2012-06-30, 20:05 | Link #61 | |||||||||
reading #hikaributts
Join Date: Feb 2009
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Anyways some arguments of mine against some of your previous posts (while i am pretty sure they are similar to others) Quote:
As for more accesibility, before the industral revolution many things that we consider normal now were luxury goods that only the royality and the rich could afford. Quote:
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"Pharmaceutical companies could not exist without some guarantee that they can recoup the cost of developing a new product." Quote:
As for your 2nd part of that quote about companies and inventors, what does this even have to do with copyright or patents? The inventors themselves do get credit for their inventions. Last edited by hyl; 2012-06-30 at 20:17. |
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2012-06-30, 21:02 | Link #62 | ||||||||
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
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99% of fanfics are crap, but there are some really good ones that I would buy if they were on sale. Also, if people buy good fanfics, we might get more good fanfics since there would be more incentive for people who aren't obsessed 14 year old fangirls to write them. Quote:
I would hope most of the people here see nothing wrong with that, since they are either the sucker paying, or the people taking for free. Since that seems to be the way late night anime is funded. Quote:
I want stuff to be free. That is very different from wanting stuff for free. If I wanted free food, I would line up at a soup kitchen and steal from the poor. If I wanted food to be free, I would be giving money to said soup kitchen so they can feed those who can't afford food. Likewise, I'm willing to pay more for entertainment so everyone can enjoy it. Quote:
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2012-06-30, 22:15 | Link #63 | ||
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
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In fact, it seems you are totally oblivious to the what the question actually is. Artists and creators must be paid for their work. Innovations are founded on motivation, not thin air. It does not just "happen". Your stance is completely from a stance of a leecher, founded in fantasy of "I am entitled to get things for free at others expense", instead of being grounded in actual reality. I'm still waiting for you to give an answer, not a random gibberish. And one more thing. I have repeatedly said, the current system is less than ideal, and needs work. None of us, not one person in the entire conversation is claiming that current system is perfect. The patient and copyright laws should change and improve, but there MUST be a law to protect the creators for progress to happen. In whatever form it maybe, otherwise the volume of motivations will severly diminish. Patient laws were made in the first place to guarantee one's trade secret will not be wasted, and will be secured. This is furthur proof that YOU are the one refusing to read and understand the subject at hand, not everyone else. Quote:
It'll limit the amount of creation to nearly nothingness, and sheer number of innovations will come to a halt. Malkuth is somehow convinced that the past century was century of hell, and previous centuries were paradise of innovation. When in fact, the past centuries was the biggest surge in innovations and advancement in entire human history.
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Last edited by aohige; 2012-06-30 at 22:33. |
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2012-06-30, 22:35 | Link #65 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
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Instead of actually answering the question, just lebel the other side as trolls, and pretend you win the argument. Very mature, Malkuth. Reddit level. I'm out, as you wish. Anh and hyl can carry on.
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2012-06-30, 22:47 | Link #66 |
Banned
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Whatever... write ONE argument to support your opinion, and I will reconsider discussing it (I can even agree with you if you can justify your opinion, instead of just stating it), but you just prefer staying outside the fray, conveniently labeling in safety and convenience, instead of supporting "your" opinion and decorating with degrading adjective everyone who disagrees.
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2012-06-30, 22:52 | Link #67 | ||
( ಠ_ಠ)
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
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How about the reason why artists need to get paid, why patient laws were made in the first place, and why the laws must be there to protect creations? Or the facts I have posted, such as lack of protection during the darker ages, the advancement of progress during the past centries, etc? Those are not argument to you, right? They're just mere letters on the screen that does not do "your argument" very good, therefore should be dismissed right? Quote:
What you decided to do here is basically "passive-aggressive". An act to pretend you are being victimized and bullied, to justify your own agression. I'm actually quite appalled at this, and as you wish, I'll be gone. You're not worth it.
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2012-06-30, 22:59 | Link #68 |
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WTF, have you ever discussed in your life? Discussing is not about winning, but learning from someone who does not share your opinion!
