2010-04-24, 22:08 | Link #9061 | ||
Endless Witch-Doctor
Join Date: Mar 2010
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A similar red to the one you mentioned. It guarantees they were sealed, but not specifically whether it was the door, window, or both that was sealed. The neighboring room was certainly sealed, but at the time of the logic error, only the seal on the door was confirmed to be intact So the neighboring room's door was definitely sealed. The cousins' room was confirmed to be a closed room right up to the very end. ...Although this doesn't confirm it was a closed room due to the seal. And something else I found strange: That is impossible. The seals on the window were also intact. Naturally, I am referring to the time of the logic error. Does this mean it takes more than one seal to seal a window? EDIT: Quote:
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2010-04-24, 22:12 | Link #9063 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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2010-04-24, 22:13 | Link #9064 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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By the way, if you guys need to reference the red/blue/gold, TIPS, etc, in Japanese, you can go to:
http://www.umineco.info/ For example, here's the page for EP6 red (and other colors) http://umineco.info/?%E8%B5%A4%E6%96...A9%B1%EF%BC%89 Might save you a lot of hunting through the game. In fact, it has a chapter listing and summary for the games, if you DO need to hunt through the games. |
2010-04-24, 22:27 | Link #9065 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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I'll acknowledge it. From the time you entered the room until the logic error occured, the only ones who entered or exited the room were you, Battler, and Kanon. And also: I have confirmed that the guest room is perfectly sealed. The closed room has been maintained ever since Erika confirmed Battler's presence. I assume the latter means there was no tampering with the seals. |
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2010-04-24, 22:33 | Link #9066 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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2010-04-24, 22:36 | Link #9068 | |
Endless Witch-Doctor
Join Date: Mar 2010
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No human can truly deny Shkanon because of the following: even if Shannon, Kanon, Sayo, Yoshiya, and Beatrice are all dead, there exists an Unknown Personality X that can still live on. As a result, "Shkanon" will never be declared dead. This makes the mystery pointless because you can always argue that Personality X survived, therefore making all red text regarding deaths useless. |
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2010-04-24, 22:48 | Link #9069 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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2010-04-24, 22:55 | Link #9070 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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You know what, I've just been through all the red/blue/gold text, with a bit of white context looking for the word 存在 . This is because of the red about Kanon:
ベッドルームに嘉音は存在しない。 客室に、嘉音は存在しない。………もちろん、クローゼット、ベッドルーム、バスルーム、この全てにおいてで ある。 Kanon does not exist inside the bedroom. Kanon does not exist inside the guest room. ...Naturally this includes the closet, the bedroom, and the bathroom in their entirety. So I'm trying to understand what 存在しない / does not exist means in Umineko. Because we've come up with two possibilities, that a personality died or that the person actually died. So what better way than to hunt down all the 存在 in the red text? Well guess what... the only other person it's used for is Kinzo. There's plenty of 存在しない for Kinzo in EP5 and 6 and a bit in EP4. But nowhere else is it directly used for another person. In the other uses, it's used for non-living nouns.. like keys, tricks. It's also used in the count of number of people (人間). But it's never used for any names other than those two. Now, that may suggest Kinzo = Kanon theory but... that's a bit weak. What it does suggest to me though is... 1. Either Kinzo is really dead. And Kanon is really dead at the end of EP6. Therefore, 存在しない。 2. Either Kinzo is really STILL alive; only the Kinzo personality died and Kanon is really still alive, only the Kanon personality is still alive. Therefore, they both 存在しない。 Because otherwise you'd have to explain why the same use of 'exist' changes for different people. I don't believe Ryukishi would write the red so that it changes in meaning without that meaning being explicit. Anyways, #1 is rather normal, if a bit sad. #2 though is... wow... how would you explain Kinzo still being alive? (Other than having the will to write that new U.N. Owen song, that is. ) |
2010-04-24, 22:59 | Link #9073 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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Is that even possible? |
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2010-04-24, 23:04 | Link #9075 |
Endless Witch-Doctor
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Kinzo discards his "Kinzo" personality and becomes Personality X. Although I am not the first person to suggest that theory, I've made my point with my above post. It's possible for anyone to become another personality and escape the red text.
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2010-04-24, 23:14 | Link #9077 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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EDIT: Maria has another personaity, and a twin sister. She kills people under this persona, and kills her twin sister in ep3, 4 and 5 and 6. Maria's twin sister's name is Erika XD
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2010-04-24, 23:22 | Link #9078 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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Woah guys really slow down. You Don't need to make it even more complicated by creating personalities of non existent people out of thin air and all this other weird stuff. Kanon committing suicide? Maria killing her twin? Are you guys serious? I'm going to have to call Knox's 8th on that one. It wouldn't even change the count.
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2010-04-24, 23:26 | Link #9079 | |
Endless Witch-Doctor
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Unless you can provide evidence that multiple personalities are only possible for Shkanon and no one else, then my point is valid. EDIT: Sort of like what chronotrig said. Stop attacking the Shkanon theory, and instead consider that it's true. After considering it I've found that it allows for a ton of other ridiculous theories. |
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2010-04-24, 23:27 | Link #9080 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
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I'm just referring to the fact that "Kanon does not exist within the room" and this can be accomplished by Kanon being dead. Since Erika's the detective, she couldn't have killed him. What if Kanon killed himself, or Battler killed him? It's another possible solution...maybe...
The other personality stuff doesn't work. The evidence for Shkanon is that Shannon and Kanon are never in the same room with each other as observed by the Detective and several times within the story Shannon and Kanon have mutually exclusive happinesses or somesuch. That's enough to satisfy Knox's 8th at least. |
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