Fate/stay night Heaven's Feel Movie Discussion Thread

[GreyZone]

I just hope they portray Shirou correctly in his last fight in UBW. I don't want to see him screaming his phrases as he did in the UBW movie scenes I skimmed through. Also I think I'll get a Shirou signature when the anime runs, just to annoy the Shirou haters.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

Actually, just a thought Cherry Lover,

What if they do a Fate/Zero timer at the end of every episode but instead of going to zero, it goes to whatever time UBW ends. Then at the end of the final episode credits, show present Sakura in the wormpit then the timer going all the way back to zero. Cue Heaven's Feel pv.

It shows more of the "unable to save everyone" motif and the fact that FSN is a Groundhog day scenario thing. Sure Sakura is still a bit ignored (let's say they DO give her more scenes in UBW), but the end I propose would force the attention of the viewer, new, Fate/Zero entree or otherwise to anticipate Heaven's Feel movie (series)

That would turn the UBW anime into basically an advert for HF, which I don't see them wanting to do.

Originally Posted by mirakura

Meh, makes no sense if the HF is/are movie(s). Like Nayrael said, they're separate works. I imagine them doing something about this in the epilogue. And I don't expect Sakura's story to be looked at in the anime. Yeah, she's Rin's sister, so what? Think of Ilya, 1) She's the mains of the last series' daughter. 2) Shirou is her brother. 3)Archer is most likely from Ilya's route. 4)She's the Einzbern Grail...Those are more reasons to make to look into than Sakura's. But they won't cos they get their stories in HF. I don't know what you're asking for here, they're not gonna change the plot just to fit Sakura in. If Sakura and Rin's relationship starts, Rin's emotions will change and so will Shirou's knowing this. Gosh, what do you want???

It depends what exactly they show. I'm not expecting a long arc where Rin saves Sakura or anything, but showing Rin's feelings for her more, showing more of Sakura herself, having Zouken killed without Rin's direct involvement and having them reconcile in the epilogue all make sense and don't really alter the plot.

Originally Posted by Nayrael

They may animate it, just in detail. In other words, it would be something like the ED song rolling in background while we see the few scenes of that event, not enough to tell a proper story but enough to explain that the Holy Grail is no more.

Honestly, I doubt it. If they're going to animate that at all, it will be done in far greater detail (possibly even a sequel).

While conceptually I agree, their sisterhood and saving Sakura is one thing they CAN'T properly do. Because the moment Shirou finds out about Sakura's status, he will try to protect her and move her to his house. And when she spends time there, and sees Rin and Shirou get close, her own darkness will cause the The Shadow to appear.

They can't go into a long plot arc about saving her, no. But, there's no reason why they can't have Gil kill Zouken off (which is kind-of implied in the VN anyway) and then show more scenes reconciling Sakura and Rin afterwards. It wouldn't in any way contradict the VN to do that, because nothing Rin does in the VN really implies "I don't care about Sakura".

And due to the Shadow appearing, Archer would abandon his quest to kill Shirou and focus on stopping the Shadow while. And the final outcome would be that Shirou kills Sakura as UBW!Shirou is the very opposite of HF!SHirou: he would kill Sakura and make himself not regret it.

Actually, I don't buy that at all. UBW Shirou is not the "opposite" of HF Shirou, he's the same person who just went through different experiences. If you threw UBW Shirou into HF Shirou's situation he would certainly not just murder Sakura in cold blood as MoS Shirou did. And, if he did, he would most certainly regret doing so, because murdering innocent people in cold blood when they're not even an immediate danger to anyone is not something a hero does, ever.

For UBW route to happen, Sakura's situation must NOT be revealed to Shirou. The moment it does, it would no longer be UBW. Sorry, but Sakura can't be saved... and it fits the UBW's theme: you can only save those you see, and Sakura is one of those that Shirou only thinks he can see.

Yeah, agreed, but I never said that I expected Shirou to find out.

The only alterations that the TV series can do is build up to events that accidentally lead to a better end for Sakura...

Well, not "accidentally", but I do agree that Shirou and Rin can't have a role in saving her.

or a tragic end (which would probably be the more fitting end given the circumstances).

Why the hell would it be "more fitting"? That's like saying that it would be "more fitting" for Rin to get tortured to death by Sakura in HF because it's not her route so she should just die....

[Tenchi Hou Take]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

I just hope they portray Shirou correctly in his last fight in UBW. I don't want to see him screaming his phrases as he did in the UBW movie scenes I skimmed through. Also I think I'll get a Shirou signature when the anime runs, just to annoy the Shirou haters.

