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View Poll Results: Lucky Star - Episode 5 Rating
Perfect 10 33 25.98%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 48 37.80%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 30 23.62%
7 out of 10 : Good 9 7.09%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 1.57%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 0.79%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 4 3.15%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-05-08, 00:59   Link #61
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telliamed View Post
So Hirano singing well (Sore ga Ai Deshou) is bad.
And Hirano singing poorly (Chala Head Chala) is bad?

Whatever. I liked this weeks ED. I'd especially be interested in seeing a live performance of it.
Well yeah basically it isn't really a good thing and I use that to differentiate from saying its a bad thing, I think "Not A Good Thing" suffices. I see it this way with regard too these two endings:

Basically why not both well done or neither well done? It kind of seems like they wanted to play favourites with their own series here, or maybe not that they are playing favourites, but are afraid of backlash so they treaded carefully with S.A.D. But from who are they afraid of backlash? Their own fanbase? There are a lot of Full Metal Panic Fumoffu fans, but there are still even more Dragon Ball Z fans out there who might not take this rendition so well. Are they not entitled to a faithful rendition like the Fumoffu fans?

That's all I can garner from it that it's studio politics that govern the endings. Either that or they think the only way to do a female cover of a male sung song is to belt it out at max volume with zero regard for how the song is supposed to go.

On the technical and logical side of it as far as the series continuity is concerned, I personally happen to think they went a little overkill on the bad karaoke side of it, especially since the last time we heard Konata sing, which wasn't even 2 episodes ago, it was a faithful rendition. Why go back? Why go in either direction? why not just start good from the beginning if you have the talent to do so? It just doesn't make any sense. Even if it is a comedy series, Konata's never been afraid to showcase her talents, it's one of the major parts of her character. That's kind of how I see it. Even though some might say Chala Head Chala isn't a serious song and it doesn't really matter if its sung that way, maybe others such as myself think it deserves a little bit of justice, the same kind of justice that Sorega Ai Deshou got. I'm not really complaining as I can listen to the original song any time I want, but I think it's just kind of bizarre that Konata morph's into the Uber Singer for one episode and then a female Will Hung in the next.

You can see a live performance here with incredibly goofy costumes.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2007-05-08 at 01:32.
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:29   Link #62
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It kinda makes me wonder just how many hardcore Dragonball Z fans would watch Lucky☆Star in the first place...
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:29   Link #63
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What favoritism? I thought Kagami sang the opening of sailor fuku to kikanjuu well... or w/e Hirano Aya will sing you'll just hate it ?


Edit: I was one of the hardcore DBZ fans before (1990s) and I am watching Lucky Star and I liked how Konata sang it.
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:36   Link #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nadare View Post
What favoritism? I thought Kagami sang the opening of sailor fuku to kikanjuu well... or w/e Hirano Aya will sing you'll just hate it ?


Edit: I was one of the hardcore DBZ fans before (1990s) and I am watching Lucky Star and I liked how Konata sang it.
Well there it is. Maybe it's difficult for them to cover a song sung by the opposite sex. By the way, what does w/e mean, I've never seen that used before.

I'll say I liked the song up until the rendition up until the chorus. I have sensitive hearing to certain types of noises at higher frequencies. Like for example if I were to hear a low volume whistle and then a person started talking in a regular voice, all I would here was the whistle and the person's voice would be rendered to little more than a faroff whisper even though the whistle was a lower volume and should be overpowered by the voice. Complicated I know. So basically certain pitches and sounds that aren't distinguishable as language can be overpowering to me, which is what happened when the chorus started, it crossed the threshold. So I guess my Primary Audio Cortex be partially to blame in my dislike of this ending.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2007-05-08 at 01:49.
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:42   Link #65
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w/o .... w/i ... don't recognize w/e (whenever?)

I think it was a faux pas to have Kona sing *anything* well -- it was much more eccentric quirky to have her banshee wail her tunes. Have Kagami warble FMP (since she likes it ) .... I thought the VA for Kagami handled her quite well: sings fairly well (some off-notes) but sounds a bit tentative (fear of failure is so her personality). Perfect for Kagami.
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:47   Link #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
w/o .... w/i ... don't recognize w/e (whenever?)
~
"Whatever"

Cheers.
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Old 2007-05-08, 01:53   Link #67
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Whatever she sings. Ok now I can answer.

I don't really think I've ever heard Aya Hirano sing anything I've found outstanding or would want to hear multiple times in a row. That's not to say I hate her singing, she's good at the type of music she does, but its not my personal taste. I can't think of any of her songs I would really want to put on a playlist.
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Old 2007-05-08, 02:30   Link #68
Kaoru Chujo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telliamed View Post
So Hirano singing well (Sore ga Ai Deshou) is bad.
And Hirano singing poorly (Chala Head Chala) is bad?...
Quoted because that's how I react to some opinions on the matter, too. (Although I understand Kaioshin's explanation about his reaction just being a personal thing, so that's cool.)

