Game of Thrones

[solidguy]

Originally Posted by james0246

Good ending for this very uneven season. I'm still not a fan of the Sansa nonsense (in the end her story was still overtaken by Theon's redemption story).

I think you're expecting something from Sansa that she was never meant to be. She is not an Arya type of heroine who goes around leaving pedophiles rekt. Sansa's flaw has always been living in a daydream and an extremely skewed/naive view of the world. Thus her characters development will require her to see people and see the world as it really is. Theon's redemption story is actually supplementary to Sansa's development, not opposing it.

I think pegging Sansa as an archetypal damsel in distress misses the mark on her character. Theon's battle has been breaking through Reek so I think it's fair Sansa has taken a backseat the last few episodes. Her time will come when she turns Petyr's plans into ash/frozen in their tracks

[frubam]

Spoiler for 10:

WTF!?!? They killed off Jon Snow!?!? WTF were they thinking? Gotdammit, that was my favorite plotline =0(. Now Longclaw is in the hands of nobody's who have NO idea what's coming. Honestly, I have no clue where the hell this show is going right now.

I will say that seeing Cersei like that kinda put a smile on my face =03(and not just because her figure was better that I'd imagine). I ALMOST felt sorry for her, but then I remembered just some of the shit she's pulled, and I instantly lost that sympathy =0\. Oh well, she'll have her revenge with The Mountain Zombie, esp when Tormen sees how she was treated(and reflexively thinking Margery will succumb to the same treatment).

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

^ Been waiting for that too happen, just to watch the fallout. I'm in the hopeful camp concerning certain theories relating to it and other events.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by solidguy

I think you're expecting something from Sansa that she was never meant to be. She is not an Arya type of heroine who goes around leaving pedophiles rekt. Sansa's flaw has always been living in a daydream and an extremely skewed/naive view of the world. Thus her characters development will require her to see people and see the world as it really is. Theon's redemption story is actually supplementary to Sansa's development, not opposing it.

I never claimed Theon's story was opposing Sansa's, rather I'm claiming the reverse of what you are saying: Sansa's story has become supplementary to Theon's. I don't dislike the interaction of the two characters stories, in fact there is a lot of good in their combination. But at every key moment of Sansa's story, her actions and agency become dependent or are showcased through Theon's story, effectively eliminating the depth of her own storyline, subsuming it within Theon's.

To put it in another way, Cersei's walk of shame is entirely about Cersei, and consequently the audiences perspective is always focused on her. We are constantly kept in close-up on her face as we experience one of the most horrific moments of the series with her (to be fair, the close-ups are also so they don't have to use the body double so much). None of her emotional or physical discomfort is hidden. This moment is all about Cersei and the world that surrounds her and that she helped create. Now imagine if, during this long drawn out emotional moment, the pov changes from Cersei to her son (or whomever else she is connected to), watching as she is subjected to this cruelty. Of course it wouldn't be beyond reasonable for her son to be watching, and of course there is nothing wrong with the audience knowing his displeasure and pain over Cersei's humiliation, but such a pov change would undercut the moment entirely. It's not that the emotional resonance of Cersie's moment would be eliminated, but you are dampening it and undercutting the depth of the moment by forcing another's viewpoint on the audience.

This is what has happened to Sansa's storyline almost since the moment she was left in Winterfell to take care of herself.

(Of course, I never expected Sansa to kill Ramsay or anything so dramatic, but I did think that Ramsay's mistress (did she ever have a name?) would die by Sansa's hands (I suspected that Sansa would push the mistress from the Tower so prominently featured during their introduction several episodes previous), and I see no reason why she couldn't have at least helped push her in this episode. Just something a little more proactive than the completely meaningless, albeit well said, words she keeps sprouting.)

Sadly, I heavily expect that Sansa's storyline for next season will be focused on one thing: whether or not she should abort the fetus Ramsay has undoubtedly raped into her. Because unless you are stabby-killy like Arya, or have dragons, this is the level of storytelling I've sadly come to expect for the female characters in Game of Thrones (which isn't necessarily bad, especially considering that Cersei's walk of shame is a high dramatic mark in the series).

