Yuri/Yaoi goggles are OK.

[Archon_Wing]

Though I wonder how much of this is do the shallowness of relationships in fiction and their likelihood of success. Naturally homosexual relationships have an even lower rate.

I mean it's definitely stupid to ship characters solely because of their sexuality, but it's arguably more dumb to ship someone because the other person is a tsundere, or they met each other for 5 minutes when they were children. But of course, that doesn't seem to be questioned as much.

There are definitely fetishistic and novelty desires around. If Chikane Himeya, Shizuru Fujino, or Homura Akemi were dudes involved in heterosexual ships, would they be so easily accepted, lol? But does it drain it of all meaning? Yosuga no Sora certainly fetishized everything it was involved in, but it doesn't mean it was mutually exclusive without having any kind of meaning when it came to incest. I mean, it is ultimately fiction and sometimes fantasy, so....

Perhaps I just despise teasing and stalling in general, especially without meaning. It's honestly very plausible, but when something is placed there and simply causes the story to be stuck in the mud when there's more interesting thing to go over, it gets frustrating. Stuff like Shigatsu, Shana, and pretty much everything Mari Okada writes was probably permanently damaged the show because of romantic potholes (not plotholes).

But on the other hand, there are these times when the writers dig themselves such a hole where you don't need goggles, in fact you'd probably be blind not to see it in which all kinds of things are tossed in your face that if an equivalent hetero couple did it, people would call you in denial to the point that it might just be insulting the audience. While something like Madoka is ambigious, I would say something like Nanoha, for all intents and purpose isn't, unless they felt like wasting everyone's time (which isn't unlikely I guess).

Better pander to one set right, then to pander to everyone and pleasing nobody. I would accuse the half hearted romantic maneuvers to be the later.

[shmaster]

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

Meanwhile, I speak for myself. I find the misrepresentation of characters silly, if not outright offensive. And I find it deeply ironic that I'm apparently not allowed to say that I find it offensive, without being accused of offending other people in return.

I... uh.....
I mean, I can understand how you can't stand the fetishist. They are the equivalent of the angry moe otaku mobs of our circles, who are outright obnoxious.
But can you not act as if you know what we think? Misinterpretation? You don't even know what our interpretations are, on what ground you are calling us for misinterpreting?

So no, this is not about me not allowing you to be offended. But rather, can you stop labeling us through the use of assumptions in proving your case?

Really, we know our hobbies are not commonly accepted by everyon and that's why the more hardcore of us the more deeply in to the closet we are. So if you don't like us, by all mean. But please don't do it through saying as if we did something not right.

[GDiddy]

Isn't this just fanfiction?

[ahelo]

I would agree with the sentiments here most of the time. I mean in most cases, why force two characters who probably aren't gay to be gay. But there are a few instances where that isn't the case. I guess one of the questions I'm posing is, is the character suddenly so much different if he/she is gay? Is the character ruined then?

[Darthtabby]

A lot of people like yuri relationships because they find them interesting and compelling. That's not to say that people finding girlxgirl hot isn't a factor, but it isn't the sole reason people like yuri relationships.

As for Sound! Euphonium, I'm not convinced that Reina and Kumiko have the hots for each other. On the other hand, I think their interactions in Episode 8 made for one of the most compelling romantic scenes I've seen in anime recently. I don't feel people who want the two of them to be a couple are disrespecting the work by doing so, though there have been a few times where I think the discussion has focused too much on shipping. The yuri-shippers have been involved in discussions about other aspects of the show however, as where their most obnoxious critic concentrated on almost nothing but (the guy in question has been banned from this board, but he's still spamming the comments section of a blog I sometimes read).

[IceHism]

I don't really get the title of this thread though. Goggles imply that you are deliberately looking for such details that support what you want. You are just as likely to start over analyzing the work and to start making statements on flimsy reasoning from elements that are not very important.

I don't ship romantically usually since if they were a couple, then i wouldn't need to ship them at all. They'd just be a couple in story. I prefer to do so platonic-ally between people with very deep friendships. Though of course, i'm probably alone in this so i'll take the other way for arguments sake.

