Re:Zero Second Season - Anime Episode Discussion

[GDB]

There's also Garfiel, since we don't really know how strong he is.

[moridin84]

Originally Posted by GDB

There's also Garfiel, since we don't really know how strong he is.

He probably isn't strong enough to kill Elsa. Then again, I didn't think that knight, Julias, was as strong as he was so it's possible.

I guess that Frederica will be fulfilling Rem's role of Subaru's bodyguard/attack dog. I was vaguely thinking that would be Garfiel but he's stuck in the barrier.

[FlameSparkZ]

We don't know how strong Elsa is, and we can't really use Reinhart was a measurement due to how OP he is

As for Garfiel, he looks strong and took out Patrasche with ease, but we haven't really seen him in an actual fight so can't really tell

So, possible "candidates" are Beatrice, Garfiel and Frederica (she's related to Garfiel, so I assume she's as strong as him).

[Frontier]

Garfiel strikes me as the kind of relationship Subaru might want to cultivate during a loop.

[moridin84]

Oh, another candidate for "super strong ally" just occurred to me. Elsa.

In retrospect, Elsa might not be the final boss. In the previous two arcs, they didn't introduce the final boss until halfway through.

I could easily imagine Elsa being in the mansion for some other reason and killing Subaru just because she saw him.

[Frontier]

So people were on-point that Subaru would end up back at the end of the first Trial. Pretty solid save point, all things considered .

Subaru's just trying to help but Garfiel thinks he's putting on airs and Emilia now thinks Subaru doesn't have faith in her. Sometimes Subaru just can't win .

Roswaal making vague allusions to Retun by Death again .

I thought Ram was oblivious to Garfiel's feelings, but look at her using it to her advantage .

Ram finally finds out about Rem. She doesn't seem to doubt that Rem is her sister though she's obviously struggling with how she should feel about it, but sub-consciously she seems to know to some extent about her and that her memories have been effected. It doesn't make things any easier for Subaru .

Subaru is all suspicious and accusatory towards Frederica when she turns out to be a pleasant and kind woman just following orders (from Roswaal?) more or less. She's not out to get anyone or plotting something behind their backs, and she really came through when Elsa showed up .

Frederica being Garfiel's sister was pretty obvious, but I'm kind of wondering how things became strained between them...

I was surprised to see a maid who can be as snippy towards Ram as she is to everyone else. I can only imagine the confrontations Rem probably had to mediate .

I was not expecting Frederica to pop up some huge animal hands, but I also wasn't expecting her to strip nude and then transform into this majestic animal form either .

Well, actually I think Rem would've said "leave me behind and save Subaru-kun," but same difference .

Petra really is a good girl. I know she says she's "grown up," but for someone her age to be as calm and committed to what she's doing given the circumstances is still pretty impressive .

The heck was that Mabeast doing there? Is that Elsa's pet or something? Is that the "Maylie" she mentioned ?

Elsa's contract was specifying the maids and Rem? Or is the "shut-in" Beatrice? Is she the main target ?

Beatrice saves Subaru just when Elsa is about to kill him, even though he was planning to die to restart the loop. I doubt they're going to leave Petra, Ram, and Frederica dead so he's probably still going to die, but Beatrice might explain some things or at least provide the answer as to what Subaru needs to do to resolve this situation .

[Kakurin]

Going by the quite specific instructions that Elsa received, especially regarding timing the killings with Subaru's return, the most obvious suspect for her employer would be Roswaal. Not sure though how and when he managed to contact her, but there aren't any other people out there with both the knowledge and the motive for these instructions.

[Dextro]

I mean it was pretty obvious from the get go that this was about to be a bad end loop for Subaru given what he said to Emilia. After that speech with Echidna saying she was going to be the one to pass the trials and not him I really don't see the story making him move forward by compromising on that belief. I'm actually surprised he did so so quickly. Did the adaptation cut out a loop or something?

[FlameSparkZ]

This loop is much worse than the previous. Fredrica is dead, Ram is dead, Petra is dead and even Patrasche is dead
Beatrice only acted at the last moment, just as Subaru was about to enter Rem's room...and he's clearly angry at Beatrice's intervention.

Also, it's implied Elsa is watching the mansion, and has a contract to kill everyone inside. But her agenda is flexible enough that she waits for Subaru to arrive to also keep the "promise" between them...and if it wasn't clear enough, she has backup.
Which I assume is the girl that appears in the OP, between the Archbishops and Elsa.

