[Manga] Chapter 344 Discussion

[ShikaShika]

Originally Posted by gibits

The sound 5 said in no uncertain terms that the more you use it the less free will you will have.

The way I understood it, reading the original Japanese, was that the curse seal will only corrode your body if you use it for long periods at a time, and that as the body is corroded you slowly lose your free will.

[xcad]

sannin simply refers to 3-nin.

(i dunno jap so i cant break down the kanji and all but here's my so-so interpretation)

a few of u read too much into the 's' in sannin. imo, s-rank = special rank while sannin is just 3-nin (as mentioned above).

eg: missing-NIN or nuke-NIN. medic-NIN.

short form for ninja.

tsunade has terrifying strength. jiraiya has terrifying perverted thoughts. orochimaru has terrifying interest in jutsus. legendary sanin = legendary 3 ninjas. honestly, legendary sanin sounds hella better than legendary saninja.

[Lemartes]

Originally Posted by tramadrama

But that's why I am enjoying Sasuke's reign of terror, the more Sasuke owns, the more we can determine Naruto's strength. I just wish for once that Naruto was more pretty-boyish with his techniques and not flat out "divide and conquer..." LITERALLY!

That's exactly what I like about Naruto. Several years ago I thought the exact same..."why can't naruto do such cool and clean techniques without messing up?!"
But today I think his display of raw power kinda cuts it much more than the pretty technique genius aspect.

Just to show you that not everyone thinks the way you do.

Regarding the whole time skip-strength thing, Hunter pointed it out pretty good.
It's a manga for boys/kids and therefore the main characters are very likely to be young, yet strong.

[Rahan]

Originally Posted by Q_Falconer

Right, I know that. I just use the term Sannin because Jiraiya, Tsunade, and Oro are all S-rank ninja. It was an example to show that S-rank status supersedes ordinary ninja rank.

And to someone else's comment about how Naruto could only achieve "Sannin" status if both Sakura and Sasuke became one as well-- Just because Jiraiya, Tsunade, and Oro were in the same squad, doesn't mean they had to be:

Spoiler:

For all we know, it could be Naruto, Sakura, and Shikamaru. Hell, maybe even Kakashi- he sure has the potential.

.

Let's be crazy. They'll be called Konoha 12. Kishi forshadowed it when all the rookies teams made it to the last round of the Chuunin Exam (and Team Gai has been added to the main cast), which was supposed to be exceptionnal and there have been a lot of "Generation" crap lately.

[Q_Falconer]

Originally Posted by Rahan

Let's be crazy. They'll be called Konoha 12. Kishi forshadowed it when all the rookies teams made it to the last round of the Chuunin Exam (and Team Gai has been added to the main cast), which was supposed to be exceptionnal and there have been a lot of "Generation" crap lately.

You should probably put that in spoiler tags... Just sayin'

But I totally agree with you.

Spoiler:

I think that when all is revealed, it's gonna be a serious "DOH!!! Obvious Duh- moment

[MysticNinjaJay]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Yeah I'm sure a zoom of something you said wasn't there supports the fact that it wasn't there. Not.

Here the exact same image with the exact same circle around the seal without zoom.

It still isn't very clear that there is a circle around Oro's seal. The way it is drawn those lines could just be the tails making it look like the seal.

Even still whether it is or isn't in other images it is clear that there is no circle.

Until we get a clear image I think it is still up in the air whether Kakashi's seal is still on or not.

[xcad]

it could be sasuke's wayward hair =/

[Kyu410]

Originally Posted by ShurikenJay

It still isn't very clear that there is a circle around Oro's seal. The way it is drawn those lines could just be the tails making it look like the seal.

Even still whether it is or isn't in other images it is clear that there is no circle.

Until we get a clear image I think it is still up in the air whether Kakashi's seal is still on or not.

There is a possibility that Kakashi's seal only appears around the CS whenever Sasuke is feeling soft.

[Mr. Johnny 5]

Originally Posted by xcad

sannin simply refers to 3-nin.

(i dunno jap so i cant break down the kanji and all but here's my so-so interpretation)

a few of u read too much into the 's' in sannin. imo, s-rank = special rank while sannin is just 3-nin (as mentioned above).

eg: missing-NIN or nuke-NIN. medic-NIN.

short form for ninja.

tsunade has terrifying strength. jiraiya has terrifying perverted thoughts. orochimaru has terrifying interest in jutsus. legendary sanin = legendary 3 ninjas. honestly, legendary sanin sounds hella better than legendary saninja.

What exactly do you mean with this text?

Isnt it...

San = 3
Nin = Ninja('s)

So Legendary Saninja doesnt exist...right?

Unless Sasuke is starting to donate money or his strenght for Konoha's charity, homeless etc. etc. i doubt Konoha will grant him a respectfull title such as the Sannin received...however...Orochimaru made his...dirty.

