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Old 2007-04-27, 02:15   Link #1661
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vhx View Post
I just watched the first episode and I have to say... what exactly is this?

I am pretty tolerant of anime genre's and consider myself to be open to new concepts and ideas. However, this show just makes my head hurt. First of all 10 minutes of talking about food, the way to eat food, and how they setup food was probably the biggest waste of my time EVER.

To be honest the only saving grace for this anime is the character's drawing style, which imo is pretty cute. I think I only laughed once and that was when she was talking about how she knocked out some foreign guy and she related it to street fighter. This anime is probably the biggest chick anime I have ever seen. If you honestly like watching anime where ditzy girls talk about pointless subjects, then all the more power to you. However, I can barely stand that IRL, much less 20ish minutes of that in anime form. I mean theres no plot at all, it's just one random thought to the next. I think I saw them go from food -> glasses -> colds in the matter of a few minutes.

I have no idea how this anime even deserves its own section. I have seen many great anime's come and go (and some awesome ones) that did not have it's own section. I guess theres always a market for things like this; so I have a feeling I'm gonna get torn into by the fans here (:P), but just honestly what's so interesting about this anime?

/boggle
It's the nature of the 4Koma beast, you either get the joke and laugh or don't and have no other choice but to scratch you head and mull it over. I think some basic to intermediate knowledge of Japanese culture and the Otaku lifestly is a prerequisite. You also need to know the meaning of the term moe, as Lucky Star parodies and slams the concept quite routinely by presenting it at it's core values without any sugar coating, for the characters to comment on. Nothing is sacred with Konata.
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Old 2007-04-27, 07:01   Link #1662
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vhx View Post
but just honestly what's so interesting about this anime?
How many times I have read this kind of question, I wonder
Now I think we should consider about having a thread for LS haters. It'll be easy for new fan or anti-fan to navigate where they should go first .
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Old 2007-04-27, 07:34   Link #1663
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vhx View Post
honestly what's so interesting about this anime?
Same things that were interesting about Azumanga Daioh. If you didn't like that, you probably won't like this. How many times has that been said in this thread? Geez, people, I know this thread is long, but read a little first.

/still hasn't had time to watch ep 3.
//maybe tonight.
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Old 2007-04-27, 07:35   Link #1664
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Thread for LS haters? It's like saying lets make a flame thread for a certain anime. I feel I don't like to have a thread like that and besides it's their option not to watch LS if they're LS haters.
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Old 2007-04-27, 07:35   Link #1665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vhx View Post
I just watched the first episode and I have to say... what exactly is this?

I am pretty tolerant of anime genre's and consider myself to be open to new concepts and ideas. However, this show just makes my head hurt. First of all 10 minutes of talking about food, the way to eat food, and how they setup food was probably the biggest waste of my time EVER.

To be honest the only saving grace for this anime is the character's drawing style, which imo is pretty cute. I think I only laughed once and that was when she was talking about how she knocked out some foreign guy and she related it to street fighter. This anime is probably the biggest chick anime I have ever seen. If you honestly like watching anime where ditzy girls talk about pointless subjects, then all the more power to you. However, I can barely stand that IRL, much less 20ish minutes of that in anime form. I mean theres no plot at all, it's just one random thought to the next. I think I saw them go from food -> glasses -> colds in the matter of a few minutes.

I have no idea how this anime even deserves its own section. I have seen many great anime's come and go (and some awesome ones) that did not have it's own section. I guess theres always a market for things like this; so I have a feeling I'm gonna get torn into by the fans here (:P), but just honestly what's so interesting about this anime?

/boggle
Just because an anime has no plot means it isn't good?

Lucky Star is Seinen slice-of-life, and slice-of-life anime is much better than plot driven ones. Especially for people like me hu does a dumb security job (MINDEF MP) and spends most of my time sleeping. Basically for older audiences who have a full-time job and can't concentrate on a long plot, and can catch in-between-the-lines jokes.

Spoiler for Episode 1 In-between-the-lines using a.f.k.'s Americanised subs:


I think if u're at least 17 u can catch the above sexual reference. So you think its juz dumb talk abt food eh? Its more sophisticated than meets the eye.

