Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai - Light Novel Discussion

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Somethindarker

That's the entire point of the novels dude.

You guys seemed to completely miss the point of the ending. They began all over again BECAUSE in the beginning they were a bunch of losers who were socially inept and afraid to open themselves up to other people but by the ending they'd already come to terms that what they held up on a pedestal ie; "friendship" wasn't that hard to find so they ate hotpot again to welcome Yukimura who was the only one who wasn't their "friend". Everyone else was already friends by that point Yukimura was the lynchpin since she basically rejected their entire time together so Kodaka wouldn't call her a friend and accept her confession.

Also why is everyone already assuming Kodaka is miserable or never grew up? Not wanting to fuck a girl you don't love doesn't make you a loser it makes you far more mature than anyone else his age, even me when I was at his age. Kodaka by the novels end had already come to terms with them being friends and seemed perfectly happy in the epilogue. You guys need to take your shipping glasses off for a second and realize while the stories end was not that great from a plot perspective everyone had a happy ending. Kodaka isn't a materialistic horndog throughout the entire novel he's been shown, frustratingly so, that he's a simple guy who enjoys cooking and shit like spices.

Why is everybody assuming that Kodoka is miserable thats because its obvious. When he was a kid him and Yozora were best friends they did everything together yozora didnt care about anything. After Yozora left he returned to being a loner and that didnt change til the neighbors club and even then Kodoka was a coward who was afraid to do anything because it would upset the peace he worked so hard to handle. Ironically it made everything 10 times worse. Though his family arranging things is much better.

[Somethindarker]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

Why is everybody assuming that Kodoka is miserable thats because its obvious. When he was a kid him and Yozora were best friends they did everything together yozora didnt care about anything. After Yozora left he returned to being a loner and that didnt change til the neighbors club and even then Kodoka was a coward who was afraid to do anything because it would upset the peace he worked so hard to handle. Ironically it made everything 10 times worse. Though his family arranging things is much better.

Woops I meant to say "miserable at the end of the story". Let me fix that.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Somethindarker

Woops I meant to say "miserable at the end of the story". Let me fix that.

He's miserable at the end of the story because of a little sneaky fact that uhh he was right to be dense in the first place. You know what Boku wa is an example of.
You know how in all these harems main guy acts like a moron when it comes to the girls.
We complain because all of the stuff is obvious and we blast the main guy because he doesnt act on obvious feelings.
Well boys and girls this is what happens when u make a beta MC not be dense. He tried to resolve it and he failed miserably and now everybody is miserable.

[Somethindarker]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

He's miserable at the end of the story because of a little sneaky fact that uhh he was right to be dense in the first place. You know what Boku wa is an example of.
You know how in all these harems main guy acts like a moron when it comes to the girls.
We complain because all of the stuff is obvious and we blast the main guy because he doesnt act on obvious feelings.
Well boys and girls this is what happens when u make a beta MC not be dense. He tried to resolve it and he failed miserably and now everybody is miserable.

Haha I disagree with you guys. But yea fuck Haganai, sure from a story standpoint they're happy or whatever but this is a prime example of why beta MC's are dumb. I didn't like the ending, then again I didn't hate it, I'm just glad it's fucking over now I can move the fuck on.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Somethindarker

Haha I disagree with you guys. But yea fuck Haganai, sure from a story standpoint they're happy or whatever but this is a prime example of why beta MC's are dumb. I didn't like the ending, then again I didn't hate it, I'm just glad it's fucking over now I can move the fuck on.

so basically you agree because my reply pretty much just said what you did.

[Somethindarker]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

so basically you agree because my reply pretty much just said what you did.

Yea from a story standpoint they're all happy and what not but I didn't like the ending and found it massively underwhelming.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Somethindarker

Yea from a story standpoint they're all happy and what not but I didn't like the ending and found it massively underwhelming.

It was destined for that. Nisekoi at this point is destined for something similar. To Love ru is infinitely stalled because of this. As much as we men dream of harems and all it entails more often then not nobody is satisfied. There are very few exceptions of stories that can make a true harem work. Our beloved DxD is also encountering a similar problem. Harems arent that simple and making it work in actual action. In life and in romance although all is fair there's utimately gonna be losers. I can think of countless harems that encountered the same problem.

[Somethindarker]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

It was destined for that. Nisekoi at this point is destined for something similar. To Love ru is infinitely stalled because of this. As much as we men dream of harems and all it entails more often then not nobody is satisfied. There are very few exceptions of stories that can make a true harem work. Our beloved DxD is also encountering a similar problem. Harems arent that simple and making it work in actual action. In life and in romance although all is fair there's utimately gonna be losers. I can think of countless harems that encountered the same problem.