It'd be pretty hard to do that unless they're dumb enough to cut out Shirou's speech. Shouting and that speech don't go well together.

I think (well also hope) he does the lines like in the VN it's the same voice actor so he should know what he's doing.

One thing this anime needs is a good version (or hell something similar to the original) and use it at the proper times. The way Emiya is used and the structure of those songs it like half those scenes).

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

It'd be pretty hard to do that unless they're dumb enough to cut out Shirou's speech. Shouting and that speech don't go well together.

I think (well also hope) he does the lines like in the VN it's the same voice actor so he should know what he's doing.

@bolded: see DEEN movie. Same VA, still shouting.


But ufotable is better just because DEEN is bad by default, so yea...

[Tenchi Hou Take]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

@bolded: see DEEN movie. Same VA, still shouting.


But ufotable is better just because DEEN is bad by default, so yea...

That's because it was a one liner. The shouting made sense in it's own way to draw attention to the line. The point of the quote was never that single line but the climax up to it and you can't shout those lines. Or rather it doesn't make sense to shout it.

When you strip out all the build up the deliver was always going to be weak.

The speech is essentially Shirou simulatenously mocking himself and Gilgamesh which is which they can't really shout those lines. Plus ufotable has good voice direction, unless they skip out the speech it'd hard for them to fuck it up.

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

That's because it was a one liner. The shouting made sense in it's own way to draw attention to the line. The point of the quote was never that single line but the climax up to it and you can't shout those lines. Or rather it doesn't make sense to shout it.

When you strip out all the build up the deliver was always going to be weak.

The speech is essentially Shirou simulatenously mocking himself and Gilgamesh which is which they can't really shout those lines. Plus ufotable has good voice direction, unless they skip out the speech it'd hard for them to fuck it up.

My point was that Shirou is supposed to be calm and mature at that moment and not shout like a hot blooded shounen battle series MC that shouts at the villain of the week. If that is not portrayed correctly then it's equivalent to just pretending that all of his character development ealier did never happen.

[Tenchi Hou Take]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

My point was that Shirou is supposed to be calm and mature at that moment and not shout like a hot blooded shounen battle series MC that shouts at the villain of the week. If that is not portrayed correctly then it's equivalent to just pretending that all of his character development ealier did never happen.

The movie skipped most of the character development and anything of worth and was basically flashy fanservice. It was shit delivery but it would have been awful either way. Which is why contracting dozens of hours into an 1h 30 movie is a bad idea.

The reason why the line is so good is far from just being about it's delivery. By itself it does sound like some hot blooded shounen quote which is why they went for it that way. In the VN that line and the entire speech itself is a culmination of character development and internal turmoil which was what explains Shirou's demeanour. Either delivery within the context of the movie itself would have been awkward.

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

The movie skipped most of the character development and anything of worth and was basically flashy fanservice. It was shit delivery but it would have been awful either way. Which is why contracting dozens of hours into an 1h 30 movie is a bad idea.

Then let's hope HF will either be a 3-4 hour movie, or a 3 part movie series

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

Saber CM will be next

https://twitter.com/Fate_SN_Anime/st...82007559921664

Yay can't wait DDDD

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

because it's not her route so she should just die....

Hehe.....

[Tenchi Hou Take]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Then let's hope HF will either be a 3-4 hour movie, or a 3 part movie series

TBF HF has a lot of crap that would be better off skipping but yeah 3-4 more and very little cooking etc and it should be fine.

edit:mores meant movies here but the fact was agreeing with him should have made that obvious

[Raziel1991]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

Why the hell would it be "more fitting"? That's like saying that it would be "more fitting" for Rin to get tortured to death by Sakura in HF because it's not her route so she should just die....

Wow, dude calm down. He already explained why in the very same post you quoted.

To be precise he explained it here

Originally Posted by Nayrael

Sorry, but Sakura can't be saved... and it fits the UBW's theme: you can only save those you see, and Sakura is one of those that Shirou only thinks he can see.

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

TBF HF has a lot of crap that would be better off skipping but yeah 3-4 mores and very little cooking etc and it should be fine.

Don't anger him....

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

TBF HF has a lot of crap that would be better off skipping but yeah 3-4 mores and very little cooking etc and it should be fine.

No, it doesn't. That "crap" is called characterisation. If you skip it, then you miss Sakura's change through the route and the effect AM has on her, and she ends up coming across as some stupid generic Yandere. It's no co-incidence that the sort of idiots on 4chan who probably just skipped all the "boring" bits for the flashy fights are the same people who make stupid, ill-informed statements about how terrible a character Sakura is.

