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Old 2006-10-17, 19:16   Link #2181
Simon
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: New Zealand
Quote:
Originally Posted by ujiuji View Post
As I tend to watch one or two episodes a week it may be a while but this thread seems to be going strong so it should still be around!
Well you can largely thank yononaka for breathing life back into the thread

Seriously though, I find myself with bandwidth to spare at the moment so I'm still seeding eps 1-3 - it's pleasing to see how many new peers keep popping up (if that's you, gentle reader, then welcome!). I guess with ep4 coming out first we can't use the tracker stats to tell us what the dropoff rate is, which is something I'd be interested to know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by warainagara View Post
About doujinji,
I've heard of Mamina-Neviril and Aaeru-Neviril.
Both are for adults and one of them is hutanari.
I guess they're like stuff abusing characters.
There you go Matrim, that answers your question about "DG". I kept an eye out for Simoun dōjinshi when I visited Tokyo a few months back, but I never saw a thing - given the Haruhi badness that I did see, this was perhaps a blessing in disguise.

This does leave me with a dilemma though - my avowed goal is to collect every Simoun-related item I can get my hands on, even frivolities like posters and telephone cards, but I'm not overly keen on the H stuff (not that I have a problem with erotica in general, it's out-of-characterness that bugs me - e.g. the Megami swimsuit pics). Hmm, perhaps I should buy them for completeness's sake but make a point of never reading what lurks within...
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Old 2006-10-17, 19:54   Link #2182
Kaoru Chujo
Minase Inori
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy View Post
...Poor Simoun had barely any budget (you'd never know from watching, though) and about half the usual alloted time to get their stuff in order....
I didn't realize this. If it means they produced the anime on a shoestring, then that gives me hope. Producers must want to use a team that can make a good anime cheaply.

The sound director, Tsujitani Kouji, has a commentary on the official site that talks about doing the entire sound track on a PC. I haven't read it all carefully yet, but maybe that's a way off getting things done cheaply, too.

He has a second commentary up now, too. One thing that caught my eye in the first one was that he and Onashia's seiyuu, Tamagawa Sakiko, were in a seiyuu singing group together at one time. And in the second one, he says it was he who first suggested Takahashi Rieko for Neviril. He also discusses the decision to use an all-female cast. It sounds as if he and the director worked very closely together on the casting.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2006-10-17 at 20:15.
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Old 2006-10-17, 23:21   Link #2183
fignae
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warainagara View Post
Grr... Evangelion.
I was personally very impressed by how the director worked Freud into it. Eva's atmosphere is also something I'll never forget.

Quote:
About doujinji,
I've heard of Mamina-Neviril and Aaeru-Neviril.
Both are for adults and one of them is hutanari.
I guess they're like stuff abusing characters.
Haha, abusing! Well, Simoun does lend itself to futanari....

But, you know, about "Inori no Uta", I'm happy to see a doujin that has relatively good art (it looks almost manga-authentic!) and in-character dialogue. I think the character voices are right, and it's not just about getting two characters to hook up, as fan comics often are.
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Old 2006-10-18, 01:33   Link #2184
yononaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Well you can largely thank yononaka for breathing life back into the thread
Oh noes, my evil plan has backfired! lol
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Old 2006-10-18, 01:50   Link #2185
warainagara
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If you are pointing to one of the two, Fignae, the impression I got from the source of the info was not so positive. But your comment certainly makes me want to read it.

Evangelion is a great work.
However, I have once done a long research to find out what the staff intended to convey by the esoteric story as a whole and ended up without conclusion. Not that I'm serious for every show, but Eva seemed to promise a reward at that time. I still wish someone to put forth its overall theme which I can agree to.
As one who tends to stick to staff's literal intention, finding several candidates for the overarching theme of Simoun was much easier. So I disagree to yononaka's thought that we read more than the show actually has. Hey, yononaka! Whether you gave us compliment or not, it's there and we read it. Besides, Eva teems with things to ponder over and feel. Also, the setting itself was enjoyable intellectual challenge.
Grr, I'm changing this thread into Evangelion's. Let me shut up.
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Old 2006-10-18, 02:09   Link #2186
kauldron26
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im still contemplating watching the show or not... Is this anime mainly YURI?? because i dont think i can handle 26 episodes revolving about yuri love, just like strawberry panic...
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Old 2006-10-18, 02:42   Link #2187
Zappster
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No, it's not.
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Old 2006-10-18, 02:47   Link #2188
Simon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kauldron26 View Post
Is this anime mainly YURI??
No, not at all. The relationships between the characters are an important part of the story - the entire anime is mostly character-driven - but there's none of the "ZOMG, lesbians! Hey everyone, check out the freak-show!" thing you get in SP (this isn't just mindless SP-bashing, I watched the whole series and will admit to enjoying some facets of it). At first it may seem to be laying on the fanservice, but don't be fooled: sabisu plays a much smaller part than in most anime, and the story is strong enough that you'll soon have plenty of other things to think about.