Things aren't looking good for Subaru...how is he going to break the loop?
I assume he'll realize that returning to the mansion early is a bad idea, which means he has roughly two more days to somehow solve the issues at the Sanctuary, and deal with Elsa's attack.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Dextro

After that speech with Echidna saying she was going to be the one to pass the trials and not him I really don't see the story making him move forward by compromising on that belief. I'm actually surprised he did so so quickly. Did the adaptation cut out a loop or something?

I personally don't see this as surprising at all. When Subaru said this to Echidna he was riding on a high wave and sort of overconfident. Getting killed by Elsa with everybody else at the mansion (probably) dead completely reset his priorities which is now rescuing everybody. And once Subaru has set himself onto a goal he'll ignore everything around him and just dashes forward without really thinking (especially if it's a matter concerning life and death). This is actually fairly consistent with his past behaviour. Remember, this is the same guy that just scrapped his promise to Emilia to stay back and nurse his health without a second thought when her life was in danger back in S1.

[Frontier]

Originally Posted by Kakurin

I personally don't see this as surprising at all. When Subaru said this to Echidna he was riding on a high wave and sort of overconfident. Getting killed by Elsa with everybody else at the mansion (probably) dead completely reset his priorities which is now rescuing everybody. And once Subaru has set himself onto a goal he'll ignore everything around him and just dashes forward without really thinking (especially if it's a matter concerning life and death). This is actually fairly consistent with his past behaviour. Remember, this is the same guy that just scrapped his promise to Emilia to stay back and nurse his health without a second thought when her life was in danger back in S1.

I don't think he's really overconfident or disbelieving in Emilia so much as he just thinks he has a chance to solve the trial and save Emilia from the obvious pain confronting her past in the first Trial is causing her, but obviously Emilia takes it to mean he doesn't think she can cut it. If anything he was just trying to be practical about it.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Frontier

I don't think he's really overconfident or disbelieving in Emilia so much as he just thinks he has a chance to solve the trial and save Emilia from the obvious pain confronting her past in the first Trial is causing her, but obviously Emilia takes it to mean he doesn't think she can cut it. If anything he was just trying to be practical about it.

I think you misunderstood that part and mixed up a couple of scenes.

[Frontier]

Originally Posted by Kakurin

I think you misunderstood that part and mixed up a couple of scenes.

Well, that was just my takeaway from it. It definitely seems like Subaru is going to need to realize he has to focus on making sure Emilia passes the test and gets through whatever her trauma is .

[frubam]

Originally Posted by FlameSparkZ

Things aren't looking good for Subaru...how is he going to break the loop?
I assume he'll realize that returning to the mansion early is a bad idea, which means he has roughly two more days to somehow solve the issues at the Sanctuary, and deal with Elsa's attack.

It was clear how this was supposed to go after Emilia got disheartened that Subaru didn't have believed him. He's gotta help Emilia get through the trials, then make their way to the mansion with the entourage(Rem, Garfield, Roswaal[?], pink loli whose name escapes me) to help stop Elsa and whomever she might be working with... well maybe not Roswaal cause he's "injured", but that could also be his way to "test" the others.

Originally Posted by Kakurin

Going by the quite specific instructions that Elsa received, especially regarding timing the killings with Subaru's return, the most obvious suspect for her employer would be Roswaal. Not sure though how and when he managed to contact her, but there aren't any other people out there with both the knowledge and the motive for these instructions.

Its seems very possible it could be Roswaal; he felt extra suspicious after his confrontation with Subaru this episode, like he knew something, but then again, the VA always makes the chars he plays sound suspicious. Still, makes me wonder if the s1 beginning episodes also had him involved with the Elsa steal plot.

[Kanon]

We already knew Federica simply obeyed Roswaal's instructions when she gave Emilia the stone, so it was no surprise to get confirmation she's a good girl. She seems fairly strong, but you have to be more than strong to beat Elsa. I really wonder who's going to take her out.

It hurt to see Ram being willing to abandon Rem so readily. She understands she's her sister and she's not wrong about the type of person Rem is (though she's dead about where her loyalty lies), but the old Ram would have never thought of abandoning her.

I agree Roswaal is most likely Elsa's employer. Who else among the people we know could it be, really? And having it be a new character would be disappointing.

[Irenesharda]

An interesting episode.

