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Old 2007-01-16, 14:26   Link #1181
Archer
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Technically, they're not meant to be used in that manner (oh, silly DEEN). There's several things in the anime that go against what is said in the game (Hello Avalon, Ea, Gilgamesh, God Hand, etc.). Personally, I have no idea whether those were Broken Phantasms or not. (I would think that they were, though.)

Here's what Fuyuki Wiki has to say on the matter:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuyuki Wiki
Archer's normal use of it is meant to be through 2 series of X-shaped slashes overlayed over each other (and not thrown either) followed by a reinforced version of Kanshou and Bakuya in the final projection. This would be the winged version seen in the anime, Kanshou and Bakuya Overedge.
For Shirou's origin: It's kinda like a horoscope, as it represents the types of actions that Shirou will take. In a way, it does predict one's future, but not really.

And I forgot about one other Phantasm:

Last Phantasm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuyuki Wiki
The greatest of Noble Phantasms. Excalibur falls into this category.
There's also the Artifical Phantasm, but the definition is pretty vague as to what it is. (It refers to Shirou using Archer's Arm)

Last edited by Archer; 2007-01-16 at 14:40.
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Old 2007-01-21, 16:38   Link #1182
Areguzanda
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I just finished Fate/stay night and I loved it.
I think I understand all of it, and it was a great Anime.
A bit sad ending though, but still.
was kind of hoping that Saber and Shiro would be allowed to be together, but that never happends in Series like this one so I kind of knew Saber had to leave.

This is probably a question asked 1000 times before but I'll still ask: any chance of a continuation of the series?
like...10 years later another holy grale war appears and Shire is choosen again?
whould have been nice though.
Personally I don't think it will be made but I'll still ask if anybody have heard something about anything like this?
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Old 2007-01-21, 18:23   Link #1183
Archer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CreativeNX View Post
I just finished Fate/stay night and I loved it.
I think I understand all of it, and it was a great Anime.
A bit sad ending though, but still.
was kind of hoping that Saber and Shiro would be allowed to be together, but that never happends in Series like this one so I kind of knew Saber had to leave.

This is probably a question asked 1000 times before but I'll still ask: any chance of a continuation of the series?
like...10 years later another holy grale war appears and Shire is choosen again?
whould have been nice though.
Personally I don't think it will be made but I'll still ask if anybody have heard something about anything like this?
The Holy Grail will never appear again, since the association dismantled the Greater Holy Grail after Shirou destroyed the Lesser.

There are several F/SN animation options, none of which are actual "true" sequels. Here's a list from the most to least likely:

1) Fate/Zero. The prequel to Fate/Stay Night, featuring Kiritsugu. Takes place ten years before, with a completely different cast of characters.
2) Unlimited Blade Works/Heaven's Feel. The other scenarios from Fate/Stay Night. Less likely than F/Z since the anime had some parts of these scenarios.
3) Remake, a la Fate/Stay Night [Realta Nua]. A complete animated remake of the entire game, consisting of all the scenarios. Obviously less likely than animations of separate scenarios.
4) Fate/Hollow Ataraxia. It is, by definition, the most "true" sequel to Fate/Stay Night. It is also the least likely to be animated at this point, due to complete lack of information given by the anime.
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Old 2007-02-06, 12:43   Link #1184
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SO....who was Archer?! (in the anime.) I've never played the game. And I was expecting to see the anime go over his background, since they did with the rest of the servants....but that didn't happen!!

Why did he act like he knew Saber personally?! Did he?

Will he be in Fate/Zero?
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Old 2007-02-06, 15:02   Link #1185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mishka View Post
SO....who was Archer?! (in the anime.) I've never played the game. And I was expecting to see the anime go over his background, since they did with the rest of the servants....but that didn't happen!!

Why did he act like he knew Saber personally?! Did he?

Will he be in Fate/Zero?
Spoiler:

Last edited by Archer; 2007-02-06 at 15:18.
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Old 2007-02-06, 15:02   Link #1186
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Which Archer are you referring to?
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Old 2007-02-06, 15:20   Link #1187
Archer
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Originally Posted by mlai View Post
Which Archer are you referring to?
That's a pretty redundant question, considering that the other Archer outright revealed his own name and identity.
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Old 2007-02-07, 10:30   Link #1188
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I never saw Archer Emiya acting as if he knew Saber personally.
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Old 2007-02-07, 14:02   Link #1189
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I believe in the anime, Archer was victim of a incomplete summoning and thus didn't have a complete memory.
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Old 2007-02-08, 12:23   Link #1190
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That is true in both the game and anime. However by the end of the first night he remembers who he is but keeps playing dumb. Wonder what would have happened if he had just said at the start who he was.
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Old 2007-02-08, 18:56   Link #1191
mishka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Question View Post
That is true in both the game and anime. However by the end of the first night he remembers who he is but keeps playing dumb. Wonder what would have happened if he had just said at the start who he was.
most likely nothing! Only Shirou might have had a nervous break down....and that's pretty much it!