The show isn't perfect, but in this particular regard you worry needlessly
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Old 2006-10-18, 03:59   Link #2189
yononaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warainagara View Post
As one who tends to stick to staff's literal intention, finding several candidates for the overarching theme of Simoun was much easier. So I disagree to yononaka's thought that we read more than the show actually has. Hey, yononaka! Whether you gave us compliment or not, it's there and we read it.
Look, would you mind explaining what is the "it" you keep talking about? I don't believe I ever said "Simoun has nothing" and the like. Other people including yourself projected what I said that way. Even if I'd said it that way, it would obviously be just an opinionated hyperbole, not a statement of fact...

So, what I was saying was that whatever was there wasn't working and that the "greatness" wasn't there. (That this includes "for me" should be obvious unless you think I think I'm God. Which I guess you might, given your repeated admonishments about my selfishness. Never mind that I said it was an opinion. How very selfish of me to have one...) I really don't see how you can tell me that it's "actually" there. (Barring some "overwhelming majority" argument which would only fly if the show were in fact widely popular.) Nor can I tell you that it isn't there for sure, other than in the sense that I don't think there's anything particularly special about Simoun.

As far as you not reading into it more than what the show "actually" has: do you have the ability to see the show exactly as it comes out of the mind of the creators? It is pretty much inevitable that once you become a fan, you develop your own extensions to what the creators have given you. There's nothing wrong with that, and to deny that it happens seems very strange to me.
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Old 2006-10-18, 06:06   Link #2190
ZeusIrae
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy View Post
Evangelion was a character study with plot thrown in, just like Simoun.
Eva's message and Simoun's message are completely different, so I don't think it's really fair to compare them on that level.


.(
o
A character study,personnaly I never saw Simoun as a character study.The priestsess were of course a central part of the show.But the most intresting for me wasn't the character themselves but how they react to the new situation.And how the whole political system react to the new situation:war.
For me,the first ten ep were about the struggle of the priestess and the system to cope with the new situation.Neviril saw herself as a Priestess and that's the focus of the show at the beginning:A priestess can't fight a war,there's a contradiction.
It's funny to see that even at the End
Spoiler:

For me it 's not only about the characters but also the end of an era symbolized by the sunken ship.It' the end of innocence, not only for the characters but also for an entire world.
The discussion between Floe and Vyura is very symbolic.They will fight,they consider themselves as pilots and no longer as Priestess;and soon the Chor Tempest will be forgotten.
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Old 2006-10-18, 09:23   Link #2191
fignae
floofer. floof.
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
The Chinese fansub group, YYK, recently released the 25th Simoun episode. With it came a translation note from their TL, glyco. They took these words 「落ちる」("ochiru") and drew another connection from it, in addition to the obvious Western connotation of the Biblical Fall we already know. It is Sakaguchi Ango's 1946 essay, "Darakuron" (『堕落論』, i.e. "On Decadence"). glyco quotes these lines from the essay:

Quote:
戦争に負けたから堕ちるのではないのだ。
人間だから堕ちるのであり、生きているから堕ちるだけだ。
だが人間は永遠に堕ちぬくことはできないだろう。
なぜなら人間の心は苦難に対して鋼鉄の如くでは有り得ない。
人間は可憐(かれん)であり脆弱(ぜいじゃく)であり、
それ故愚かなものであるが、堕ちぬくためには弱すぎる。



堕ちる道を堕ちきることによって、
自分自身を発見し、救わなければならない。
They then give a translation, in Chinese. The corresponding paragraph can be found on the web, in English, translated by Ian Smith, which I'm quoting below. This is the concluding paragraph of the essay.

Quote:
We are not going to fall because we lost the war. We are going to fall because we are human, simply because we are alive. But can we save humanity from an eternal decline? Why is it that the human heart cannot face up to extreme hardships with the strength of steel? We are delicate and frail and thus strange creatures, but we are too weak to keep from falling into decadence. In the end we must kill the chaste virgin, we must devise Bushido, and we must prop up the Emperor. But we must each kill our own virgin, we must each devise our own kind of Bushido and our own Emperor; it is essential that people descend down their own correct path and they must descend to the very end of that path. It is also crucial that Japan fall in the same way. We must save ourselves by discovering ourselves once we have fallen to the bottom of the path of decadence. Political salvation and other shortcuts are nothing but superficial folly.
Contrary to how this post looks, I don't think the reference is absolutely significant. I'm in two minds about it at the moment.

Nonetheless, it is academically very interesting. Sakaguchi wrote this after Japan's defeat in World War II. His thesis contains the idea (sorry, I haven't read it in detail) that the nation can pick itself up in the wake of defeat, even that the fall is necessary in order for the nation to discover itself again. This idea has severe resonances when applied to Simoun.

