Character Discussion - Suzaku

[Orga777]

People seem to love flip flopping on the issue of whether there is good or bad or not in this series... There is NOT any good/bad in this series. There are no Darth Vader's or Luke Skywalker's here. NOTHING is that cut and dry. Everyone is in gray. How many times is this said but forgotten again?

[DN24]

People seem to love flip flopping on the issue of whether there is good or bad or not in this series... There is NOT any good/bad in this series. There are no Darth Vader's or Luke Skywalker's here. NOTHING is that cut and dry. Everyone is in gray. How many times is this said but forgotten again?

I agree that almost everyone in CG is in the gray area,I think people get it too but the problem is we want our favorite character to be in lighter area,to do so we push the others characters into the darker area to make our character look better

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by DN24

I agree that almost everyone in CG is in the gray area,I think people get it too but the problem is we want our favorite character to be in lighter area,to do so we push the others characters into the darker area to make our character look better

Exactly, apparently to everyone Lelouch's massacre if justifiable

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by DN24

I agree that almost everyone in CG is in the gray area,I think people get it too but the problem is we want our favorite character to be in lighter area,to do so we push the others characters into the darker area to make our character look better

People that do that don't understand the show then... Last time I checked everyone has done something horrible in this series in some way except for non-Geassed Euphie and Nunnally.

[Silver Soul]

So what makes it wrong that Suzaku is threatening Kallen with Refrain for information if she refuses to give him any, what other methods should he use on her if she is already at odds with him

[bladeofdarkness]

shes a POW
he even uses the word for POW when refering to her
using violence in order to get info out of POWs is against the law

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

shes a POW
he even uses the word for POW when refering to her
using violence in order to get info out of POWs is against the law

He uses the word 'prisoner.' That does not necessarily mean POW. I have a feeling Britannia does NOT see the United States of Japan as a real nation.

[Crenshinibon]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

shes a POW
he even uses the word for POW when refering to her
using violence in order to get info out of POWs is against the law

Against the Geneva convention, which likely never took place in Geass chronology. We really have no idea Britannia's law is concerning this, although I doubt that they would do anything at all to restrict themselves.

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

shes a POW
he even uses the word for POW when refering to her
using violence in order to get info out of POWs is against the law

You haven't even answer my question when a person is taken prisoner, the Code of Conduct reminds the service member that the chain of command is still in effect and that the service member cannot receive special favors or parole from their captors, so what makes Kallen any different if she refuses to relay any information and what other tactic could he have done to avoid this.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Crenshinibon

Against the Geneva convention, which likely never took place in Geass chronology. We really have no idea Britannia's law is concerning this, although I doubt that they would do anything at all to restrict themselves.

but we know that there are conventions of that kind in the geass-verse
lulu said he'd treat suzaku by the convention when they captured him in ep 18

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Silver Soul

You haven't even answer my question when a person is taken prisoner, the Code of Conduct reminds the service member that the chain of command is still in effect and that the service member cannot receive special favors or parole from their captors, so what makes Kallen any different if she refuses to relay any information and what other tactic could he have done to avoid this.

name
rank
personal number

thats all she owes him

[Tolle Erik Koenig]

Originally Posted by Crenshinibon

Against the Geneva convention, which likely never took place in Geass chronology. We really have no idea Britannia's law is concerning this, although I doubt that they would do anything at all to restrict themselves.

It's called the Manila Convention there.

[Silver Soul]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

but we know that there are conventions of that kind in the geass-verse
lulu said he'd treat suzaku by the convention when they captured him in ep 18

That could just be Lelouch letting his past with Suzaku get in the way of his leadership position so that's really nothing to go by

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Silver Soul

That could just be Lelouch letting his past with Suzaku get in the way of his leadership position so that's really nothing to go by

Guilford also made a mention of it in R2 when Zero told him that Toudou and the others are not terrorists but soldiers for the United States of Japan. And as Tolle Erik Koenig said, the Manila Convention is what they were referring to.

[morbosfist]

They've confirmed through both Lelouch and Guilford that prisoner treatment standards do exist. Suzaku using illegal drugs on a prisoner not in his custody is surely a violation of that.

[Crenshinibon]

Originally Posted by Tolle Erik Koenig

It's called the Manila Convention there.

Does it cover matters to the same extent? Unless you (or some informed person) knows, my point stands that we really don't have enough information to determine whether or not Suzaku is actually doing something illegal. "Some kind of convention" existing doesn't mean that it inherently adheres to the real world variation.

If the information is out there, I'd gladly be proven wrong.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

They've confirmed through both Lelouch and Guilford that prisoner treatment standards do exist. Suzaku using illegal drugs on a prisoner not in his custody is surely a violation of that.

That would mean staging an execution for them would be too... Except Britannia doesn't seem to see them as a real nation. So is it still breaking the rules?

[morbosfist]

It didn't see them as a real nation when they were terrorists within their own borders. It's quite a different matter when they control actual territory.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Orga777

That would mean staging an execution for them would be too... Except Britannia doesn't seem to see them as a real nation. So is it still breaking the rules?

That was before Zero and the Black Knights were recognized by other nations in the world as a political body. The United States of Japan are now recognized and even have allies. Regardless of what Britannia thinks, now that the rest of the world acknowledges them then Black Knights taken prisoner fall under those rules.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by demon_god04

That was before Zero and the Black Knights were recognized by other nations in the world as a political body. The United States of Japan are now recognized and even have allies. Regardless of what Britannia thinks, now that the rest of the world acknowledges them then Black Knights taken prisoner fall under those rules.

Correct me if I'm wrong but during WWII Soviet prisoners were not treated well compared to allied troops under Germany since the Soviet Union never signed/agreed with those consitutions regarding prisoner treatment.

So USJ maybe recognized but unless they start negotiating and signing agreements and treaties with other nations including Britannia then they won't fall under the official status category (So for Kallen it's a fine line).