Anyways, these sorts of shippings tend to throw out the logic of the story anyways. They're meant to satisfy the imagination and i guess this is how doujinshi is usually born. I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't think gender or sexual orientation matters that much either in this sort of discussion. The main problem is probably when fans start to make their headcanon / fanon and trying to proclaim that it is true. I suppose that is where I start disapproving of it.

[Akito Kinomoto]

Let me put this as simply as possible:

I have certain preferences for what I want to ship and ogle in fanworks, but that does not interfere with my assessment of the characters in the story proper. So you'll have to excuse me if I call out people for making assessment S when there's far more evidence for assessment H. And no, I don't need to grow a thicker skin; some people need to grow a thinner skull.

[DustHalls]

Originally Posted by IceHism

Anyways, these sorts of shippings tend to throw out the logic of the story anyways. They're meant to satisfy the imagination and i guess this is how doujinshi is usually born. I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't think gender or sexual orientation matters that much either in this sort of discussion.

Exactly. Those who insist that their homosexual headcanons are canon because they looked at each other once or whatever and then are genuinely surprised when it turned out not to be that way are a very vocal minority, from my experience. Usually people with self-professed yaoi/yuri goggles know full well that there's little to no chance of it actually happening in the show. They're just playing around with ideas by making up scenarios with something they find appealing. Basically fanfiction. That's the nature of shipping.

It's not that hard to get, really. To explain it to non-romance fans, I'd compare it to a superhero fan trying to think who'd win a fight between, say, Batman and Ironman. There's no way a scenario like that will come up, ever, and most non-fans will only see it as an exercise in futility. But the superhero fan only engages in all these speculative scenarios because of the pleasure of it. It's fun. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

Now, as a yuri fan myself, I'll admit that it's much more fun to ship two characters who have chemistry than two who don't. Like a pair of characters who, if they got together, it wouldn't really feel outside the scope of possibility. And I don't think that I'm the only one like this. This is probably a trait all shippers share, regardless of whether they are yuri fans, yaoi fans, or if they simply like het ships. That's also probably the reason why shows like Free! are so popular with yaoi fans, for example. There's a bunch of guys who share deep relationships with each other, and really, everyone knows that none of them will get together at all. But there's also no indication that they're interested strictly in girls, so who's to say that they're not gay/bisexual? That's the ideal scenario for a yaoi shipper, I imagine, because they're free to imagine scenarios for whatever coupling they want and there's still some degree of believability to it.

That's the way I see it, at least. Or maybe I've been playing too many visual novels and got too used to the idea of "any of these different romance options are possible under the right circumstances."

What I don't understand is how someone can get so frustrated and irritated over people... shipping fictional characters? Now THAT'S something that doesn't make any sense to me.

@ the Hibike! Euhphonium's ReinaxKumiko debate, well, I don't think this one has much to do with shipping. I don't like them together, even as a yuri fan, because I really dislike Reina's character, so I'd be cheering if Kumiko didn't end up with her, but all their scenes seemed awfully romantic to me. To compare it to a favorite canon couple of mine, most of the Reina/Kumiko scenes were way, way, way more romantic than anything that Tomoya and Nagisa from Clannad shared before he confessed his love to her, and nobody found it unbelievable when he did, right? Shippers complained because they liked him better with any of the other girls, but the romance itself? Everyone agrees it was there. This is why I find it really weird how anyone could have such a hard time seeing how some might find Kumiko and Reina's relationship romantic. Even if you see it as friendship (which it may very well be) it may also easily be romantic.

And what about this: even if Reina declares to have a crush on a male character, there's still the chance that she might be bisexual. There's nothing to prove she's not, yet. So interpreting her as strictly straight is based on as many assumptions as interpreting her as bisexual, right?

What I mean is, even if Reina got together with Taki-sensei in episode 13, if I read a fanfiction describing an alternate ending where she got together with Kumiko instead, I wouldn't find it a completely unlikely scenario, or that it "completely destroys their character", or anything like that even if I don't like the pairing myself.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by DustHalls

Exactly. Those who insist that their homosexual headcanons are canon because they looked at each other once or whatever and then are genuinely surprised when it turned out not to be that way are a very vocal minority, from my experience. Usually people with self-professed yaoi/yuri goggles know full well that there's little to no chance of it actually happening in the show. They're just playing around with ideas by making up scenarios with something they find appealing. Basically fanfiction. That's the nature of shipping.