I am also puzzled by people's refusal to let the staff play around with the ED and do some "well" as well as some "in character." I like both. It's just personal taste, I guess, but I don't see the need for rigid consistency here.

Much as I like Aaya as a seiyuu and as a personality, I'm not going to claim she's the greatest singer in the world. She's an all-round entertainer, though, who can sing well enough to be enjoyable. I like it her softer, more melodic things, but she's learning to rock a bit. And learning comic singing, too, it appears. I think her singing, like her voice-acting, is continuing to improve.
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Old 2007-05-08, 02:37   Link #69
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I think Aya's singing is great.... I just didn't think her "great voice" really fit the Kona character. "raucous and energetic" just seems to fit Kona better. Obviously, its not going to make or break the show for me and its really been my *only* complaint about the first 4 episodes.

The basic problem is I don't view the end segment as a traditional ED at all. If it was, I'd be fine with them singing Gaelic much less in 'best voice'. The segment, however, is constructed as an "in character" moment and I just didn't think the voice change fit the character very well. Aya portrays Kona so that Kona's growly voice comes out when she's passionate about something. I did like the way she uttered "fumoffu" ...

I thought the portrayal of Kagami singing was precious: it sounded like earnest brassiness being suddenly a bit unsure and wavering.
Perfect for the character, whether or not that's the VA's 'best voice' (加藤 英美里, Katō Emiri).

Last edited by Vexx; 2007-05-08 at 02:50.
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Old 2007-05-08, 02:54   Link #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I did like the way she uttered "fumoffu" ...
I'm not the only one!

I even looped it a couple of times..
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Old 2007-05-08, 06:51   Link #71
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I think they're all doing it in character as far as HS kids at karaoke goes. I dunno how to put this but some songs you can totally f**k around on and sound all off tune, and no one will really give a damn. In fact, it's probably better you don't take them seriously. The first 2 and HEAD CHA LA are such songs.

OTOH, I think Kona's character, and most girls, would use something like "Sore ga Ai Deshou" as a "show off" song to prove she can actually sing.

Me and my friends always do this - pick some JROCK (X-Japan, GLAY, Luna Sea) to go nuts on, and then do some other songs in a "more serious" manner.
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Old 2007-05-08, 07:21   Link #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I think Aya's singing is great.... I just didn't think her "great voice" really fit the Kona character. "raucous and energetic" just seems to fit Kona better. Obviously, its not going to make or break the show for me and its really been my *only* complaint about the first 4 episodes.

The basic problem is I don't view the end segment as a traditional ED at all. If it was, I'd be fine with them singing Gaelic much less in 'best voice'. The segment, however, is constructed as an "in character" moment and I just didn't think the voice change fit the character very well. Aya portrays Kona so that Kona's growly voice comes out when she's passionate about something. I did like the way she uttered "fumoffu" ...

I thought the portrayal of Kagami singing was precious: it sounded like earnest brassiness being suddenly a bit unsure and wavering.
Perfect for the character, whether or not that's the VA's 'best voice' (加藤 英美里, Katō Emiri).
My opinion is that Aya's (and Emiri's) rendition of the songs in the ED were appropriate for the songs being sung.
Quote:
"Singing anime songs is all about staying true to the original song." --Konata's reply to Miyuki in ep. 4 (translation by a.f.k.)
The 3 songs that Aya sings "genki" are songs not to be taken seriously. Come on, "CHA-LA HEAD-CHA-LA"? The song begs to be sung at full tilt, in-character or not (lyrics). Sorega Ai Deshou on the other hand, is a wholly different kind of song (lyrics). And IMO, Aya doesn't sing it in her "great voice" entirely. I get the vibe that she's using a "karaoke voice", imitating Mikuni Shimokawa's performance (as implied by Kagami). Although I would love to hear Sorega Ai Deshou sung with Aya's Kona-chan voice.

Last edited by Willen; 2007-05-08 at 07:33. Reason: added "quotation marks" to a quote
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Old 2007-05-08, 10:07   Link #73
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Well I guess perhaps some don't happen to think that Sorega Ai Deshou is any more special a song than Chala Head Chala (or I guess I'm the only one). I happen to think Sorega Ai Deshou is kind of a cheesy love song and that she could have just as easily gone all out. It's like Vexx said, they really should never have done the well sung version of any song and saved any faithful renditions strictly for the character CD's. I also subscribe to the idea that the ED is part of the show like he does and that they should stay in character. In this sense while Konata sang ED's 1, 2 and 4 Konata didn't sing Sorega Ai Deshou, that was pure Aya Hirano for that one, it didn't even sound like Konata, more like somebody else in the room that was singing. If we hadn't just had Aya Hirano sing the ending 2 episodes ago it wouldn't have seemed as out of place. I can't complain about Kagami and Sailor Suit and Fuku, because we have yet to know if she's even a bad singer and if in her case, singing it well IS in character.

