Sega vs Nintendo

[The Master]

Originally Posted by roriconfan

Seriously, Sega was forced to insert Sonic, its mascot, into Nintendo games. Doesn't that mean anything? Sega was defeated three times in a row before joining the enemy. And the rest is history..

I dont think Sega did to bad out of that deal and hey the games were good. Beating Mario to a pulp with sonic on super smash bros and having mario beat sonic in a race is just fun.

[TrueCaptain]

Nintendo had the better hardware and the better games, it just took the SNES a little while to catch up to the Genesis due to Sega's system having a larger user base for so long because it was out almosr 2 years longer than Nintendo's machine. There were lot's of bumps in the road for Nintendo along the way too, the NES was still a popular machine and it took a while for the SNES to get out of the shadow of it's bigger brother, Mortal Kombat was a huge release for home consoles and the SNES version didn't have the blood which led the Genesis version to sell 6X the carts that the SNES did (even though the SNES version had superior sound and graphics), and the last huge reason why the SNES took a while to overtake the Genesis was because video game fans were growing up and Sega offered more mature titles. All of these factors were hard for the SNES to overcome.

Then a few things happened, RPG's were becoming popular and the SNES had much more to offer than Genesis, video game magazines began giving SNES games better reviews, and the 3rd and most important thing that helped the SNES overcome the Genesis was the fact that Donkey Kong Country was released to huge fanfare and proved that the SNES was the superior machine with it's high res graphics and smooth controls for the time. DKC ended up selling over 9 million copies and Nintendo pulled ahead in console sales over Sega and won the 16-bit wars, it was such a fun time to be a gamer....

I owned both systems throughout the years and I continue to play my SNES from time to time, though it's been a while and I'm getting the itch to fire up some Mario RPG or maybe some Zelda III, oh how I love the history of video games.

[Gin]

Growing up, I had Nintendo and Sega consoles. But when ever my friends came over, we played Nintendo games. Then the N64 came out with 4 player capabilities, and that was all we ever played again.

[HayashiTakara]

Originally Posted by Gin

Growing up, I had Nintendo and Sega consoles. But when ever my friends came over, we played Nintendo games. Then the N64 came out with 4 player capabilities, and that was all we ever played again.

Star Fox 64 and Mario Kart much? XD ah good ol'days

[Gin]

Don't forget about Super Smash Bros.

[Benoit]

Originally Posted by TrueCaptain

Nintendo had the better hardware

No, it did not. The Master System was more powerful than the NES, and the Mega Drive had more raw power while the SNES was better in the graphical department.

most important thing that helped the SNES overcome the Genesis was the fact that Donkey Kong Country was released to huge fanfare and proved that the SNES was the superior machine with it's high res graphics and smooth controls for the time

High-res graphics? It was still the same 256x224 resolution, the same as the NES'. In comparison, the Mega Drive's video resolution was 320x224.

Nintendo pulled ahead in console sales over Sega and won the 16-bit wars

Neither truly won the "16-bit wars".

[TrueCaptain]

Originally Posted by Benoit

No, it did not. The Master System was more powerful than the NES, and the Mega Drive had more raw power while the SNES was better in the graphical department.

High-res graphics? It was still the same 256x224 resolution, the same as the NES'. In comparison, the Mega Drive's video resolution was 320x224.

Neither truly won the "16-bit wars".

Actually, I was referring to the SNES vs Genesis, there is no reason bringing up the Master System as nobody even had it and there was NO real competition between the MS and NES since it was s one sided. But I'll agree with you that internally the Genesis had a power edge, but it was unused and the SNES boasted better graphics in it's games which in turn made it look like the more powerfull system. If your going to have more power than your competitor then you may as well use it otherwise making a claim toward having greater power makes it irrelevant.

As it pertains to the 16-bit war let me correct you, there was a winner and the winner was Nintendo. The SNES ended up selling more consoles than the Genesis (over 10M more) and the SNES ended up selling more carts than the Genesis did in the end, which in turn makes it the winner. Thats like saying two runners ran a foot race and even though one man made it past the finish line first, he didn't win.

The Captain has spoken....

[HayashiTakara]

lol Master System and Mega Drive... I can count the amount of people I know who actually owned these in one hand.

[TrueCaptain]

Originally Posted by HayashiTakara

lol Master System and Mega Drive... I can count the amount of people I know who actually owned these in one hand.

Keep in mind that in Japan the 16-bit war was so in favor of Nintendo that Sega didn't even have a chance, in the U.S it was much closer but Nintendo ended up winning in the end.

[roriconfan]

Originally Posted by TrueCaptain

in the U.S it was much closer but Nintendo ended up winning in the end.

I wonder if the fancy propagandistic SEGA commercials had something to do with that...