When an anime is slice-of-life, the rewatchability goes up alot as compared to a plot-driven anime or a comedy anime. For plot-driven anime, you can anticipate the plot twists and for comedies, you can anticipate the joke. SoL is good to watch over and over again and almost never fails to amuse.

I personally have watched Lucky Star episode 1 five times, episode 2 seven times and episode 3 four times and counting (episode 3 is the best so far). Looks like I'm gonna watch episode 3 alot of times, should be at least ten.

One of the best SoL anime of all time is Azumanga Daioh. This one I can re-watch a few million times. I thought Lucky Star was going to be inferior to Azumanga Daioh until episode 3.

If you think a series this good doesn't deserve its own section, you are better off not watching anime at all in my opinion.

Last edited by dKiWi; 2007-04-27 at 07:50.
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Old 2007-04-27, 08:07   Link #1666
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@ vhx.. Just consider yourself not otaku enough to understand some of the jokes ... this anime would definitely not be your taste till the end. The other some are just a slice of life drama.. ordinary peoples talking about ordinary thing.. your call, if you dont like episode 1, I would suggest you never bother wasting your bandwidth to download subsequent episodes either.
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Old 2007-04-27, 09:35   Link #1667
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenjiharima View Post
Thread for LS haters? It's like saying lets make a flame thread for a certain anime. I feel I don't like to have a thread like that and besides it's their option not to watch LS if they're LS haters.
C'mon, I was just joking ^^".
It's just kind of frustrating to see the same questiong being asked over and over.
How about asking "What's so interesting about LS" in Q&A thread.....?
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Old 2007-04-27, 10:24   Link #1668
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duo Maxwell View Post
How many times I have read this kind of question, I wonder
Now I think we should consider about having a thread for LS haters. It'll be easy for new fan or anti-fan to navigate where they should go first .
I wouldn't call them "haters" (at least not initially)... more like "don't getters".
Later, the insecurity over not getting it does cause some to start "hating" though ... a classic human behavior.

That last remark was a bit rude, don't you think, dKiWi? "Good" is a subjective term... although I can recognize when something is "good" even if *I* don't care for it.
A lot of opera and ballet is good.... though I can't sit through it. Some forms of music I can't stand -- though I can recognize which ones are excellent examples of the genre.
Lucky*Star, I feel like is a fine carry-forward of a type of comedy I enjoy immensely - but, like Monty Python, Hitchhiker's Guide, Mr. Bean, National Lampoon, Stephan Wright .... there's a lot of people who just sit there and scratch their heads. If they're mature about it, they just shrug that its not hitting their "funny" ... if they're insecure about that - they say it sucks and anyone who likes it is stupid.

You don't have to *be* otaku to get all the jokes... you just have to know *about* otaku-ness. Just remember.... geek/nerd does not equate to 'otaku' (there's just a large overlap). Dorktower is a good reference material for that overlap
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Old 2007-04-27, 11:57   Link #1669
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It's interesting when people get worked up about the slightest comment here.

If you believe someone is being extremely negative about a show in their comments, you must also believe other people can be extremely positive about it.

Both are the same in more than one way, yet, you rarely see the second one being questioned or challenged.
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Old 2007-04-27, 11:57   Link #1670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dKiWi View Post

I personally have watched Lucky Star episode 1 five times, episode 2 seven times and episode 3 four times and counting (episode 3 is the best so far). Looks like I'm gonna watch episode 3 alot of times, should be at least ten.

One of the best SoL anime of all time is Azumanga Daioh. This one I can re-watch a few million times. I thought Lucky Star was going to be inferior to Azumanga Daioh until episode 3.

