2004-11-05, 13:35
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Link #181 | |
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~Lost in the Moonlight~
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: WA State
Age: 51
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2004-11-05, 14:18
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Link #182 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: God forsaken middle of nowhere, Texas
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That really isnt appropriate to this discussion, and that definately is flaming. As to the taxes and grants; yes they are. Why do you think that state governments give corporations tax breaks and grants? Its to get them to come to the area or stay in the area, since that means jobs, which means tax revenue. |
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2004-11-05, 15:18
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Link #183 | |
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Raid-the-mods
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Sol System
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The Gov't needs to provide some incentive to have businesses to come back. The state finally gave grants and tax breaks to a lot of Pharms (Drug companies) and the economy is starting to pick up. Even though the overall B&O tax increase a little, the overall windfall was much larger. People had money and they spend it. Sales tax is collected = more money to gov't. Oh, FYI One Boeing 737 jet collects $800,000 in Sales and B&O tax. Boeing plants produces about 25-30 jets a year. (www.seattletimes.com). For every job that boeing loses, 4 jobs are lost. (UW study). Basically, Boeing supported 15% of WA state's overall economy. Boeing's avg earnings is about $13 billion. If Boeing stayed in WA, the tax windfall would be about $1.6 billion |
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2004-11-05, 15:31
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Link #184 | |
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Cantonese Dimples
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: North Jersey (near NY city)
Age: 46
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Please show me any part of my posts where I say taxes play NO role in the economy. I have never said that. Taxes do play a role in the economy but it doesn't CAUSE a bull or bear market. And I agree that taxes and grants are part of a the decision factor on how to run a business but to a very small to medium degree and it is rarely the ultimate deciding factor. Any company that depends on these grants or taxes to show a profit isn't exactly doing very well. Please read my #1 reason again more carefully. I said the President has LITTLE impact ~ some role, albeit small in my belief. So are you agreeing now that the tax cuts did have an effect on stabilizing the dot.com crash if you are using it as one of your arguments?
If anyone is blind it is you for not reading my post correctly... I have never said the President plays no role in the economy but I am not the type that hands out credit or blame on the President whenever something happens with the economy. We enjoyed 8 great years under Bill Clinton but does he deserve the credit for causing it? He entered into his presidency as the computer and internet craze started ~ he came in at the right time. And just before Clinton left, the cracks started to show and our economy went straight to the crapper as soon as Bush became President. He came in at a bad time. He threw out some tax cuts and signed a few laws and now we're suddenly rebounding back out of the "depression". Is it all because of Bush? Hell no! He helped out but it was mainly us. I was just arguing that if you are to blame Bush for things, make sure you blame him for the right things (WMDs for example). And if I've given credit to Bush about the economy, it's to defend Bush when it comes to the economy. So I'll kindly end my retort by saying you can't read very well and you don't know jack when it comes to our economy. Quote:
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2004-11-05, 21:25
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Link #188 |
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-=GIF Sennin=-
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Sonoran Desert
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Who knows how many thousands of votes were discarded and how many voters (excuse me, democrat voters) were barred from voting on bogus charges. Remember the 2000 election? People from Florida were barred from voting based on the charges that they were convicted felons. However, the main reason was that they shared the same first and last name of a convicted felon. MANY people were barred from the votes that year (51% being black).
I read an article in the newspaper that said that many computers were used to store more votes than they can handle, and that thousands of votes in each county were lost and the records cannot be recovered. As long as republicans such as George and Jeb Bush are in power, we will need to fix democracy in the USA before we start fixing it in other places in the world. People claim that George Bush is a good leader, a good leader would have more than 1/2 the country's support and NOT induce the greatest protests mankind has ever seen. Bin Laden thanked George Bush (on his most recent tape) for sitting still like an idiot in that classroom and gave his men much needed time to get that second plane in the second tower. Had George Bush acted sooner, one of the two towers might be standing today. But it was his own stupidity that rendered him frozen and unable to act. That is NOT what a strong leader does. I liked Ralph Nader's comment about George Bush describing him as "a big business in the disguise of a human" (or something to that degree). Bush has no morals and will do whatever it takes to stuff his coffins, whether that means sacrificing jobs/the american economy/american troops. I'll be trying to figure out for the next 4 years why anyone voted for him. 4 more years.... OF HELL!! |
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2004-11-05, 21:55
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Link #189 |
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Looks fun...Time to jump!
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Heres some post-war... I mean post-election news thats quite interestinghttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3987697.stm what do you think about this?