HF works even less well with the sort of crap that Deen pulled with UBW than UBW did. You cannot simply cut out all the "boring" scenes and keep all the action, that results in people failing to understand or care about Sakura, which is essential for the story to work.

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

Wow, dude calm down. He already explained why in the very same post you quoted.

No, that doesn't in any way explain why Sakura should just be left to die. It's just blatant bias.

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

No, it doesn't. That "crap" is called characterisation. If you skip it, then you miss Sakura's change through the route and the effect AM has on her, and she ends up coming across as some stupid generic Yandere. It's no co-incidence that the sort of idiots on 4chan who probably just skipped all the "boring" bits for the flashy fights are the same people who make stupid, ill-informed statements about how terrible a character Sakura is.

HF works even less well with the sort of crap that Deen pulled with UBW than UBW did. You cannot simply cut out all the "boring" scenes and keep all the action, that results in people failing to understand or care about Sakura, which is essential for the story to work.



No, that doesn't in any way explain why Sakura should just be left to die. It's just blatant bias.

Not all people like boring scenes. Zero is action packed, and Zero watchers, who came for the action, will drop it if there're too much cooking scenes like there are.

[GreyZone]

Considering that someone from ufo stated that they choose the "theatrical release" format for HF "because that format is the best to show that route's charm", I'd say they do put value on Sakura's characterization.

Originally Posted by mirakura

Not all people like boring scenes. Zero is action packed, and Zero watchers, who came for the action, will drop it if there're too much cooking scenes like there are.

Just as boring as those "unnecassary Saber and Iri moments" from Zero?

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Considering that someone from ufo stated that they choose the "theatrical release" format for HF "because that format is the best to show that route's charm", I'd say they do put value on Sakura's characterization.



Just as boring as those "unnecassary Saber and Iri moments" from Zero?

Meh, Saber in a suit! Saber Iri moments aren't long, the cooking scenes, you do not know how much I skipped just to reach something important....

[GDB]

Originally Posted by mirakura

Meh, Saber in a suit! Saber Iri moments aren't long, the cooking scenes, you do not know how much I skipped just to reach something important....

Playing dollie with your waifu is not as important as actual characterization. Don't just throw around terms like "important" when you mean "things you think would be more interesting".

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by mirakura

Not all people like boring scenes. Zero is action packed, and Zero watchers, who came for the action, will drop it if there're too much cooking scenes like there are.

Then they can piss off as far as I am concerned. You cannot simply cut those scenes out and still retain a viable story. If they do that, I will not even bother watching it, because it will be every bit as bad as the UBW movie was.

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Considering that someone from ufo stated that they choose the "theatrical release" format for HF "because that format is the best to show that route's charm", I'd say they do put value on Sakura's characterization.

In which case, they cannot do what he is suggesting. You cannot cut those scenes out if you value Sakura's characterisation (although you can, perhaps, shorten them a little).

Just as boring as those "unnecassary Saber and Iri moments" from Zero?

Exactly....

In fact, just like all of Saber's characterisation anywhere in the story. None of that is needed, right, she's just a cute girl with a sword that bashes things. That's all we need to know to enjoy all the action scenes. Who cares about characterisation?

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by GDB

Playing dollie with your waifu is not as important as actual characterization. Don't just throw around terms like "important" when you mean "things you think would be more interesting".

Lol, no, Saber and Iri moments were characterization for both charas. We learn about Iri, and we learn Saber can let go and actually have fun. And unlike Sakura's they don't last as long. Killing 3 birds with one stone. Important isn't necessarily interesting, and that's what the cooking scenes are. Action lovers won't want to go through those long cooking scenes. So they could at least shorten it. Lol, and they call Fate route '/stay kitchen'. Action lovers would rather wanna know about the 'badass King' than the 'girl with a bad life'...

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by mirakura

Lol, no, Saber and Iri moments were characterization for both charas. We learn about Iri, and we learn Saber can let go and actually have fun. And unlike Sakura's they don't last as long. Killing 3 birds with one stone. Important isn't necessarily interesting, and that's what the cooking scenes are.

I think they should just cut it out. Saber doesn't need characterisation, that takes up time for all the scenes where she runs in screaming and bashes things with her sword.

Action lovers won't want to go through those long cooking scenes. So they could at least shorten it. Lol, and they call Fate route '/stay kitchen'.

Again, tough shit. They can deal with it. HF is not written for the benefit of "action lovers".