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Old 2006-07-20, 14:14   Link #981
Kaoru Chujo
Kuno Misaki
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by fignae
...Wow. Her drawings are just great (godly!)....
I think I've mentioned this before, but check out the "Dolls" section, especially the "Photo Album," for her yuri doll collection. The dolls she works with are Super Dollfie.
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characters/seiyuus: Sailor Moon Crystal | Amagi Brilliant Park | Coffin-Princess Chaika | Cross Ange | Daitoshokan no Hitsujikai | Danna ga Nani ga Itteru | Denkigai no Honya-san | Donten ni Warau | Le Fruit de la Grisaia | Gugure! Kokkuri-san | Inou Battle wa Nichijou-kei no Naka de | Madan no Ou to Vanadis | Orenchi no Furo Jijou | Seven Deadly Sins | Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso | Shirobako | Sora no Method | Tribe Cool Crew | Trinity Seven | Ushinawareta Mirai o Motomete
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Old 2006-07-20, 14:51   Link #982
DaFool
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Ever since Yun and Mami appeared, I've always been a Yun fanboy. In this sense, her popularity confirms my psychoanalysis on myself. I'm surprised that the feelings that made Japanese otakus vote for her are similar to mine.

Yun is the sensible male-brain-in-female-body archetype. In other words, a friend who happens to be hot. Although men may worship goddesses like Neviril, its the accessible female who wins in the end.

Yun speaks in masculine.
She's no-nonsense.
At the same time she's your best buddy and greatest support, as showed by key scenes.
By singing the lullaby, she shows that she has potential maternal instincts as well. That is just damn attractive.
Not to mention, the elegant ladylike way she carries herself, and that damn miniskirt!

DaFool faints.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo
An anti-Simoun post a month or so ago said that the poster didn't have to check to know that this show was made my men. That is true for the director and other staff -- and probably for the main writer, who seems to use a pseudonym -- but the images are all Nishida Asako, who as I said was both the character designer and the animation director. She did the same two jobs on Yama to Boushi to Hon, and was animation director of Fate/Stay Night, among other shows.
That shouldn't really matter though. Heck, even Hollywood movies ever since the fifties were directed mostly by men, but that didn't mean that character or romance was lacking in all shows. The difference is that Simoun aimed to be beyond the blatant exploitation of characters type of series, and it succeeded. Also, its through talents like Nishida Asako who are so inspiring that many male artists are preferrinng the female style of artistic depiction...that is why more and more bishoujo games and seinen manga / novels are illustrated like shoujo, and sometimes by women, and in some cases even have more detailed, elaborate, and intricate drawings than typical shoujo. I noticed this ever since I branched off from shounen into shoujo and then enjoyed the recent seinen boom. Heck, even shounen nowadays are less 'bold and spikey' and more soft and muted in design.

Last edited by DaFool; 2006-07-20 at 15:12.
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Old 2006-07-20, 15:03   Link #983
wowo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo
With the pic of Neviril, she wrote that she loved the Diana-like (I think that's Diana the Huntress, the Greek goddess) feeling that Takahashi Rieko brought to the role, even though it was a bit different from her original conception, which was more big-sisterish.
She's talking about Dianna Soriel from an anime called Turn A Gundam, who Takahashi Rieko was the voice actress of. She's actually the reason I kept watching the show even though I didn't like episode 1 too much (I mistakingly thought it was a fan-boy yuri show with no substance).
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Old 2006-07-20, 16:48   Link #984
warainagara
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Yun is certainly an uncommon type among anime characters.
I'd say her popularity may reflect the change of taste for characters.

Recently, a trend called Otome Boom(乙女ブ-ム : young lady boom) has been shed light on among Japanese sub cultures.
This trend was established by Nobara Takemoto, who wrote a novel named Simotsuma Monokatari, and revived the interest in Nobuko Yoshiya, the initiator of the Japanese yuri culture.
The Otome culture found in Yoshiya' novels and defined by Takemoto seems to be about girls who take a noble pride in themselves, do not yield to modern, worldly value or standard including male expectation for girls, and at the same time take the utmost care about their feminine beauty.

