even if Kenichi trains much harder(which is sort of ambiguous), he has been training for less than 2 years. Of course he is at a massive disadvantage compared to someone who has received comparable training from infancy.
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Old 2014-03-28, 20:59   Link #5963
Endscape
The Mage of Four Hearts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvein View Post
I wouldn't say his masters are better. It hardly matters who is stronger, but who has better training methods. Kenichi has Akisame and Elder on his side.
Not to mention, Kajima's techniques are out of Kenichi's experience, which is what's giving him the most trouble. Kenichi's a slow starter, and he's usually does worse initially when running into unfamiliar techniques.

Quote:
It's just a matter of time spent and basic specs. Even if Kenichi trains much harder(which is sort of ambiguous), he has been training for less than 2 years. Of course he is at a massive disadvantage compared to someone who has received comparable training from infancy.
Honestly, Kenichi's been beating people like that the whole manga though.
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Old 2014-03-28, 21:05   Link #5964
aliasxn
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^

Pretty much. Not only do we not know how strong Senzui is, but there's no correlation between the power of the master and disciple. It's more like Kenichi has been training for 2 years whereas everybody else have been training their whole lives, he's bound to hit a road bump like this from time to time.
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Old 2014-03-28, 21:07   Link #5965
bludvein
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Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
Not to mention, Kajima's techniques are out of Kenichi's experience, which is what's giving him the most trouble. Kenichi's a slow starter, and he's usually does worse initially when running into unfamiliar techniques.



Honestly, Kenichi's been beating people like that the whole manga though.
I didn't say it was insurmountable, but there is no doubt he is massively losing in the experience department. He hasn't had the time to run into such a wide variety of fighters like Yomi's members have. So Kenichi usually has to get specialized training before his fights, by borrowing from his masters' experiences to make up the difference. He didn't get that this time, and his disadvantage is brought to the forefront.
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Old 2014-03-29, 02:10   Link #5966
KLGChaos
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Plot twist. Kajima kills Kenichi and the Yami wins. The end.

Just kind of sucks that we wait 200+ chapters for Kenichi to finally have a real fight and you already know he's going to lose, which means we'll have to wait another 200+ chapters to see him actually get back into the swing of things and possibly have a chance of winning. In the meantime, it'll continue to be History's Strongest Masters.

Again, unless there's a major time skip, Kenichi's progress is going nowhere and while I've been waiting for this fight for a long time, it's whole purpose is just to show how weak Kenichi actually is. Once this Ryou vs Yami plot is done, they need to get back to focusing on raising the disciples instead of on a world threatening plot that they have no use in.
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Old 2014-03-31, 00:59   Link #5967
noktown
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
Plot twist. Kajima kills Kenichi and the Yami wins. The end.

Just kind of sucks that we wait 200+ chapters for Kenichi to finally have a real fight and you already know he's going to lose, which means we'll have to wait another 200+ chapters to see him actually get back into the swing of things and possibly have a chance of winning. In the meantime, it'll continue to be History's Strongest Masters.

Again, unless there's a major time skip, Kenichi's progress is going nowhere and while I've been waiting for this fight for a long time, it's whole purpose is just to show how weak Kenichi actually is. Once this Ryou vs Yami plot is done, they need to get back to focusing on raising the disciples instead of on a world threatening plot that they have no use in.
It's been always like this in the manga,the audience thinks "Damn,Kenichi must be so strong now",then a new villain is introduced who's supposedly master level,beats the crap out of Kenichi,but Kenichi remembers something cool and manages to make a come back and win.And then the audience thinks "That's it this time he's so strong",and a new villain is introduced....and it goes on and on.
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Old 2014-04-04, 19:37   Link #5968
Alhazad2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
Plot twist. Kajima kills Kenichi and the Yami wins. The end.

Just kind of sucks that we wait 200+ chapters for Kenichi to finally have a real fight and you already know he's going to lose, which means we'll have to wait another 200+ chapters to see him actually get back into the swing of things and possibly have a chance of winning. In the meantime, it'll continue to be History's Strongest Masters.