[Benoit]

Originally Posted by TrueCaptain

there is no reason bringing up the Master System as nobody even had it and there was NO real competition between the MS and NES since it was s one sided

You're wrong. It was very popular in Europe, and it was a fierce battle between the two systems there. The Master System still lives on in Brazil, by the way.

But I'll agree with you that internally the Genesis had a power edge, but it was unused

Unused? You'll have to explain that one. The Sonic games definitely used it, for one.

As it pertains to the 16-bit war let me correct you, there was a winner and the winner was Nintendo. The SNES ended up selling more consoles than the Genesis (over 10M more) and the SNES ended up selling more carts than the Genesis did in the end, which in turn makes it the winner.

It's not as simple as that. The SNES was king in Japan, and the two were at each other's throats in the US, with the Super NES having the edge, while in Europe the Mega Drive was more popular in the end.

There's more to the world than Japan and the US.

Originally Posted by roriconfan

I wonder if the fancy propagandistic SEGA commercials had something to do with that...

Cut it out, will you? If it was all talk, people wouldn't have kept buying it, and certainly wouldn't have kept buying the games.

[roriconfan]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Cut it out, will you? If it was all talk, people wouldn't have kept buying it, and certainly wouldn't have kept buying the games.

But you must admit, quite often something sells just because of talk.

[TrueCaptain]

Originally Posted by Benoit

You're wrong. It was very popular in Europe, and it was a fierce battle between the two systems there. The Master System still lives on in Brazil, by the way.

Unused? You'll have to explain that one. The Sonic games definitely used it, for one.

It's not as simple as that. The SNES was king in Japan, and the two were at each other's throats in the US, with the Super NES having the edge, while in Europe the Mega Drive was more popular in the end.

There's more to the world than Japan and the US.

Cut it out, will you? If it was all talk, people wouldn't have kept buying it, and certainly wouldn't have kept buying the games.

While it's true that there is more to the gaming world than the U.S and Japan, it's rare when the UK or any other country other than Japan and the U.S get mentioned when talking about console wars. The SNES had the upper hand in the U.S and Japan which is basicly all that matters to the press and media. Sonic looked nice and took advantage of the power of the Genesis, but there have been SNES games with visuals that are better than the Sonic games, not only that but the "Mode 7" scaling within the SNES helped publishers create certain kinds of games that the Genesis couldn't do, so again, claiming power is irrelevant when your not boasting the best looking games with the most content out there.

[Benoit]

Originally Posted by TrueCaptain

While it's true that there is more to the gaming world than the U.S and Japan, it's rare when the UK or any other country other than Japan and the U.S get mentioned when talking about console wars. The SNES had the upper hand in the U.S and Japan which is basicly all that matters to the press and media.

It's all that matters for US press and media.

Sonic looked nice and took advantage of the power of the Genesis, but there have been SNES games with visuals that are better than the Sonic games

So what? You talk as if the quality of graphics is directly related to the raw power of the console. This is not true. You can make a console as powerful as you want, but at the end of the day it'll remain limited the graphics chip's pallette.

not only that but the "Mode 7" scaling within the SNES helped publishers create certain kinds of games that the Genesis couldn't do

Yes, "helped". The Mega Drive can also do some form of Mode 7 scaling, if programmed to do it. It just isn't built-in to the graphics chip.

[Js2756]

Originally Posted by Benoit

It's all that matters for US press and media.

It also mattered for anyone who worked in the industry, as the US (North America) and Japan at the time were the largest 2 video game markets in the world. Given that 82.5% of all SNES units sold were in those two markets, maybe that's why Europe wasn't mentioned back then.

Incidentally, 61.2% of all Genesis units sold were also in those two regions (more than half of all Genesis units were sold in North America).

So European sales for that generation, were under 20%, as 17.4% of Genesis units were sold there.

[Benoit]

Tell that to Sega and developers who worked at the time. Sega made an effort to service the European market back in the day, just like the developers, because Europe has better laws to prevent anti-competitive measure that Nintendo loved to use back in the day.

10%+ of millions of machines and games is not trivial.

[TrueCaptain]

Originally Posted by Benoit

Tell that to Sega and developers who worked at the time. Sega made an effort to service the European market back in the day, just like the developers, because Europe has better laws to prevent anti-competitive measure that Nintendo loved to use back in the day.

10%+ of millions of machines and games is not trivial.

I understand your a Sega fan bro, I am too, but the war was won by Nintendo and the main factor in any console winning a war is in the ammount of hardware and software sold. Nothing more, nothing less. Nintendo sold more SNES systems and games worldwide than Sega sold of their product, sure the Genesis may have won over in certain area's of the world but it's the accumulitive number that matters most and if you google search world-wide console sales you will find that the NPD sales numbers favor the Super Nintendo. I love both companies and I love both pieces of hardware, but I must give credit where credit is due and thats to Nintendo for winning the 16-bit war.

[roriconfan]

And then there are those who make fun of all this so called "war"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Va8Sh4Agr58