What I really don't get is why no one figured out that Shirou was the young Archer since he did the tracing technique and traced Archer's swords!!! I mean come ooooon....
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Old 2007-02-09, 00:16   Link #1192
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Most likely nothing? How about the whole "Wait...how did you become a servant...no wait....what happened in your version of the grail war?!" part. Its implied rin and shirou had a relationship after the grail war ended. Then theres also shirou and saber's relationship.

Its implied rin figured out, or at least suspected, that shirou and archer are linked somehow..."No way....kanshou and bukaya?!". But most people are just going to think that shirou traced those BECAUSE he saw archer using them.
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Old 2007-02-09, 00:45   Link #1193
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Originally Posted by Question View Post
That is true in both the game and anime. However by the end of the first night he remembers who he is
Really? Then why didn't he try and kill Shirou since he was so desperate in getting out of his status as a counter-guardian.
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Old 2007-02-09, 00:51   Link #1194
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Well he certaintly didnt like shirou. But he was wounded by saber so couldnt do much, till the berserker fight where he had mostly healed.

In the game if saber never injures archer then archer does make his move.
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Old 2007-02-11, 10:21   Link #1195
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just wondering hwo many sword s does saber has? and during non combat times,where did she put her invisible sword?
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Old 2007-02-12, 02:51   Link #1196
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Erm she only has one sword. The "invisible sword" is actually invisilble air, a spell to keep her sword hidden.
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Old 2007-02-23, 16:25   Link #1197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanzaki Urumi View Post
1.when Kotomine was explaining to Shirou about the HGW, he also admitted he was the unsuitable person that touched the grail, thus causing the fire , if i wasnt mistaken. So that means Shirou afound out that Kotomine was the cause of the fire, why didnt he go beserk on him?
Don't think Shirou is the type to go beserk on others. Also there is no saying that weather Shirou found out about Kotomine is the cause of fire in the game what so ever...
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Old 2007-02-24, 06:12   Link #1198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archer View Post
Mystic - Otherwise known as sorcery. What you pretty much see everybody using in the war. The effects of sorcery can be replicated by current science. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Thaumaturgy

Magic - Miracles. Magic allows people to do things that are impossible with current science. Anything that can be done with an infinite amount of time and resources with current science is not Magic. There are currently only 5 Magics left in the world, with even fewer amount of users. No participant of the Fifth Heaven's Feel was a true magic user. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Magic

Noble Phantasm - A legendary artifact, crafted after other people's perceptions of it. Essentially, a legend given form. The attack strength of a Noble Phantasm is based upon how strong legends and other people perceive it to be. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Artifact#NoblePhantasms

Broken Phantasm - Raising the attack value of a Noble Phantasm by essentially blowing it up. What you see Archer doing when he fires Caladborg II at Berserker.

Marble Phantasm - The ability to do anything that is possible within the realms of reality. If the chance of an event happening is not zero, then the Marble Phantasm can allow it to happen. Not seen in Fate/Stay Night.

Reality Marble - A "reality" that overrides the true reality. It is essentially the materialization of the user's soul. Everything within the Reality Marble must follow the rules within it, though that rule is often limited. However, it can even allow people to do things that are impossible in the true reality. Whenever a Reality Marble is deployed, the true reality tries to crush it, allowing the user only a few minutes to use it. Only a few sorcerers were able to obtain this sorcery. An imitation of Magic. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Spells#RealityMarble

Origin - http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Origin Shirou's foundation is swords. The direction that his life will take is dependent on his foundation. Even if he can't do any other sorcery to save his life, he will at least be able to use sorcery regarding swords. This becomes rather obvious when you look at his Reality Marble, Unlimited Blade Works.
So what archer did in the fight with berserker was not a noble phantasm but a reality marble? The bow and arrow he used against Berserker was his noble phantasm?

Does that mean the portal Gilgamesh summons with all the swords is also an reality marble and the energy blast he shoots from his turbine sword ishis noble phantasm?
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Old 2007-02-24, 11:43   Link #1199
Archer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myname View Post
So what archer did in the fight with berserker was not a noble phantasm but a reality marble? The bow and arrow he used against Berserker was his noble phantasm?

Does that mean the portal Gilgamesh summons with all the swords is also an reality marble and the energy blast he shoots from his turbine sword ishis noble phantasm?
Unlimited Blade Works is considered a Noble Phantasm, even though it is a Reality Marble. The bow is not a Noble Phantasm, though the "arrows" he uses are. Said arrows are actually Noble Phantasms created from his Reality Marble, then transformed into Broken Phantasms.

