[Manga] Who is Tobi?

[JustRob]

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

But back to Obito, you'll notice that Obito and Tobi share many similarities in appearance.

Like what? His hair? Because I can't think of any other appearance that's unique to Obito that Tobi also has. Yes his hair is quite similar, but there's so many people in Naruto with spiky hair (Naruto, Juugo, Yahiko, Kankuro, probably forgot some). Also, let me point you to this picture:



It shows Madara is already wearing a mask, but his hair is quite similar to his hairstyle from when he was young.

I know it's odd for a Naruto character to get a haircut, but they probably did it so they wouldn't immediately give away that Tobi = Madara, after all we have known Madara's hairstyle since part 1 from Valley of the End.

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

I also don't really think that Tobi's extravagant personality before his fight with Sasuke was all an act. Why would he need to act like that, why would he need to "join" his own organization, and why would he have been the underling of Zetsu if he was as powerful as he is now?

Another thing, Tobi only began to act as Madara after his fight with Sasuke. After Deidara used his suicide attack that wiped out the whole forest, Tobi is then seen in the Land of Rain talking to Pain and Konan. I don't know about you guys, but I think this is an important element to consider when thinking about Tobi.

Interesting observation, but I'm missing the conclusion. Where are you going with this? Are you saying he has a split personality?

Finally, let me just post the image that convinces me the most that this guy is truly Madara:



This is the most we have seen so far of his face. As you can see he looks really, really old, and he has the traditional "Madara wrinkle" beneath his eye as well, though this could be just because he's old. However, if he's old, why is hair black?

[james0246]

^Admittedly, the wrinkles are not quite as prominent in the manga image, but I do, mostly, agree with what you've said (especially about Madara not being Obito).

[Kafriel]

It would be quite a cool twist is if the Jyuubi, can communicate with those with EMS, at the point of death the Jyuubi took over Madara and has been using his body to do his will and restore him. Like Sanary was used by Parista

This is an interesting theory, does the timeline of events allow for it? Rikudo sennin sealing the Jyuubi, Madara being excommunicated from Konoha and "????" which is the connection between the Jyuubi's "will" and Madara...but how would Madara get in touch with the moon? Sanary got possessed near the 50th floor of the labyrinth, with clear signs of...well, being possessed :P Madara's been the same way ever since we met him, unless you want to account his Tobi side to the Jyuubi

I also don't really think that Tobi's extravagant personality before his fight with Sasuke was all an act. Why would he need to act like that, why would he need to "join" his own organization, and why would he have been the underling of Zetsu if he was as powerful as he is now?

I, on the other hand, think that he acted exactly because he is Madara. Can you imagine the most hardcore underworld criminals being interested in working with a half-dead loser, betrayed by his clan and defeated by Hashirama? So, the absolute power of Pain would keep them in check while he could form his plans from the shadows.

[Mr. Johnny 5]

It definetly has to be Bruce Wayne! Didn't you see Dark Knight?

[TGNail]

Originally Posted by JustRob

Like what? His hair? Because I can't think of any other appearance that's unique to Obito that Tobi also has. Yes his hair is quite similar, but there's so many people in Naruto with spiky hair (Naruto, Juugo, Yahiko, Kankuro, probably forgot some).

I'll take a couple of wild stabs at this.
1) Hair
2) Eye- same intact eye as Obito
3) Manga mentions that Madara is but a ghost of his former self in terms of chakara.
4) Mangekyou Sharingan - very similar time/space warp ability as Kakashi's eye
5) His Mangekyou Sharingan pattern was never shown up close.
6) As proven by Orochimaru, death is only an inconvenience.

[Kafriel]

Eye- same intact eye as Obito

Every living Uchiha has intact eyes...

Manga mentions that Madara is but a ghost of his former self in terms of chakara.

I think it was said that he is not as powerful, and that he survived thanks to his rarely strong chakra, meaning he has tons of chakra but comparably less power.

4) Mangekyou Sharingan - very similar time/space warp ability as Kakashi's eye
5) His Mangekyou Sharingan pattern was never shown up close.

MS patterns vary by person regardless of eyes used: Itachi's MS activated in Sasuke's eyes when he faced Madara. It seems that abilities also vary by person: Sasuke has great control over Amaterasu, Itachi had a stronger Tsukuyomi, etc.

6) As proven by Orochimaru, death is only an inconvenience.

Obito died in the middle of a mission, his body effectively destroyed. I doubt Madara's ghost possessed his body, healed his injuries and lifted the rocks that were pinning him down.

[JustRob]

I don't see how Madara's and Kakashi's sharingans are similar. Kakashi uses a black hole to suck in people's limbs and then cut them off. Madara has the ability to portal people to an entire separate dimension. There's truly nothing similar about it.

[ZGoten]

Originally Posted by JustRob

I don't see how Madara's and Kakashi's sharingans are similar. Kakashi uses a black hole to suck in people's limbs and then cut them off. Madara has the ability to portal people to an entire separate dimension. There's truly nothing similar about it.

Kakashi's black hole must send it's preys somewhere, too. Why couldn't it be the same separate dimension? Maybe it's just that Kakashi doesn't know it, because he's never used it on himself.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by JustRob

Kakashi uses a black hole to suck in people's limbs and then cut them off.