It's not that hard to get, really. To explain it to non-romance fans, I'd compare it to a superhero fan trying to think who'd win a fight between, say, Batman and Ironman. There's no way a scenario like that will come up, ever, and most non-fans will only see it as an exercise in futility. But the superhero fan only engages in all these speculative scenarios because of the pleasure of it. It's fun. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

Now, as a yuri fan myself, I'll admit that it's much more fun to ship two characters who have chemistry than two who don't. Like a pair of characters who, if they got together, it wouldn't really feel outside the scope of possibility. And I don't think that I'm the only one like this. This is probably a trait all shippers share, regardless of whether they are yuri fans, yaoi fans, or if they simply like het ships. That's also probably the reason why shows like Free! are so popular with yaoi fans, for example. There's a bunch of guys who share deep relationships with each other, and really, everyone knows that none of them will get together at all. But there's also no indication that they're interested strictly in girls, so who's to say that they're not gay/bisexual? That's the ideal scenario for a yaoi shipper, I imagine, because they're free to imagine scenarios for whatever coupling they want and there's still some degree of believability to it.

That's the way I see it, at least. Or maybe I've been playing too many visual novels and got too used to the idea of "any of these different romance options are possible under the right circumstances."

Agree with a lot (if not all) of things you put up here. I can't say about yaoi, but on yuri shipping, one of the best thing about shipping is its subtle nature. You look at the most famous yuri shipping fanbase: FatexNanoha, Touhou, Kantai and the Madoka series.... and all of them are subtle as heck. Much like harem show, or shounen romantic. The idea is once you put in on as canon, it put the closure of the relationship. So in someway, shows with yuri/yaoi shipping materials has quite a different appeal with shows that involves romance of two homosexual characters. Much like a thriller movie has different appeal with just seeing ghosts running around chopping people head off.

Many failed to realise that, and always ask why do people ship characters without them being confirmed to be homosexual. Yes, true. But why people getting scared without the movie actually showed the ghosts? Same thing really.


Do i feel irritated when shippers just ship 2 random guys or girls together? I do actually. But it isn't any different from the irritation some had when see people argue over the fight betweenSuperman and the Hulk. Or feminist irritated when see guys discuss about their favourite waifu. Or fans of a series worshipped its Mary Sue. It isn't different one bit honestly. I means the realistic chance of ReinaxKumiko to happen must be way more than Marvel and DC universes actually merged (or anime fans drool over a feminist's designed character )

[Kotohono]

I'll freely admit I enjoy time to time which I feel there is reasonable chemistry, bond, and closeness between characters in combination of other interactions.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

<snip>

This post made me roll my eyes and just sounds absolutely ridiculous and outlandish to me, and I am member of the LGBT community .

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

Frankly, I find it offensive, in ways I can't adequately describe.

There's an element of fetishism to such views about character relationships that irritates me, but that doesn't fully explain why I don't like such apparently off-tangent interpretations.

The knee-jerk reaction would be to see it as the unwarranted imposition of foreign liberal perspectives on a local culture. But then, I'm aware that the Japanese fans themselves indulge in such fantasies, so who am I to judge?

And of course, there will probably by many who disapprove of my view, and quickly accuse me of homophobia. I would deny that, but I don't think such denials would convince such people.

Seriously you're calling it offensive, when you're probably straight yourself and probably shipped het pairings before at some point . So yea I am as an LGBT person I am going to call your sorta of reaction is as completely homophobic and say you're being offensive because that's how it feels to me personally. Because it feels like you want to say "It's ok to hetship before confessions or crushing because it's the majority and ok to assume, but not yuri/yaoi ships it needs to be canon or not at all because it's a minority." or something without saying it directly in your post.

To deny otherwise is irrational unless you're going to tell me that you never ship characters which is difficult to believe.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

So, I prefer to keep my peace, for the most part.