Yup, although with harems the main problem is what to do once everyone will be down for it. Getting there is far more interesting than the actual ending and you can only go so long before you run out of reason why the characters are against it. Either way I'm done with Haganai I might pick up the authors next work supposedly he's got more clout with his publisher so editor interference should be lower I'm not looking forward to it per se` but I'll give it a 1 volume try and if I like it I'll keep reading.

[Fwarlord]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

It was destined for that. Nisekoi at this point is destined for something similar. To Love ru is infinitely stalled because of this. As much as we men dream of harems and all it entails more often then not nobody is satisfied. There are very few exceptions of stories that can make a true harem work. Our beloved DxD is also encountering a similar problem. Harems arent that simple and making it work in actual action. In life and in romance although all is fair there's utimately gonna be losers. I can think of countless harems that encountered the same problem.

To be fair, it's actually easier for harem to work in fantasy setting than in a real lief setting. And I think the key for it to work is the protagonist truly treating all members in his harem equally (for example, Godou in Campione), or else it would end up looking like there's only one winner - the main girl, and all other girls are just losers who've yet to be rejected by the protagonist because he's just too kind to hurt their feeling.

But all those things have nothing to do with Haganai. It's completely fine if Kodaka ended up with a girl or no one at all. What he really had to achieve is moving on from that club, fine some friends on his own and integrate into society like a normal person. Really, the club was created with the purpose of helping its members making friend and find happiness on their own, it should cease to exit once that objective is achieved. But somehow the mean became the end and they all ended up believed the club was the only place they could find happiness to the point they're willing to sacrifice their personal relationship with other people just to protect the damn club or even force other members who formed relationship with outsider to serve them and get back to the club. It's no different from those evil cults that forbid believers to leave.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Fwarlord

To be fair, it's actually easier for harem to work in fantasy setting than in a real lief setting. And I think the key for it to work is the protagonist truly treating all members in his harem equally (for example, Godou in Campione), or else it would end up looking like there's only one winner - the main girl, and all other girls are just losers who've yet to be rejected by the protagonist because he's just too kind to hurt their feeling.

But all those things have nothing to do with Haganai. It's completely fine if Kodaka ended up with a girl or no one at all. What he really had to achieve is moving on from that club, fine some friends on his own and integrate into society like a normal person. Really, the club was created with the purpose of helping its members making friend and find happiness on their own, it should cease to exit once that objective is achieved. But somehow the mean became the end and they all ended up believed the club was the only place they could find happiness to the point they're willing to sacrifice their personal relationship with other people just to protect the damn club or even force other members who formed relationship with outsider to serve them and get back to the club. It's no different from those evil cults that forbid believers to leave.

Your first point is a problem in most harems that i'll agree with but thats usually because most harems are cases where main guy meets main girl and others gather around main guy and girl after being beaten by said girl a large majority of harems are that way. its because its not a true harem.

To the second point the bold part is utter nonsense. Yozora created the club so she could be around Kodoka again considering he didnt remember her when they first met. Yozora would have been fine with it being her and Kodoka but in order to keep the club she needed more members nothing else.

[SoloPanda]

I don't know what everyones talking about. This was an outstanding story with a wonderful ending, I laughed for days. Of course i stopped reading in volume 4 so that counts as the end for me Everything that happened after that was justa bunch of bad fanfics by some rabid fan.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by SoloPanda

I don't know what everyones talking about. This was an outstanding story with a wonderful ending, I laughed for days. Of course i stopped reading in volume 4 so that counts as the end for me Everything that happened after that was justa bunch of bad fanfics by some rabid fan.

You cant say that Solo you have to read it to the end. tsk tsk tsk. I expected more from you.

[MacMeaties]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

It was destined for that. Nisekoi at this point is destined for something similar. To Love ru is infinitely stalled because of this. As much as we men dream of harems and all it entails more often then not nobody is satisfied. There are very few exceptions of stories that can make a true harem work. Our beloved DxD is also encountering a similar problem. Harems arent that simple and making it work in actual action. In life and in romance although all is fair there's utimately gonna be losers. I can think of countless harems that encountered the same problem.

I'm glad to find someone else who feels the same way I do regarding harems.