That's not really how black holes work, you know.

[Kafriel]

Rob still has a point, Kakashi's technique has a name and gravitational abilities, while Madara's is an unknown time/space jutsu which he can activate with his hand/body, or so it was shown when he erased himself away...

[yakumo-chan]

I really think that Tobi is someone we know....

because if you would see.... its almost 3 or 4years he has been wearing that mask.....
i mean.... why not take it off when we have already seen Madara's face...... even if he has a hidden eye in his left eye... its still doesnt make sense why he has been wearing that mask for almost 3 or 4yrs!!!

i really want tobi to be someone we know!!!

As my theory... I really think its one of Jiraiya's pupil..... in the 2nd page of this thread..... the one with the orange headband....

wouldnt it be cool if Naruto was not the prophecy child at all!??
I think Tobi is the prophecy child.....
and he is doing bad things for the Good cause

[james0246]

^We do not know Minato's other teammates, so claiming it could be one of them while at the same time claiming it could be someone we know doesn't make sense.

That being said, the whole prophecy child/chosen one schtick is over and done with. Even the Toads have announced who the P-Child is, so there is very little point in thinking of it again. Hell, even Jiraiya, before he battled Pain didn't even consider for a second that one of Minato's teammates could be the P-Child.

Originally Posted by Kafriel

Rob still has a point, Kakashi's technique has a name and gravitational abilities, while Madara's is an unknown time/space jutsu which he can activate with his hand/body, or so it was shown when he erased himself away...

No, they both suck. It's just Kakashi's suckage seems less controlled than Madara's, and Madara is able to reverse-suck stuff out, whereas Kakashi can only suck things in...

[Akachou]

Originally Posted by Kafriel

Rob still has a point, Kakashi's technique has a name and gravitational abilities, while Madara's is an unknown time/space jutsu which he can activate with his hand/body, or so it was shown when he erased himself away...

I think that only Pain had "gravitational" powers. Kakashi's jutsu is a space/time jutsu and he can make attacks or people disappear.

We can't tell how similar it is to Madara's technique because Kakashi does not have an Uchiha body, so using the eye power drains his chakra much faster and he might not be able to fully unlock the potential of his eye.

Maybe Madara will pull off his mask and says he is Obito, just because so many people keep thinking he is, then - just like in Mission Impossible - he pulls off his face and hair and out comes the real Madara. That'd be funny, especially with a gap between two chapters in it.

[milan kyuubi]

Originally Posted by Kafriel

Rob still has a point, Kakashi's technique has a name and gravitational abilities, while Madara's is an unknown time/space jutsu which he can activate with his hand/body, or so it was shown when he erased himself away...

Kakashi is able to send other things somewhere else with his MS. The same thing Tobi does but on himself, so yes they are similar.

[Kafriel]

I think Tobi is the prophecy child.....

Unfortunately, Jiraiya never met or tutored Tobi, so the chances of Tobi being the child of prophecy are 0%. As for being one of Minato's classmates...let's see, the Uchiha massacre took place during the third Hokage's time, so by the time Minato was around, the only Uchihas alive would be Itachi, Sasuke and Madara...and I think it's safe to say that Tobi is indeed an Uchiha, otherwise his sharingan would have depleted his chakra pool a long time ago.

[Akachou]

I could as well tell a story about a guy who left the village in the night of the massacre. A refugee kid. His parents rescued him in the last minutes of their lives and he fled to another village. He never activated the sharingan, so he was somehow accepted as a regular child at the village of grass.

Who says there are only three? There are only three known survivors and only one of them is actually KNOWN to be alive and this is Sasuke.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by Akachou

Who says there are only three? There are only three known survivors and only one of them is actually KNOWN to be alive and this is Sasuke.

So...Sasuke = Tobi?

[Rei Kaiga]

A theory I have is that my Tobi is a separate Uchiha(or not Uchiha at all) as we only ever see one of his sharingan, and what would be the point of only exposing 1 eye? Maybe the eye transplant was performed on tobi, to add to this i would say that tobi has Madara's eye and that Madara could be in the coffin Kabuto summoned with the other eye just my small input

[Rei Kaiga]

nd i know this might be dum but i looked at the pictures posted up above on this page and i think that maybe it could be Danzo and the Danzo sasuke fought was a fake as we know that Danzo's implanted sharingan is in the same place as tobi also danzo has only one sharigan just another theory

[JustRob]

Hmmm. If Kakashi's technique is a black hole that sends things to another place, then I suppose it is similar to Madara's trick, but there's one thing that confuses me. How did Deidara get his arm back? Wasn't it sent into that black hole?

Also, Kakashi's technique looks quite different from Madara's. If they both share the same Sharingan (Obito's), shouldn't it be exactly the same?

Lastly, I think we should discuss whether or not Madara's ability is a Sharingan ability at all. Despite having seen his Mangekyou Sharingan design in flashbacks, we haven't actually seen it in present time yet. Could he have turned on his Mangekyou when his eye wasn't visible to us, or is it just an ability Madara has regardless of his Sharingan?