2009-08-12, 13:40 | Link #1861 | |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Michigan
|
Quote:
Ever heard the saying "common sense ain't that common"? or "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." ? What seems like common sense to you may not to another. Sense you don't know what Ranka was thinking or what she knew or suspected (none of us do), how can you judge her so harshly? Hmm, no one else behaved stupidly in MF. Let me get back to you on that one... Ok I'm back. Picking a fight with a cyborg as a normal human being may qualify. |
|
2009-08-12, 15:02 | Link #1862 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
As for the countermeasures by NUNS, Ranka did not know of them when she left, therefore her actions remain deeply irresponsible. It can maybe be argued that if Ranka hadnīt come along and when Sheryl would have entered the terminal, then she would have been used, but I think the execution of that would have been up to debate. As for responsibility, yes, I think there is some for Ranka. Not to the extent of indicting her on criminal charges or the like, but enough that it would have been very nice of the show to acknowledge it, instead of letting her completely off the hook. Because in many cases we do know what she was thinking.
__________________
Last edited by magnuskn; 2009-08-12 at 15:40. Reason: Grammar |
||||
2009-08-12, 15:24 | Link #1863 | |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
Furthermore, Banana did not force her to go, in fact, he was very willing to do whatever she desired and it was her desire to leave, not his. So I have no idea where you get the notion that it was Banana's decision to leave. - Tak
__________________
|
|
2009-08-12, 16:08 | Link #1864 | |||||||
Lovestruck Fool
Fansubber
Join Date: Jan 2006
|
Quote:
From the standpoint of the timeline, it's certainly possible that on further reflection, Ranka decided on this broader ideal of forging peace between the two species. But even still, the audience is left out of the loop as to how this transition came about. Quote:
Quote:
The keyword is "change", whether it appears to be for the better or for the worse (from our individual frames of reference). Given that "coming of age" stories are so popular, these changes are often along the lines of "self-improvement" as societal norms dictate. But characters don't necessarily need to be written that way to be dynamic. Quote:
In episode twenty-one, Alto tells her that he'll defend the spot where she'll sing and takes off, at which point Brera tells Ranka that she doesn't have to sing if she doesn't want to. Here too she breaks down - these are words that she would have really needed to hear from Alto. The primary rift between the two, as far as Ranka is concerned, is that she sees her role in protecting Frontier as intertwined with her relationship with Alto, whereas Alto sees the two as being distinct. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I'm sure Snow intended it the same way. |
|||||||
2009-08-12, 16:14 | Link #1865 | ||||||
Professional Lurker
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NS, Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I didn't mean to imply that it was Brera's idea to leave, only that he was asked to leave and decided to leave. Ranka wasn't holding a gun to his head and forcing him to leave, ergo he has just as much responsibility for leaving. If Brera had been forced, then yes, blame lies entirely with whoever applied the force. Like I said, my fault for not finishing my thought there, sorry. Quote:
Quote:
This depends on whether or not she was actually guilty of anything. Looking at everything that happened, I don't think she was any more responsible for events than any of the other protagonists. She had her failings, sure, but at least one other character played a similar role. Sometimes it seems as though Ranka is judged by different standards than any of the other main characters. Last edited by Snowblind; 2009-08-12 at 16:18. Reason: quote fixing |
||||||
2009-08-12, 16:20 | Link #1866 | |||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I certainly believe that the vast mayority of characters in Macross Frontier overcame their own limitations. Ranka stands out as the one who did not advance very far. Quote:
Quote:
Of course weīll never know what would have happened if Ranka would have continued to be happy for some more weeks... would the young Vajra been discovered and the situation handled in a better way? Letīs just say that even Grace was surprised. Well, Ozma had extenuating circunstances as a defense. Ranka did not have to fear that a hit squad from Leon would come after her. Quote:
Quote:
__________________
|
|||||||