I think what irritates me the most of such fetishism is that it smacks of cultural imperialism: "We're okay with homosexuality, and anything that looks like romantic attraction between two people of the same sex must be homosexuality, and we want to celebrate it! How dare you disagree with us? Anyone who thinks otherwise is a horrible troll and can go stew in some place dark and unpleasant."

And again Hetero shippers are never guilty of shipping to the extreme or over something minor? And most people don't ship to that extreme, I certainly don't to that level, and even if they do, they're ussually well aware that those characters won't actually be gay in such extreme cases.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

Coming from a culture where it's quite normal to see grown, heterosexual Indian men hold hands when they go out, because that's what they like to do, I cannot fathom why every such innocent behaviour in anime has to be automatically seen as fujoshi-baiting. It's just a different culture, that's all. Don't read too much into it.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

You don't have to take my word for it. It happens often enough that other people ask me about it, prompting me to ask Indian friends about such behaviour. I wouldn't even have noticed it otherwise. It's just friendship. That's how it's expressed among some Indian men. There's nothing remarkable about it, other than the potential misunderstanding it may cause among some Singaporeans.

Your own ignorance of culture is showing right now.

You claim they're "heterosexual" but India is extremely against homosexuality culturally right now, so you can't know their actually that way if they appear since it's very dangerous to come out there so only very few do at all, especially when coming out is met with absurd outcomes (including "correctional rape" by family members) and many are forced into arranged marriages from parents despite knowledge of their sexuality so even marriage doesn't prove anything there at all now. They could be closeted cause of the culture for all you know.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

The market is what it is. And the industry does whatever it has to do to survive. But I, for one, would very much prefer that producers do not resort to such low-hanging fruit when it comes to portraying homosexuality. Wandering Son is a great example of how the issue of homosexuality can be explored with sympathetic sensitivity. And that promotes understanding of the deep-rooted issues involved.

Instead, we get content that's all about baiting your audiences. And that adds to the problem of discrimination. It adds to popular stereotypes about homosexuality, rather than promoting understanding and acceptance.

Look I would greatly prefer and love if the industry regularly produced series like it, but sadly that is very extremely from the reality of the anime industry series of it's quality are in the single digits for all time, and the number of anime series with canon LGBT characters focused on and not being a joke or gimmick is less 1% of anime probably totaling under 100 series I'd bet.

Compared to dozen upon dozens of Het romance series annually, in addition to plenty of series for people to ship het romance without it being a focus.

So please forgive me if I am willing to ship things when they just happen to shown zero interest in males and generally never mention the subject. Additionally then show a confirmed one sided crush or abnormally close and strong emotional and physical bond and throw subtext lines likes "We'll know each other better than anyone", "you're the sunshine that warms my life", "We'll always be together, I love you two", calling each other "precious" or "very important person", or they do things like holding hands all the time publicly, gazing into each others eyes, going to extremes for each other well beyond what a "friend" would do, enjoying time together as if it were a date thinking it might be one, or even having one of them call it date, or even adopting a child together in one case .

Or in some cases the authors having said characters have feelings "beyond friendship" towards another, but isn't willing to show it outright as a confession, which is somewhat realistic in a sense because people who are LGBT are often trapped in the closet for years, thus confessing to their crush would be extremely difficult which how it is in many societies especially japan.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

I don't have problems with "shipping" wars. I have a problem with interpretations about characters that aren't true. If the characters aren't homosexual, then they simply aren't.

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

Meanwhile, I speak for myself. I find the misrepresentation of characters silly, if not outright offensive.

See Above if they're portraying characters like that is wrong to think they might be homosexual or is it really a misrepresentation of characters?

Especially when the LGBT population is nearly 10% of the population yet it sees nowhere near that level of representation in media in general, it's a bit better in manga than anime, but it's still a rarity.

Is really so absurd for someone to want see it more often than what we're given right now and to look for it where it's not 100% canon?

[Triple_R]

I thought Kona made a great post in general, but this part in particular I strongly agree with...

Originally Posted by Konakaga

Look I would greatly prefer and love if the industry regularly produced series like it, but sadly that is very extremely from the reality of the anime industry series of it's quality are in the single digits for all time, and the number of anime series with canon LGBT characters focused on and not being a joke or gimmick is less 1% of anime probably totaling under 100 series I'd bet.