Again, unless there's a major time skip, Kenichi's progress is going nowhere and while I've been waiting for this fight for a long time, it's whole purpose is just to show how weak Kenichi actually is. Once this Ryou vs Yami plot is done, they need to get back to focusing on raising the disciples instead of on a world threatening plot that they have no use in.
Who said he was going to lose? I'm sure people said the same thing when he fought against Kanou Shou, yet he won regardless. Shou was the opposite of everything Kenichi believed in, so he made the perfect opponent. Now, he's up against an essentially evil version of himself, who'll undoubtedly give him his toughest fight yet. But don't count out Kenichi yet, Kajima made a big mistake by explaining how his powers worked, that's sending up a loser flag right there. Don't be surprised if Kajima goes down in this fight, considering the stakes I doubt Kenichi will get a rematch, so he must win. Losing is really not an option.
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Old 2014-04-04, 21:48   Link #5969
Yorae_paladin1
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True Kajima made a fatal error he revealed his secrets to the enemy
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Old 2014-04-04, 22:44   Link #5970
KLGChaos
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I just don't see Kenichi winning against Kajima. So much has been made of him being more than disciple class and given the power rankings in this manga, even the lowest of masters can destroy a small army of disciples. And it's not like Kenichi has done much in the last 200 chapters. We'll see.
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Old 2014-04-04, 23:01   Link #5971
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
I just don't see Kenichi winning against Kajima. So much has been made of him being more than disciple class and given the power rankings in this manga, even the lowest of masters can destroy a small army of disciples. And it's not like Kenichi has done much in the last 200 chapters. We'll see.
Kajima hasn't gotten nearly the buildup that Kanou got, and Kenichi still managed to win against him, so where's the doubt coming from?
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Old 2014-04-04, 23:03   Link #5972
hamazura
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when i read this manga, i only expecting nipple slip, i dont even know any character in this manga
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Old 2014-04-05, 03:56   Link #5973
Alhazad2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
I just don't see Kenichi winning against Kajima. So much has been made of him being more than disciple class and given the power rankings in this manga, even the lowest of masters can destroy a small army of disciples. And it's not like Kenichi has done much in the last 200 chapters. We'll see.
Unless he's explicitly stated in the story to be an expert, I would call Kajima a slightly better disciple, just like Kenichi. If he was an expert, he wouldn't need training from Saiga and Senzui, he'd be working his way to becoming a master in his own right. Not to mention YOMI is explicitly comprised of disciples.
So I seriously doubt Kajima's an expert, there's only been two known experts in the story, and neither were Kajima. So I say it's not as hopeless as you might be inclined to believe. Until next time...
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Old 2014-04-05, 04:46   Link #5974
Ultragunner
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one of the reasons why Kenichi feels so hopeless is because Kajima is different from the other Yomi members. Unlike them who are all prodigies selected by the top of the top masters around the world, the prime example is Shou. Kajima is no genius (or at least he says so ), but he still managed to push through all that, just like how Kenichi has.

As of the moment, he appears to be clearly stronger than Kenichi. What would you feel if your opponent is the stronger version of you yourself and he determines to annihilate you? I think everyone including me would freak out
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Old 2014-04-05, 16:38   Link #5975
Randrak42
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: By the vending machine, drinking tea.
You know...for a group of "Killer Fist" users, there seems to be no killing going on, even when they defeat a master class opponent.
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Old 2014-04-05, 16:56   Link #5976
SoloPanda
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Kenichi doesn't really have to beat him. The objective isn't to win these fights but to get to the base and do the computer stuff to stop the eternal sunset or whatever its called. Kenichi just has to hold his own until someone can get that done and even if he loses at that point then his side wins the battle and he can start training for the next fight with the guy.

I think it will end in a relative draw with the Yomi leader yelling, "I'll get you next time Gadget!!!" or something similar when they can't finish the fight.
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Old 2014-04-05, 17:18   Link #5977
Yorae_paladin1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
You know...for a group of "Killer Fist" users, there seems to be no killing going on, even when they defeat a master class opponent.
they seem to be trying to convince the ryozanpaku warriors there way is wrong and theres is right hell Mikumo has come up with a twisted philosophy if humans do not battle there worthless saying peace and tranquility is worthless and conflict is humanities true nature
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Old 2014-04-05, 19:06   Link #5978
Shadow5YA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
You know...for a group of "Killer Fist" users, there seems to be no killing going on, even when they defeat a master class opponent.
Agaard fatally wounded Apachai. They just happened to make a cop out later by reviving him with the POWER OF MODERN MEDICINE.

Ogata killed Tanaka.

Hongo also killed Jenazad.
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Old 2014-04-05, 19:14   Link #5979
SoloPanda
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Agaard fatally wounded Apachai. They just happened to make a cop out later by reviving him with the POWER OF MODERN MEDICINE.

Ogata killed Tanaka.

Hongo also killed Jenazad.
and most importantly

Matsuena Syun killed HSDK


..... sorry... the temptation was too great
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Old 2014-04-05, 20:02   Link #5980
Mach56gs
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I remember reading this manga.

Boy did it change.
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