Code Geass R2 - Episode 25 Discussion / Poll [END]

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

oh
that is so epic beyond words
bullshit
but still epic beyond words nevertheless

Yeah, I know. But this is what most people use as an example when trying to apply the same theory to Lelouch in the last episode.

[yvj]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

This is the Cowboy Bebop thing:

That is quite possibly the most epic pile of BS I have ever laid eyes on. It makes no sense but damn I wish it was true.

[Charred Knight]

Honestly I don't see how anyone could hope that Lelouch lives

I mean the level of pure douchebaggery of Lelouch to accidently destroy most of Tokyo, and then blow up Japan's Sakuradite so they can't even barter it for the necessary food, and then to ditch the whole problem on the Black Knights is epic douchebaggery.

I mean compare the devestation of Tokyo from the Rebellion with the devestation caused by World War II, and Tokyo took a decade to recover.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

Honestly I don't see how anyone could hope that Lelouch lives

I mean the level of pure douchebaggery of Lelouch to accidently destroy most of Tokyo, and then blow up Japan's Sakuradite so they can't even barter it for the necessary food, and then to ditch the whole problem on the Black Knights is epic douchebaggery.

I mean compare the devestation of Tokyo from the Rebellion with the devestation caused by World War II, and Tokyo took a decade to recover.

wish i could rep for truth
if he did do the whole ZERO-R thing knowing that he was going to live through it
then he IS the worlds largest douche-bag
IMO it negates everything he did, and makes him a hypocrit for it

[incorrupts]

Lol people, are we beating a dead horse again? Show showed it in a crystal clear away, and even if there were doubts, staff stated it, no point in carrying this further. 8D //apart from the whole ZR losing point too.

[bladeofdarkness]

right now we arent really debating "is lelouch dead or not"
thats clear
but the point that CK raised and i agree with is that lelouch being alive ruins MUCH of the impact of the ending
the KEY phrase behind zero-r is IMO "the only ones allowed to shoot are these prepared to be shot"
and lelouch surviving zero-r throws that whole EPIC CHARACTER DEFINING LINE right to the trash can
becouse its bullshit
lelouch "shot" like crazy, only to wiggle his way out of it in the end
and stuck the rest of the world with the tab

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

right now we arent really debating "is lelouch dead or not"
thats clear
but the point that CK raised and i agree with is that lelouch being alive ruins MUCH of the impact of the ending
the KEY phrase behind zero-r is IMO "the only ones allowed to shoot are these prepared to be shot"
and lelouch surviving zero-r throws that whole EPIC CHARACTER DEFINING LINE right to the trash can
becouse its bullshit
lelouch "shot" like crazy, only to wiggle his way out of it in the end
and stuck the rest of the world with the tab

Alright blade, but...Lelouch is dead, lol.
If Lelouch wanted to live, he could be a nice prick pwning people from his emperor status {what he did, but he did have the jesus-christ outlook in the end} and would not want to commit suicide, pulling a mary-sue in the end. Lelouch does not want power from himself, he only wanted for Nunally in the beginning, and as series progressed for his important persons as well. So yeah.

[snowdevil_crow]

I dunno, if Lelouch were cursed to live forever and ever and never see his loved ones again, I think that would be a pretty good, what's the word, punishment I guess. It would still be a sacrifice.

It just seems so much more poetic if he's dead. Or... I don't know. Right.

[Bonzo]

Nobody can't deny there were a lot of way to spare Lelouch life, I did it for example (and to live disabled with a giant and infinite remorse is worst of every death), but at last his death was the only real way to close everything and to delete every evidence about code, geass etc, then incinerate his body before Lloyd do something of crazy....but at the same, to remove C.C was better too.
With C.C alive and free to make everything she want is like to activate a atomic bomb and leave it in the middle of a city.
But we already spoke about it 100 times.

[azul120]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

Honestly I don't see how anyone could hope that Lelouch lives

I mean the level of pure douchebaggery of Lelouch to accidently destroy most of Tokyo, and then blow up Japan's Sakuradite so they can't even barter it for the necessary food, and then to ditch the whole problem on the Black Knights is epic douchebaggery.

I mean compare the devestation of Tokyo from the Rebellion with the devestation caused by World War II, and Tokyo took a decade to recover.

By Black Knights, you mean Zerozaku, right?

Not to mention at least one of the Black Knights never did answer for their own douchebaggery. But I understand that argument doesn't really apply here, since it's more about the hypothetical situation of Lelouch living after what he did as part of the Zero Requiem instead of dying.

[Kid Ying]

Originally Posted by snowdevil_crow

I dunno, if Lelouch were cursed to live forever and ever and never see his loved ones again, I think that would be a pretty good, what's the word, punishment I guess. It would still be a sacrifice.

It just seems so much more poetic if he's dead. Or... I don't know. Right.

Yeah, but for me, it would be such a bad end that i can't imagine why some people want Lelouch living with the code... It would suck baaad. Specially for him, who loves his family more than anything.

[snowdevil_crow]

I've heard some people say they thought death was too easy for him, that he deserved to suffer way more for all the crap he did. *shrug* Not sure I agree, but meh.

[azul120]

Originally Posted by snowdevil_crow

I've heard some people say they thought death was too easy for him, that he deserved to suffer way more for all the crap he did. *shrug* Not sure I agree, but meh.

With such a fractured and often unobjective fanbase, it's no surprise.

[Adult_Swimmer]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

how is it that EVERYONE who argue that lelouch is still alive conviniently forget that taking the code cancels your ability to use geass ?
or that for a potentially immortal man, his reaction when kallen almost squashes him or when gino destroys the shinkiro seems like someone who fears death (as it would stop the plan)

I'll stop now. I put my two cents in and now it is drifting back to the same back and forth I've seen before. I've seen this point debated in numerous other places, so not everyone has forgotten it.

Too bad they had to get cute at the end. Arranging his own assassination after building himself up to be a monster was a fitting end.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

Yeah, but for me, it would be such a bad end that i can't imagine why some people want Lelouch living with the code... It would suck baaad. Specially for him, who loves his family more than anything.

You seen that recent poster where Lelouch is playing with the dog?

That's what they want, Lelouch and C.C having a care free life, like Lelouch was some patron saint who did wonderful things and now gets to live in peace.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

Lol people, are we beating a dead horse again? Show showed it in a crystal clear away, and even if there were doubts, staff stated it, no point in carrying this further. 8D //apart from the whole ZR losing point too.

It's Charred Knight, he only knows one topic and will continue trumpeting it forever and ever as well as making random shit up that didn't even happen in the show. This is why most people just prefer to ignore him now.

Now then, assuming for the sake of argument that Lelouch is indeed alive (even going against the words of the creative staff who say he's not), there is a huge dividing line between being a douchebag or deceiver, and having your achievements or crimes negated because of it. In fact there isn't even really a dividing line, the two concepts are completely seperate and have nothing to do with each other by default. You can be the noblest soul in the world with all of the best intentions in what you are trying to accomplish, but still commit atrocities that would make people cringe in disgust on the way to achieving them. See the proverb, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Likewise you could be one of the most reviled figures in history and still have many great achievements to your name that actually helped people. Simply put, there is no given relation between intention and action. It just doesn't work that way otherwise the world would be a less chaotic place.

Other things that have nothing to do with each other:

WWII and Code Geass
Cowboy Bebop and Code Geass
Lelouch and the accidental destruction of the Tokyo Settlement

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

It's Charred Knight, he only knows one topic and will continue trumpeting it forever and ever as well as making random shit up that didn't even happen in the show. This is why most people just prefer to ignore him now.

You do know I didn't start this right?

I just posted my feelings on it, hell they where not even insulting.

[Shinn_Kabuto]

About the pic, well, it's not really true. Sunrise likes to complicate things. That's it.

[snowdevil_crow]

Sunrise are the greatest trolls ever. 8D

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by snowdevil_crow

Sunrise are the greatest trolls ever. 8D

There are so many greatest trolls ever now that I never cared stopped caring. A month ago it was Kadokawa, yesterday it was Kyoani, today it's Sunrise, tomorrow I guess it's Gonzo....

As people become suddenly aware of the fickleness of anime fandom, so do I continue to revel in it. Though whether that's at the expense of it or along with it is still hard to tell even for myself.