Compared to dozen upon dozens of Het romance series annually, in addition to plenty of series for people to ship het romance without it being a focus.

So please forgive me if I am willing to ship things when they just happen to shown zero interest in males and generally never mention the subject. Additionally then show a confirmed one sided crush or abnormally close and strong emotional and physical bond and throw subtext lines likes "We'll know each other better than anyone", "you're the sunshine that warms my life", "We'll always be together, I love you two", calling each other "precious" or "very important person", or they do things like holding hands all the time publicly, gazing into each others eyes, going to extremes for each other well beyond what a "friend" would do, enjoying time together as if it were a date thinking it might be one, or even having one of them call it date, or even adopting a child together in one case .

Or in some cases the authors having said characters have feelings "beyond friendship" towards another, but isn't willing to show it outright as a confession, which is somewhat realistic in a sense because people who are LGBT are often trapped in the closet for years, thus confessing to their crush would be extremely difficult which how it is in many societies especially japan.

This is very well-put.

The following doesn't apply to Hibike specifically, but it does apply to some other anime shows - You have a group of teenage girls that hang out all the time, that are very affectionate with one another, that talk about almost everything together, and have some scenes that I think would make a completely neutral viewer wonder if there's more than just friendship there. Oh, and they never talk about guys.

Teenage years are the years of raging hormones, and all that. So I find this sort of presentation notable. I mean, I could maybe see a couple of the female characters just not being interested in romance in general right now, or making a self-aware choice to put it off until they graduate, but for the entire cast to seemingly be like that? Honestly, that does seem unusual to me from a heterosexual standpoint. So the yuri interpretation honestly just fits better in my own mind in some cases.

And there really are certain words and actions that typically come across more as romantic than as platonic.


I still remember when I showed the last episode of the original Nanoha anime to one of my two sisters. I wanted to see what a non-anime fan would think of a certain Nanoha/Fate scene in that episode.

Her reaction to that scene? A very matter-of-fact "Yeah, they're gay".

Some of these character relationships really are more believable as romantic than as platonic, in my opinion. There are certain lines that people in purely platonic relationships typically don't cross, at least in my experience. So if two anime characters are crossing those lines, and especially if they do so more than once, why not see it as romantic?

I daresay that this even seems like common sense to me. In some cases, I find that the person arguing against a yuri or yaoi interpretation is in fact the person most in conflict with Occam's Razor. If it looks like a romance, and if it sounds like a romance, then I'm inclined to think its a romance. I don't see the problem with that, unless the anime completely rules it out in one way or another.

[Haak]

General speaking, I'm not inclined to putting on any yuri goggles or anything and that's probably because, as has been stated, there's a certain fetish-tic aspect to it that I don't especially ascribe to. I'm pretty sure everyone on this forum would agree that there is a fetish for yuri and yoai relationships. That's why you see it as part of the marketing strategy for plenty of anime, particularly those geared towards fujoshis.

But that doesn't mean it's anything to get offended about. I mean fetishizing a sexuality is kinda weird but what is so bad about it really?(and in the grander scheme of things, there are much weirder and more offensive fetishes around) The worst you can say is that they are disrespecting the authors intentions but I'm pretty sure most yuri/yaoi gogglers who goggle at the slightest thing just do it for fun: I've never come across anyone, even on the internet, who seriously supported a Yuri pairing that I believed was based on absolutely nothing at all (I have come across plenty of shippers in general that do that but that's an entirely different beast). I have come across people who seriously believed a yuri pairing that I believed was not true but I wasn't at all surprised in them believing it. The example that I'm thinking of is Kill la Kill where some people were convinced that Mako and Matoi were a thing and I was inclined to disagree.

And this is how it is in most cases. A lot of people might be putting their yuri goggles on but if they do it's either because they do so jokingly or because the story is kind of vindicating them in certain ways. So there's not really any attempt at disrespecting the authors attempt here.