Also everything you mentioned, I have addressed already, go back read and try to think about what I wrote... if my expression using the english language sucks so much, you can still ask for a clarification... I will in good-will try to help. As for your personal references, dunno... I have no clue what you wish to imply, so I'd rather leave it there. Suffice to say, if you feel that I feel victimized, that's your understanding... definitely not mine, unless you can read my thoughts too Now can you skip the off-topic sarcasm, and personal stuff, and try to stick to the subject? |
2012-06-30, 23:15 | Link #69 | |
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
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Actually, I'm relatively happy with the patent system. Apart from a lot of patent trolling/etc, and restricting technologies from going to poorer countries, it does its job relatively well. Reform is needed, but not as major as what copyright, especially in the US, needs.
Copyright on the other hand, is working against the creation of more cultural goods. It needs major-ass reform. Anything short of nuking it from orbit and starting over is a band aid that will quickly fall off. Quote:
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2012-06-30, 23:24 | Link #70 | |
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Oh! wait it gets better, have you even considered if some wise-ass had patented printing press, surgical operations, the human genome, alphabets, spoken languages, lightning fire Not dark ages, but pretty much the end of civilization would be at hand if such idiocy was supported earlier in human history and prehistory |
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2012-06-30, 23:30 | Link #71 | |
1.048596
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Location?
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Having a patron fund art is extremely limiting. This is due to the fact that it requires a patron wealthy enough to fund what is needed for creation of art/innovation, caring enough about what is produced to fund it, and accessible enough by the creator to have the patron fund the project. Each one of these is a large limitation on what the creator can produce.
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2012-06-30, 23:41 | Link #72 |
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A certain Leo operated under that system, when innovation was not subject to commercialization, and we all know how all his inventions worked five to ten centuries afterwards... at least some then holy roman occupied decadent italian dukes did not claim intellectual ownership to his worthless fantasies because they paid for his food and lodging
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2012-06-30, 23:53 | Link #73 |
Senior Member
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Nice to see this old thread I started get bumped like this, and really take off.
After giving it some thought, my views are similar to Random32's. Patents are important because they ensure that creators/inventors can sell their creations without having to worry about unscrupulous people taking their ideas/inventions/content and trying to sell it themselves. This, of course, is necessary in order for creators/inventors to feel that their creative pursuits are worthwhile. Patents serve a frankly necessary motivating factor. The problem is copyright. The problem is that copyright goes beyond a truly legitimate financial concern - It doesn't just fight bootleggers (people profiting from breaking copyright). I think that, eventually, society is going to have to accept that for anything that can be digitized, it is going to be widely copied and disseminated for free, if people are interested in it at all. Trying to legally crack down on that will either be a fool's errand, or result in a draconian solution that's worse than "the problem" itself. So for all intents and purposes, I think that copyright law should not apply to the internet (or only apply in the most egregious of circumstances - certainly not for a mere AMV on YouTube, say). I honestly think that the anime model might be the way of the future here - Sell this digitized content in something tangible, make it into a "Collector's Item", and pitch it that way. The most hardcore fans may well go for this, as is the case with many otakus in Japan.