2009-08-12, 16:33 | Link #1867 | |||
Nyaa~
Join Date: Mar 2009
Age: 35
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Last edited by Foreshadow; 2009-08-12 at 16:47. |
|||
2009-08-12, 19:12 | Link #1868 | ||||
Professional Lurker
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NS, Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
(*Disclaimer: 'Ehhhhh?' is in no way meant to be hostile. It's an expression of puzzlement only. ) I don't really think that's a fair analogy. When you're basically told that you're the only one who can help - but no one is really sure how you're helping - then being unsure and making mistakes along the way are par for the course. So she's blamed for wanting to help, and then blamed for not helping when she's in no condition to help, and then blamed again for trying to suck it up and help... Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't, damned if she does... again? O.o |
||||
2009-08-12, 20:01 | Link #1869 | |||
Nyaa~
Join Date: Mar 2009
Age: 35
|
Quote:
Quote:
Of course none of the characters are perfect. Where is anybody saying that they are? The difference between the other characters and Ranka are, They Grew, Ranka continued to get Bailed out time after time. I don't think Ranka ever got blamed for taking Brera away. No one really cares about him on Frontier anyway. Macross quarter went to get Information on the Vajra and Grace so that it could benefit the entire fleet. Ranka left to bring Ai kun back to the Vajra. Not quite the same thing. Read the rest of the thread if you want responses to those bullet points, They've definitely been addressed before. (Better then I can anyway) So your basically blaming people who had to urge Ranka into her duty for trying to get her to do the responsibilities she accepted. - Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the Fairy Project deemed a failure anyway? Quote:
100% of that post was in the thread already. Read that if you want other points of view. I felt that I should respond because you put the effort in to respond to me. If that came across as Mean, sorry, I have a migraine now though. I'm going to go law down. Last edited by Foreshadow; 2009-08-22 at 00:26. |
|||
2009-08-12, 20:20 | Link #1870 | |||||
Professional Lurker
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NS, Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Thanks for taking the time. Hope you're feeling better soon. Last edited by Snowblind; 2009-08-12 at 20:22. Reason: Removed point to reduce length |
|||||
2009-08-12, 20:24 | Link #1871 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Earth
|
Damn you beat me by a sec Snowblind ...I was going to say the same thing to Foreshadow's post...it's hard to argue in here...it's like there are two different Rankas in the series...it's really hard to discuss when both sides can't even agree with what the character is doing in the series
__________________
|
2009-08-12, 20:39 | Link #1872 | ||
Alto x Ranka :)
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New York City
|
Quote:
Quote:
The reason for Ranka not telling Alto could very well be because Brera cut her off before she could finish since he then stated that he would be the one to take her, Ranka really wanted Alto to take her so she felt it was the only choice at that moment. Ranka also said that she wanted to at least take Ai back to his home, meaning that there was another reason (most likely being her desire to bring peace) and also her understanding of the danger behind this task.
__________________
Last edited by DeX-kun; 2009-08-12 at 20:54. |
||
2009-08-12, 20:50 | Link #1873 |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
*Clears throat*
~ 神様に恋をしてた頃は こんな別れが来るとは思ってなかったよ It’s long long good-bye さよなら さよなら 何度だって 自分に 無上に 言い聞かせて 手を振るのは優しさだよね? 今 強さが欲しい 貴方に出逢い STAR輝いて アタシが生まれて 愛すればこそ iあればこそ もう二度と離さないで 捕まえてて ひとりじゃないと 囁いてほしい planet… ~ - Tak (Make peace now... unless you want to see my rendition of Anata no Oto...)
__________________
|
2009-08-12, 20:57 | Link #1874 | |
Alto x Ranka :)
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New York City
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2009-08-12, 20:58 | Link #1875 |
A blast from the past
Artist
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Fortaleza-CE, Brazil
Age: 46
|
I can't believe some people actually think the Quarter crew deserting was actually alright. Did it produce results? Sure. Was it okay? No way, José... What Wylder did, calling Leon out, could have easily been done before - they did not come back with a smoking gun they didn't have before, after all.
Just thought to point that out, as the Ranka discussion seems to be going around in circles, again...
__________________
|
|
|