To Aru Kagaku no Railgun - Character Discussion - Saten "Level 0" Ruiko

[serenade_beta]

Saten-san wore funny pants today (ep 4)...
I forgot what you called them.

[AdmirerofSatenRuiko]

Originally Posted by serenade_beta

Saten-san wore funny pants today (ep 4)...
I forgot what you called them.

Yeah, it was "unique"
In the first season she wear more pretty clothes, though there are eye-catching ones in this one as well. Let's hope we'll get to see her in the red swimsuit she choose:3

[serenade_beta]

Saten-san...
Well, I guess it isn't abnormal for a middle schooler to play Mahjong. (; o_o)
Not that I would know.

[Chaos2Frozen]

Its better to start young.

[whitecloud]

maybe if she is good she would face saki later in tournament...

[Chaos2Frozen]

It seems people are not aware of the great academy city mahjong competition (doujin)

[AdmirerofSatenRuiko]

She was really beautiful in this episode, I hope we'll get see some really cute new outfits of her in the near future. More Saten is needed!

[zaeraal]

Watching the episode 7 of Railgun S, I noticed those quotes she said:

Those who believe shall be saved.
Don't forget that seeing is believing!

That's quite a strong refference to her Urban Rumors site, that goes by name auribus oculi fideliores sunt
- lit. The eyes are more trustworthy than the ears -> which in English means "seeing is believing"

She must be quite a lot influenced by that site and not just that.

In Railgun PSP game it was mentioned, that besides many internet sites and blogs, there are TV shows and even her favorite MAGAZINE.
The Magazine goes by name Zarathustra which is name of the founder of Zoroastrianism.
The principes of that religion are in the struggle between truth (good) and lies (bad), where humans are searching for the truth.
Which matches her personality a lot and even her quote

Those who believe shall be saved.

is mostly a religious one, that comes from religions like those.

So it's quite possible she is (even if accidentally) a believer of a different religion, which does not matches with the AC theories.
Which could be one of reason she does so poor on the esper program, regardless of how much she tries.
What do you think? (the Parameter List asides) Maybe she would do really well if she would have been a magician..

[Dark Faith]

Originally Posted by zaeraal

So it's quite possible she is (even if accidentally) a believer of a different religion, which does not matches with the AC theories.
Which could be one of reason she does so poor on the esper program, regardless of how much she tries.
What do you think? (the Parameter List asides) Maybe she would do really well if she would have been a magician..

Those quotes also caught my eye, and I too think that her status as a level 0 is related to them. (Not the quotes themselves, but rather the beliefs behind them)
She seems to put too much faith in rumors and tales (often of the supernatural kind) while lacking the pragmatism that would be expected from a student in Academy City.

She probably would've been better off in the Magic Side, yes. She doesn't have the profile of an Esper.

[rladls716]

But then, it is too late for her to become a magician because, you people know what I'm talking about.

Putting that aside, what kind of power she'll might use based on that religion?

[AdmirerofSatenRuiko]

Very interesting thoughts. Aside from Zoroastrianism, seeing how important the omamori she received from her mother is to her, I think Shinto also plays a significant part in her life. But this is true to most Japanese anyway.
This profile really does not fit science-based esper development. But in my opinion we can't be 100% sure about her doing better on the Magic Side.

Spoiler for Thoughts about the way the universe works:

Well, they way I approach the nature of esper and magical powers, is based on the Theory of Everything. I strongly believe that all phenomena of the universe are linked and are manifestations of something fundamental. I include the spiritual in this as well.
In Shinto, the concept of kami, as the basic essence or life force that is foundation of everything in the world, that can be found in stones, water, trees and all beings is the closest thing to the ultimate truth in my opinion.
In the Index/Railgun universe the evidence of this theory is: Imagine Breaker.

Esper and Magic Side are not two separate, sharply demarcated worlds, both are based on something fundamental. So I think that there is a possibility that espers can be good magicians, and vice-versa. But this has nothing to do with beliefs and religions, but with the ability to find one approach to and gain control of the forces of nature.
Anyway, for me, in a certain sense, Saten-san will always be one of the strongest persons in Academy City.

