2008-10-02, 13:30 | Link #4041 | |||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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You write. Grey Knights are badasses not because of Kha's Church Knight khrack but because Ben Coulter writes badass. Medal of Honor winners are badass not because of the Medal, but because of their deeds. Quote:
To take another example, in my own mind, Franz has always been Crouching Pwn Puppy Hidden Badass, but the pwn puppy part is the one that sticks to the forefront. Why? Because I haven't written anything worthy of designation as badass. I intend to change that. And to do so, I will write. You can proclaim your charecter to be the greatest badass of the world. But if you don't show it, nobody will care.
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2008-10-02, 13:46 | Link #4042 |
He Who Smites Shippers
Join Date: Mar 2008
Age: 36
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Both of you misinterpret my usage of the Badass Normal label. To quote TV Tropes, a Badass Normal is "A character who might only be slightly less powerful or skilled than the rest of the cast, but notably has none of the fantastic enhancements, magic or special powers they do."
This has nothing to do with the classic Kamina/Archer/Chuck Norris/Bruce Lee definition of badass (which, I will readily and freely admit, must be earned by one's deeds), it just means (in this case) that the character doesn't have magic but can still fight on a level playing field with the main characters. If you need any proof at all of this, then take a look at the page itself; DBZ's Mr Satan and Ranma 1/2's Kuno Tatewaki, both of whom are joke characters in their respective franchises, are listed under the entry, despite being the absolute polar opposite of anything that could be considered badass in the classical sense. For that matter, I don't plan on trying to make Iris into a badass, at least not any more than the main cast are. If anyone is going to try for that title, it'll be Alex, who slips and has the occasional hotblooded moment every now and then. *EDIT* And just for the record, my title is a Makai Kingdom reference, not a self-applied label of badassery.
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Last edited by Comartemis; 2008-10-02 at 14:00. |
2008-10-02, 13:59 | Link #4043 |
Σ(。д°(o--(ಠ益ಠ )
Author
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hotsprings Resort
Age: 37
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You're putting too much emphasis on tropes and their interpetation.
Rather than giving a character tropes, let the tropes come to you. In other words, don't let your character be controlled by tropes. You limit things far too much if you follow a guideline, rather than let the character grow on its own. Tropes are not attributed to characters at the get-go. Rather, they are applied AFTER the character is introduced and seen in action. It's not up to the creator to designate a character "badass" -- that role is the responsibility of the audience. Rather, it is the duty of the creator to show it, prove it, tell the audience why this character should be a badass. Otherwise, despite the creator's intentions, the character will be labeled as something else. As Goose said, write it out. Don't just tell us this. We have no proof otherwise.
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2008-10-02, 14:03 | Link #4045 | |
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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I'd also dispute Iris being a Normal by Nanoverse standards, since, while she can't do magic, she does have other things to make up for it. Also, Badass Normals are still badass. And such things still need to be earned. There's a little rule of thumb when it comes to stories: show, not tell, Comar. You've been telling, but no showing. In fact all of this supposed badassery is really just an Informed Ability. Not as fun when the tropes come to bite you back, is it?
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Last edited by Wild Goose; 2008-10-02 at 14:15. |
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2008-10-02, 14:07 | Link #4046 | ||
He Who Smites Shippers
Join Date: Mar 2008
Age: 36
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2008-10-02, 14:23 | Link #4047 | |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Spoiler for Fate in a Striker:
Just as with Nanoha, magic is your friend when explaining how the heck they survive such impossible maneuvers/altitudes/impacts etc. If you can accept it from bathsuit wearing Fate, then just apply that same acceptance to Strike Witches. Seriously. Read these translated scans for some delicious background info on the various characters and settings (also shows that jet engines are already in design) that this world is filled with. After that, I can advice you to go to baka-tsuki and read the translations of the novels (all of the above was done by Selkirk, by the way). If, by then, you are still convinced that the world of Strike Witches is nothing more then fanservice filled junk, then Strike Witches probably isn't a show for you. Oh, and on a rather unrelated note, little Canadian pilot Wilma Bishop is claimed for both Strike Witches and Nanoha purposes. :3 |
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2008-10-02, 14:32 | Link #4048 | ||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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Shindo really SHOWED Mills being badass. That's the sort of standard I'm aiming for... Quote:
I'm aware of Ranma. I've been aware of it for ten years. As for Kuno, note what the Badass Normal page says about him: "For those who know the series, yes, it does hurt to call him badass[Emphasis mine - WG]. It just proves you can be badass and yet not be anything close to cool." Besides, Zengar is a bigger ham than either Kuno or Jeremiah. But he's cemented his position and reputation as a Badass and Crowning Moment of Awesome. So there.
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2008-10-02, 14:36 | Link #4049 | ||||
Loveable Jerk
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2008-10-02, 14:46 | Link #4051 |
NERV Personnel
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Let's just leave it at this: nicknames and titles are not given to oneself; they are earned and given by one's peers. Badass is a title and thus shall be given to a character should stories and shorts involving said character offer evidence to the readers that the character should be given the title of Badass. Simple. End of debate.
