AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Retired > Lucky Star

Notices

View Poll Results: Lucky Star - Episode 03 Rating
Perfect 10 12 10.26%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 38 32.48%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 38 32.48%
7 out of 10 : Good 17 14.53%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 6.84%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.85%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.85%
1 out of 10 : Painful 2 1.71%
Voters: 117. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 2007-04-28, 05:30   Link #181
Pellissier
♪~ Daydreaming ~♪
*Graphic Designer
*Administrator
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Italy
Indeed thanks to both. It shows once again how troublesome it is to catch certain references within different cultures. I'll rewatch that scene with a new eye from now on.
__________________
Pellissier is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 05:49   Link #182
Deathkillz
~ You're dead ^__^* ~
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: uk, England
Age: 24
Send a message via MSN to Deathkillz
yea its sometimes a problem when the show comments heavily on the cultural and language differences...there only so much foot notes you can put above the lines spoken but seriously it really limits the fun if you arent able to get the joke first thing >.< with the LC subs i had to pause the ep quite a number of times just to read the info at the top...which kinda annoyed me as it not only interrupted the flow of the ep but also i get the feeling of being dumbed down

edit: and thats a fricking big nose (points at wiki article) XD
__________________

Siggy: hohohohoho~ | AnimeHistory welcome to our blog ~ | Summer2009 early review
Under the radar series Summer2009: Kanamemo, GA Geijutsuka Art, NEEDLESS
Deathkillz is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 06:26   Link #183
Ascaloth
I don't give a damn, dude
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In Despair
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Pedophilia refers to sexual attraction to pre-pubsescent children. It is often misused by lay people to refer to attraction to "underage" women (where underage varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction). It depends on how one defines a "young girl" I suppose ....
"loli" also refers to a clothing style or waifish appearance - making its meaning even more multi-layered. My observation of japanese culture shows some grey murkiness in the term's use.
In terms of the episode.... it really depends on how we're to intrepret her remarks ... and whether we should consider her "lolita"-ish or younger. She certainly doesn't look child-like when she drops into her "dark" mode.

As far as the english lexicon... half the english language is composed of lifted words (more than a few recently from japanese).... english is a thuggish language of acquisition.

... which is why I said "whatever" ....

Does this mean we get to chain you up and paddle you now?
Hold the chains and paddles, grasshopper. From the way you describe your missus every now and then, some might say you're a lolicon. J/K
Ascaloth is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 07:27   Link #184
Simon
気持ち悪い
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: New Zealand
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
[Akari] was talking about how she has her own brand of obsessive fans, and "lolicon" was not said with endearment in mind. She was being condescending and rude to her own fanbase (and indirectly, the fanbase in general), with an intent to insult.
I wonder if she posts on Mixi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diedrupo View Post
Lolicon and pedophile may be two different words, but they are pretty similar. ... Pedophile would be a perfectly acceptable word to replace it with ... since it is the english word closest to what Lolicon means short of using "lolita complex" which would be awkward in any translation.
Slightly OT, but "lolita" can also be used with a very different meaning in Japan. Do the Japanese ever refer to the dirty-raincoat variety as "lolita", or do they reserve "loli" for that? I once saw a sign reading 「ロリ・コーナー」 in a Toranoana store, though unfortunately not soon enough to prevent my eyes burning...


Anyway, ep3:

Am I the only one who immediately thought "Haruhi reference" during this dialogue?

Kagami: But I have a feeling that anyone would look good with a ponytail.
Konata: Are you sure about that?

I'm probably reading too much into it (in fact does this bit in the manga predate SHnY?), but just the way Konata paused seemed significant. Unless it was an "anyone except you, Kagami-chan" sort of pause.

I also cracked up at Konata's impassioned speech about not defiling your anime collectibles by using them - not least because I've just been sorting out my collection of pretty-but-useless Japanese phonecards. The dramatic BGM during her speech just makes it funnier.

Finally, I love Konata's voice during the "I'm a geek" bit - the combination of Hirano's intonation and the slight echo they add has me going back and replaying it with my eyes closed. And don't get me started on the "victory sound" she makes during this scene:

Spoiler for ep3 17:44:

Excuse me while I squee
Simon is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 10:07   Link #185
Samatarou
Son of God
*Artist
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Am I the only one who immediately thought "Haruhi reference" during this dialogue?