If i am correct then the Sannin were the only ones in Konoha (so far) which received a title (instead of a nickname)

[shikamaru_kun]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

If i am correct then the Sannin were the only ones in Konoha (so far) which received a title (instead of a nickname)

There also some nins which were credited to being as strong as the Sannin - eg. Hatake Sakumo "Konoha's White Fang".

Probably Naruto, Sasuke and Sakura will be named something along the lines of sannin, or given their own individual nicknames. From what Kakashi said though, they probably will be more powerful than the original sannin.

And about Orochimaru's snake form, wouldn't summoning Manda or another snake have the same effect?

[Mr. Johnny 5]

Originally Posted by Jehuty

Spoiler:

what? I thought it was funny >>

What the heck....i watched the picture obviously not for the first time but....is Sasuke sitting on a Goliath-look-a-like-giant?

Originally Posted by shikamaru_kun

There also some nins which were credited to being as strong as the Sannin - eg. Hatake Sakumo "Konoha's White Fang".

Probably Naruto, Sasuke and Sakura will be named something along the lines of sannin, or given their own individual nicknames. From what Kakashi said though, they probably will be more powerful than the original sannin.

And about Orochimaru's snake form, wouldn't summoning Manda or another snake have the same effect?

That is true...i havent forgotten about him...but i think it was merely a nickname aswell...but the manga (Yellow Flash) did mentioned that he was "respected" on the same level as the Sannin.

[Ichimaru]

i still dont find his sasuke fight with 1000 ninjas as impressive as the current container Orochimaru is in, since that person did beat every other opponent in oros jail lair...which imo, are stronger than those 1000 ninjas

[Sasuke_Bateman]

Originally Posted by Ichimaru

i still dont find his sasuke fight with 1000 ninjas as impressive as the current container Orochimaru is in, since that person did beat every other opponent in oros jail lair...which imo, are stronger than those 1000 ninjas

So the guy who fought to become Oro's container is stronger than Sasuke is? lol fair enough

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Ichimaru

i still dont find his sasuke fight with 1000 ninjas as impressive as the current container Orochimaru is in, since that person did beat every other opponent in oros jail lair...which imo, are stronger than those 1000 ninjas

Yeah sure. To survive a battle royal with a dozen of no-name ninja and being then completely overwhelmed with a glance from an armless and dying Oro is more impressive than defeating singlehandedly a whole army without a scratch, a sweat or even a drop your opponents's blood on your cloths.
In fact Konohamaru catching a cat is surely also more impressive than that.

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

If i am correct then the Sannin were the only ones in Konoha (so far) which received a title (instead of a nickname)

Sannin is a nickname just like the others.

[Rurik]

Originally Posted by ShurikenJay

It still isn't very clear that there is a circle around Oro's seal. The way it is drawn those lines could just be the tails making it look like the seal.

Even still whether it is or isn't in other images it is clear that there is no circle.

Until we get a clear image I think it is still up in the air whether Kakashi's seal is still on or not.

I'm trying very hard to picture this to be something else rather than Kakshi seal in this image, but I just can't imagine it been anything else than Kakshis Seal. Just my opinion about it.

[yinstro]

Well im sure we ll see soon, but im pretty sure in that pic that is the seal, not drawing something you can forget, but drawing something usually takes thinking, and its highly unlikely he tried to draw fine detail of the ends of the tails an ended up forming a practical circle.

And yeah, sasuke doesnt have a pure seal, its hard to say what effect his will have. The fights not over yet people, when its over you can better bitch, because a lot of your complaints may not be valid by teh end of teh fight.

The whole 13-16 year olds being at teh top of the world in things isnt as crazy as people think. Prodigies are known to exist, and they tend to peak early, ie, they are almost as good as they have ever been at thier younger ages. I think that as far as extreme sports one of teh top people is like 15 and can compete with david mirra and other way older opponents. look at gymnastics, those girls peak at what? 13-18? i know when they are in teh 20s they say they are over the hill. Its not a rarity that of a top level in certain fields, young people crop up

[Sazelyt]

Originally Posted by Hunter

And just for the sake of the discussion could you point to me the chapter explaning the creation of the CS?

Don't know which chapter it is, but, it is not only about creation (here, level upgrading), it is also about using it.

How Yamato has no choice? He just has to not use Mokuton jutsu and not train them, it's even easier than not using the CS at the beginning in fact.
And there is nothing wrong for Yamato to use these power, are you really saying here that you think Yamato shouldn't use Wood jutsu if he could help it because it came from Orochimatu?

Yamato was not given the choice of "Do you want to obtain a previous hokage's bloodline, my kid? I can guarantee you it will make you stronger, and helpful for Konoha". He was just given, and it is still not the same as cursed seal. Yamato was genetically modified, in his basic characteristics, unlike Sasuke, who on the basis stays as the Sasuke of before and who needs to activate the power of a seal to use such power. That difference is one of the reasons why Yamato can use that power without having a concern. And, he wasn't even the one who criticizes Oro's methods the way Sasuke does.