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2008-10-02, 14:59 | Link #4052 | |||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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tl;dr version: you've been wanting spoonfeeding and you've been talking big with nothing to show for it. Nobody really cares or listens, Comar. Stick to your TV Tropes if you want. Us, we're gonna write. TV Tropes is not the end all be all. It is not a replacement for planning. It is not a replacement for suitability. It is not a replacement for "Show, not tell." Show, not tell. Even TV Tropes says that. A pity that for all your obsequeince to it you don't seem to have grasped the lesson from that site - or rather, you selectively apply what you learn there. Well, I guess we'll just havta come back in our next lives to check if there's any progress, or if Alex remains vaporware.
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Last edited by Wild Goose; 2008-10-02 at 15:13. |
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2008-10-02, 15:10 | Link #4053 | ||
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Ayup, all we got going for Wilma so far is that small block of text, there's an awesome story waiting to be written there. And just think of the possibilities for crossing over these two series. |
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2008-10-02, 15:16 | Link #4054 | ||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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2008-10-02, 15:22 | Link #4055 |
He Who Smites Shippers
Join Date: Mar 2008
Age: 36
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In the interest of avoiding a flamewar or further poisoning the tone of the thread, I'm going to ignore everything you just said and go on about my business.
But just for the record: I have never insisted that Alex was a badass, and I HAVE written a few snippets here and there whether you've noticed them or not, perhaps not so many as the great and mighty "author" Wild Goose or Tempest or Keroko, but I've written a few things. Apparently you're so awesome and wonderful that you didn't deign to look at the works of a lesser writer. As for changing things, you said yourself that Franz went through something like 50 drafts before you finally got around to making him, so complaining about me changing Alex's concept is hypocrisy, pure and simple. Asking for assistance with a character or a concept is not the same as asking people to do the work for me (which I have not done EVER in my time here), and for your information I AM the aggrieved party here, Goose. You are the one, as usual, who insists on being rude and antagonistic for no readily apparent reason. Whatever Goose. Respond to this however you like, I've filled my "pissing match with Goose" quota for this week.
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2008-10-02, 15:49 | Link #4056 | |
RUN, YOU FOOLS!
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Formerly Iwakawa base and Chaldea. Now Teyvat, the Astral Express & the Outpost
Age: 44
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2008-10-02, 16:00 | Link #4058 |
OC Belka Scriptor
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Germany
Age: 40
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Man... where did you get all your knowladge about strike witches?
I only know what I know from the anime, the manga till chapter 4 and the first 2 chapters of the first novel. (in other words, everything I found translated on the web.) Maybe I should hang around in the SW thread more often. xD
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2008-10-02, 16:21 | Link #4059 | |||||||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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On snippets: the only ones I can recall of the top of my head that you wrote involved Yuuno, and the other was some introspection/introduction by Alex. And in all brutal honesty, if I have to chose between sleep and reading anyone's stuff here, I'll chose sleep. This is the first time in a long time I've been able to have downtime and read on the internet. Tell ya what: prove yourself. Repost links to your little snippets. If you've got them, then put up and I'll give them another look. But it's not just me saying that you gotta write and show Alex being a badass. Sure, if it was just me, you might have a point, but everyone is telling you to write. What does that tell you? (Incidentally, I am an author in real life. I've written a number of articles that have been published in the newspaper, as well as official reports and writeups. So there. ) Quote:
Franz's evolution has been a gradual process building up and emphasising and de-emphasising aspects of the character. Yours is more "wank concept of the week". (Which is not my words and comes from IRC, but is a rather apt description, IMO.) Quote:
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I'm not sure how this counts as being rude and antagonistic. Also, while you may be feeling aggrieved, I am feeling annoyed and irritated with how you always keep raising blast doors and ignoring whatever I try to say, refusing even to consider that myself, and everyone else who's tried to talk to you, may have a point. You want us to listen to you - but you'll only listen to us when it suits you. Just like your beloved TV Tropes, which you only use when it suits you. Quote:
Besides, while you see this as a pissing match, I see this as spirited debate ...although it means that it's now 5.23AM and I need to wake up at 7.00 am... According to turmoil, you need to sleep more than 4 hours a night. 4 or less, and you will go insane....
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2008-10-02, 16:24 | Link #4060 | ||||
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Considering Wilma's personality is up for grabs, yes, yes we can. I personally imagine her to be a very caring older sister. Random hugs should be commonplace, and would serve to embarrass the shy Lynette.
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As for me, I'm a sponge for knowledge on series I take a particular liking to, and read every itty bitty detail of info I can possibly get my hands on. I scour image boards and blogs for new info and read what is translated to excruciating detail. For example, the character chart has far more info then which girl wears what panty, if you look at it more closely. |
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hayaurion, kaonland, keroland, khrack, original content |
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