Also, the two notions of the fall as Biblical and the fall into "decadence" can arguably co-exist; there doesn't have to be a contradiction. Besides the similarities they share, the controlling motif behind them both is, after all, the behemoth that is "modernity", a combination of technology, capitalism and politics that culminates in change, and more importantly, the self-awareness of change. I could waffle on about how Simoun fits "Western" literary history, but that would take time and knowledge I don't have at my fingertips.

That said, wrapping all this in the nutshell of a child growing up and falling and learning is a great metaphor, one that leads us on many possible avenues of thought. We'll never know the work's creator or his unconscious with any intimacy, I must disclaim, but I like knowing that the Japanese collective unconscious contains such an element.

[See Ian Smith's essay and translation of Darakuron for full text.
Also see the original text by Sakaguchi Ango -- and the picture of the wing, the wing!]

For those who didn't hear the word... which is most of you that may have included me (oh god, I wrote all this about a word?!), it appears in Episode 1 and 25 and, er, I don't know where else.
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Old 2006-10-18, 12:45   Link #2192
warainagara
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Spoiler for response to yononaka:
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Last edited by warainagara; 2006-10-18 at 13:02.
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Old 2006-10-18, 19:12   Link #2193
FatPianoBoy
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Near Cincinnati, OH, but actually in Kentucky
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by fignae View Post
For those who didn't hear the word... which is most of you that may have included me (oh god, I wrote all this about a word?!), it appears in Episode 1 and 25 and, er, I don't know where else.
It may or may not be interesting to note that 落ちる can also mean 'to fail' (テストを落ちる; to fail a test). This may perhaps go along with
Spoiler:


Great post by the way, fignae
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Old 2006-10-19, 11:24   Link #2194
IchiKyo
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Sorry to trouble you guys but
How do you written Aaeru name?
Aaeru? Aael? Aeru? Aelu?
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Old 2006-10-19, 12:10   Link #2195
Kaoru Chujo
Minase Inori
 
 
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The fansubs have settled on Aaeru, which is exactly what it is in Japanese. There is some publicity stuff from Japan that makes it Aer, which is also nice because it is like "air." But there are some important points in the show where people pronounce her name in three full syllables, so I think Aaeru is still the best.
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Old 2006-10-20, 10:10   Link #2196
Seska
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Join Date: Feb 2006
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Age: 41
/Offtopic On

Onegai,

Can somebody here, help me out?

I've read today, that""Japan Society for Rights of Authors, Composers and Publishers" (JASRAC) has YouTube deleting some (nearly 30.000) Files.
Well, i already lost my Air Gear AMV cause of that. And to prevent losing
my Simoun AMVs, i need your help.

Has someone an EMail to contact them (english speaking&writing of course)
to check out, if they have something against them? (in other words.
Get the right to stay "Live!")
or can someone write in Nippon to them, and asking in my name to stay live, please?
I love my AMVs, cause i put my heart in them.

Domo arigato, in advance.

Mfg,
Seska

/Offtopic Off

Last edited by Seska; 2006-10-20 at 10:51.
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Old 2006-10-20, 10:26   Link #2197
IchiKyo
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Because we all violate Youtube Rules somedays...
They delete my First Account... [Have 14 AMV of Haruhi Inside]
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Old 2006-10-20, 16:46   Link #2198
IchiKyo
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http://www.megaupload.com/?d=X7BKDWQ0

Double post but this is the Opening of the Game...
Interesting, need to watch it...
Finally i will see a Story... Orchestred and directed by Fafner Scenarist
The Ancient Simoun and the destiny of Sibylla
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Old 2006-10-21, 10:41   Link #2199
Guppy
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Thanks for that link! The OP was beautiful - I loved the animated versions of the eyecatches. The group shot at the end was interesting, too... kind of a "flip side" shot including everyone who was left out of the previous one.
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Old 2006-10-21, 14:01   Link #2200
Kaoru Chujo
Minase Inori
 
 
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Yes, Ichikyo. Merci mille fois. I was fascinated by the futuristic scenes -- from ancient times when the lost technology was new? -- and by the new sibylla waking up (from the past?). And I liked the simoun tumbling as they rose, and the rose petals like cherry-blossoms in the air. And the music. Am I so much of a fan that I will even play the game? (Shakes head.)
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characters/seiyuus: | Mahouka Koukou | Glasslip | Tokyo Ghoul | Sailor Moon Crystal | Locodol | Ao Haru Ride | Hanayamata | Aldnoah.Zero | Nozaki-kun | Magimoji Rurumo | Zankyou no Terror | Tokyo ESP | Rokujouma no Shinryakusha | Love Stage!! | Jinsei | Rail Wars | Blade Dance | Himegoto
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