[serenade_beta]

OTOKOOOOOOOO~~~!

Anyways, finally a reappearance. The closer the story moves towards Index, the less appearance any of the girls other than Mikoto has.
I wonder what they plan to do for the second cour.

[Miraluka]

Originally Posted by serenade_beta

OTOKOOOOOOOO~~~!

Anyways, finally a reappearance. The closer the story moves towards Index, the less appearance any of the girls other than Mikoto has.
I wonder what they plan to do for the second cour.

Two options:

- Fillers.

- Use some material from railgun's mininovels and expand it a lot like the studio did with the Level Upper's arc.

[dniv]

Originally Posted by zaeraal

Watching the episode 7 of Railgun S, I noticed those quotes she said:


That's quite a strong refference to her Urban Rumors site, that goes by name auribus oculi fideliores sunt
- lit. The eyes are more trustworthy than the ears -> which in English means "seeing is believing"

She must be quite a lot influenced by that site and not just that.

In Railgun PSP game it was mentioned, that besides many internet sites and blogs, there are TV shows and even her favorite MAGAZINE.
The Magazine goes by name Zarathustra which is name of the founder of Zoroastrianism.
The principes of that religion are in the struggle between truth (good) and lies (bad), where humans are searching for the truth.
Which matches her personality a lot and even her quote is mostly a religious one, that comes from religions like those.

So it's quite possible she is (even if accidentally) a believer of a different religion, which does not matches with the AC theories.
Which could be one of reason she does so poor on the esper program, regardless of how much she tries.
What do you think? (the Parameter List asides) Maybe she would do really well if she would have been a magician..

I wish I had read this earlier. These are some great observations/quotes. IMO, I feel like Saten actually... might be able to do magic (eventually)... things that stand out about her as well... Saten believes in the lucky charm that her mother gave her. Believing in an artifact that works like that is rare in academy city.

Spoiler for Railgun manga chapter 59:

Even Kamijou noted that...

That's something that stands out. Also from chapter 59,60

Spoiler for railgun manga chapters 59,60, liberal arts city LN:

Saten already has a decent link to Xochitl and therefore the magic side... (she might connect Mikoto to it eventually...) I feel like she really is the type of person who would believe in magic and could therefore learn about it and be useful at least with dealing with magical threats if ever necessary...

Plus, there is one case that works in terms of esper/magic... and I'm not talking about someone's first name that ends in an "o," I'm talking about someone else...
Given that... it might happen in this case even if it is unlikely...

[AdmirerofSatenRuiko]

Originally Posted by Wilfriback

Two options:
- Fillers.
- Use some material from railgun's mininovels and expand it a lot like the studio did with the Level Upper's arc.

Either way, I hope Saten-san will somehow escape the image of the moe support character she got degraded to.
Seriously, what was the meaning of the lot of work they put into her during the 1st season? They cared for her so much, they put her in the center of attention so many times, she was such a deep, columnar main heroine. Moreover, they choose her outfits masterfully, in a much better way then in this season.
I'm really looking forward to see the BD sales. I wonder how many fans will turn away, how many will stay, and how many will join in light of the drastic changes in the atmosphere of the anime.

[Haigon]

I prefer Saten as a powerless girl, that is why I like the character, she's a "normal girl" surrounded by many powerful individuals, giving her some power would completely ruins Saten in my eyes.

[zaeraal]

Originally Posted by rladls716

Putting that aside, what kind of power she'll might use based on that religion?

It would be most likely based on her element (air) and as in magic linked to some other being power or miracle.
But Zoroastrianism is really extensive religion, with tons of good and bad beings.
There are also lot of miracles and it even has it's own judgement day.

I am not an expert on it, I read only few pages on wiki, but most notable stuff I found was:

Spoiler for size:

There is often mentioned Fire (this one is a lot), Water and Earth / Plant element, but I never saw air.

The miracles Zororoaster did: He protected the fires and the cattle. He healed the sick and restored the sight of a blind man.
He established many fire-temples. He suppressed the worship of demons, witchcraft and sorcery.
He drove pestilence and removed national calamities and disasters.
He cured diseases, counteracted the noxious creatures and brought abundant rain on earth.
Defeated the main evil boss (Ahriman) and became the master of all demons.