Now as for Sound Euphonium, I decry the attempt at classifying the yuri in Kumiko and Reina's relationship as "Yuri goggles". As Icehism pointed out, the term "goggles" implies a certain level of grasping at straws. But you don't need fucking goggles to see the yuri when they're fucking shoving right in front of your fucking eyeballs. I've already written about the infamous Episode 8, but this last episode really took the cake. Now do I think it'll actually happen? No, I think this is really just short-sightedness on Kyoani part. But I certainly wish it wasn't, because I'm completely sold on KumikoxReina. And the thing is, I don't recall ever being interested in a yuri pairing until now. I've generally steered clear from blatant yuri relationships because they've always come across as pandering and cynically fetish-tic (which is why I dropped Yurikuma Arashi very quickly). Now again, there's nothing offensive about it, but I just didn't see any value in a romance that was completely and utterly defined by its sexuality, as if yuri is all it needs. It just comes across as shallow and uninteresting to me. That's why I'm so sold on KumikoxReina: there's nothing shallow about their relationship because their relationship is extremely well built on their passion for music. If KumikoxReina were a thing then it wouldn't be defined by yuri. The yuri would just be a side effect.

Though now I'm super interested in Legend of Korra. I stalled after the lacklustre finale of Season 1 but it looks like that was a big mistake.

[Eragon]

Originally Posted by Haak

Though now I'm super interested in Legend of Korra. I stalled after the lacklustre finale of Season 1 but it looks like that was a big mistake.

I would caution against getting your hopes up too much. Although, I think knowing that Korrasami is cannon might change your perspective while watching. The rest of the show is pretty good too.

[GDiddy]

Originally Posted by Haak

General speaking, I'm not inclined to putting on any yuri goggles or anything and that's probably because, as has been stated, there's a certain fetish-tic aspect to it that I don't especially ascribe to. I'm pretty sure everyone on this forum would agree that there is a fetish for yuri and yoai relationships. That's why you see it as part of the marketing strategy for plenty of anime, particularly those geared towards fujoshis.

But that doesn't mean it's anything to get offended about. I mean fetishizing a sexuality is kinda weird but what is so bad about it really?(and in the grander scheme of things, there are much weirder and more offensive fetishes around)The worst you can say is that they are disrespecting the authors intentions but I'm pretty sure most yuri/yaoi gogglers who goggle at the slightest thing just do it for fun: I've never come across anyone, even on the internet, who seriously supported a Yuri pairing that I believed was based on absolutely nothing at all (I have come across plenty of shippers in general that do that but that's an entirely different beast). I have come across people who seriously believed a yuri pairing that I believed was not true but I wasn't at all surprised in them believing it. The example that I'm thinking of is Kill la Kill where some people were convinced that Mako and Matoi were a thing and I was inclined to disagree.

And this is how it is in most cases. A lot of people might be putting their yuri goggles on but if they do it's either because they do so jokingly or because the story is kind of vindicating them in certain ways. So there's not really any attempt at disrespecting the authors attempt here.

Now as for Sound Euphonium, I decry the attempt at classifying the yuri in Kumiko and Reina's relationship as "Yuri goggles". As Icehism pointed out, the term "goggles" implies a certain level of grasping at straws. But you don't need fucking goggles to see the yuri when they're fucking shoving right in front of your fucking eyeballs. I've already written about the infamous Episode 8, but this last episode really took the cake. Now do I think it'll actually happen? No, I think this is really just short-sightedness on Kyoani part. But I certainly wish it wasn't, because I'm completely sold on KumikoxReina. And the thing is, I don't recall ever being interested in a yuri pairing until now. I've generally steered clear from blatant yuri relationships because they've always come across as pandering and cynically fetish-tic (which is why I dropped Yurikuma Arashi very quickly). Now again, there's nothing offensive about it, but I just didn't see any value in a romance that was completely and utterly defined by its sexuality, as if yuri is all it needs. It just comes across as shallow and uninteresting to me. That's why I'm so sold on KumikoxReina: there's nothing shallow about their relationship because their relationship is extremely well built on their passion for music. If KumikoxReina were a thing then it wouldn't be defined by yuri. The yuri would just be a side effect.

I joke about doing that all the time with series.

I've never seen Sound Euphonium but who cares if the two leads are homosexual/bisexual? Even if they're neither, people are going to ship what they want anyway.