Kagami: But I have a feeling that anyone would look good with a ponytail.
Konata: Are you sure about that?
It's been discussed in some forums, it certainly made me think of Kyon's speech to Haruhi about looking good in a ponytail. When you add in the fumoffu allusion too it makes you wonder whether Kyon might have a secret hobby of lurking in dark alleyways wearing a horse's head... in Konata's imagination maybe...
__________________

Close this thread, Open the nexT
Samatarou is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 11:54   Link #186
Vexx
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascaloth View Post
Hold the chains and paddles, grasshopper. From the way you describe your missus every now and then, some might say you're a lolicon. J/K
look up "weeaboo" and the obscure reference will make more sense

Heh, he said "weeaboo".
Vexx is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 12:07   Link #187
Jazzrat
Bearly Legal
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
thanks for the cookie

just an extra for the niceties, the same long pointy nose metaphor was also used in Honey & Clover when Morita proclaim Bill Gates as his guardian angel. (Mr Microsoft had a unnaturally pointy nose in that part)

Spoiler for pointy noses:
__________________

Last edited by Jazzrat; 2007-04-28 at 12:23.
Jazzrat is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 15:47   Link #188
Maveric
Aimai 3 cm
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Columbus OH
Age: 30
Send a message via AIM to Maveric
At the end of the episode (afk 19:30), Konata says "That was what you call an element of turning people on." right before her "GOOD JOB!" Is that supposed to mean the same kid of "turn on" as in western culture? Cuz they've used it before too, but I don't see how this play on words really works as a joke.

Or you know, I could have no sense of humor and just don't get it.
Maveric is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 16:17   Link #189
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Moe isn't necessarily sexual.
Anh_Minh is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 18:53   Link #190
Samatarou
Son of God
*Artist
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maveric View Post
At the end of the episode (afk 19:30), Konata says "That was what you call an element of turning people on."
afk used the same phrase to describe moe in Haruhi, it's a rather narrow definition which fitted the Haruhi case where she was talking about Mikuru's moe attributes but like Anh_Minh says moe isn't necessarily about sexiness, in fact there is no universally accepted definition of the term moe, it means many things to many people in various subcultures. That it arises from two homophones, "budding" and "burning" (萌え and 燃え), is about all that can be said without too much fear of contradiction.

All Kona-chan means when she says "good job" is that Miyuki is living up to the moe sterotype that Kona-chan has of her. Personally I'd never considered klutziness to be a significant aspect of moe, but it's clear from Kona-chan's ramblings about Miyuki that some people do, presumably because it can confer an endearing quality of vulnerability that makes people feel protective about that person. However not every klutzy person is moe by a long chalk, and in fact I don't regard Miyuki as moe myself, I think Tsukasa is the real moe character. Miyuki is the "tick box" moe character, like others have said she's a parody: on paper she has all the attributes required of a moe character yet they don't combine to give a real feeling of moe (I probably just pissed off a lot of Miyuki fans there....)
__________________

Close this thread, Open the nexT
Samatarou is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 21:39   Link #191
Skane
Anime Snark
 
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Singapore
Age: 31
Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samatarou View Post
~ (I probably just pissed off a lot of Miyuki fans there....)
Wait... there's Miyuki-fans out there?

j/k

Narf.
__________________
Skane is offline  
Old 2007-04-28, 23:01   Link #192
Daniel E.
AniMexican!
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Monterrey N.L. Mexico
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skane View Post
Wait... there's Miyuki-fans out there?

j/k

Narf.
ROOARRRR !!!

I wont forget this!! j/k
__________________
Daniel E. is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 03:11   Link #193
Anime Online
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
I would say Miyuki fits one version of moe, but the really moe one would be Akira. From her overlong sleeves, her cute Japanese and her expressions, the overall impression just screams "MOE!". This makes her Jekyll & Hyde transformations funnier.
Anime Online is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 03:17   Link #194
Telliamed
sensei no pet
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia, USA
I think we'd have a much harder time trying to find the character in L*S who isn't moe.

... hell, even Minoru has it.
__________________
Telliamed is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 04:03   Link #195
Kaoru Chujo
Minase Inori
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Personally, I like most of the Akamatsu Ken definition of moe, which involves a reflexive "motherly" obsession with someone cute and in need of protection. I think that's why being klutzy is moe. But I think Akamatsu protests too much when he says there is never a sexual element involved.

However, I think that the term has become completely debased now, in the SaiMoe tournament in particular, so that it in common parlance it just means "turns you on." So that translation would be okay...except that I think Konata is using "moe" in its original sense.