He also was protected by "Ahura Mazda" (god) and no matter how many times he was attacked by evil, he always got away (even as newborn)

There was a mention of Judgement day - Final battle between good and evil. During the final assault, the sun and moon will darken and mankind will lose its reverence for religion, family, and elders.
The world will fall into winter, and Ahriman's (something like Satan) most fearsome miscreant, Azi Dahaka (some dragon/serpent like creature, that had lived in the inaccessible fortress of Kuuirinta, also reffered as "he who has 10 000 horses), will break free and terrorize the world.
Good will eventually win, the dead will be ressurected and the metal in all mountains will melt and flow across the Earth.
All the bad guys will burn and the good ones will survive. And the river of metal will flow to hell where it will kill the Ahriman for good.
Everyone will become immortal, heaven will descend to the moon, and the earth will rise to meet them both...

They also mentioned the 6 Archangels that rule over - animals (cattle), fire, metal, water, earth and plants.
Then there are Guardian Angels (Fravashi). Each person is accompanied by a guardian angel, which acts as a guide throughout life.
Then there are normal angels.
People chose their angel and pray to him during their life. http://www.avesta.org/angels.html

They have tons of prayers/mantras that can be sing for hours even by trained priests.
And though many texts were lost, most of them talk about the same stuff -
Fighting agains evil, praying for the good, truth, praying to the god, angels, elements...
Mantras are hymns, which benefit those who chant them with devotion and understanding.

There was also mentioned afterlife, that is connected through Chinvat Bridge and in some legend one person went through that bridge to heaven in his induced (by wine) dream.
Arda Viraf met there a beautiful girl named Daena (the name means "that which is seen or observed").
He is then led by an angel through the "star track", "moon track" and "sun track" – places outside of heaven reserved for the virtuous who have nevertheless failed to conform to Zoroastrian rules.
In heaven, Viraf meets Ahura Mazda who shows him the souls of the blessed (ahlav). Each person is described living an idealised version of the life he or she lived on earth, as a warrior, agriculturalist, shepherd or other profession...

Originally Posted by serenade_beta

OTOKOOOOOOOO~~~!

Anyways, finally a reappearance. The closer the story moves towards Index, the less appearance any of the girls other than Mikoto has.
I wonder what they plan to do for the second cour.

They will probably adapt in the last 6-8 episodes the Liberal Arts City Arc.
She has a minor role there, where she saves some people while Mikoto is fighting and convinces Xochitl to help them.

Originally Posted by dniv

I wish I had read this earlier. These are some great observations/quotes. IMO, I feel like Saten actually... might be able to do magic (eventually)...

Plus, there is one case that works in terms of esper/magic... and I'm not talking about someone's first name that ends in an "o," I'm talking about someone else...
Given that... it might happen in this case even if it is unlikely...

I am not sure about who you were talking about in tha last line, but yes, there are always possibilities for her even now.
The only curriculum she MOST LIKELY recieved was in elementary school when she joined AC and we can easily suppose they never gave her anything after that.
And I am sure something like that can be easily reverted, to allow her use magic.

And if Accelerator can protect himself from the dmg caused by magic, we can suppose there might exist a magical tool that will do the same.
On top of that, using a magical tool does not requiere that much knowledge.

Originally Posted by AdmirerofSatenRuiko

Either way, I hope Saten-san will somehow escape the image of the moe support character she got degraded to.
Seriously, what was the meaning of the lot of work they put into her during the 1st season? They cared for her so much, they put her in the center of attention so many times, she was such a deep, columnar main heroine. Moreover, they choose her outfits masterfully, in a much better way then in this season.
I'm really looking forward to see the BD sales. I wonder how many fans will turn away, how many will stay, and how many will join in light of the drastic changes in the atmosphere of the anime.