This nature of the Otome culture is eventually connected to platonic yuri, as many of Yoshiya's works showed. (Marimitte is said to be affected by Yoshiya's novels)
And Takemoto said concerning yuri "beautiful thing is beatiful in itself."
Haven't we seen a similar idea?
The concept of the latter part is found in the title of Simoun op song.

It seems many Japansese are getting to find beauty in this kind of girls' love and girl characters who have inherited the features of Otome boom, as much as Takemoto is.
It may be partially due to the fact that many of them have got tired from the typical harem girls.
The reason Japanese often say Marimitte is favored by so many male fans is that the girls are noble, independent and don't flatter fanboys.

Rozen Maiden is the representative anime that reflects the Otome culture, although there may be some harem taste.
Simoun is a show which presents otomes who are in agony for their identities, fight for themselves.
As for Yun, she is one of the most Otome-ish among the Simoun characters, IMO.
She is clear about her own standard, doesn't submit to snobbism and respects tradition and mental values.
At the same time, she has the outstanding feminine beauty.
She may not be my type, but I do understand why Japanese boy like her.
Personally I prefer another otome Neviril, cause I think I can understand her person more than Yun.
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Last edited by warainagara; 2006-07-20 at 17:12.
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Old 2006-07-20, 22:07   Link #985
Kaoru Chujo
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Thanks so much, warainagara and wowo. I'm already looking around for works by Yoshiya Nobuko and Nobara Takemoto. And perhaps Turn A Gundam will be the first "mecha" anime I can learn to enjoy -- unless Simoun is mecha. If Takahashi Rieko is as good there as she is here, perhaps it will be. As usual, my embarrassment at being so ignorant is exceeded by my delight at learning more.

I lost interest partway through the first season of Rozen Maiden, but perhaps I was seeing it in the wrong way and should take another look at season 2. And I just noticed that those Super Dollfie dolls Nishida Asako uses -- and which certainly make me think of Shinko -- cost about $500 each, exclusive of clothing at $30-70 a dress, $8 a T-shirt, etc. Ouch.

Thanks also to DaFool for the interesting thoughts about Yun and about shifts in art styles. From the beginning, I've found the character design in Simoun really powerful, especially the eyes. Are the eyes as special as they seem to me, or just one version of a common style? I see so many elements there to be played with to create expression.
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Hashihime blog | Twitter @nakanokimi | autumn 2014 previews | autumn 2014 schedule |
characters/seiyuus: Sailor Moon Crystal | Amagi Brilliant Park | Coffin-Princess Chaika | Cross Ange | Daitoshokan no Hitsujikai | Danna ga Nani ga Itteru | Denkigai no Honya-san | Donten ni Warau | Le Fruit de la Grisaia | Gugure! Kokkuri-san | Inou Battle wa Nichijou-kei no Naka de | Madan no Ou to Vanadis | Orenchi no Furo Jijou | Seven Deadly Sins | Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso | Shirobako | Sora no Method | Tribe Cool Crew | Trinity Seven | Ushinawareta Mirai o Motomete
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Old 2006-07-20, 22:22   Link #986
guest
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This show is trying to challenge some controversial issues here, such as incest, pedophile (Limonode and Dominia), and out right lesbianism. I just hope that it won't fall into the category of "Kurau." Kurau was promising in the beginning but fell short in the end. It certainly develops well on the relationship of Kurau and Christmas but really nothing more than that. It never really explains what Rynax is, where they come from, and how they work. The whole scheme is not done well, either. In short, it had the potential of being a great story with depth but in the end, it doesn’t have much of it.

It is actually kind of like Yami to Boushi to Hon no Tabibito and they have the same director or producer or something like that. It started out as a very interesting story but in the end, it just does not deliver what they promise. The ending seem to simplify (or try to avoid?) a complicated situation so that it just let everything slide.