[MrTerrorist]

Well that was a way to end the season. A lot of characters died yet their fate ends with an ambiguous cliffhanger.

BTW, Lena Heady doesn't do nude shots so in "that scene" was not her but her body double.

And the Mountain returns as a zombie Kingsguard.

[SPARTAN 119]

Spoiler for Season Finale and Speculation:

Well, as for the fate of Stannis, whe I made the death predictions last week, I had forgotten Brienne was in the area. However, I think part of it still rang true- I predicted that if Stannis lost the battle, he would commit suicide. In the end, his wife did, and Stannis essentially allowed Brienne to kill him, albeit he was too weak to resist, but at the same time, his last words were essentially him telling her to get on with it, so, I think he had accepted his fate, and maybe even thought that, after the fate of his wife and daughter, I he might have even thought he deserved to die.

As for Jon Snow, one must remember that the Red Priests can revive the dead, and one just so happened to show up just as he was assassinated. Then, though, I suspect Davos will find out what happened to Shireen, and, well... Melisandre will discover she can't revive herself...

[Seafoam]

Spoiler for 10:

Jon revived as Azor Ahai is probably what's gonna happen. I'm gonna laugh though if Stannis isn't dead and Brienne has him help her get Sansa.

[Slayerx]

Frankly, i thought that season finale was absolutely terrible...

Spoiler:

First Stannis... that ending just felt pathetic in every sense of the word. Thanks to the burning of Shireen I had stopped caring about stannis. I didn't care that he sacrificed her for nothing, i didn't care that it came to bite him in the ass, I didn't care that he lost the battle, and i didn't care when Brienne came to kill him. I was totally 100% no longer invested in him...

Before he burned Shireen, this fight would have been brilliant. I liked stannis and hated the boltons so i had a vested interest in him beating them. If he did, then it would be a great feel good moment. however, if he lost, since i had grown to like him, it would have made his end so very tragic... but in a good way. Because he would have died after REFUSING to sacrfice his daughter for his victory, his end could almost be seen as heroic. It would basically be the perfect way to kill him off. And then there's brienne. Since i sympathize with her aswell as Stannis, Brienne vs Stannis created such a great conflict for me. I want both to win but one MUST lose... but no... since i lost my investment in stannis, his loss just comes off as pathetic, and Brienne's victory feels anti-climatic. Stannis; a brilliant story arc that stumbled right at the very end.


And Myrcella... Kinda represents how the series has OVERUSED death. Yes killing off good characters can raise the stakes and create tension, but if you don't balance that out with good things then death will become predictable and the tension is lost. I knew that kiss would be poisonous. I Spent the whole next scene just waiting for her to fall over dead in Jamie's arms. Myrcella was happy, and we can't have anything happy in GoT; Being happy and likable is pretty much a death flag.

Jon... y'know after all the misery, i just stopped caring by the time we got to him. Instead of being shocked and broken hearted like i was with the death of Robb, i just felt nothing. Cause again, misery in this series has become predictable... on the plus side, i d back the prediction that he will be brought back to life, but that won't change the dull feeling I got from seeing him die.

As for those that didn't die? Dany is stuck with the Dothraki... again. Considering how i want her plot to get her over to westeros the LAST thing i want to see is her have another delay. I guess Trion in charge of Merreen is mildly amusing... but that's it on that front. Sansa; nice for her to escape, but i don't have any idea where he story will go from here, so i don't feel like i have much too look forward to. Though she's probably pregnent with ramsey's child; because, misery. Sam going to the citadel? Well considering he's happy, its probably gonna result in the night watch coming after him; they'll probably kill Gilly. Like i said; misery has become the expectation. And Arya... I don't know. Seeing her turn into a spirit of vengence was a great journey, but i worry about her becoming a "faceless man". If she becomes successfully becomes "no one" will she still be someone for me to care about? Afterall becoming "no one" would seem to mean throwing away everything that makes her who she is, and thus throw away everythign i like about her and want to see... so ya, worried i won't enjoy her story going forward.

