For 40+, who else is nearly done?

[Eisdrache]

You are dodging the question. Again.

The solution is to pay them a living wage.

[ArrowSmith]

By which method - government diktat? Seattle has tried that raising the minimum wage and it's destroyed the restaurant industry.

[Solace]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

What is your solution, democratic socialism?

My solution is that they should be paid enough to cover the average monthly expenses of rent/food/etc in the area they work. Negotiable, of course. There is no one perfect formula to be applied. It's just a matter of ensuring people aren't at risk of being dumped onto the streets.

You preach the free market, but the free market is speaking, and it's telling you that the current conditions are not sustainable long term and detrimental things are happening because of it. You can ignore that, claim people don't have the right to things, and feel better about it, and that's great. It's just not reality either.

[ArrowSmith]

Again, you keep insisting they need to be paid 'enough' w/o explaining how you would enforce it. I assume at the end of a government gun?

[Solace]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

Again, you keep insisting they need to be paid 'enough' w/o explaining how you would enforce it. I assume at the end of a government gun?

As opposed to the current corporate gun? It has to be enforced somehow.

[ArrowSmith]

Please tell how.

[Nivek von Beldo]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

By which method - government diktat? Seattle has tried that raising the minimum wage and it's destroyed the restaurant industry.

Yes and studies show that nope, even if mcdonals automatize, in other restaurants the employment stay the same

If higher wages means less anime, hope those remain benefit them

[ArrowSmith]

Yes, the reality is that anime studios will shutter and we'll get less anime. Hopefully better quality. What happens to those out of work animators? Well they can become Hikikomori or get a job stuffing vending machines. I know that sounds heartless, but nobody is entitled to their 'dream job'. You have to continuously earn it.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

Ask janitors whether they make enough money to 'live'. Life is unfair.

You may be stunned, but there are actually countries out there where a janitor not only makes enough money to live, but even makes enough to go on a vacation every now and then. Hell, there are even countries on the world that are at near full employment and everybody makes enough to live. In the end it is a distribution question. Nobody is entitled to pluck off nearly all profit just because he has "power". But then again, you are obviously American and in the USA might makes right.

[Guardian Enzo]

Janitors in Japan make considerably more than most animators, and for less hours. Not that I begrudge them being treated as human beings - that’s not the problem here.

[ArrowSmith]

Nothing is going to change in the animation industry as long as there is always the next wave of college graduates ready to perform slave labor.

[Eisdrache]

Unsurprisingly that's yet another line of argumentation.

Either way it's more accurate to say that there is a small number of people earning a significantly larger share of the profit because they are CEOs, managers or whatnot. This group can perfectly relinquish an amount in the billions with zero downsides to themselves. Of course they will be fighting every inch of any such proposal.

[ArrowSmith]

Such is life.

[Solace]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

Please tell how.

I think your topic has derailed enough.

[ArrowSmith]

Originally Posted by Solace

I think your topic has derailed enough.

Thanks, I'd like to steer it back to the crisis in the anime industry that has led to the low quality anime that is driving MY crisis.

[Forsaken_Infinity]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

What is your solution, democratic socialism?

For starters. We can do better than that, e.g., anarcho-syndicalism. But you are just parroting good old propaganda and I don't think you are engaging in this good faith. I very much doubt that you have read up on any of the alternatives to capitalism beyond cursory denouncements that is pervasive across mainstream media.

Why do you take this "market dictates your salary" as some god given gospel from up high? The goal of any society should be to take care of its members first. If an industry can't survive unless its employees are paid unlivable wages, it deserves to die.

This doesn't apply to just animators, it applies to everyone, janitors included. But what's stark with the animators is that theirs is actually a skilled labor, and crucial to their industry. They aren't exactly easily replaced either. But the "free market" is a lie and their wages are artificially strapped by pointing to tradition, passion, or whatever other bullshit as a defense.

The reality is that employees not being paid a livable wage is just a fucked up situation -- one that should automatically disqualify an ideology if you claim that such a situation is inevitable under it -- and an outcome of a lot of behind-the-back politicking and not due to any inherent property of an open market.

As I don't wish to continue the derailing, I will stop here but I implore you to read up on the history of socialism, especially in the US.

With regards to the ostensibly main topic of the thread, I have seen my share of anime but there's more than enough good anime that I haven't seen to keep me occupied for a long time if I were to actually try. I won't bother anymore though with most of them because good, or even very good, isn't good enough. My time is precious and my infatuation with anime, while still there in the back of my head, has to take a back seat to other pursuits. I am also too addicted to video games I guess :/

[Guardian Enzo]

It's funny, I was feeling a little bad about derailing the thread, then I realized the Ayn Rand poster was actually the OP and all the bad feelings went away.

Besides, I think this sidebar is quite relevant, because for a lot of us the quasi-slave labor practices in the industry are one of the big reasons it's harder to love it than it used to be.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

Thanks, I'd like to steer it back to the crisis in the anime industry that has led to the low quality anime that is driving MY crisis.

Such is life.

[Dawnstorm]

I'm nearing 50 now, and I don't have that problem. It's a bit of a turbulent time for anime production, with a trend of looking backwards to see what worked in the past, with rehashes and nostalgia titles, and I'm not sure if that's going to stay that way for a few years, or if that's just a re-orientation, a transitional period, but the trends grown stronger over the last frew years. This is not the best season (spring was easily the worst season of last year, too), but there are still shows I enjoy, like <i>Dororo</i>, <i>Mix</i>, <i>Hotroibocchi</i>, and <i>Senryu Shoujo</i>. As you'll probably see, I have no problem with highschool shows. Last season was pretty decent for me as well, with <i>Mob Psycho 100</i>, <i>Dororo</i> (again), <i>My Roommate is a Cat</i>, <i>Kaguya sama</i>, and <i>Endro~!</I>.


I've always enjoyed a large variety of shows, so I'm not usually much impacted by trends; I'll find something among the shows that are there. Masterpieces have always been rare anyway, and <i>Show Genroku Rakugo Shinju</i> isn't that long ago. I'm patient and versatile in my taste, so that's not a problem for me.


The only trend that might make me look for a new hobby is the 3D CGI. A show with significant CGI in it has to work a little harder to win me over, and if the the camera work triggers my motion sicknes it has to be <i>really</i> good. Naturally, I don't mind CGI I don't even notice (which, I imagine, is a lot of background stuff). [No amount of CGI is going to keep me away from shows like <i>Hi Score Girl</i>. It's no deal breaker.]


I do find myself dropping shows a lot quicker, and a few years back I deleted every entry in my MAL account by hand because I couldn't find out how to bulk-delete. I found keeping a list made me finish shows I didn't like, because I somehow disliked setting the status to "dropped". It's silly, but apparently that's how my mind works. I'm much happier watching anime, since I stopped keeping a list. I can get quite obsessive about hobbies, and it's easy to get stuck in a rut.


I'm certainly not nearly done with anime. I enjoy plenty in each season, even in weaker ones like the present one.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by ArrowSmith

Thanks, I'd like to steer it back to the crisis in the anime industry that has led to the low quality anime that is driving MY crisis.

I'd suggest being more selective and watching only a few shows each season might help with that.

I'm disappointed when there are only a handful of shows I might want to follow, but then I keep turning up hidden gems like That Time I Was Reincarnated as a Slime.

And I'm rewatching Shin Sekai Yori for the first time since 2012 and enjoying it more. It's easier dealing with the enormous amount of content about their world the second time around. Not to mention it's probably the most beautiful show I've seen from A-1 Pictures.