I think I start to see these in Simoun, after these many of episodes, still not much about anything other than the girls’ relationships. I am not saying that a drama focusing on relationships is not good enough. There are a lot of shows which deal with similar category and have done it well. Simoun needs something or something else. I hope this time Simoun will be different.
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Old 2006-07-20, 23:08   Link #987
Futaba-chan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaFool
Yun is the sensible male-brain-in-female-body archetype.
Yun speaks in masculine.
She's no-nonsense.
At the same time she's your best buddy and greatest support, as showed by key scenes.
Hmm, kind of like Megumi from Tenshi na Konamaiki, then? (Including the incongruously good grooming?)
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Old 2006-07-20, 23:21   Link #988
fignae
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo
Thanks so much, warainagara and wowo. I'm already looking around for works by Yoshiya Nobuko and Nobara Takemoto. And perhaps Turn A Gundam will be the first "mecha" anime I can learn to enjoy -- unless Simoun is mecha. If Takahashi Rieko is as good there as she is here, perhaps it will be. As usual, my embarrassment at being so ignorant is exceeded by my delight at learning more.
Yeah, Shimotsuma Monogatari is somewhat shocking, if the novel is at all similar to manga and anime. Thanks warainagara for the info! As for Turn A, I watched a few episodes out of curiosity, and the surprising thing was although she sounded the same (I doubt Takahashi Rieko has great voice variance, though I may be proven wrong) I thought Neviril's voice is more richly layered, more interesting compared to the characters she plays there. The anime itself was so Gundam it became physically painful to watch. But it was worth the look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by guest
I think I start to see these in Simoun, after these many of episodes, still not much about anything other than the girls’ relationships. I am not saying that a drama focusing on relationships is not good enough. There are a lot of shows which deal with similar category and have done it well. Simoun needs something or something else. I hope this time Simoun will be different.
Hard to answer this before the series has ended, but personally, I see Simoun as having already surpassed the two series you mention.
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Old 2006-07-20, 23:43   Link #989
wowo
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Ouu, thanks for the info Warainagara. I didn't know it was some sort of boom.
BTW, Shimotsuma Monogatari (aka Kamikaze Girls) is a freakin' awesome movie. I highly recommend it to everyone.

About Turn A Gundam... sadly, the fansubs that are released are not that good. Turn A Gundam is my favorite anime series of all time next to Utena, and I really, really wanted it to be good, but... about 40% of the lines are not just "not capturing it", but just flat out wrong. This is a fictionary example, but:

A: No! How dare you lay a hand on me!
B: We have to leave, now! Come on!
A: Ah! Father, father! I cannot leave without him!

Is translated like:

A: Don't touch me!
B: Let's go!
A: I hate you as much as my father!

About 10-20% of the lines make no sense or are just completely the opposite of what the character is saying...

Turn A Gundam is made by Yoshiyuki Tomino. What makes all his series great is not only the story and the characters, but the dialogue. Even Japanese people call his dialogue "Tomino Language" since it's so unique, and there is that "something" that gets right into your subconscious mind... it's really crazy. Really powerful. I mean, the mecha stuff is thrown in there because Bandai and Sunrise wants to make toys, not because Tomino likes them.

Anyway, his dialogues are so layered, even a native speaker can interpret his lines in several ways. I looked at some official translations of his stuff, and even those are "good" to "ok" at best. True poetry.
(BTW he did not make Gundam SEED and Gundam Wing! >_<

So maybe after Simoun, people at Simoun-Fans might want to take a look at it?
I would definitely help out, though I bet it'll take a long, long time to translate a 49 episode show. With tons of dialogues. And it's hard. Very hard.
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Old 2006-07-21, 00:59   Link #990
Kaoru Chujo
Kuno Misaki
 
 
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I really like Kurau, and even felt the ending worked and the info about the Rynax was sufficient. Of course, for me the relationships are enough.

But Simoun is in a higher class than Kurau. I do hope we get something really mind-blowing in the end about the ancient civilization and the characters' lives, but this show could simply fall apart now and I'd still think it was a wonderful anime.

