[Manga] Chapter 443 Discussion

[Hunter]

Welcome to the weekly manga chapter discussion thread. This thread is created early to discuss spoilers and speculation about the upcoming chapter.

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[Paraden1989]

where is the summery of the next chapter?

[davie]

Can't wait ^_^

[Fran~]

Basically:

Spoiler:

Naruto defeats Pain and finds Nagato, some yadayada from Naruto to Nagato about protect what is precious to him, Nagato remembers Yahiko and Konan's ideals.

Hinata awakes just for faint again.

Naruto and Nagato open a bottle of scotch and started to chat about some masked guy, Nagato said that he did it for the lulz (nah, for his own sake) and started to tell about his past.

There is some little variations from anothers spoilers, but basically this is the common thing in every spoiler i read.

Pic from Ohana:

[bozan]

sounds like a pretty empty chapter, although I guess that's to be expected (unfortunately). Anyone think Neji's gonna be the one to kill nagato?

[james0246]

^That would actually be an interesting development. I could see Naruto talk Nagato down from his high horse, eventually convincing Nagato that there was still hope for peace without total destruction. Only to then have Neji burst onto the scene and kill Nagato, effectively showing that the cycle of vengeance will continue onward.

Mind you, I am not expecting thiS to happen, I simply think it would be a little interesting...

That being said, let us all take a moment of silence for probably the best (fighting) villain in the series: Pain. Orochimaru and Madara may be better at being walking embodiments of evil, but Pain stepped up to the plate of villainy and delivered a much needed homerun hit. So, let us give our respects to this fallen villain...Amen...

[Fran~]

Neji is just a side character... why Kishi would bother if Naruto as a main character fought his own inner demon just to not do it in first place?.

Pain is just a Nagato's tool, basically, Nagato needs new bodies and Pain will arise again.

[Kaiba]

Naruto and Nagato open a bottle of scotch

If this is true, this will be the greatest chapter ever.

[kitten320]

Originally Posted by Kaiba

If this is true, this will be the greatest chapter ever.

I have so agree there
And have Tsunade to join them

[Fran~]

I will send my resume to Kishi... it seems my ideas aren't bad at all

[kenjiharima]

More Hinata air time that's good to here.

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by james0246

^That would actually be an interesting development. I could see Naruto talk Nagato down from his high horse, eventually convincing Nagato that there was still hope for peace without total destruction. Only to then have Neji burst onto the scene and kill Nagato, effectively showing that the cycle of vengeance will continue onward.

I think if Nagato does not die before others from Konoha arrive on the scene then it will be quite interesting from Naruto's viewpoint. Assuming Naruto does not want to kill Nagato, but Konoha ninja are enraged. Tsunade cannot be blamed if she is out of the picture because she lost all her chakra and is just sitting somewhere in Konoha helplessly and looking old. The interesting thing is that Naruto is just a genin, he is not yet the hokage, so some faceless/noname Konoha ninja might demand that Nagato be killed, or maybe it will be the root anbu. Of course Naruto will then defend Nagato by not letting Konoha kill him, which introduces quite an interesting conflict, even more interesting if root anbu think that now they are in charge, since Tsunade is disabled. Of course legally speaking they have the right to order the genin Naruto around. But there will be people like Neji who will back up Naruto, no matter what. So i think the opposite about Neji, once he has been saved by Naruto he has become a good guy, therefore he cannot stand on the bad side. It's the dragonball logic here of course, the ex-bad-guy becomes one of the supporters of the main character. Another reason is that now Hinata has confessed to Naruto, and in such cases i think it's very probable that they won't have the chance to see each other for a long time, kind of romantic story cliche. Which means Naruto will leave the village and go for a journey in the world, to find answers, while the village falling more and more into root anbu's influence. The reason for Naruto's leave could be that he does not want a civil war, because if he stays and has the good guys (Neji, Shikamaru, etc...) on his side and root anbu on the other then it's logical that people will have to fight and die, and Naruto does not want that even more friends die in Konoha. Because of such a logic Naruto may be shown by Kishimoto to be a bit like Itachi: leaving the village to save Konoha lives, and accepting that root anbu blames him for the village's destruction. Being similar to Itachi would be another reason why Sasuke may in the end understand Itachi and thus understand Naruto and thus finally turn against Madara. Also Naruto leaving the village gives the opportunitiy for 2 more interesting encounters: Sasuke vs root anbu and Naruto-KillerBee.

[Kyero Fox]

Originally Posted by kenjiharima

More Hinata air time that's good to here.

yes please, i dislike the "Yay I got some spot light time" *stab* "oooh nooo Now i gotta sit in the hospital for several chapters after I just confessed my feelings"

doesn't cut it for me...


also I would kill for some more Killer Bee.

