Character Discussion - Suzaku

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Dream_Traveller

If you think Bush is the shining example of a president, I feel very sorry for you.

At least he is still not another Hitler or Stalin or Mao. Or would you prefer the US be ruled by the likes of any one of them?

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

It was an illusion because the main reason for it was to stop the Black Knights from gaining more supporters. Do you really think Schneizel or anyone else would've let Euphemia create the SAZ if Zero didn't exist? In fact Euphemia only got the idea for it after learning that Lelouch and Nunally were still alive.

Well, yeah thats the thing it never swept their minds it doesn't mean that she was as heartless however and when the hell did Lelouch became a saint anyways its not like his whole life was devise of helping the Japanese as a whole neither.

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Yorae_paladin1

Those guys can't make decisions worth shit they need zero to hold there hand. Kallen is no leader she is just a fighter, Ougi is pitiful and todo compared to Lulu he is nothing they won't be able to contain it.

But they stand by Lelouch because of his principles, and if any single one of them felt that Lelouch wasn't going to live up to his promise and betray them none of them would hesitate to kill him.

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Eliarine

Who cares about the reason behind it if is created and brings actual peace? Euphemia believed in it. So did Suzaku, so did all the Japanese who were willing to sign up. The only reason it failed was because of Zero.

So are you also saying the ends justify the means? As long as there is a good ending, it doesn't matter how it was achieved?

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

But they stand by Lelouch because of his principles, and if any single one of them felt that Lelouch wasn't going to live up to his promise and betray them none of them would hesitate to kill him.

And how far would they get? It'll pretty stupid(funny) for them to plan to kill someone who brought them to the place they are right now.

[Ruvixur]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

In fact it was worse with the USSR because there was a cold war and everyone was afraid that 1 wrong move could result in a global nuclear war.

Ever heard about Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD).

Thik about those people who lived in USSR and then lost EVERYTHING. Oops, my mistake, they were left with life. What's good for me, is bad for you. I'm just taking side of people, who "lost".
There was no need to destroy USSR in such way. It's just that there wasn't enough "Suzaku" to change system from within without destroying it.
Though, Changing and Destroying are a bit similar.
And I've heard of MAD.

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Silver Soul

And how far would they get? It'll pretty stupid(funny) for them to plan to kill someone who brought them to the place they are right now.

It'll be pretty stupid to accept and allow Lelouch to betray them. They trust him and have faith in him for a reason, they aren't following him blindly.

[Yorae_paladin1]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

But they stand by Lelouch because of his principles, and if any single one of them felt that Lelouch wasn't going to live up to his promise and betray them none of them would hesitate to kill him.

Standing up cause of principles does not a future make. You can win a goal but real question is how long can it last. That is the trick. None of Lulus subordinates have the capability to keep Lulus vision alive hell they don't have the capability to stand on there feet.

There is a possibility someone better than Lelouch will appear but on the other side as an enemy if that happens they are finished.

[Ruvixur]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

So are you also saying the ends justify the means? As long as there is a good ending, it doesn't matter how it was achieved?

What? Aren't you actually the one who justifies the means?
Are you pro-Suzaku (no justify) or pro-Lelouch (justify)
Maybe Suzaku and Lelouch aren't the best examples, but we have to keep this thread purpose ( Suzaku discussion).

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

It'll be pretty stupid to accept and allow Lelouch to betray them. They trust him and have faith in him for a reason, they aren't following him blindly.

Trust me they even said that they'll allowed themselves to be used for the greater good which is pretty pathetic regardless

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Ruvixur

Thik about those people who lived in USSR and then lost EVERYTHING. Oops, my mistake, they were left with life. What's good for me, is bad for you. I'm just taking side of people, who "lost".
There was no need to destroy USSR in such way. It's just that there wasn't enough "Suzaku" to change system from within without destroying it.
Though, Changing and Destroying are a bit similar.
And I've heard of MAD.

So it would've been better for everyone in the world to live under the constant fear of a nuclear war happening at any unpredictable time?

No thanks, I'll take a few minor world problems than deal with the risk of a global holocaust.

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Silver Soul

Trust me they even said that they'll allowed themselves to be used for the greater good which is pretty pathetic regardless

Yes Greater GOOD as in battling tyranny and oppression and helping those who live in fear, but if in the end after Britannia has been defeated and Lelouch turns into another Charles, do you think any of them are going to stand by and do nothing?

They aren't going to sit down and accept that 1 tyrant they had to fight hard to defeat has been replaced by another tyrant. It would just return to square one if they did. And Lelouch is not going to become a second tyrant.

[Eliarine]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

So are you also saying the ends justify the means? As long as there is a good ending, it doesn't matter how it was achieved?

I'm talking about the motivations behind the creation of the SAZ. So, no.

[orangejuicetang]

Do you think the Black Knights are more interested in destroying Britannia or liberating Japan? They aren't siding with Zero because of his principles, but because he brings results which helps speed up the liberation of Japan. If he wasn't successful, they wouldn't hesitate to get rid of him.

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

Yes Greater GOOD as in battling tyranny and oppression and helping those who live in fear, but if in the end after Britannia has been defeated and Lelouch turns into another Charles, do you think any of them are going to stand by and do nothing?

Yes, Yes, thousand times yes since Lelouch got them there and the Black Rebellion proves that without Lelouch they're pretty much useless and by that time it can be assured that he'll find more followers at his disposal

[Yorae_paladin1]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

Yes Greater GOOD as in battling tyranny and oppression and helping those who live in fear, but if in the end after Britannia has been defeated and Lelouch turns into another Charles, do you think any of them are going to stand by and do nothing?

You think they can stop him if Lulu becomes another Charles. Lulu lead there ass to victory and can easily break them if he so pleases.

Like I said these people can't stand on there own.

[Ruvixur]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

So it would've been better for everyone in the world to live under the constant fear of a nuclear war happening at any unpredictable time?

No thanks, I'll take a few minor world problems than deal with the risk of a global holocaust.

That's why it was needed for BOTH sides to change their ways from within and with minimal casualities.
Actually, Right now The World ( i mean Earth) isn't in it's best condition, now we have even more problems( though, they all come from different aspects).

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Yorae_paladin1

You think they can stop him if Lulu becomes another Charles. Lulu lead there ass to victory and can easily break them if he so pleases.

Like I said these people can't stand on there own.

And the fact that they represent Japan is an insult

[Dynastya]

Originally Posted by Ruvixur

That's why it was needed for BOTH sides to change their ways from within and with minimal casualities.
Actually, Right now The World ( i mean Earth) isn't in it's best condition, now we have even more problems( though, they all come from different aspects).

Yes there are still a lot of problems to be solved, but at least there is almost ZERO chance left of a global nuclear war happening.

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by Dynastya

Yes there are still a lot of problems to be solved, but at least there is almost ZERO chance left of a global nuclear war happening.

RW=no
CG=Nina (nuff said)