Unless the series comes out and says right off, 'Yeah they love each other romantically.'

[Chiibi]

I find it freakining annoying.....that's just me though. But people going like "OMG, THEY'RE SO GAY".....because a same sex friendship is totally unheard of right?

Yeah, that's super annoying.

[Moka_37]

I dont mind Yuri/Yaoi goggles. I wont ship characters myself unless i think theres something definitely going on and i like the chemistry. I dont ship often, but how others choose to ship doesnt really bother me.

Now when it comes to Sound! Euphonium.. I think its okay if people think they are just friends. But I honestly think if people insist there is absolutely no way Kumiko and Reina could be attracted to each other thats due to common practice of assuming people are straight unless proven other wise. This "proof" usually falls along the lines of doing something related to sexuality like kissing. People misguidedly assume this in everyday life all the time so i suppose it will happen when watching anime too.. But in reality romance between the two people is just as if not more important. (Unless they hold the same standard when deciding if a straight relationship is real). Infact, I usually dont ship anime characters because in yuri although i enjoy the shows, the sexuality (kissing etc) is all there but, for me anyway, the relationship is usually lacking.. I suppose this is due to those particular yuri being written mostly for fetishism? Thats the reason why i like Kumiko and Reina. Although they havent even kissed once the romantic feelings between them is clear and realistic. Infact they could never kiss and Id still ship them to the moon and back. I think their relationship was intended to be romantic by the writers. Even if its just yuri baiting and she ends up with the guy later as i suspect she will based on the manga

[Kotohono]

Originally Posted by Chiibi

I find it freakining annoying.....that's just me though. But people going like "OMG, THEY'RE SO GAY".....because a same sex friendship is totally unheard of right?

Yeah, that's super annoying.

You can say the same about some heteroshippers being annoying like that . Like Opposite sex friendship is impossible to exist in some of their eyes.

Sure some of them act bad like like heteroshippers do, but no you go on ahead and generalize against those who don't fit your preference, cause it's totally fair to equate a few vocal people to everyone in a group.

[Eragon]

Originally Posted by Chiibi

I find it freakining annoying.....that's just me though. But people going like "OMG, THEY'RE SO GAY".....because a same sex friendship is totally unheard of right?

Yeah, that's super annoying.

Oh the irony.

[ahelo]

Originally Posted by Chiibi

I find it freakining annoying.....that's just me though. But people going like "OMG, THEY'RE SO GAY".....because a same sex friendship is totally unheard of right?

Yeah, that's super annoying.

The point why I started this thread is to actually question this notion we have? Why is it annoying for you that people have their goggles on and see these characters as not straight? Do the characters get ruined because some people think their gay. When people allude same sex friendship to a relationship, does it ruin the characters for you in that very unlikely situation that they could be gay, hence the annoyance?

Yet no one bats an eye when two characters of the opposite sex who are probably just friends get paired off. Why is it (I'm just generalizing from my own observations) that less people get annoyed when this happens on the other hand?

Originally Posted by Konakaga

You can say the same about some heteroshippers being annoying like that . Like Opposite sex friendship is impossible to exist in some of their eyes.

Sure some of them act bad like like heteroshippers do, but no you go on ahead and generalize against those who don't fit your preference, cause it's totally fair to equate a few vocal people to everyone in a group.

I think you've summarized my sentiments towards the entire thread the best.

[Akito Kinomoto]

Originally Posted by ahelo

Yet no one bats an eye when two characters of the opposite sex who are probably just friends get paired off. Why is it (I'm just generalizing from my own observations) that less people get annoyed when this happens on the other hand?

You've gotta be kidding. It's impossible for two people of the opposite sex to be just friends. Clannad is dishonest with Tomoya and Kotomi's strong friendship, for example, while Kyousuke and Kirino from Oreimo is a genuine example of how all romance should be. Honestly, I'm glad someone mentioned Wandering Son, because if you want to have gay characters you need a story revolving around them and it shouldn't be a side effect of the romance. We must constantly remind people that there's always a social issue with homosexuality instead of entertaining the idea it can just happen. It's just common sense.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to look for Reina X Shuichi fanart. Such a lovely couple~