In the end... this season finale has given me next to NOTHING to look forward to. It did a pretty nice job of killing my interest. The series overused its misery. Misery does not work without hope. Then tension comes from the mix of hoping things will turn out well, while at the same time knowing they might turn out horrible. You don't know what to expect... now, i expect nothing good. I am coming to expect every good person to die or live in misery, and that makes all their future misery predictable.


Season 6... i might still watch it... but i won't be looking forward to it like i was this past season. They just didn't give me anything to look forward too

[sunset]

Well, time to join the Night's King camp, I guess..... go, walkers! ^_^

[Sheba]

"Nothing good must happen to a Stark. NOTHING."

Not even Greek Gods were that dickish to an entire lineage. At this rate, I am going to root for the White Walkers. Or Hodor.

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Frankly, i thought that season finale was absolutely terrible...

Spoiler:

First Stannis... that ending just felt pathetic in every sense of the word. Thanks to the burning of Shireen I had stopped caring about stannis. I didn't care that he sacrificed her for nothing, i didn't care that it came to bite him in the ass, I didn't care that he lost the battle, and i didn't care when Brienne came to kill him. I was totally 100% no longer invested in him...

Before he burned Shireen, this fight would have been brilliant. I liked stannis and hated the boltons so i had a vested interest in him beating them. If he did, then it would be a great feel good moment. however, if he lost, since i had grown to like him, it would have made his end so very tragic... but in a good way. Because he would have died after REFUSING to sacrfice his daughter for his victory, his end could almost be seen as heroic. It would basically be the perfect way to kill him off. And then there's brienne. Since i sympathize with her aswell as Stannis, Brienne vs Stannis created such a great conflict for me. I want both to win but one MUST lose... but no... since i lost my investment in stannis, his loss just comes off as pathetic, and Brienne's victory feels anti-climatic. Stannis; a brilliant story arc that stumbled right at the very end.


And Myrcella... Kinda represents how the series has OVERUSED death. Yes killing off good characters can raise the stakes and create tension, but if you don't balance that out with good things then death will become predictable and the tension is lost. I knew that kiss would be poisonous. I Spent the whole next scene just waiting for her to fall over dead in Jamie's arms. Myrcella was happy, and we can't have anything happy in GoT; Being happy and likable is pretty much a death flag.

Jon... y'know after all the misery, i just stopped caring by the time we got to him. Instead of being shocked and broken hearted like i was with the death of Robb, i just felt nothing. Cause again, misery in this series has become predictable... on the plus side, i d back the prediction that he will be brought back to life, but that won't change the dull feeling I got from seeing him die.

As for those that didn't die? Dany is stuck with the Dothraki... again. Considering how i want her plot to get her over to westeros the LAST thing i want to see is her have another delay. I guess Trion in charge of Merreen is mildly amusing... but that's it on that front. Sansa; nice for her to escape, but i don't have any idea where he story will go from here, so i don't feel like i have much too look forward to. Though she's probably pregnent with ramsey's child; because, misery. Sam going to the citadel? Well considering he's happy, its probably gonna result in the night watch coming after him; they'll probably kill Gilly. Like i said; misery has become the expectation. And Arya... I don't know. Seeing her turn into a spirit of vengence was a great journey, but i worry about her becoming a "faceless man". If she becomes successfully becomes "no one" will she still be someone for me to care about? Afterall becoming "no one" would seem to mean throwing away everything that makes her who she is, and thus throw away everythign i like about her and want to see... so ya, worried i won't enjoy her story going forward.

In the end... this season finale has given me next to NOTHING to look forward to. It did a pretty nice job of killing my interest. The series overused its misery. Misery does not work without hope. Then tension comes from the mix of hoping things will turn out well, while at the same time knowing they might turn out horrible. You don't know what to expect... now, i expect nothing good. I am coming to expect every good person to die or live in misery, and that makes all their future misery predictable.