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2004-11-05, 22:02
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Link #190 | ||
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: China
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 Kind of silly for people to start thinking about immigrating when Bush's second term hasn't even started yet. No one outside his team really knows what he'll do, and absolutely no one knows what's going to happen over the next four years. What are people going to do? Move to Canada for 4 years and see if they will return afterwards? The U.S. will still tax its citizens no matter where they live; you just get a certain amount... free. Don't know the correct def for it. So they're still paying for the things that they don't like. Just suck it up and deal. There'll be other elections in which people can voice their opinions, and who knows, maybe the youth groups will actually vote in them. The articles that I've read mentioned that the expected turnout by the younger voters didn't happen like the Democrats had hoped, and they had over-estimated the direction that the Hispanic voters were leaning. Favorite quote in the article: Quote:
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2004-11-05, 23:27
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Link #192 | ||||||
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Let's look at the senario too. A group of terrorists hijack a PASSENGER AIRCRAFT and are heading toward the twin towers. And let's just "ASSUME" you know that they're comming in 2 hours. How would you react? 1. Send F-16's and shoot down the Aircraft, thereby saving the tower, but killing everyone inside the tower. By doing this, you'll be shot down with a wave of criticism, saying that you killed American lives. 2. Let the Aircraft smash into the tower. Thereby killing huge amounts of people, but you won't be accused of killing a bunch of your own people. 3. The scared passenger attempt to take back the plane. but you have no way to reach them Ideally, senario 3 is the best, that did happen. But only for 1 plane. Remember there was 4 different planes that were hijacked and flown at different places at once. Twin Towers, White House (Camp David), and the Pentagon. Quote:
The Unemployment rate AGAIN is 5.4%. FULL EMPLOYMENT is considered to be 5%. AND IT'S going down. The economy already been debated. Troops huh? Here's an interesting idea. We train soldiers for them to not fight? Only there to look good? Maybe they believe in fighting for Bush. Don't assume he's sacraficing them. "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country." - JFK Why did I vote for Bush? Here goes. If I voted for Nader I wouldn't be making much of a difference anyways. Kerry is a flip flopper. Kerry keeps attacking Bush and not his policy, that's not a good thing. Kerry doesnt' have a definite plan. He keeps claiming "I have a Plan..." Ok? So what? What's his plan already? - This one really determined it for me. Quote:
Idiot. Last edited by aahhsin; 2004-11-05 at 23:45. |
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2004-11-06, 00:43
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Link #194 | |
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It's bacon!
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Up and to the Left
Age: 43
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One of the most well known reasons is the tax hole that allows corporations to avoid much property tax by having manufacturing facilities over seas,.. in most cases, all their manufacturing facilities are over seas. That same hole also helps them to reduce corporate tax here as their product is being sold here cheaper. A lot of joint corporate relationships have been formed at this point. Those relations in China for example. When the products from China are sent here,.. first say the product cost $30, they already take profits for manufacturing and etc., we sell it here at about $20. Kind of looks like importing, only there's no import tax,.. or so I believe. It's seen as a good thing for both joint companies in their eye as both sides profit. Only, that money doesn't go to the big workers here in the domestic part. And as corporations pay less taxes, less money to the government,.. and last we are left with a drain on our currency as much money goes to China. It been a total mess through the WTO in similar ways, but we'll move on, Now, when business discover that their competitors are outsourcing to reduce the overall cost of their product or services, that business then decides to follow the same move as their competitors. You know this as you've stated some of that in part of #2. The businesses are outsourcing to compete with their competitors that have gone the way of the outsource. Now those people that have lost their jobs have now no choice but to seek out another job, usually on similar careers. But those jobs that they seek are also trying to compete with the outsourced companies. And those jobs have also made cuts,.. be that benefits, healthcare, and or weekly pay. Now even though the products and services have been made cheaper, domestic buying power has also went down. But as those workers here are making less money, they also pay less in taxes. Now get someone to plug the tax hole starting with the China syndrome. Maybe call them importers and charge them import tax. This will cause a lot of outsourced corps to crap their pants. First thing that they will likely do is to start moving manufacturing back here. Then the jobs return and everybody is happy. Only, investors in stock will be unhappy as their favorite corporation starts taking a nose dive. But this is where we'll need some tax relief, until those corps can get their stuff back together. Well, we don't have much room to give tax relief as, well, our national budget system would asplode as you already know where it is now. So something will need to be taxed more before the hole can be plugged. You say the president has little impact on the economy. He can impact it with taxes. I could probably at this point do a Bush as call the "no role in the economy" acquisition made by myself a " exaggeration", but I was probably wrong in saying it as that, and I'm sorry. But don't ever say that he has little impact on the economy. Plug the hole in the China Syndrome the president can do. That impact will be huge. "Taxes do play a role in the economy but it doesn't CAUSE a bull or bear market." I bet you more than anything that if I could tax the living crap out of every corporation, many times more than the democrats and much more sudden, I'm sure I could cause a bear market. Or I can try to cut taxes even further than Bush has already done, then watch our national budget asplode and cause a Bear market. We're talking about the good old days of the beginning of the American Industrial revolution. Recession In, recession Out, in, out... |
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2004-11-06, 01:38
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Link #195 | |
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It's bacon!