Unlimited Blade Works allows the user to recreate weapons after encountering them. This Reality Marble contains all the materials necessary for such tasks, though something that cannot be recreated with the known elements (such as Avalon or Ea) cannot be created. This can be done even while the Unlimited Blade Works is not deployed (expanded a la the last part of Archer vs Berserker anime battle). In doing so, the user is essentially creating something from nothing.

Gate of Babylon is not a Reality Marble as it does not override reality. Gate of Babylon instead opens a portal to Gilgamesh's already existing vault of treasures, which he can use as he pleases. This is significantly different from Unlimited Blade Works, as Gate of Babylon simply transports the weapons, whereas Unlimited Blade Works creates them.

The "turbine sword" (Ea) is a Noble Phantasm, though the energy blast is not. Actually, it shouldn't even be an energy blast (as seen in the anime), as Ea only contains and compresses air. This highly compressed wind is used to then open a spact/time rift, which "slices" through the intended target. The maximum output can be achieved when Enuma Elish is used as the activation word.
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Old 2007-02-24, 13:31   Link #1200
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I have a question too: Please read last line of my post if you think my post is too long.


Hmm...I personally don't think UBW is a Noble Phantasm. Even though in the game it did say UBW is one. The defination of a Noble Phantasm is a materialized legend isn't it? For a Noble Phantasm the principal rule is that there is a 'legend' about it. However there's no legend about the UBW at all, so I don't like the idea of calling UBW a Noble Phantasm.

Having read Kara no Kyoukai and Tsukihime, here's my version of explanation of UBW:

Unlimited Blade Works, or Reality Marble is an incomplete Marble Phantasm. Where the wielder of Marble Phantasm can create something out of nothing without any limitations, the wielder of a Reality Marble, can only create things that are within his/her 'own world'. That is, what's most significant of a person's inner heart. For example, if there's a computer freak wielding a Reality Marble, what he can summon are basically computer-related items, such as processors or programs. Of course, if the computer freak one day changes and become a ero-game freak, then his Reality Marble will no longer be able to summon computer chips, but lots of CG, or even CD of those games.
Also when a Reality Marble is switched off, the 'true' reality comes back, while a Marble Phantasm is capable of destroying the reality it erodes away and staying there without switching off.

To make it even more simple, let's start from the lower level of Reality Marble related magic: tracing/projection.

Think of a projector in real life:
You put images into the projector and project it onto a screen and an image is created. Same for tracing magic:
You put concepts in your magic circuit and project it onto reality and an object is created.

Now imagine you have a thousand projectors and a thousand screens completely surrounding you. Don't mind how you cramp all the projectors together, but now each projector is projecting a fraction of an image onto each of the screens. There, a 'world' made by picture is created. The 'reality' around you disappeared as you are surrounded by screens, and with the projections you create an imaginary world around you.
Similar for Reality Marble. You open up multiple magic circuits and have them project different objects around the reality you are in. Only this time the objects projects are not limited by images, but also objects, atoms, air and even time flow. This is how I think a Reality Marble works.

Now for Shirou's case.
Shirou did not learn Reality Marble properly like a magician do. Therefore, his reality marble is not complete. Unlimited Blade Works is actually not a projection of his inner heart, but a projection of his alaya-naya, or 'source' in English. Shirou's 'source' is swords. And therefore his Reality Marble is UBW--it's not Shirou's inner heart eroding the real world, but the entity of 'Emiya Shirou's existence' eroding the real world. That is, even if Emiya Shirou is to one day turn into a skateboard otaku his Reality Marble is still UBW. But since Emiya Shirou is so close to his 'source' I don't think he would be pick up any non-sword related hobby...
I often compare Emiya Shirou with Ryogo Shiki from Kara no Kyokai--they both are close to the 'source' in different ways. While Shiki is able to directly open a communication path and understand the 'source', Emiya Shirou is constantly communicating with the 'source' however he only see the sword part of the 'source'

To sum it up:
Reality Marble = incompletely/weaker form of Marble Phantasm.
Unlimited Blade Works = incomplete Reality Marble backed up by the 'source'

So: UBW = a very broken form of Marble Phantasm backed up by the 'source'

Of course, this theory is just me gathering bits and pieces from the 3 novel works of Nasu---there is no evidence what-so-ever that backs me up so only believe what you like: it's A-OK if you completely/partially disagree on my theory.


Question!
Q: Is Saber's Excalibur and Caliburn a one-handed or two-handed sword? It looks like one-handed to me, but Saber is always wielding it with two hands...
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