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2012-07-01, 05:10 | Link #74 | ||||||||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Now, if you have an idea for a project (let's say a movie), you have to pitch it to professionals. They're not infallible, but at least it's their day-job. They can conceivably spend more than a minute to think it through. You want to replace them with netizens and our notoriously short attention span. That will obfuscate the differences between a "movie idea" that's a 100-word blurb, and a "movie idea" that's a complete script just waiting for a few rewrite. And god there will be a lot of 100-word blurbs to compete against. That means, in turn, that the only things that'll stand out will be the ones that can be explained and strike a chord with just a few keywords. In other words, prequel, sequels, and adaptations (like we don't already have enough of those). Oh, and things with big name stars, but you'll have to pitch it to them first. So you'll be able to pitch "Justin Bieber, (Twilight-)Vampire Hunter" (... now I kinda want to see it done...), but you won't be able to pitch a self-contained movie on its own merits. Quote:
Besides, that will still shrink the amount of available money. While there are "people who want to make money" galore, charity's much less common. Not to mention, there are other causes. Quote:
I won't argue that the copyright system isn't abused and couldn't stand some heavy reform. Heck, I wouldn't be against some kind of global license (if we have some way to track downloads so the money is shared equitably and success is rewarded) funded by taxes. (And in case someone's as quick to jump to conclusions as I am , I'm not poor enough to not pay taxes.) Last edited by Anh_Minh; 2012-07-01 at 07:42. |
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2012-07-01, 07:27 | Link #75 | |
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Simply put, I think that a well-managed entertainment industry can find ways to be successful while coping with widespread internet piracy . The reason I say that is that the anime industry has found a way to do it, and it's far from inexpensive to create anime. The problem I have with copyright restrictions is that it's main impact on the internet is being just one, big, annoying killjoy that probably doesn't earn a penny for professional creators in the processing of being that. Let me give you a good example of that - The famous "Yu-Gi-Oh Abridged" series by LittleKuriboh. This was insanely popular on YouTube, and I also enjoyed watching it. But then YouTube started deleting it like crazy, all because of copyright infringement. "Yu-Gi-Oh Abridged" shortened Yu-Gi-Oh episodes, and redid (most) of the lines to basically spoof the show and have some fun at its absurdities. But it wasn't a mean-spirited thing; it was clearly a labor of love done by a fan of the show. Now, do you really think that Yu-Gi-Oh Abridged was hurting DVD sales for Yu-Gi-Oh? If anything, it was renewing some people's interest in the show. The problem with modern copyright law is that, in application, it's like a big, dumb, messy bomb that causes a lot of collateral damage. It frequently, if not typically, causes more harm than good. Fans should be able to freely make and share AMVs on any website that has the functionality in place to do this (including YouTube). Fans should be able to freely write fanfiction and share it on any website that is set up (in whole or in part) for the dissemination of fanfiction. And original TV airing anime episodes are in large part just advertisements anyway - How can it be bad for an advertisement to gain a wider audience? These things are good for various entertainment franchises. If anything, they add to their fame and popularity. The anime and manga industry is a great example of this, where derivative fanworks (particularly in the form of doujins) are absolutely huge in Japan. But this doesn't seem to be hurting those two industries. If anything, it seems to be helping them.
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2012-07-01, 07:47 | Link #76 | |
reading #hikaributts
Join Date: Feb 2009
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As for parodies, they shouldn't fall under the copyright law as long as it's fair use. |
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2012-07-01, 07:58 | Link #77 | |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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That said, the problems you've raised aren't problems with the principles of copyright (that creators can control the reproduction of their work and thus sell the rights) but in its translation into actual laws and in the use of said laws. I don't find it that worrying, though. Those who use the Internet the best will eventually gain an advantage. And while I can see that the greater visibility brought by fanwork would be an advantage, I can also see that having TV broadcasts (and DVDs) compete against internet streaming where all the ad revenue goes to Google instead of the production companies would hurt the latter's bottom line. It's not really a simple, all or nothing problem, and any solution would have... collateral damage. |
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2012-07-04, 16:34 | Link #78 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
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European Parliament Kills Global Anti-Piracy Accord:
"The European Parliament on Wednesday declared its independence from a global anti-piracy accord, rejecting the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement. The vote, 478-39, means the deal won’t come into effect in European Union-member nations, and effectively means the global accord is dead." See: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/07/eu-kills-acta/ |
2012-07-04, 16:37 | Link #79 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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2012-07-04, 17:46 | Link #80 |
formerly ogon bat
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Mexico
Age: 53
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"However, despite this apparent victory for the Internet, transparency and democracy, the Commission indicated that it will press ahead with the court reference, and if the Court doesn't reject ACTA as well, will consider bringing it back before the Parliament."
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