If you think a series this good doesn't deserve its own section, you are better off not watching anime at all in my opinion.
You must have an unbelievable amount of time on your hands. And don't you think you are overexaggerating the compexity and impact of Lucky Star just a wee bit. You're making it sound like it's the greatest comedy ever written or something. You don't need to scare the guy into not watching it by making him feel unworthy and too dumb to watch it. Let's keep an open mind over a curious personality, the same way people kept an open mind about me when I jumped into Haruhi and the 21st century last sum....Wait....is that what happened with me? Man slice of life fans can be unwelcoming, but for a few. It's almost no wonder why new initiates can be turned off very quickly in the beginning (like me last summer with Haruhi).

Hey Daniel E. sorry I can't postive rep you for your post yet (I'd almost give you 3 reps for nailing it right on the head with what I've been trying to say. Since nobody listens to me, hopefully they will listen to your wisdom). What you said in the second paragraph is what I've been trying to explain to people in relation to accusations of trolling. Except replace extremely negative with moderately negative in my case and you've got it. I'll paint a picture of my personal theory regarding environments of popular anime.



There seems to be no room for dissent on boards of these types of shows. What I find interesting is that if you go to a board on say Darker Than Black, it's completely civil.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2007-04-27 at 12:18.
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Old 2007-04-27, 12:01   Link #1671
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It's interesting that the issue of what constitutes "quality" is a big deal in the business world as well.

At the risk of sounding like an old fogey (guess I am actually), as part of my PMP certification the PMI folks preach that quality is how well the end product matches the requirements. IOW, if the requirements say "use bailing wire" and your end product does, in fact, use bailing wire, then the final product is of good quality.

Now, you may say that the requirements should specify something more substantial, but that's not a quality issue. That's someone either misunderstanding what they were asking for, or having decided that they needed to cut corners somewhere to match the budget.

SO... for a series like LS, the quality question is, does this do a good job of bringing the manga to life? If it does, then it's a quality adaption even if you don't particularly care for this type of series - in which case you should look for something where the requirements and your tastes align better.

All that said, how long until ep 4?
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Old 2007-04-27, 12:37   Link #1672
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin_Sama View Post
You must have an unbelievable amount of time on your hands. And don't you think you are overexaggerating the compexity and impact of Lucky Star just a wee bit. You're making it sound like it's the greatest comedy ever written or something. You don't need to scare the guy into not watching it by making him feel unworthy and too dumb to watch it. Let's keep an open mind over a curious personality, the same way people kept an open mind about me when I jumped into Haruhi and the 21st century last sum....Wait....is that what happened with me? Man slice of life fans can be unwelcoming, but for a few. It's almost no wonder why new initiates can be turned off very quickly in the beginning (like me last summer with Haruhi).
Actually its more like I get back from work pissed off with the world, and I decide to watch the OP to destress, then I end up watching the entire episode. Can't... click... the... X... gah. Too good. This repeats almost everyday. I end up watching about 4 anime every season and may end up dropping at least 2, which explains my excess time. Rather watch 1 series to death.

And its not like I want to scare anyone but it isn't like I wasn't offended by what he wrote. And I was dismally disappointed by the lack of counter-arguements.

Usually I rather not actually post in these forums and just leech information, and recently have not been browsing too much. But posts like this has changed my mentality for good.
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Old 2007-04-27, 12:51   Link #1673
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Originally Posted by NaweG View Post
It's interesting that the issue of what constitutes "quality" is a big deal in the business world as well.

At the risk of sounding like an old fogey (guess I am actually), as part of my PMP certification the PMI folks preach that quality is how well the end product matches the requirements. IOW, if the requirements say "use bailing wire" and your end product does, in fact, use bailing wire, then the final product is of good quality.

Now, you may say that the requirements should specify something more substantial, but that's not a quality issue. That's someone either misunderstanding what they were asking for, or having decided that they needed to cut corners somewhere to match the budget.

SO... for a series like LS, the quality question is, does this do a good job of bringing the manga to life? If it does, then it's a quality adaption even if you don't particularly care for this type of series - in which case you should look for something where the requirements and your tastes align better.

All that said, how long until ep 4?
Quoted in entirety for Great Truth....

The release pattern so far has been
LC usually releases their "speed sub" on Tuesday...
a.f.k. usually on Wednesday...
The other vary.