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Up and to the Left
Age: 43
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 But I just wanted a shot at this. Quote:
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2004-11-06, 01:47
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Link #196 |
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Weapon of Mass Discussion
 Fansubber
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: New York, USA
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Just to institute a point of reality into this single issue: When the first airplane hit the Twin Tower the initial response was not that there was a terrorist attack. As I recall it, pretty much everyone thought that this was a horrible accident. With this misconception it wouldn't matter that there were two hours to prepare for the second plane. Even if Bush had left the classroom at once, I doubt that it would have had even the slightest effect on the outcome of the second Twin Tower. It still would have been hit. It was only after the second impact that people were thinking it was an attack so there's no reason to start figuring out what he should have done to stop the second airplane. Osama only talked as if it might have made a difference because he wanted to belittle our president by pretending that he might have created a different outcome. It was pure propoganda.
With that said, my personal feeling is that when the tragedy happened, Bush should have forgone the photo op of chatting with little kids. Even if the only thing he could have done is to give a speech about the tragedy, it should have had priority.
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2004-11-06, 02:30
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Link #197 | |
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
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negotiations with a suicide bomber?? It's also not that easy to say. "ok we're not sure wat's going on, but shoot down a plane with several hundered INNOCENT ppl in it." i think by the time u figure out where the plane is going, it'll already be in a city.... especially since NY isnt a country state. i dont like bush (i dont like Kerry either), but it's kinda annoying how everyone loves to blame everything on him. Especially about the economy, because the bad economy is not the president's fault at all. President doesnt really control the US economy nearly as much as the Fed. (Federal Reserve) The recession we had was actually planned by Alan Greenspan and the Feds. If they believe that the inflation is too high they will slow down the economy to make inflation normal. During Clinton we had like 2% unemployment, which made the Feds nervous, this would mean HIGH inflation. US is best with a 5% unemployment. Raising the interest rate on stocks they succesfully crashed the market. Bush doesnt control the US money, Fed does. Didnt anyone take economy? agree, disagree? |
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2004-11-06, 03:06
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Link #198 | ||
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WAHA~
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: World overloaded with fun
Age: 39
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 My final comment (no sarcasm this time): no matter how much I disagree with Georgie's positions on most domestic issues, I can at least find relief that he has proven himself to be a capable leader for our country. The rest of the world were not very fond of us to begin with; our maverick invasion merely gave them an excuse to lash out their anti-American sentiment, so it's not like Georgie's decision all the suddenly pissed off our dear friends. As for the economy...it goes up and down, and though the invasion on Iraq did lead to an increase in national deficit and rise in oil cost, the impacts frankly are not as bad as I expected; there's no need to blame everything on him. Last edited by sarcasteak; 2004-11-06 at 03:31. |
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2004-11-06, 03:17
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Link #199 | |
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Aria Company
Join Date: Nov 2003
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I really don't see how anyone could support bush after he responded to kerry's critism that he took a dictator and replaced it with chaos, by saying " What's he's saying is he perfers the stability of a dictatorship to the freedom and stability of a democracy." There is no democracy in Iraq. What we have is anarchy. Before the war, there were few terrorists in Iraq, now there are thousands. So anyway, what's bush's plan for iraq? I really don't see any. You insist he has one, so maybe you could fill me in? I don't think 'stay the course' counts. I will end this with a quote from scott adams, "A strong leader is expected to maintain steadfast resolve in his opinion even if the environment changes or he gets new information. In any other context, that would be considered the first sign of a brain tumor. When presidents do it, it's called leadership, and frankly, we can't get enough of it."
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2004-11-06, 03:59
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Link #200 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: China
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I'm more interested in seeing more action, especially on the economics side, than just listening to, basically, sound bites on the news. People get over politics; there will be other elections. People don't get over the lack of, among others, food. Americans are also really big consumers when compared to everyone else. It'll be interesting to see if this can continue. If you will excuse me, though, "GS: D" is now starting. Cheers.
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