But I'm not going to be a stickler here. I'd probably just translate it "moe," myself, but "turn-on" is quite reasonable, and has the definite advantage of being more widely understood.
__________________
MINASE Inori 水瀬いのり age 18. 2010 Occult Academy (Akari). 2011 Uta no Prince-sama 1000% (students). 2012 Nukko (Sumire), Symphogear (minor roles). 2013 Love Lab (Suzu), Super Seisyun Brothers (Kohara Shiyo). 2014 Robot Girls Z (Gre-chan), Nobunaga The Fool (Chibihane, Toku), Black Bullet (Mibu), Is the order a rabbit? (Chino), Sugar Soldier (Kisaragi Makoto), Gargantia OVA (Rima), Locodol (Mirai), Aldnoah.Zero (Eddelrittuo), Sora no Method (Noel).
Hashihime blog | Twitter @nakanokimi | summer 2014 previews | summer 2014 schedule |
characters/seiyuus: | Mahouka Koukou | Glasslip | Tokyo Ghoul | Sailor Moon Crystal | Locodol | Ao Haru Ride | Hanayamata | Aldnoah.Zero | Nozaki-kun | Magimoji Rurumo | Zankyou no Terror | Tokyo ESP | Rokujouma no Shinryakusha | Love Stage!! | Jinsei | Rail Wars | Blade Dance | Himegoto
Kaoru Chujo is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 05:26   Link #196
nikorai
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Russia, Moscow
Age: 29
Send a message via ICQ to nikorai
hello.
im awfully late. just watched the episode though i downloaded it back on tuesday. i think i need to watch it again. there are a lot of talks full of jokes and references. i surely missed half of them
nikorai is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 10:27   Link #197
bayoab
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
Personally, I like most of the Akamatsu Ken definition of moe, which involves a reflexive "motherly" obsession with someone cute and in need of protection. I think that's why being klutzy is moe. But I think Akamatsu protests too much when he says there is never a sexual element involved.
I'm going to interject here and point out that Akamatsu is a lolicon/pedophile. (Yes, he falls under both). Therefore his attempt to define "moe" is the same as asking a standard leecher to define a fansub. (They will deny/not mention illegality.)
Quote:
However, I think that the term has become completely debased now, in the SaiMoe tournament in particular, so that it in common parlance it just means "turns you on." So that translation would be okay...except that I think Konata is using "moe" in its original sense.

But I'm not going to be a stickler here. I'd probably just translate it "moe," myself, but "turn-on" is quite reasonable, and has the definite advantage of being more widely understood.
I think it's clear that, especially in the context of ep3, Konata means fetish which is just the same contextually as a turn-on. She is refering to how Miyuki's silly clutziness is something guys will like. (I use fetish since she refers to it as an element or type.)

The other problem of not translating "moe" is that while "moe" makes sense to hardcore otaku as a word, the majority of otaku have one of three definitions in their head. Therefore putting it in a sub would cause different meanings to different people.
bayoab is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 12:19   Link #198
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Logician and Romantic
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoab View Post
I'm going to interject here and point out that Akamatsu is a lolicon/pedophile. (Yes, he falls under both). Therefore his attempt to define "moe" is the same as asking a standard leecher to define a fansub. (They will deny/not mention illegality.)
Except of course, Akamatsu is happily married...

I fail to see how he wouldn't be qualified to give a definition for moe. Your opinion of the manga author is rather unnaturally harsh, I am afraid. Are you suggesting he should be in jail?
__________________
Vallen Chaos Valiant is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 14:25   Link #199
bayoab
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Except of course, Akamatsu is happily married...

I fail to see how he wouldn't be qualified to give a definition for moe. Your opinion of the manga author is rather unnaturally harsh, I am afraid. Are you suggesting he should be in jail?
Akamatsu got married to his current wife when she was 16. (He was 30+.) I can't find the information for it but she was at most 14 when they first met. (There are rumors regarding negima!? and love hina regarding these issues.) To give another analogy, him defining moe is the same thing as a drug addict defining addiction.

I am not suggesting he should be jailed or anything. I am just saying that someone who likes young girls should not be defining that a word regarding feelings toward young girls (in his case).
bayoab is offline  
Old 2007-04-29, 14:32   Link #200
FatPianoBoy
Dansa med oss
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Near Cincinnati, OH, but actually in Kentucky
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoab View Post
I am not suggesting he should be jailed or anything. I am just saying that someone who likes young girls should not be defining that a word regarding feelings toward young girls (in his case).
Because he has feelings for young girls, he's not qualified to define feelings toward young girls...?

As for your comparison, I think I'd trust a drug addicts definition of addiciton more than someone who has never known what it's like to be addicted to something.
__________________
FatPianoBoy is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:46.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.