Does nobody other than Vexx get why it is that I think they've made an error in judgement here?
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Old 2007-05-08, 10:10   Link #74
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Such a big fuss over a karaoke. Wow.
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:02   Link #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
Quoted because that's how I react to some opinions on the matter, too. (Although I understand Kaioshin's explanation about his reaction just being a personal thing, so that's cool.)

I am also puzzled by people's refusal to let the staff play around with the ED and do some "well" as well as some "in character." I like both. It's just personal taste, I guess, but I don't see the need for rigid consistency here.

Much as I like Aaya as a seiyuu and as a personality, I'm not going to claim she's the greatest singer in the world. She's an all-round entertainer, though, who can sing well enough to be enjoyable. I like it her softer, more melodic things, but she's learning to rock a bit. And learning comic singing, too, it appears. I think her singing, like her voice-acting, is continuing to improve.
I think there is a rigid consistency to how they are doing this though, but it won't become apparent whether I'm right or not until at least halfway through the series. If we get a hot-blooded mecha or action series song sung by a female, then I will know absolutely for certain if my theory on Male songs get mangled, female ones don't is true. Of course theories need to be tested and we can't do that yet, so it remains one.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2007-05-08 at 11:43. Reason: Need to specify the type of song I'm thinking of.
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:11   Link #76
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eh... everyone has their own priorities on what is more important in the way of criteria for whether something worked or not. I don't think it was true to the character for the reasons I've stated. Other people don't see any conflict within the presentation for a variety of reasons - these are the ones I've gleaned:
1) its an ED; anything goes...
2) Its an FMP song and it would be sacrilege to sing it any other way
3) Kona is talented at singing and imitates style as Kagami suggested.
(edit: couple that with Kona singing "male songs" as a growly banshee and "femme songs" in sweet voice as Kaioshin suggests)
4) Aya is not to be questioned

Apologies if anyone thought those descriptions were hyperbolic or insulting.
I consider item 3 a legitimate counterargument but I would be less skeptical of that if she'd sung each song in very different ways. I tend to think Kagami's dialog line was specifically put there as a rationalization because the director knew some viewers would say "eh?" otherwise. If Kona gets to sing more songs later we'll find out. For now, it looks like we got Kagami for 3 episodes and I doubt she sings those sorts of anime songs

<shrug> its really not that big a deal when compared to the overall series and the skill with which they've adapted the source material. I'm actually more concerned that Lucky*Channel is going to be a serious drag if they don't make some serious changes to it by next episode. The same joke 3 or 4 times with variation is funny.... 24 times? Not.

Oh, and a big welcome to new user Willen -- I guess our chat on this got him fired up enough to join
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:24   Link #77
Kaoru Chujo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willen
"Singing anime songs is all about staying true to the original song." --Konata's reply to Miyuki in ep. 4 (translation by a.f.k.)
This makes me think of something Endou Aya said in an interview on the official site. She said that the main cast -- except for her -- were making a lot of ad libs. Maybe this was one of them? I've extracted some more things from her little interview and have posted them in the Voice Actor thread, as well as in my blog.

And Kaioshin, I "get it" why you and Vexx object to the varying styles. I just don't feel the same way. But your suggestion about male-female is interesting. And the Kona-chan quote above is interesting, too. Maybe Aya herself said: "I'd like to do that one straight," and the director said: "okay," just ignoring any inconsistency it might give rise to.

I do think it's cool that we can have such a long discussion about this point. Quite an anime. I credit the original director with these innovations -- such as the ED that isn't an ED. He hits with some, he misses with others, but it's all interesting.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2007-05-08 at 13:04.
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:38   Link #78
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Well the problem is I don't think that this one was true to the original song as in this case I think she went overboard with the yelping near the end.

Okay well Kageyama Hironobu is legendary for getting really really into his songs and going "COME ON!" in a bit of a hair metal style voice, but it doesn't sound that shriekish and he only does it inbetween lyrics. I think she tried for his style of getting progressively more pumped and excited as the song goes on, but misinterpreted the way he does it and missed the mark, thus failing the imitation. Maybe we can pass this off to Konata being a meer mortal and leave it at that. As hot blooded as Konata appears to be, maybe she just isn't hot blooded enough for the song.
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:44   Link #79
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Karaoke is much funnier when there are bizarre moments of interpretation

I guess we've come to the idea that the original director is still going to be around for the creative function ... he's just getting an administrative senpai to help him stay on track with the managerial items??? Is that the probable situation?
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Old 2007-05-08, 11:46   Link #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Such a big fuss over a karaoke. Wow.
Thank you Sheba! My sentiments exactly. This anime series has NEVER taken itself seriously, and yet everyone here is trying to find something to find every petty fault this series has. I understand that everyone has an opinion, but jeez, it's only karaoke. Who cares if they're "out of character"? =/
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