I've taken a look at Eien no Anime's releases.... people who are somewhat unhappy with some of a.f.k.'s choices in translation or grimacing at some of LC's efforts might consider looking at EnA. They sort of occupy a middle ground -- definitely some errors but for 'no apparent reason' they didn't distract me so much. Their font and color choices for subtitling also scored a "win" from the Queen-of-picky about such things in my home.

P.S. I've watched the L*S episodes probably as many times as dKiWi (though in some cases it was to check translations) a good deal of it was just because I was channeling the enjoyment I get out of the show ... from the simple BGMs to the OP to just watching the character animation.
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Old 2007-04-27, 13:09   Link #1674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Quoted in entirety for Great Truth....

The release pattern so far has been
LC usually releases their "speed sub" on Tuesday...
a.f.k. usually on Wednesday...
The other vary.

I've taken a look at Eien no Anime's releases.... people who are somewhat unhappy with some of a.f.k.'s choices in translation or grimacing at some of LC's efforts might consider looking at EnA. They sort of occupy a middle ground -- definitely some errors but for 'no apparent reason' they didn't distract me so much. Their font and color choices for subtitling also scored a "win" from the Queen-of-picky about such things in my home.

P.S. I've watched the L*S episodes probably as many times as dKiWi (though in some cases it was to check translations) a good deal of it was just because I was channeling the enjoyment I get out of the show ... from the simple BGMs to the OP to just watching the character animation.
I think the most times I have ever watched an episode was 5 for Kuroi Gundam the first episode Zeta Gundam. I saw it once subbed, again once subbed, then I saw it with a friend on my R1 Dvd's then again with my friend and his brother because I was needed as Mr. Explanation guy and then again with my friends brother and her girlfriend for the same reason. Each time I enjoyed it a little less, I also think I got up and went to make something to eat during the 5th time.
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Old 2007-04-27, 13:15   Link #1675
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Originally Posted by NaweG View Post
All that said, how long until ep 4?
Sometime tomorrow night there'll be raw/unsubtitled videos, in 2-3 days you'll see Lucky-Channel's fansubs, and in 4-5 days you'll see AFK's version.
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Old 2007-04-27, 13:39   Link #1676
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin_Sama View Post
I think the most times I have ever watched an episode was 5
Ah... heh heh... 5 times is a lot? (quietly slinks away)

I have absolutely no idea how many times I've watched some episodes of Haruhi, Karin, and similar classics... but if AVIs could wear out... I guess I watch anime like most people listen to CDs... I mean most people listen to an album more than five times, right?
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Old 2007-04-27, 14:36   Link #1677
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Originally Posted by dKiWi View Post
I think if u're at least 17 u can catch the above sexual reference. So you think its juz dumb talk abt food eh? Its more sophisticated than meets the eye.
I thought it was just about food. And I thought it was humorous. I've even had conversations like that in real life. And we weren't thinking anything vulgar, at least not until someone with his mind in the gutter makes the suggestion. Then we just start laughing at him for his H-ness.

Quote:
I personally have watched Lucky Star episode 1 five times, episode 2 seven times and episode 3 four times and counting (episode 3 is the best so far). Looks like I'm gonna watch episode 3 alot of times, should be at least ten.
They have medicine for OCD now, you know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaweG View Post
It's interesting that the issue of what constitutes "quality" is a big deal in the business world as well.

At the risk of sounding like an old fogey (guess I am actually), as part of my PMP certification the PMI folks preach that quality is how well the end product matches the requirements. IOW, if the requirements say "use bailing wire" and your end product does, in fact, use bailing wire, then the final product is of good quality.
And if the requirements are utterly brain-dead? Business documents try to describe three different things at the same time: What the client wants. What the client needs. And what the client asks for. By your judgement, you should always deliver the third.

