2012-05-20, 13:15 | Link #42 |
books-eater youkai
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Betweem wisdom and insanity
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Not worth the effort or making it not worth all the problems than would come from it. Sadly, the second seem to be valued less while it should be as much( if not more ) tan the first.
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2012-05-20, 14:36 | Link #43 | |
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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Israel has not tried to start up anything with Lebanon since the withdrawal.
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2012-05-20, 16:05 | Link #45 | |||
formerly ogon bat
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Mexico
Age: 53
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2012-05-20, 17:03 | Link #49 | |||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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Why is the Palestinian cause even relevant with the issue of Iran, anyway? Does Iran even care about the Palestinian cause? It probably does, and even I think that if Israel finally established a respectable peace with the palestinians, then Iran would be at least a little pacified. But the fact of the matter is that there are way better ways of supporting the Palestinian cause than by sponsoring terrorism, and all the Iranian regime has really shown is that it cares more about hating Israel than supporting the Palestinians. And due to the fact that Hamas doesn't want negotiations and Netanyahu is perfectly content with the status quo, the Palestinian Question isn't going to be resolved anytime soon so it's pointless to factor it in anyway. And even if it was miraculously solved, there's no gauruntee that would stop Iran anyway.
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Last edited by Haak; 2012-05-20 at 17:18. Reason: broken link |
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2012-05-20, 18:28 | Link #50 | |
Deadpan Snarker
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Neverlands
Age: 46
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Why doesn't the US invade Rogue states like N-Korea or Iran, but did Iraq and Afghanistan? The answer is simple: North Korea and Iran are very capable of defending themselves
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2012-05-20, 18:39 | Link #51 | |||||||
formerly ogon bat
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Mexico
Age: 53
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Come again, stop Iran from what specifically? Last edited by Daniel E.; 2012-05-21 at 03:18. |
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2012-05-21, 02:13 | Link #52 |
Aria Company
Join Date: Nov 2003
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It's less a matter of they can defend themselves, because let's face it, they'd be crushed in a conventional war, and more a matter of both nations possess strong conventional deterrents. Iran can shut down the Straits of Hormuz, and North Korea has a ton of artillery pointed at Seoul. Both would be stopped pretty quickly, but they'd do a hell of a lot of damage before that happens. You'll note that neither involves engaging and defeating US forces in a head to head battle. In addition, occupying Iran would be a nightmare, while North Korea risks Chinese intervention.
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2012-05-21, 02:25 | Link #53 |
Gamilas Falls
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 46
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Consider how long both North Korea and Iran have been considered enemies of the United States and how long either has had even a hint of nuclear capability. There was a whole lot of time when they didn't have any of those abilities and yet they still were not invaded (mostly). North Korea has been a starring match over the DMZ since 1953 and Iran has been a "problem" since 1979. Niether has needed nuclear weapons before to keep the Americans from invading.
In fact the threat of American invasion seems to increase the more one threatens to get nuclear weapons (see Iraq) if one is still inside the Non-Nuclear Proliferation Treaty. Israel, India, and Pakistan were never in that treaty, and North Korea bowed out of it just before going nuclear. Iran is still in the treaty, and if they do attempt to develope nuclear arms without leaving the treaty (via a clause made for that purpose) they are going counter to the treaty. What can be done to those going against the treaty is not stated at all as far as I can tell, but the world in general doesn't like the spread of nuclear arms based on the number of countries that are in the treaty (all but the four mentioned above and techically Taiwan...because it isn't considered a country by the treaty...it says it will follow the treaty, and does not have the right to nuclear arms that China itself has the right to own).
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2012-05-21, 03:43 | Link #54 |
Knight Errant
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 35
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I don't think Iran genuinely cares about the Palestinians, or Lebanese. It's more a case of them frantically looking for allies, and also funding opponents of their enemies.
Currently Iran's only ally is Syria, along with hezbollah (though how much help it would be in a full war is questionable...). The main use of their support of hezbollah is to undermine their greatest rival and threat in the region: Israel. Funding Hezbollah, and Hamas, achieves a number of objectives for them. It isolates Israel from it's neighbours (the rest of the arab world will always sympathise with the palestinians/lebanese), and it forces them to expend more money on defense, all the while creating an atmosphere of paranoia and fear, which is likely to cause Israel to make all kinds of mistakes and shed western allies if they take unjust actions, for instance, they've already lost the sympathy of a lot of Europe, policy succesful. Otherwise, Iran actually doesn't have many friends in the arab world, Arabs and Persians have traditionally been at odds with each other. There's certainly plenty of bad blood between Iraq and Iran. Iran doesn't have friends in the Arab world the way, say, Turkey does. It has to take what it can get. A nation without allies is a nation that gets pounced on and destroyed. |
2012-05-21, 04:31 | Link #55 | ||||||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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The reasons why I believe Israel is for the two state solution are based on their actions: They withdrew from Gaza, they established the Palestinian National Authority and Police, and negotiated for a retreat in the 2000 Camp David summit and the follow up Taba summit. I'm not inclined to believe in conspiracy theories so whilst I do believe that Netanyahu has tried to stall things, I don't believe that Israel doesn't believe in the two state solution and I certainly don't believe in any conspiracy theories that Israel is trying to take over everything. Quote:
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2012-05-21, 11:22 | Link #56 | |||||
formerly ogon bat
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Mexico
Age: 53
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As for the two soldiers, your argument simply does not add up. What kind of officer would make two normal soldiers patrol a border that is a technical battlezone? You do not see them doing that on the koreas border. If said soldiers were inside a tank it would be ok, but they would not have been captured if inside a moving tank. The only logical reason is that these soldiers were commandos entering into lebanese territory that were caught in the process of entering or returning from lebanese territory. Quote:
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2012-05-21, 11:41 | Link #57 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: قلوب المؤمنين
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I don't know how much people around here has been updated of the current politics in israel but, here goes : http://www.juancole.com/2012/05/new-...an-attack.html
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2012-05-21, 11:55 | Link #58 | |
Deadpan Snarker
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Neverlands
Age: 46
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Saddam got US weapons by the boatload, Al Queda rose to power by US arms I think Iran is allowed to sell anyone weapons, except those that are prohibited by their law or signed treaty ...The same way the west is selling arms
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2012-05-21, 11:58 | Link #59 | ||||||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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The soldiers were in armoured Humvees crossing between Zar'it and Shtula. Before the attack, Hezbollah had sent diversionary attacks to military posts in border villages, blatantly suggesting that it was a planned attack. Hezbollah were the only belligerents here. Quote:
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