Season 6... i might still watch it... but i won't be looking forward to it like i was this past season. They just didn't give me anything to look forward too

There is a reason I'm pretty much rooting for the Night King and his lot at this stage, I'm sick of the crapsack of the world because when the rest of continent realise how fucked they are, we might get some actual focus on a character to be a hero and worth actually caring about (queue the theories). It has gotten to the point where if anything good happens to anyone, especially a stark, they're going to die shortly after. I've said it ages ago, but the story lacks a focus for the audience to care about and become invested in... After so much death, caring is hard.

[sunset]

Originally Posted by Sheba

"Nothing good must happen to a Stark. NOTHING."

Not even Greek Gods were that dickish to an entire lineage. At this rate, I am going to root for the White Walkers. Or Hodor.

As much as I feel for the Starks, let's not forget the entire House Baratheon has just been wiped clean off existence (and House Targarian is literaly on its one last leg).
And unless Uncle Kevan starts getting really busy real soon, house Lannister has no surviving heirs, with Lancel now a religious fanatic, Tyrion persona non grata in Westeros and Jaime a Kingsguard.
The only houses that seem to be doing well for themselves are probably the Freys and the small houses and class B bannermen around the Tyrells, the Arryns or the Martells.

[Guardian Enzo]

Because all the hints you need have now aired, I don't think it's a spoiler (but just in case) to say

Spoiler for Theories:

There are three possible ways Jon lives on, assuming he does. And based on his likely parentage it seems almost impossible he won't be needed for the endgame.

1. The Warg route, into Ghost. We already know Jon can do this and Ghost is presumably nearby, but given what we know about what happens after skinchangers warg into animals, this is problematic.

2. The White Walker route. A touching reunion with Benjen? Dissent within the wights? It could happen, but I favor the last option...

3. The Kiss of Life. We already know red priests can revive the dead (Thoros of Myr and Berric Dondarrion). Melissandre very conspicuously arrives back at Castle Black before Jon is murdered. Mel is likely looking for a new horse to back after she destroyed Stannis' life and left him to die. This one makes the most sense to me - it'll be a hard road for Jon, no doubt.

Originally Posted by sunset

And unless Uncle Kevan starts getting really busy real soon, house Lannister has no surviving heirs, with Lancel now a religious fanatic, Tyrion persona non grata in Westeros and Jaime a Kingsguard.

Tommen seems quite enthusiastic about extending the line.

[sunset]

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

Tommen seems quite enthusiastic about extending the line.

I didn't include him because he's theorectically a baratheon and his wife is in jail.

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

Because all the hints you need have now aired, I don't think it's a spoiler (but just in case) to say

Spoiler for Theories:

There are three possible ways Jon lives on, assuming he does. And based on his likely parentage it seems almost impossible he won't be needed for the endgame.

1. The Warg route, into Ghost. We already know Jon can do this and Ghost is presumably nearby, but given what we know about what happens after skinchangers warg into animals, this is problematic.

2. The White Walker route. A touching reunion with Benjen? Dissent within the wights? It could happen, but I favor the last option...

3. The Kiss of Life. We already know red priests can revive the dead (Thoros of Myr and Berric Dondarrion). Melissandre very conspicuously arrives back at Castle Black before Jon is murdered. Mel is likely looking for a new horse to bacl after she destroyed Stannis' life and left him to die. This one makes the most sense to me - it'll be a hard road for Jon, no doubt.

Tommen seems quite enthusiastic about extending the line.

The theory I like I don't think the TV series has covered or displayed the points well enough in comparison to the book. But it kind of relates to your point 3, and the fact that there are not truely dark or light people, just grey, including the frosties to the north and a broken treaty.

[Kyero Fox]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Frankly, i thought that season finale was absolutely terrible...

Spoiler:

First Stannis... that ending just felt pathetic in every sense of the word. Thanks to the burning of Shireen I had stopped caring about stannis. I didn't care that he sacrificed her for nothing, i didn't care that it came to bite him in the ass, I didn't care that he lost the battle, and i didn't care when Brienne came to kill him. I was totally 100% no longer invested in him...