I'll definitely try Turn A Gundam now that I know the language is interesting -- whether I understand it or not, lol.
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Hashihime blog | Twitter @nakanokimi | autumn 2014 previews | autumn 2014 schedule |
characters/seiyuus: Sailor Moon Crystal | Amagi Brilliant Park | Coffin-Princess Chaika | Cross Ange | Daitoshokan no Hitsujikai | Danna ga Nani ga Itteru | Denkigai no Honya-san | Donten ni Warau | Le Fruit de la Grisaia | Gugure! Kokkuri-san | Inou Battle wa Nichijou-kei no Naka de | Madan no Ou to Vanadis | Orenchi no Furo Jijou | Seven Deadly Sins | Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso | Shirobako | Sora no Method | Tribe Cool Crew | Trinity Seven | Ushinawareta Mirai o Motomete
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Old 2006-07-21, 01:57   Link #991
Guppy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fignae
Yun has a gravity the other characters don't possess. It's like Neviril's, but different, harder.
It seems to me that the gravity Neviril exhibits comes from the regal air she carries - when she's on top of her game, she looks every inch the leader of Chor Tempest. None of the others even come close to having her command presence. On the other hand, Neviril can be extremely brittle under pressure, as we've seen twice already (after Amuria's death, and in her current troubles with Aeru).

Yun's gravity seems to come from her stoicism (bordering on fatalism, as Aeru has pointed out) in the face of bad circumstances. She's lost friends, come to terms with it and kept on going; and unlike virtually every other member of the Chor, we haven't seen her show any serious emotional weakness yet. Yun does the best she can in any situation and rarely complains. I'm not surprised she's won fans who appreciate her quiet, no-nonsense attitude compared to the drama queens, human typhoons and psychological basket cases that make up the rest of the Chor.
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Old 2006-07-21, 02:23   Link #992
warainagara
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Ah, Shimotsuma Monogatari itself may not fit the general understanding of Otome culture I mentioned.
If you try reading the novel from an expectation of a noble, traditional figure of young ladies, you definitely wouldn't be satisfied.

The reason why Takemoto is seen as the establisher of the Otome boom is his activities as much as his novel.
He has written numerous articles about Otome culture that had existed long in Japan and led a new evaluation of Yoshiya.

The new boom for otome seems to contain various streams of modern element and traditional view.
One example is the lorita looks.
Shimotsuma also deals with lorita looks.
And Gothlori(Gothic +Lori) clothes are in fashion in Japan. : There are singers who intentionally seek lorita looks.

Rozen Maiden is featuring Goth Loris, too.
Some advocates of this newly introduced part of otome culture say it is girls' proud interest in their beauty.
But I personally think this is the most commercialized part of the recent Otome boom.

edited)
Spoiler for about guest' comment:


edited 2)
Simoun novel series 1 comes out on 25th of this month from Megami bunko!
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Last edited by warainagara; 2006-07-21 at 04:10.
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Old 2006-07-21, 06:08   Link #993
wrex_japan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guppy
It seems to me that the gravity Neviril exhibits comes from the regal air she carries - when she's on top of her game, she looks every inch the leader of Chor Tempest. None of the others even come close to having her command presence. On the other hand, Neviril can be extremely brittle under pressure, as we've seen twice already (after Amuria's death, and in her current troubles with Aeru).

Yun's gravity seems to come from her stoicism (bordering on fatalism, as Aeru has pointed out) in the face of bad circumstances. She's lost friends, come to terms with it and kept on going; and unlike virtually every other member of the Chor, we haven't seen her show any serious emotional weakness yet. Yun does the best she can in any situation and rarely complains. I'm not surprised she's won fans who appreciate her quiet, no-nonsense attitude compared to the drama queens, human typhoons and psychological basket cases that make up the rest of the Chor.
You also gotta take into account that most of these girls were not trained to be warriors, but priestesses, and they were suddenly thrust into battle. The shock and realization has negatively affected certain characters, such as Nevril and Paraietta (who still has to come to grips with the reality of the situation). I think people like Yuun, Dominuura, and Aeru know what their current purpose is, and thus their judgments are not clouded by these other factors. Having said that, seeing Simoun's past track record, I wouldn't be surprised if they had a Yuun-centric episode exposing her human frailties.
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Old 2006-07-21, 06:27   Link #994
Yui from Okinawa
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Argentum atoll nation get wireless-communicater at ep16?