[cheese4u]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

I think if Nagato does not die before others from Konoha arrive on the scene then it will be quite interesting from Naruto's viewpoint. Assuming Naruto does not want to kill Nagato, but Konoha ninja are enraged. Tsunade cannot be blamed if she is out of the picture because she lost all her chakra and is just sitting somewhere in Konoha helplessly and looking old. The interesting thing is that Naruto is just a genin, he is not yet the hokage, so some faceless/noname Konoha ninja might demand that Nagato be killed, or maybe it will be the root anbu. Of course Naruto will then defend Nagato by not letting Konoha kill him, which introduces quite an interesting conflict, even more interesting if root anbu think that now they are in charge, since Tsunade is disabled. Of course legally speaking they have the right to order the genin Naruto around. But there will be people like Neji who will back up Naruto, no matter what. So i think the opposite about Neji, once he has been saved by Naruto he has become a good guy, therefore he cannot stand on the bad side. It's the dragonball logic here of course, the ex-bad-guy becomes one of the supporters of the main character. Another reason is that now Hinata has confessed to Naruto, and in such cases i think it's very probable that they won't have the chance to see each other for a long time, kind of romantic story cliche. Which means Naruto will leave the village and go for a journey in the world, to find answers, while the village falling more and more into root anbu's influence. The reason for Naruto's leave could be that he does not want a civil war, because if he stays and has the good guys (Neji, Shikamaru, etc...) on his side and root anbu on the other then it's logical that people will have to fight and die, and Naruto does not want that even more friends die in Konoha. Because of such a logic Naruto may be shown by Kishimoto to be a bit like Itachi: leaving the village to save Konoha lives, and accepting that root anbu blames him for the village's destruction. Being similar to Itachi would be another reason why Sasuke may in the end understand Itachi and thus understand Naruto and thus finally turn against Madara. Also Naruto leaving the village gives the opportunitiy for 2 more interesting encounters: Sasuke vs root anbu and Naruto-KillerBee.

That all sounds completely plausible, and it would be pretty cool if it happened that way. But that's more of a direct root to a cool outcome, Kishi usually takes the longer root that ultimately leads there but has a lot of stuff that we don't neccessarily want to see along the way. Either is fine with me as long as it gets there.

[Fran~]

Originally Posted by Kyero Fox

yes please, i dislike the "Yay I got some spot light time" *stab* "oooh nooo Now i gotta sit in the hospital for several chapters after I just confessed my feelings"

doesn't cut it for me..

In fact... Hinata and Sakura spoke a few words (Sakura: that's was very dangeorous, Hinata: Naruto means everything to me) and then Hinata faints again....

[Killer Bee]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Which means Naruto will leave the village and go for a journey in the world, to find answers, while the village falling more and more into root anbu's influence. The reason for Naruto's leave could be that he does not want a civil war, because if he stays and has the good guys (Neji, Shikamaru, etc...) on his side and root anbu on the other then it's logical that people will have to fight and die, and Naruto does not want that even more friends die in Konoha. .

But isn't there already a civil war going on?

Won't the question arise as to where the Anbu agents under Danzou where during Pain's attack?

And because Tsunade is still alive, won't Danzou and his followers have to kill her to take take the reigns of power ... creating civil war? I don't think Naruto would abandon the village in those conditions. While Naruto would probably prefer to end cnonflict with his trademark charm that seems to drain the hate and evil out of villains, I'm sure that he isn't afraid to kill as shown when he hit Kakazu with his FRS. Naruto wasn't holding back, which is evident by the damage he did to himself, and Kakazu would have eventually have died with or without Kakashi's intervention.

That said, I don't think Naruto is avoiding death, as death is an everyday reality of being a ninja. I think Naruto has just made bonds and doesn't want the bonds to be broken ... by death(Jiraya) or simply by abandonment(Sasuke).

By leaving the village to avoid his friends being killed, that would mean that all his friends would have to fall in line once Danzou make his power play, which is highly unlikely. So all Naruto would be doing is just leaving them when they need him, which is very unNaruto-like.

I'd still love to see Neji have a shot at Sasuke though. The byakugan is the most uncelebrated doujutsu in the entire manga. Letting Neji have his way with Sasuke would go a long way to giving the Hyuuga Clan the respect that has lacking in the story. The way the manga has been going the Hyuuga are nothing more than spinning tops with binocular vision.

[DeDe]

I am really looking forward to this conversation and flashbacks since it will finally end this arc. Then we can deal with Danzou, Sasuke, and the Kage Summit. I love the politics of Naruto more than the fighting.

Shikamaru's dad really believes in Naruto. He has always been one of the coolest old guys. Would have liked to have seen him and his buddy Inoichi fight though.

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

I'd still love to see Neji have a shot at Sasuke though. The byakugan is the most uncelebrated doujutsu in the entire manga. Letting Neji have his way with Sasuke would go a long way to giving the Hyuuga Clan the respect that has lacking in the story. The way the manga has been going the Hyuuga are nothing more than spinning tops with binocular vision.

