Guilty Crown - General Discussion

[ookamigirl]

Shu got betrayed...
Those interrogations were kinda nicer than I expected, way to polite and civilized.
Guess only Inori really cares about him, since Gai & the rest have their own hidden agendas.
Great episode with lots of action.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Haak

Well at least he's not going back to school...

Agreed.

Looks like he's being taken to some sort of terrorist compound/training camp.

I suspect that Episode 5 will be a more comedic/lowkey one like Episode 3 was, but at least we'll get to learn more about some of the members of the Undertaker group.

[felix]

Looks like he's hitting on Inori; assuming the scenes there follow one another it's going to be really pathetic. The entire preview seems like the show is backtracking to Shu/Inori diary mode. Is this the GitS formula they were talking about?

[Archon_Wing]

Well, at least the preview image has Tsugumi. You all should know what I'm looking for.

I demand purple long haired dancing wannabe catgirls!

[Flower]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Well, at least the preview image has Tsugumi. You all should know what I'm looking for.

I demand purple long haired dancing wannabe catgirls!

I assume it is ok if they are skilled computer hackers too, yes?

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Flower

I assume it is ok if they are skilled computer hackers too, yes?

Yes.

Also, good ass shots.

[Haak]

Well in all honesty I am curious to see these wacky hijinks. I just hope they don't somehow make Shuu into a supercompetent, superhuman Bourne-like badass by the end of the episode.

[blakstealth]

Of course it's okay. The cat ears even flop around! :3

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

Of course it's okay. The cat ears even flop around! :3

That was arguably one of the best parts of episode 4

[Iron21]

Originally Posted by Haak

Well at least he's not going back to school...

Just to clarify was that last line "Where did Inori and Gai go?"? and is he complaining about Gai being a hard ass?

From what I heard, Shu sounds like he's jealous of Gai. Boy, I hope this isn't a regressing episode for Shu, don't make him more pathetic please.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by ookamigirl

Shu got betrayed...
Those interrogations were kinda nicer than I expected, way to polite and civilized.
Guess only Inori really cares about him, since Gai & the rest have their own hidden agendas.
Great episode with lots of action.

I beg to differ.

Before Segai picked up Shu from his cell, the guy couldn't even get his plastic package of Udon Noodles to open so he could eat. I mean it's one thing to deny a prisoner food to break them but in that manner? That's just cold.

The least they could do is give him something to cut it open with.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by Iron21

From what I heard, Shu sounds like he's jealous of Gai. Boy, I hope this isn't a regressing episode for Shu, don't make him more pathetic please.

Ah yeah, it sounds like he's jealous that everyone loves Gai.

[Sides]

Spoiler for Hare crying and Inori spying:

Shu that bastard, making Hare cry.
Kind of makes me wonder, if Inori would have behaved the way she did, if she didn't went to school that day. I mean sure, she would still be part of the operation, but maybe she wouldn't have gone astray from Gai's plan.

[Iron21]

Originally Posted by Haak

Ah yeah, it sounds like he's jealous that everyone loves Gai.

More like just Inori than anybody else, but yeah. Gai probably took her for some "reprogramming" after she disobeyed him.

First day in, find out the only person you trust is closer to the cool leader. Man up situation here, but since it's Shu we're talking about.....yeaaah.

He's not to that point yet.

[felix]

Originally Posted by Haak

Ah yeah, it sounds like he's jealous that everyone loves Gai.

To be fair Gai is over-playing the asshole part when it comes to Shu and Inori. It's as if Shu and Inori weren't low enough on the character scales the series has to make it it's priority to lower them even more. Imagine for a second Shu actually sucking up to Gai's crap. The sad part is... he probably will eventually. At least the way things are going now.

[Kirarakim]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Well, at least the preview image has Tsugumi. You all should know what I'm looking for.

I demand purple long haired dancing wannabe catgirls!

I keep asking myself why don't I just drop Guilty Crown?

And then I realize if did I would not fully be able to appreciate these cracktastic posts.

[DragoZERO]

Episode 4 was fun. We had some nice development from the characters and the action was sweet.

I do wish Inori had a different outfit, that one is a tad over the top, even for all this.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

The setting in Guilty Crown is not significantly different, in overall atmosphere and feel, than the setting in Marvel or DC comics.

It should also be noted that there are many people who support Marvel comics over DC comics for one large reason. The DC comic heroes tend to be one dimensional. The conflicts tend to be too one dimensional. Batman is one of more different DC comic heroes, that's for sure, but the reason is because it actually manages to portray everything a little more grey, a little more nuanced. Perhaps Guilty Crown is too much like a typical DC comic?