http://www.geocities.jp/emiri_0623/simoun02-e1.htm



New twin engine three-fuselage( twin fuselage except for armimg- center-fuselage ??) , two-seater Argentum fighter anti "Simoun"!
Now I get Argentum fighter pilots conversation at ep.16! (A part)

http://www.geocities.jp/yuiyuasa/argentum3.zip (Extract 4.964MB file size is compressed 524KB by WIN-ZIP.)

Some of phrase is unknown by voice effect noize, but only 20 second term is
restored by sound effect canceller & reverse canceller!

Now I recored by Japanese KANJI(HIRAGANA) / ROMA-JI , and tranlate by the English here!!

Unknoun phrase "Here koi" (twice, by noise effct is strong!! no restore!)

飛行隊長: 「各機散開」(「かっき さんかい」)/ Kakki sankai
Flight leader: " Each wing , Break it ! "

Pilot A:「了解!」(「りょうかい」)" All right ! "

Pilot B:「了解!」(「りょうかい」)" All right ! "


飛行隊長:「 第二(飛行)小隊右へ!」「だいに しょうたい みぎ へ」 /  Dai ni shoutai migi e!)
Flight leader : " Second flights, Right turn! "

パイロットA:「発見した! シムーンだ」(「はっけんした!シムーンだ」 / " Hakken shita ! Simoun da! ")
Pilot A : " I found! Simoun ! "




不明な会話内容 (逆回し??)
Unknown phrase (Because of the reverse & noise-voice effect)

パイロット:「なにも、見えん」(「なにも みえん」/ Nanimo mien!)
Pilot C: " I can't find simoun anyone ! "

飛行隊長:「見失うな!」(「みうしなうな」/ Miushinauna !)
Flight leader :  " Dont lost it ! "



I estimate their conversation among each air-craft meanings that "Argentum squad acquired wireless- communication ,
and Lotte tactics and Zoom or dive tactics!

Last edited by Yui from Okinawa; 2006-07-21 at 10:15.
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Old 2006-07-21, 06:47   Link #995
Guppy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrex_japan
You also gotta take into account that most of these girls were not trained to be warriors, but priestesses, and they were suddenly thrust into battle. The shock and realization has negatively affected certain characters, such as Nevril and Paraietta (who still has to come to grips with the reality of the situation).
Perhaps, but I think we're past the point where that's a valid excuse; those who seriously couldn't deal with the idea of flying and fighting have opted out already. I don't think Paraietta really has a problem with perceiving her situation (in fact, she's adopted some military attitudes faster than the others), but she's overstretching her abilities trying to be both Neviril's protector and acting Chor leader. The cracks are starting to show badly, and it's destroying her self-confidence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrex_japan
I think people like Yuun, Dominuura, and Aeru know what their current purpose is, and thus their judgments are not clouded by these other factors.
Aeru is basically a human-shaped force of nature, and so it's hardly surprising that she's unruffled by, well, anything. See goal, bulldoze into goal - that's our Aeru. The suicide-bombing aftermath is the only time we've ever seen her at a total loss, and thus far it hasn't been repeated.

I think you're on the mark with Dominura - more than any of the others, almost all her actions have been purposeful and calculated. Limone probably became the only exception to that, especially in the last few episodes.

Like Dominura, Yun is also doing her job, but it's a job she hates and which she knows is likely to get her killed. She's somehow managed to accept that and keep going anyway, which I suppose would tend to put everything else in perspective for her. I think that's really why her judgement is unclouded - Yun doesn't really seem to have much personal investment in what she's doing, although she does it to the best of her ability.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrex_japan
Having said that, seeing Simoun's past track record, I wouldn't be surprised if they had a Yuun-centric episode exposing her human frailties.
Neither would I. Everyone has a breaking point somewhere.
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Old 2006-07-21, 08:13   Link #996
DaFool
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The past few responses illustrate why Aeru and Yun are #1 and #2 respectively. They just bite the bullet and charge like there's no tomorrow, all-weather personalities which are suited to war. Of course doesn't mean that they can't be affected, nor that they don't have a breaking point. But definitely they decided to not bask in their emotions and just do their job. If Neviril didn't crack up like she did, no doubt she would have been #2 or even #1. However, it is still fitting to see her weak state, even though it destroys her 'Queen' image.