Tenten has a better chance of being Hokage than Neji having his way with Sasuke in a fight. No way does Kishimoto ever let a Konoha side character, a forgotten one at that, touch the exalted Sasuke.

I'll just have to do with my fanfiction where Neji beats up Sasuke and romances Shikamaru.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Fran~

In fact... Hinata and Sakura spoke a few words (Sakura: that's was very dangeorous, Hinata: Naruto means everything to me) and then Hinata faints again....

Was anyone else kind of depressed by Hinata's words? We (i.e. the community at large) have talked before about Naruto's ability to neuter his opponents of their negative emotions (Killer Bee literally just mentioned this concept a few minutes ago), but if the end result is the utterly vacant Hinata (a person who's only concern is for another), then I would prefer for the villains to retain their various neuroses just so some personality can exist in the series.

[Fran~]

That's why i don't like the character named Hinata (trying to avoid hinata's fanboys) she has zero self-esteem and zero personality to show, hence to me, humbly, i think she has little value as a character and i don't understand why so much noise about her.

I would like her if Kishi would put some effort in a character with some personality, i don't know if he tried to show a "delicate" or "timid" person, but he ended with a character with zero personality.

We all like the characters who show some self esteem and "endure" the plot, heroes and villains, it doesn't matter, but to see that kind of characters like Hinata is kinda "meh"...

I ¨thought that Hinata will grow as everybody did it, with some guts, because she is a f*cking ninja and not a character take it from a romantic comedy. Naruto is about Ninjas not about high school girls. Women in Naruto need to be like Temari, even like Tsunade, Shizune, Sakura and Ino (they are medical nin after all).

well, now Hinata's fanboys can start to burning me... (you must catch me first )

PS: Blame Kishi, not me...

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

But isn't there already a civil war going on?

Where? I didn't notice it. Danzou has a plan, he is waiting the moment Konoha leadership becomes weak and a certain level of chaos is needed. Tsunade is currently without chakra and more importantly Konoha is in ruins. This is the best time if Danzou wants to do something. Naruto is away from the village, so are many who are loyal to Tsunade and Naruto.

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

Won't the question arise as to where the Anbu agents under Danzou where during Pain's attack?

For example they were defending the "king", if someone were to attack the shelters. There are always good excuses for not going to the front line

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

And because Tsunade is still alive, won't Danzou and his followers have to kill her to take take the reigns of power ... creating civil war? I don't think Naruto would abandon the village in those conditions.

You assume that there's already a civil war, but as we see in Itachi's stroy a civil war is only the last step in a much deeper issue. Itachi did kill his own clan to prevent civil war, under the influence of Danzou. Danzou now does not need to start a civil war to make Naruto retreat, it's enough if he threatens Naruto and his friends with that and shows that his people are already ready to kill.

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

I'm sure that he isn't afraid to kill as shown when he hit Kakazu with his FRS. Naruto wasn't holding back, which is evident by the damage he did to himself, and Kakazu would have eventually have died with or without Kakashi's intervention.

That said, I don't think Naruto is avoiding death, as death is an everyday reality of being a ninja. I think Naruto has just made bonds and doesn't want the bonds to be broken ... by death(Jiraya) or simply by abandonment(Sasuke).

It wouldn't be his own life that Naruto is afraid of losing, but the lives of his friends, those who still live. After so many casualties it would be easy for Danzou to threaten Naruto with such things. So Naruto would be afraid that Danzou's men for example assassinate Sakura or Hinata, or that they kill Neji or Yamato if they join Naruto's party. Even if he killed each and every root anbu it would be inevitable that they killed someone who is close to Naruto. Of course Danzou and his shitty people would be easily defeated by Naruto, but Naruto would not risk the life of his friends.

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

By leaving the village to avoid his friends being killed, that would mean that all his friends would have to fall in line once Danzou make his power play, which is highly unlikely. So all Naruto would be doing is just leaving them when they need him, which is very unNaruto-like.

I agree that it's not Naruto-like, however in this case he became smarter person and he has a goal to create a peaceful world, and he already lost many friends. So if he leaves the village not only there's no civil war but also Madara will target Naruto who is away from the village so he takes away the risk from the village. And finally: going away does not mean that Naruto does not want to return, many times the main hero goes away because he has no solution for the problem currently, but he has the intention to come back as soon as he finds a solution.

Originally Posted by Killer Bee

I'd still love to see Neji have a shot at Sasuke though. The byakugan is the most uncelebrated doujutsu in the entire manga. Letting Neji have his way with Sasuke would go a long way to giving the Hyuuga Clan the respect that has lacking in the story. The way the manga has been going the Hyuuga are nothing more than spinning tops with binocular vision.

I agree mostly, but after Sasuke got the MS i think Neji is no match for him, and even with CS2 it's the same. I think Kisame could be a good match for Neji, or maybe Suigetsu.