Regardless, a comparison of Guilty Crown to comic books doesn't do anything. It's again trying to justify the show by saying "XYZ" did it too. Maybe people didn't like XYZ either? Maybe, the execution here is way off compared to XYZ? Maybe we don't agree that XYZ is the same as GC? Either you're trying to point out people as hypocrites, which just doesn't change the substance of their claims, or you are saying that our opinions are not that relevant because people like these sorts of stories (I mean is a reason why I should have to conform the majority view here?). I don't know, but you'd have to explain yourself on this front on why exactly a comparison argument is even valid here.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Because at the end of the day, the laws of physics in fiction is not that big of a deal unless your show or story is mainly for people really into science and technology (like Star Trek). Guilty Crown is, like comic books, aimed at a slightly different audience than that. It's aimed at people who just want to enjoy some great action scenes with a passable and easy to follow plot that paints in bold emotional strokes but isn't meant to be high-end intellectually.

You know who this show is being aimed at? Arguably the target audience seems to be as wide the Euclidean plane. They seem to have about as many catch all devices places put in here to pique the interest of just about everyone. Notice the extreme diversity of viewers this show seems to attract.

One of my main contentions with this show is the setting and the way they use it. Serious one moment, absurd the next. Tonal issues abound.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Guilty Crown is not pretending to be anything that it's not, and it has no identity issues. It's been showcasing the sensibilities of an action-packed Hollywood blockbuster (including modern superhero movies) from the very first episode, and with the exception of a semi-comedic Episode 3, its remained consistent with those sensibilities. This identity that Guilty Crown has chosen for itself is also not in any way, shape, or form, out of line with what its PVs portrayed.

I say it's pretending because it has certain elements and the execution is so off that those elements become rather laughable. The PV's are irrelevant on this matter.

Also Hollywood blockbuster comparison? Why does that matter?

Originally Posted by Triple_R

I think the issue here is that some people have a preconceived notion that semi-realistic setting means that nothing unrealistic and/or very implausible should happen. But that preconceived notion is regularly contradicted by some of the most well-known and popular fictional stories around.

More fallacious logic.

Secondly, it is not a preconceived notion. You present a setting that is grounded in the real world, and also do it with many serious political and social issues around. You have a main character that's taking everything very seriously. I personally feel the setting and the elements at play deserve a more mature handling than what we've been given thus far.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Not every show I watch needs to have picture perfect realism. In fact, I would find that rather boring after awhile. The best action shows I've watched only achieved that by being willing to throw realism out the door every now and then.

The fact that you're even stating something like this (Which is a straw man) indicates you been missing I and other's points in this thread.

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Kirarakim

I keep asking myself why don't I just drop Guilty Crown?

And then I realize if did I would not fully be able to appreciate these cracktastic posts.

It's nice to know I am a big enough draw to stop people from dropping. But it's ok, I like reading my own posts too. They're that awesome.

Ok, not really, but on a serious note we might actually get something for this Shu/Inori relationship next episode. But priorities are still priorities for me, and right now it's "good" fanservice.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Just to be clear, I wasn't saying that Major Segai = The Joker.

I brought up the Joker mainly to counter this idea that "evil villain = crappy villain".

Nothing wrong with a sympathetic antagonist, of course, but an evil villain can work too. The key is that s/he has to be a smart evil villain, who has enough depth to use manipulation, moral appeals, and philosophy to try to get to his enemies (Joker pulls this frequently on Batman, for what it's worth). He can't be evil to the point he doesn't even get social norms and values at all (this was the main problem with psycho-blondie in Episode 2, not the simple fact he was evil).

The problem with this particular comparison is that this isn't really the best way to counter the idea that "evil villain = crappy". What makes Joker such an interesting and fascinating villain isn't his evilness, it's his insanity and the peculiar relationship he entertains with the Batman. This is primarly what makes him such an emblematic (and the best) comic book villain. Take that away and only let him keep his evilness and he'd be as boring a villain as they come. Furthermore, as evil as he might be, his most widely spread backstory is pretty tragic and portrays in a sympathetic light, so even he is not an entirely black villain.

I agree that an evil villain can work, but only if there are other layers to his personality. That being said, I think it's too early to complain about that in Guilty Crown, as the villains have barely had any screentime yet. My complaints is not that there are evil villains (I mean, it's kinda common for a villain to be evil, isn't it? ), it's that all the people of GHQ we've seen so are evil as hell. It's not like GHQ is secret super villain society, is it? Shades of gray would be nice. But once again, it may be too early to complain about that. We're only 4 episode into a 22 episodes long series after all. Nonetheless, it won't stop me from complaining when and if they push it too far as they have in episode 2 though.