Problem is, clients are often morons. If they knew what they were doing, they wouldn't need me to do it for them.
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Old 2007-04-27, 15:09   Link #1678
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Originally Posted by Telliamed View Post

They have medicine for OCD now, you know.
Funny you should mention, I have OCD for real and I still don't get the idea behind watching an anime episode more than maybe twice at the absolute most. Once your done with an episode I think its healthy to move onto the next one, or finish something else up you may have on the back-burner. I guess my OCD gimmick would be something of a gotta keep going nature.
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Old 2007-04-27, 19:39   Link #1679
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Quote:
Lucky Star is Seinen slice-of-life, and slice-of-life anime is much better than plot driven ones.
Uh-huh...

Now, I love slice of life, but that doesn't make a whole genre better than a whole lot of other genres...
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Old 2007-04-28, 01:20   Link #1680
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I'm going to pick up the gauntlet here and try to write a good counter-argument to VHX's post.

The first issue here is that topically this show is dealing mostly with a relatively specialized set of topics related to otaku. Anime trends, MMORPGs, old sci-fi movies, etc. If you're not hugely into most of those topics, or don't care to have them analyzed self-referentially, it'll be harder for you to get much from this show. The humor in this show isn't 50% universal, unlike say, urinal jokes.

In order for a slice-of-life comedy to appeal to you, you must be passingly familiar with the particular slice that's being examined. For instance, multiple people in this thread (including myself) have been a bit awed at just how precisely the food conversation mirrors conversations we have had with our friends in real life. If you have never had a conversation even remotely resembling that one, it'll be rather hard to relate to. A lot of the value this show offers is in displaying common patterns (memes) such as conversation topics or stereotypes in their stark essence. In the first episode, the character Miyuki is introduced as a supremely cute-girl moe character. However, the specific details of what makes her moe are not only laid down with cold precision, she's then openly made fun of. So a fan of such moe is going to go Oooh! And then go Man, she's kind of lame for such a cute girl... but wait, when characters do lame stuff like that I think they're cute... what does that say about me? The trouble is that if your first reaction is "What a ditz", you're never going to get the rest of the chain of thought and the dramatic tension that it leads to.

Another reason to appreciate this show is the way in which it balances in-your-face commentary with subtle observations. An example of the first would be the scene where Konata explains to her friends that this kidnapper in the newspapers was probably trying to act out a common theme in adult games. The response is basically "How does a high school junior get to know so much about porn games?". A lot of viewers who immediately grokked Konata's explanation are now feeling something like Aaaugh, busted! For an example of something more subtle, consider the sequence where Konata visits Kagami who is at home sick. From Kagami's perspective Konata is largely annoying (mostly for failing to follow expectations of how to treat a sick person), but when Miyuki hears about it her take on Konata's behavior is radically more positive. The tricky thing is that Miyuki might actually be correct in her assessment, if you go back and rewatch the timing of the first part. There's an additional irony in that Miyuki's supposedly proper visit ends up looking like it's a lot more strain on the sick girl. This sort of thing encourages multiple viewings of the show, and increases appreciation for the levels of meaning that aren't often apparent at first (although I can't believe anyone didn't get Konata's suggestive motions when describing how to eat ice cream, that was *so* not-subtle).

So, this show does an impressively good job of exposing stereotypes, common assumptions, otaku excesses, etc. If you don't see them, or more importantly if you don't desire to watch a show that pushes you to think about that sort of thing, you're not likely to find this enjoyable. Those elements are there in abundance though, which is why there are quite a few fans for this show.

On to other subjects... I agree that people who can rewatch animes many times must have a lot more free time than I do. Unlike music, it's hard to watch anime while say, driving an hour one way to work. I have way too many hobbies to begin with though, doesn't help. And um, I've watched the OP about 100 times now. The first time I thought it sucked. The second time I decided it was oddly catchy. About the fifth time I started noticing the unusual use of time signatures. Around 50 I started making corrections to the translations. I think my wife is starting to wonder about me... of course she says I'm almost as cute as Miyuki, so I guess I've got her sufficiently deluded or something.
BTW Kaioshin-kun, Lucky Star *is* the greatest comedy ever written. You just haven't come out of the closet enough with your loli-moeness to admit it yet. And yer OCD? That explains a few of your odder posts.
:: makes a note to send Kaioshin a case of soap::
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