I can definitely see why Subaru did what he did in regards to Emilia. He's now on a deadline and he knows that Emilia won't be able to conquer the test right away. He know he needs HEAVY help against Elsa. If he waits for Emilia to try a second time, it will be too late. So, he tried to do it early and thought he would get support from the others. However, the problem is that in the loop before, through his actions and helping Emilia and getting to know Garf, he was able to gain the man's trust, which he didn't do this time. This changes the dynamic, and so now Subaru doesn't have much support anymore.

We learn more about Fredricka and they get there a day or two early, but this just means that Elsa was watching the place and just adjusts it. And Elsa had to be hired by someone who knew Subaru was supposed to return at a certain time. But who would know Subaru would decide to leave with the villagers prior to Emilia completing the trial, AND could hire Elsa ahead of time? ALSO that person would have to know that Petra would decide to become a maid prior to Subaru leaving? All very interesting.

That ending was pretty intense, losing Ram, Petra, and Fredericka, all at once. And now Beatrice to.
So, how are they going to solve this? If Subaru comes ahead of time, it doesn't work. If he leaves on time, he's too late. And if he leaves late, say after Emilia finally solves the 3 trials, it will be WAY too late. So what can he do?

[Wandering Soul]

Roswell is clearly the most s uh suspicious person as to who could have hired Elsa. In fact come to think of it, we still don't know who hired Elsa to take Emilia's emblem the first time and that entire incident did lead to Subaru coming to the mansion.

You can't blame Ram considering she doesn't Rem, but it still hurts to see her dismiss Rem like that and even be willing to leave her to death.

[Frontier]

Originally Posted by Kanon

We already knew Federica simply obeyed Roswaal's instructions when she gave Emilia the stone, so it was no surprise to get confirmation she's a good girl. She seems fairly strong, but you have to be more than strong to beat Elsa. I really wonder who's going to take her out.

Brother/Sister tag-team with Frederica and Garfiel ?

It hurt to see Ram being willing to abandon Rem so readily. She understands she's her sister and she's not wrong about the type of person Rem is (though she's dead about where her loyalty lies), but the old Ram would have never thought of abandoning her.

You can definitely tell learning about Rem shook her up from that flashback of them in the room together, but she's still not quite sure how to deal with it .

I agree Roswaal is most likely Elsa's employer. Who else among the people we know could it be, really? And having it be a new character would be disappointing.

Man, he's really going through a roundabout way of giving Emilia and Subaru character development .

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

That ending was pretty intense, losing Ram, Petra, and Fredericka, all at once. And now Beatrice to.
So, how are they going to solve this? If Subaru comes ahead of time, it doesn't work. If he leaves on time, he's too late. And if he leaves late, say after Emilia finally solves the 3 trials, it will be WAY too late. So what can he do?

I think the only thing he can hope to do at this point is get to the root of Emilia's issues that's preventing her from getting through the first trial and trying to get through the rest as quickly as possible.

One way or another I have to imagine he'll still be involved with the other trials because I don't really see the series skipping what goes on during them.

[Applehell]

Originally Posted by Dextro

I mean it was pretty obvious from the get go that this was about to be a bad end loop for Subaru given what he said to Emilia. After that speech with Echidna saying she was going to be the one to pass the trials and not him I really don't see the story making him move forward by compromising on that belief. I'm actually surprised he did so so quickly. Did the adaptation cut out a loop or something?

Nope.

The episode even flashes back to what Garf said. The earlier loop and Emilia's suffering from repeated attempts of clearing the trial over he 4 days was having an effect on him. Its where having retroactively knowledge of the future can be such a double-edge sword

Another thing of interest here: it seems like wherever someone tries or touches a memory of event eased by Gluttony's authority they get these sudden headaches. . This basically seems be some sort of mechanism to disuse one for poking too much into contradictions in their memory

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Frontier

I think the only thing he can hope to do at this point is get to the root of Emilia's issues that's preventing her from getting through the first trial and trying to get through the rest as quickly as possible.

One way or another I have to imagine he'll still be involved with the other trials because I don't really see the series skipping what goes on during them.

My thing is, I don't think he has any time.

When he left the first time, it was after Emilia had failed a second time to beat trial 1. Even if she had passed the trial instead, she would still have to go through trials 2 and 3, which are trials he knows nothing about. So he can't help her with them. And even if he did, he wouldn't have time. Elsa would have come to the mansion and killed everyone by then. There's just not enough time.

Perhaps, what he could do is try to take the 2nd trial right after he respawns again? See if he can trigger it somehow? Another option is he could go to the mansion and demand that everyone leave immediately? (though that might not work if Elsa is watching the place.)

Other than that, the only other thing I can see happening is Beatrice gives him some key on how to solve this.