I liked both Yamibou and Kurau, but definitely the yuri wasn't such a big factor for me...I was more in for the adventures with pretty girls and the hardcore sci-fi more than anything alse. But definitely it seems Simoun has far so many levels, and even if it crashes and burns...

Spoiler:


shit, it was still a great ride. I notice now if the worldview is consistent and well-described, I really enjoy the anime. The architecture, the culture, the religion, the relations between the sexes, between nation-states, the technological system, the weather, and most importantly the characters, Simoun excels in that.

Thanks warainagara for the nice explanation of Otome culture. I think that Rozen Maiden, Marimite, and Simoun has far more quantities of Otome-type girls than even Mai Hime / Otome. Less childish and wispy, more headstrong and with backbone. That nobleness and excellence of character is extremely attractive regardless of whether you are male or female. A regal woman would make us want to bring out the best in ourselves, such as how Shinku healed Jun, how Lafiel made Jinto mature, etc.

Last edited by DaFool; 2006-07-21 at 08:32.
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Old 2006-07-21, 09:03   Link #997
wowo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo
I'll definitely try Turn A Gundam now that I know the language is interesting -- whether I understand it or not, lol.
Let me first warn you that the story is the s l o w e s t moving thing ever.
Hell, it makes Simoun feel like Charlie's Angles.
And though the language is poetry, it is not beautiful - it's all about nuances and unconventional word choice and sentence structure.
But if you're up for it, I think the last episode will leave an impression that won't leave you for a lifetime.


Okay, back to Simoun.

One thing that I found interesting for this show.
Spoiler:
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Old 2006-07-21, 15:32   Link #998
m000m000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo
Furoe is one of my (many) favorites. I don't find her annoying at all. She's Miss Natural. She doesn't hold back, but comes right out with her feelings.
I guess you're right. In my case it doesn't help much though, since in my eyes half the time she opens her mouth she makes herself sound like a shameless whiney brat that makes you roll your eyes and go "look who's talking". I just inherently dislike people/characters like that.



Quote:
Originally Posted by wowo
I don't get what's so great about Yun. She's cool, but she barely says or does anything. I mean 2nd place? That's a pretty impressive rank!
Well, if I'd be looking at the whole thing objectively in terms of character complexity I'd be inclined to agree (In that case the clear leads should be Nevile, Paraietta, Aeru and Dominura, IMO). But it's a popularity contest, and she's definitively got the goods, so to speak, in that she has plenty of factors that push the right buttons on a good deal of people (including me).
I mean, what's not to like about a would-be tough and distant but also visibly scarred girl, who talks like a man, and while unusually direct in her confrontations others (...and yet, avoids them! It's an interesting mix), is anything but masculine in-character. The conflicting speech and demeneor/visuals is one of those things I find especially cute in her. Moe desu yo! That's not to say that's all that there is to her, though...




Quote:
Originally Posted by Guppy
Yun's gravity seems to come from her stoicism (bordering on fatalism, as Aeru has pointed out) in the face of bad circumstances. She's lost friends, come to terms with it and kept on going; and unlike virtually every other member of the Chor, we haven't seen her show any serious emotional weakness yet.
No, she's showed up she has her weakness from the very first episode we met her in.

The reason she doesn't talk much and mingles minimally with the others, is because of her past and out of the fear of having it repeated again. So in response to that she projects this hard shell of being someone who doesn't need anyone or attachment to others around her - It's a defensive mechanism set to prevent further break-downs should loss of nearby people occur again. If you have nothing invested, you have nothing to loose.