Before he burned Shireen, this fight would have been brilliant. I liked stannis and hated the boltons so i had a vested interest in him beating them. If he did, then it would be a great feel good moment. however, if he lost, since i had grown to like him, it would have made his end so very tragic... but in a good way. Because he would have died after REFUSING to sacrfice his daughter for his victory, his end could almost be seen as heroic. It would basically be the perfect way to kill him off. And then there's brienne. Since i sympathize with her aswell as Stannis, Brienne vs Stannis created such a great conflict for me. I want both to win but one MUST lose... but no... since i lost my investment in stannis, his loss just comes off as pathetic, and Brienne's victory feels anti-climatic. Stannis; a brilliant story arc that stumbled right at the very end.


And Myrcella... Kinda represents how the series has OVERUSED death. Yes killing off good characters can raise the stakes and create tension, but if you don't balance that out with good things then death will become predictable and the tension is lost. I knew that kiss would be poisonous. I Spent the whole next scene just waiting for her to fall over dead in Jamie's arms. Myrcella was happy, and we can't have anything happy in GoT; Being happy and likable is pretty much a death flag.

Jon... y'know after all the misery, i just stopped caring by the time we got to him. Instead of being shocked and broken hearted like i was with the death of Robb, i just felt nothing. Cause again, misery in this series has become predictable... on the plus side, i d back the prediction that he will be brought back to life, but that won't change the dull feeling I got from seeing him die.

As for those that didn't die? Dany is stuck with the Dothraki... again. Considering how i want her plot to get her over to westeros the LAST thing i want to see is her have another delay. I guess Trion in charge of Merreen is mildly amusing... but that's it on that front. Sansa; nice for her to escape, but i don't have any idea where he story will go from here, so i don't feel like i have much too look forward to. Though she's probably pregnent with ramsey's child; because, misery. Sam going to the citadel? Well considering he's happy, its probably gonna result in the night watch coming after him; they'll probably kill Gilly. Like i said; misery has become the expectation. And Arya... I don't know. Seeing her turn into a spirit of vengence was a great journey, but i worry about her becoming a "faceless man". If she becomes successfully becomes "no one" will she still be someone for me to care about? Afterall becoming "no one" would seem to mean throwing away everything that makes her who she is, and thus throw away everythign i like about her and want to see... so ya, worried i won't enjoy her story going forward.

In the end... this season finale has given me next to NOTHING to look forward to. It did a pretty nice job of killing my interest. The series overused its misery. Misery does not work without hope. Then tension comes from the mix of hoping things will turn out well, while at the same time knowing they might turn out horrible. You don't know what to expect... now, i expect nothing good. I am coming to expect every good person to die or live in misery, and that makes all their future misery predictable.


Season 6... i might still watch it... but i won't be looking forward to it like i was this past season. They just didn't give me anything to look forward too

I think your watch has ended.

[Jagger]

There was nothing shameful about that body, that's for sure. Lena always looks great with short hair too. I'm looking forward to seeing how she exacts revenge on the sparrows.

I'm not sure Stannis is dead. You could see doubt in Brienne's eyes for a second. The fact they panned to another scene just as he was about to be killed is very suspicious.

The dothraki surrounding Dany was interesting. Hard to say if they're friendly or not. It would be nice if Dany got a dothraki horde again and cross the poison water with them like she wanted in the beginning.

[Guardian Enzo]

Originally Posted by sunset

I didn't include him because he's theorectically a baratheon and his wife is in jail.

Well, she won't be in jail forever. And sooner or later Tommen's true parentage is going to be publicly acknowledged I suspect.

Originally Posted by Jagger

There was nothing shameful about that body, that's for sure. Lena always looks great with short hair too. I'm looking forward to seeing how she exacts revenge on the sparrows.

That was a stunt body, actually, with Lena's face CGI'd onto it.

[Dop]

At this stage, I'm prepared to believe only one person is going to come out of this well.

Hodor.

[HayashiTakara]

For theories: