2010-11-06, 07:47 | Link #1 |
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[manga] Sage of the Six Paths General Discussion
It's been said that the sage of the six paths was the first ninja to create modern ninjutsu (what ninja uses today in present). It is unknown how he came to this world. Was he born like all humans or is he a product of some demonic intervention (is he half human and half demon). Considering his vast powers I would place my bet on him being half demon or at least have some connection with the juubi (meaning perhaps one of his parents was demon). His powers are able to control bijuu's now maybe he got his bloodline after sealing the juubi into himself, but I remember a information about him meeting the juubi after he started his traveling to spread ninjutsu around the world.
He had or maybe even invented the greatest has power in Naruto world called izanagi. He was literally able to create reality into an illusion and illusion into a reality. He was also able to create thing out of nothing and give them life. This is how he created the nine bijuu's using juubi's chakra. My theory is that he also left some part of himself within bijuu's when he crated them. Why else would Naruto received his psychical powers when he absorbed the nine tails chakra. He had to sons, it would seam that Naruto is the decanted of the second son (ether by blood or some other way). But it is confirmed that Sasuke and Madara are the decedents of the first son.
There are currently four people who are in possession of his power or some of it... Madara, Nagato, Danzou, Naruto, Sasuke (he is optional, we don't know if by having EMS you can gain some of sage powers, that's why I didn't numbered him among this four). But to use his power to max level it seams you need power from both sons (Senju and Uchiha), only then will they be capable of using Izanagi without any consequences. Sage was the only who was able so far to use this power without giving anything in return (Danzou had to sacrifice one of his eyes every time he used this. And if I remember he also had the time limit before he can use it again. Also Danzou only had the power to create reality into an illusion). In reality his powers were so great that on his death bad he was able to extract the juubi from himself and separate it into the nine parts. He did this to save the world, but this also confuses me as to what he thought that by separating one monster into nine would save the world. Wouldn't nine beings destroy world faster then one? His psychical form was what made me believe that he is in fact half demon or maybe half of something else like gods, angels etc. Why else would he have horns on his head? While Naruto now has horns as well leads me to believe that it was not helmet (for the lack of better word) that he had but those horns were the part of his body. Also there is about his necklace that to showed on Naruto's new form and I now that necklace was not part of his body. This also may be true about horns not being part of his body, but maybe I am wrong. * Some guidelines that needs to be followed....
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Last edited by james0246; 2011-03-31 at 13:41. |
2011-03-31, 15:13 | Link #3 |
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You forgot to mention The Gold and Silver Brothers . It was mentioned that they're very close to the Rikudo Sennin, IF so, then Naruto is very close to the Rikudo Sennin as well, cuz he's an Uzumaki and has 6 scratches on his cheeks.
I wonder what they're for.
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2011-03-31, 17:05 | Link #4 | |
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Down to business:the 3 points I wanted to talk about are quoted. 1. I was looking, but I couldn't find where it was stated that the Rikudo sage started the Ninju religion, which was then evolved (or devolved) into Ninjutsu. Being a precursor to Ninjutsu would fit very well into my next point. 2.The Rikudo sage was able to make illusion into reality. As it is said that he is the creator of the tailed beasts (from the splitting of the one beast) it would be safe to assume he re-created the 10 tails as several different entities as to keep them from wanting to unite into one being again. Such an act would be far beyond simple Ninjutsu, and would really be like Creating a reality from raw energy. 3. My final point is about his eyes. In your own picture if you look at the eye painted above the sage's head it's a combination of Rinengan and sharingan and it has 9 tomes. It looks like 3 sharingan combined into one eye with 3 tomes along each circled line. I had always assumed that this is what his eye looked like, and that the 6 tome necklace was the signifigance of the Tomes (totaling 6) in the pair of sharingan eyes, and Spoiler for Manga:
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Last edited by Kotengu; 2011-03-31 at 17:15. |
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2011-03-31, 18:56 | Link #5 |
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Please correct me if i'm wrong, but what you called as "tome" is a "Tomoe" and those things in the Sage's Chest aren't Tomoe but Magatama.
The answers about #1 are on the first mentions about the Sage, i believe that it was Jiraiya the first one to mention him. #2 is simple, Kishi doesn't think to that level, to him is Ninjutsu because the sage used some skills where ninjutsu is involved and that's all. This is fiction, Spoiler for manga:
Spoiler for manga:
About the thread itself... i believe that's beyond any analysis... Madara was crystal clear: Sasuke: Sage's elder son. Naruto: Sage's younger son. And that's all you need to know. They're natural born enemies. Madara even respects Hashirama, but in the end they are enemies.
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2011-04-01, 06:06 | Link #6 | |
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But who knows, currently it seems that we are at Cell saga I mean Madara reavealed that he wants to become "complete". What will be android 16 and 17 here? One thing is the rinnegan eyes from Nagato, the other may be the demons being sealed in Madara. And there we have Perfect Madara. After the Cell saga however came some superhuman crazy magical stuff in DB, so if Naruto continues the same pattern maybe demons and death gods and mighty magicians who control them may appear. That was just raikage's assumption, so Kishimoto may or may not use that in the future story, as it fits his needs. I mean Kishi can just forget about this since he didn't present this as a fact. Last edited by Ero-Senn1n; 2011-04-01 at 06:29. |
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2011-04-01, 11:02 | Link #7 |
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I think we're waaaay past superhuman 'threshhold' .. chakra and pretty eyes (or other genetic mutations) can do anything, from levitation, telerportation, intangibility, deatomisation, lava & stone spitting to pure/impure resurrection (and various other means of using the soul .. binds, seals etc.) & *reality warping* (including cheating death) .. I mean the sage made the moon ! the moon ....
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2011-04-01, 13:01 | Link #8 | |
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For example superhuman would be if there were immortal creatures as characters of the story. Sure Orochimaru or Madara are immortal, but they use tricks to prolong their life, and that i would not call true immortality. Maybe Hidan was the closest to having such an abnormal gift of immortality that cannot be explained in a natural way, i mean a talking head is just abnormal no matter what So this Hidan tells that his god Yashin granted him immortality. What i meant is that i don't believe that this Yashin god will be one of the characters. But i can imagine him being dragged into the story long after Naruto beats Madara. It may not fit in but if the anime team or Kishimoto himself wants to capitalize on this then he can just change the story so that Naruto and Sasuke fight such godlike creatures like Yashin. But that will look more like a fight between godlike magicians than ninjas, it will be something different from the current Naruto. |
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2011-04-01, 16:13 | Link #9 |
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tailed beasts are just balls of chakra .. although Juubi may be immortal seeing how even Sage was unable to kill him properly (both in a straight fight and after he became a jinchuriki .. I mean, it was said that if Naruto is killed - fox dies .. that wasn't the case with Juubi I assume, since othwerwise Sage could've sacrificed himself - maybe on his deathbed or something if he wanted to live a little longer)
ability-wise I think Naruto has everything, short of an actual universe-creating God, covered I agree though that Kishi'll stick to ninjas
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2011-04-01, 17:21 | Link #10 | |
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It's the same with Yondaime and Naruto.
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2011-04-01, 19:41 | Link #11 | |
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Remember before the 4th hakage sacrifices himself to seal it, he tells that even if Kushina were to die with the kyuubi it would eventually return to this world and Madara will use it again. If these could be killed then why wouldn't someone like the sage or 1st hokage kill them? Instead of letting them be used to kill people. The story needs such a problem that cannot be resolved by just killing the demons. |
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2011-04-01, 19:53 | Link #12 |
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I'm ok with that, but... i just want to say that Tailed Beasts are weapons... and in wars, if you captured an enemy ship, tank or fighter, you actually use it. This is the same, perhaps the ambition to have such weapons is a huge temptation.
I believe that Kishi is using an analogy for the bijuus close to nuclear weapons. You know that nukes brought certain stability between Nato and Warsaw Pact. In Narutoverse it's the same. Can you imagine a War with tailed beasts?, Yuugito and Bee against Naruto and Gaara?.
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2011-04-02, 08:32 | Link #13 | |
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The weapon that Nagato wanted to create would be more like it, but since only one side would have it at a time that would also be different from nuclear weapons. |
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2011-04-02, 13:26 | Link #14 | ||
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So, one thing is the reason to have these tailed beasts and not to kill them and another one is if that reason was correct or wrong (it was proven wrong IMO). Quote:
Spoiler for manga:
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2011-04-02, 15:03 | Link #16 | |
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Vietnam -> USA Afganistan -> USSR Falklands -> UK Pakistan-India -> both of them. I put those examples precisaly because they didn't resort to nukes. And how to forget Israel!. Nuclear weapons don't prevent wars, but there is the temptation to use it, not as a weapon but as a psychological tool. I heard the rumor that M. Tatcher tried to threaten Argentina with nukes. Here it's the same, hidden villages didnt' use tailed beasts, because they know that the Hell would open and there is no turning point.
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2011-04-02, 15:53 | Link #17 | |
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I already told you an example when they used it: the sand village using Gaara inside Konoha, but they failed to use it. |
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2011-04-03, 07:07 | Link #18 | |
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That's not true, as far as I'm concerned. Orochimaru killed the Kazekage, took his position and ordered Gaara to attack Konoha with the Bijuu.
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2011-04-03, 11:28 | Link #19 | |
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Also it's probable that Orochimaru killed the kazekage after all the invasion plans were made, you can't impersonate a kage for too long without someone noticing that something is wrong. Orochimaru was there in the forest of death too. Even in this war the tsuchikage wanted to use Naruto and KillerBee in the war, the only reason they are not used in this war because they are the targets of Madara. |
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2011-04-03, 11:42 | Link #20 | |
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