However, if Yamato were to be given a seal like Anko has and he were to use its powers, then, it will become similar to Sasuke's case. But, only then...

And your last sentence proved you wrong : Sasuke isn't ready to take any kind of power regardless of the way it was obtained which is why he turned his back on the MS. But again it is not what his speech was about since using or not the CS has nothing to do with playing with people's lifes.

As I said, what Itachi mentioned was an exception. I am highly positive that if he were told to become stronger by killing Naruto in a different way by a different person, he would have done that. The only reason he didn't do that is because it was something Itachi said, nothing else.

Again, playing with someone's life directly or indirectly are not different things, on the basis, imo, it seems it is only different according to Sasuke, and I do not approve that way of thinking.

I don't mind you are just completely mistaken about what I just said. Sasuke thinks he has to take Itachi when he will be strong enough and he's now taking on Orochimaru because he thinks he became strong enough for that whereas your point is that Sasuke should have done something about it before.
You want him to have done something when he couldn't have done anything so yeah that would be moronic for him.
He does think he has exceeded Oro now which is why he's trying to kill him.

What was changed in the last one month or so, when Sasuke was talking about doing things with Orochimaru if necessary, whereas, he shouldn't be that much different than before regarding his views about himself and Orochimaru? If Sasuke had the same kind of thinking the first time he went to Oro (meaning if necessary I would do with him, otherwise, I will eliminate him and do what I need to do), that shouldn't be surprising to us. So, I think, if Sasuke is not a moron, he should have that idea written in his mind even at the beginning.

So, if we go back to our main point, with that thought, Sasuke, could have done something about Oro's way of doing things. At least, that would make his way of thinking more credible.

That's not even assumption anymore, that's day dreaming. Orochimaru acting all goody goody because Sasuke felt like it? Right.
And Oro does know about Sasuke's feeling on the issues as he noted that Sasuke was still a softy. You just have to see how Sasuke talked to Orochimaru at the end of part 1 and during his re-introduction to se ethat he didn't fake love or approbation with Orochimaru.

I seriously believe that Sasuke could have forced Oro to change his ways as long as it will make Oro feel that it would be easier to achieve his primary objective at the moment - which is obtaining Sasuke's body.

And you think than when the police seizes drug money they burn it? You would have a point if Sasuke allowed Orochimaru to continue his twisted life in order to become stronger but like I said you expect Sasuke to do something before he had the strength to make the difference.

Sasuke is not a part of organization, he is himself alone, so he can make the decision he likes. And, if his way of thinking is as important as his objective (that should be, right, otherwise, he would have killed Naruto before), then he should have done something about that even if he didn't have the power to do that before. And, actually, he still had sufficient power, which is based on the value of his container.

The main point is whether he could have kept Oro satisfied, if he had asked Oro to change his things? And, to me, yes, it is possible. Even if Sasuke may not have completely prevented that, he would have mostly prevented that.

[Amaiko]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

I'd have to agree with that. Why would Oro risk losing Kabuto's genius medical expertise by giving him a seal that has a survival rate of only 10%? While I'd like to think that Kabuto is more than just a lackey to Orochimaru, he's only done one thing that could be considered an act of possible betrayal and that was contemplating killing Sasuke in the hospital.

He was also shown grimly remembering the scene where Orochimaru taunted him about not being powerful enough to kill him right before Tsunade attempted to kill Orochimaru with her fake healing attempt. That scene was also constructed in such a way that the reader was left hanging for a little bit as to whether it was Tsunade or Kabuto that had attacked Orochimaru, which just so happens to parallel the whole Kabuto-leaving and the "What? Who's chakra is this?" scene from 343.

It's interesting, because the Kabuto-saves-Orochi-from-Tsunade scene apparently convinced Orochimaru that Kabuto was entirely loyal to him, and now there's a scene in the next-most recent chapter that calls back to that one...

And considering the way things have turned out, perhaps even that was not out of ill intentions towards Oro.

I always took it as Kabuto attempting to "save" Sasuke by killing him: he seems almost like he's pitying him during his inner monologue. This is also the scene where Kabuto insinuates that he's not entirely with Orochimaru by choice, with his line about it being "unfortunate" that he and Sasuke "stood out too much and caught Orochimaru's eye."

[Q_Falconer]

You know, the funny thing is, we still know NOTHING about Kabuto's background. We heard before about the details of Kabuto's discovery [on the battlefield surrounded by dead ninja], and it was alluded to as being highly suspicious- even sinister- and yet, we have yet to find out exactly what happened.

Spoiler:

That one fact could possibly explain most, if not everything about him.

[A.N.B.U]

yea i think kabuto will have some crazy bloodline trait or some crazy strength due to experiments he has done on himself.