But clearly this is something that's slowly started to fall apart during the course of the series.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guppy
Like Dominura, Yun is also doing her job, but it's a job she hates and which she knows is likely to get her killed. She's somehow managed to accept that and keep going anyway, which I suppose would tend to put everything else in perspective for her.
I don't really see that as acceptance. She feels a heavy burden of personal guilt hanging over her from being the only one alive from her old friends.


Dominura was doing her job because she thought she was "doing the right thing", both in terms of herself and the general people around her. She liked/was "happy" with what she was doing. She had a personal goal, a purpose, and she was going to make sure she'd achive it.

Yun's doing her job because her concious won't let her stop, even if she'd want to. She's doing it out of obligation, not out of her own free will. Now, that obligation may be a logical/moral fallacy that only exists in her head - I'll take it she blames the deaths of her friends partly on herself or just otherwise guilt for "being the only one left and not being able to 'do anything'/prevent her friends from meeting their fate".

But in the end, whether the obligation or duty that drives oneself forward is a logically sensible or morally just one doesn't matter - The outcome is the same as long as it is an obligation, a duty for you, instead of a personal goal or purpose you'd want to achive or do.

By her own words, Yun hates what she's doing. But she'd hate herself more if she'd just give in and quit - She'd "betray" her old friends who died in battle.
The fact she may die in the process of fulfilling this moral obligation of hers doesn't matter to her - anymore - Because - She's already lost it all once. Since she because of that now technically has "nothing to lose", she's out to make sure that she, nor anyone else out there, is not going to suffer what she's gone through because of her.

Ergo, the reason why she keeps herself relatively distant from the others.

So to sum it up, Yun's seeking atonement through martyrdom, to put it very... strongly. Well, that's kind of a too strong expression, but I think it covers her tought logic (or what we've been shown of it so far) relatively well.

Obviously, that's not a very... healthy life philosophy. You can see plenty of subtle cracks in it already, but I bet(/hope) we will see it all come tumbling down at a later point. Remember just how strongly she reacted to Aeru's remark about her virtually having a deathwish? She may be no-nonsense and insightful when dealing with the others, but can't(or doesn't want to) see the forrest for the trees when it comes to dealing with herself .

But I guess we'll have to wait for Paraietta's downward spiral to hit rock-bottom first. Personally I hope there are some spikes in that pit .


Well, that's my take on her character. Obviously she could just have grown very strong from her events, but I think she has a clear air of fragilty or sadness around her character, which probably was, again, best exposed in Aeru's confrontation with her in the episode she's introduced.

Quote:
I think that's really why her judgement is unclouded - Yun doesn't really seem to have much personal investment in what she's doing, although she does it to the best of her ability.
Yeah, her attitude allows her to see the rest of the Chor unclouded, but she paid a rather hefty personal price for that ability .

In a way she's "been there, done that, got the T-shirt" in a lot of things (but not "everything" - She obviouslly has issues herself, as noted above) compared to the others because of her past - Probably most directly seen in her golden moment of exposing Paraietta's transculency to herself - What Yun's telling Paraietta there is essentially a direct reflection of herself and her moral driving force.

Incidentally, it's also the first time she admits, though indirectly, that she has some affection for the people around her (Given the subject of discussion, I don't think she was speaking in a roundbout general way). I mean she essentially said she'd be the fist to help out when/if her friends are in trouble.

The clock is ticking Yun, the Clock is ticking...


Quote:
Yun does the best she can in any situation and rarely complains. I'm not surprised she's won fans who appreciate her quiet, no-nonsense attitude compared to the drama queens, human typhoons and psychological basket cases that make up the rest of the Chor.
You forgot to mention incestous rapists as well

But this Is a golden summarization of a lot of things, and thus quoted for Truth .
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Old 2006-07-21, 15:36   Link #999
KateSSS
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Damn those are some fucking long posts!
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Old 2006-07-21, 15:57   Link #1000
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Originally Posted by KateSSS
Damn those are some fucking long posts!
tl:dr? ;-P

Last edited by m000m000; 2006-07-21 at 16:55.
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