The clothes are fine for me, but it's quite pointless to give her nice outfits just to appeal to fans, without any meaning behind it.
I also find the filler scenes boring compared to those in first season. They could have really given them better story, get them slightly involved, save Nunotaba..
And we still have at least 5 episodes before the Sister arc is finished (as in no Saten, Uiharu and barely any Kuroko).
Afterward you will have like 8 episodes for the The Liberal Arts City arc.
And though Saten is involved there, she is again a damsel in distress, having to be saved at least 3-4 times, then beaten up, nearly killed and later knocked out by Mikoto, because she wanted to help, but Mikoto wanted to do it instead..

As for BD sales, I am sure the Kamikoto shippers will save it.

Originally Posted by Haigon

I prefer Saten as a powerless girl, that is why I like the character, she's a "normal girl" surrounded by many powerful individuals, giving her some power would completely ruins Saten in my eyes.

It's called character development. Character's appearance, personalities, weaknesses, virtues and powers develop, change and mature over time.
I think the sadest thing that kills characters for me is when they don't change when they are meant to (or change when they are not meant to).
Saten already had her share of tears, hardships and challenges she faced and endured, that I believe she deserves to change for the better.
If done correctly, I would really welcome her gaining powers, it would be a refreshing change that can add new depth to her character as she learns how it is to live with powers (and that it is not so simple as she believes)

The constant damsel in distress, while being fodder for others and being kept away from the real story is getting a bit anoying already.

[Ilidsor]

I am not sure about who you were talking about in tha last line, but yes, there are always possibilities for her even now.
The only curriculum she MOST LIKELY recieved was in elementary school when she joined AC and we can easily suppose they never gave her anything after that.
And I am sure something like that can be easily reverted, to allow her use magic.

And if Accelerator can protect himself from the dmg caused by magic, we can suppose there might exist a magical tool that will do the same.
On top of that, using a magical tool does not requiere that much knowledge.

If reversing esper development just because it's only a little was possible than Tsuchimikado would have done it. Same thing with getting a magic item to allow him to do magic.

Accelerator didn't really "protect" himself from magic so much as stop it from immediately killing him. It still did a lot of damage.

Saten is never going to learn to use magic. It's just not possible in the story. She might get to use some magic items but I really doubt it.

Most likely she will discover that her 'charm' works and gives her good luck and be happy with that. And that's if any sort of development happens at all.

[AdmirerofSatenRuiko]

Originally Posted by zaeraal

The clothes are fine for me, but it's quite pointless to give her nice outfits just to appeal to fans, without any meaning behind it.

Well, appealing to fans in a stylish way is a great thing in my opinion. I loved how they focused on her, emphasizing her beauty and cuteness.

Originally Posted by zaeraal

They could have really given them better story, get them slightly involved, save Nunotaba..

Or they just could have decided NOT to make the Sisters Arc at all, and create a series similar to season1, using some manga and LN material and many anime original content

Originally Posted by zaeraal

Afterward you will have like 8 episodes for the The Liberal Arts City arc.
And though Saten is involved there, she is again a damsel in distress, having to be saved at least 3-4 times, then beaten up, nearly killed and later knocked out by Mikoto, because she wanted to help, but Mikoto wanted to do it instead..

Oh, didn't know the Arc to this detail, too bad I'm really sure they will not modify it... but wait! They are adding Erii to the Arc if my memory serves, she will stole screentime from Saten and co. Fantastic, Railgun S is just too fantastic, it can always surprise me with its greatness.
Back in the good old days, even without esper powers, Saten showed many times how powerful she is. And now, she's really just a damsel in distress. She ended up like Himegami.

[serenade_beta]

Originally Posted by zaeraal

The clothes are fine for me, but it's quite pointless to give her nice outfits just to appeal to fans, without any meaning behind it.
I also find the filler scenes boring compared to those in first season. They could have really given them better story, get them slightly involved, save Nunotaba..
And we still have at least 5 episodes before the Sister arc is finished (as in no Saten, Uiharu and barely any Kuroko).

Well, at least better than nothing. Give her weird clothes, have her play Mahjong.
Ueharu has even less presence, and Haruue finally disappeared.

But I hope they do a filler or two and also follow-up on Nunotaba.
But, so we still have 5 episodes (I didn't know)? ( -_-)........
..........TSUMANNEEE----~~