Harems are a fantasy. In reality most people struggle to make a relationship with one other person work let alone a group. Polygamy can work in rare cases but often it doesn't just like most monogamous relationships but even less so. Just think of how many relations each of us readers have had that never went anywhere; now imagine just how much more difficult they would have been juggling 3-4 of them at the same time.
The whole genre is just pandering to a male fantasy in which they have a monopoly over multiple women they can choose from at any time without the concern of an actual relationship with any of them.
Beta MCs exacerbate this and Alpha MCs are even worse as they just outright skip the emotional relationships for having a bunch of fuck buddies who miraculously love him and stay faithful to him despite how he treats them for the most feeble, one sided reasons.

Got a bit ranty towards the end but still... long story short just pick ONE. Let the others move on with their own lives.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by MacMeaties

I'm glad to find someone else who feels the same way I do regarding harems.

Harems are a fantasy. In reality most people struggle to make a relationship with one other person work let alone a group. Polygamy can work in rare cases but often it doesn't just like most monogamous relationships but even less so. Just think of how many relations each of us readers have had that never went anywhere; now imagine just how much more difficult they would have been juggling 3-4 of them at the same time.
The whole genre is just pandering to a male fantasy in which they have a monopoly over multiple women they can choose from at any time without the concern of an actual relationship with any of them.
Beta MCs exacerbate this and Alpha MCs are even worse as they just outright skip the emotional relationships for having a bunch of fuck buddies who miraculously love him and stay faithful to him despite how he treats them for the most feeble, one sided reasons.

Got a bit ranty towards the end but still... long story short just pick ONE. Let the others move on with their own lives.

Well i hate to ruin your fun but i happen to like the harem genre what i said is something that i find amusing about the genre.

[Fwarlord]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

To the second point the bold part is utter nonsense. Yozora created the club so she could be around Kodoka again considering he didnt remember her when they first met. Yozora would have been fine with it being her and Kodoka but in order to keep the club she needed more members nothing else.

I know it's the original reason why Yozora create the club, but you know, what I said is the reason she used to convince other to join the club and also what they believed in when joining it. Every single member in the club, except Yozora and Yukimura, actually believes it can help them to fix their sociopathic nature and make friends on their own, at least at first. But now it's just a lair of anti-social shut-in.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by Fwarlord

I know it's the original reason why Yozora create the club, but you know, what I said is the reason she used to convince other to join the club and also what they believed in when joining it. Every single member in the club, except Yozora and Yukimura, actually believes it can help them to fix their sociopathic nature and make friends on their own, at least at first. But now it's just a lair of anti-social shut-in.

Well thats true either way. Yozora's purpose was to gather kodoka she made it garbled hoping nobody would translate it and even moreso she denied both sena and rika. Yukimura was accepted because it was believed she was a guy. The purpose for the girls itself is another conversation. this whole conversation is about why Yozora screwed up and how she invited the harem along.

Manga's have been written over stories about reunited childhood friends and hell you can still add sena and rika and even yukimura you'd probably have a decent story that way. This one was destined to end ugly the minute Yozora and kodoka's true relationship was revealed to the rest of the club

[AnimeFangirl]

So that's the way it ended, huh? Boy am I glad I stopped after season 1. I thought season 1 was the best place to end the series - bunch of people have no friends, end of the show they have friends. The show didn't have anywhere to go from there but down, so I'm glad I got out early.

[Marcus H.]

A "fake paradise"? "Illusory happiness"? Maybe it doesn't matter. Real life doesn't require every single moment to be lived under the harshness of reality. We woosh around like Superman after getting a raise, getting a birthday cake suddenly feels like you've just turned 8, and getting smashed with your best buds and getting the worst hangover in your life still felt like your very best experience.

I feel that a change of point of view is needed to appreciate the ending of Haganai. This isn't necessarily about living the life of a socially awkward human being or achieving riajuu by getting a girlfriend (or even a harem) before you get your high school diploma. Maybe it's just a sign that even social rejects can find some place to belong to, and how that's an underrated meaning of friendship.

So no one told you life was gonna be this way
Your job's a joke, you're broke, your love life's D.O.A.
It's like you're always stuck in second gear
When it hasn't been your day, your week, your month, or even your year, well

But I'll be there for you
When the rain starts to pour
I'll be there for you
Like I've been there before
I'll be there for you
'Cause you're there for me too

[MacMeaties]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

Well i hate to ruin your fun but i happen to like the harem genre what i said is something that i find amusing about the genre.

I like it as well lol. I just have a love hate relationship with some of the tropes in it.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by MacMeaties

I like it as well lol. I just have a love hate relationship with some of the tropes in it.

in most cases i hate the tropes but just as interestingly in certain cases i simply hate the fans of specific characters. The thing that i hate the most is when people try to use tropes to justify a pairing when evidence within the story suggest the opposite.