Ok realdeal. I flamed you to death. I was wrong. Let's get back to the topic now shall we?
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Originally Posted by realdeal
And no what your saying is irelevant, the anime clearly show sasuke looking at him, gai was simply too fast his eye could not follow him, thats what disapearing speed in animes are like. Its simmilar to suijiro situation. And no, kenshin has never been on the other side of the room, watch him and suddenly his behind them..his speed is not that great. His portrayed slightly more human like. If you recall that gattling gun scene, 4 peeps died there..kenshin needed help for diversion because he obviously was not fast enuff. That right there is a true measure of his speed. God-like is an expression btw, they dont necesarily mean his speed is god-like.
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Counter argument:
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Originally Posted by EbonySeraphim
If you have watched all of the Kenshin series (or much of it at all), you would know that numberous times, Kenshin has done the exact same thing. Especially in the early episodes, where you see Kenshin taking out 40 guys before any of them could even make a move on him. At the same time, when dealing with someone like Soujiro, we see that Kenshin is "grounded" while Soujiro is doing the dissappearing. All that is showing is that Soujiro is faster than Kenshin - or else you would wonder "why isn't Kenshin disappearing too!!!" Disappearing is a relative thing between two characters where the speed difference is something that should matter - and you cannot compare them in these two anime.
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Regardless of whether or not there is an example of Kenshin not showing "disappear" speed, he has been shown to have it. Jin-E vs Kenshin, from a distance of probably 5 meters (greater than 15 ft away), Kenshin nailed Jin-E in the nose after disappearing from his original spot. Vs Senkaku in the Shishio arc, Kenshin did nothing but "disappear" while Senkaku was unable to hit him. Vs Toma using the Shiden no Tachi (Shiden blade), in one of the fights Kenshin dissappeared around Toma to dodge an attack. Vs Ginjo Kenshin again, did the dissappearing act. Soujiro vs Kenshin - Amakaru Ryu no Hirameki vs Shun-Ten-Tatsu, Kenshin and Soujiro both disappeared. Regardless of instances where he didn't show or use this speed, Kenshin is capable of doing it. There are times I can point out when Jounin like Kakashi and Asuma didn't disappear, that doesn't mean they are capable of displaying such speed. I also extend that aguments with the notion that disappearing is disappearing, there is no saying what speed is faster than another when the time to get from point A to point B is zero. It cannot be judged.
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Originally Posted by realdeal
2ndly, i dunno why ppl like you get upset or try so hard to back up kenshin superiority over other characters. Im a huge kenshin fan, infact its my favourite anime of all time, however I cant dispute the fact that naruto characters are made stronger than kenshin, just like dbz characters are made stronger than naruto.
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Addressed already here:
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Originally Posted by EbonySeraphim
I hope I'm not completely coming off as someone who think's Kenshin (or characters in his anime) would completely own Naruto characters. The problem I see is that there are so many gimmicks in Naruto that make fans of it (all members here) so prone to using their imaginations, that pitting anything against Naruto characters, would result in the other side being "worse." I just want to "settle the bias" and have it known that you can't compare two different anime characters in the way that realdeal is going about it. It really shouldn't be compared at all because both entities are imagined, and both worlds have different limitations on the beings that exist in them.
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And again here if you read the post addressed to Shadamehr:
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Originally Posted by EbonySeraphim
Shadamehr: You missed my point a bit. I didn't necessarily mean to say that Naruto's world and Kenshin's world are equal in power but they show it differently. It is obvious that some involve much higher scales in terms of power than others. What I was saying is that, to compare characters in one to others fairly, it is quite easy to say a character from a more powerful world, would win over the one in a weaker one. But what kind of discussion is that? Who cares to "discuss" the fact that a gundam would easily beat a measily fly? I'm trying to say that in order to discuss the powerlevels of the characters in an "interesting and fair" manner, you should scale the worlds of each anime to put them on par with each other.
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And for kicks I also talked about it earlier on page 3:
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Originally Posted by EbonySeraphim
Do you have to conform to my "scale"? Of course not. I'm just saying that if you want to compare two fighters between the two series in any kind of fair way, you would have to do something that scales power in each series, or else it is ridiculous. You might as well be matching up Pokemon to Naruto characters. The relationship between the swords in Naruto and Kenshin is weak to nothing.
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You also said:
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Originally Posted by realdeal
I seriously doubt kenshin can beat 1000naruto. You say 13yr old boy..well hes no ordinary 13yr old boy, i mean yahiko maybe but naruto jumps from trees to trees, do mad spinning crap in the air, and when kyubified, fast. No to mention this guy is probably alot stronger than kenshin too..breaking ground just by running..and be able to dig a hole in the ground and still do an uppercut out through the ground. Kenshin cant even do that, lol. Maybe kenshin is twice faster than he is when hes kyubi..but 1000 coming after him? c'mon, like i said have 100 jump on top of him like in mizuchi and zabuza case and he wont be able to get up, lol.
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Matched up with this part already said:
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Originally Posted by EbonySeraphim
Point number two[still to realdeal] - how could Kenshin not beat 1000 13-year-old boys? Err...he moves faster than all of them, knows what all of them are going to try to do, evades all of them, and takes them out one by one - that is one way. Another could be the fact that all 1000 of them cannot be right next to him at the same moment, so he only has to deal with a group of at most 10 at a time that are near him anyways.
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The first part of what I said may need to be explained a bit. In the series it is known that one of Kenshin's battle abilities is reading moves like the Sharingan does. Kenshin has a foresight that is based off of his experience and he knows what attacks are being thrown that aren't serious, and knows what to expect what in general. As far as being faster than all of them - unless you argue that Naruto clones have "disappear" speed, it should be clear that Kenshin is shown to be faster. [Note that I said Naruto clones - singular Naruto has "disappeared" once.] Kenshin also is definitely capable and shown to evade much faster attacks then anything Naruto has been shown to deliver. I don't think evasion would be much of a problem, even coming from a large group of them. The last part about only dealing with a group of 10 of them at the same time should be pretty self explanatory. If there are 50 of you vs 1 guy, there is no way all 50 could attack all at once. You would get in the way of yoruself. Only a small group could be an immediate threat.
Keep in mind that the above arguments don't consider any possible "plans" Naruto would try to concoct. If clones distract him while one does something "sneaky" it is obviously a more serious attack that would require elevated ability to dodge, defend, or anticipate. Claiming that Kenshin would loose to such a thing would basically just be a matter of your opinion on if he is capable of doing so[dodge/anticipate/defend] or not. I personally believe Kenshin could probably evade, anticipate, or defend against a lot of plans Naruto would come up with. I'm sure anyone fighting on Naruto's side would think the exact opposite. Of course, I didn't even bring up any of Kenshin's abilities that would lead to him to possibly winning a fight since I only addressed Kenshin defending Naruto clones.
Because I don't think I have plainly stated this, I'll go ahead and say it now: It is clear that the Naruto world is balanced higher than Kenshin. Characters are made to do more inhuman things in terms of strength, speed, and defense. On that basis is it obvious that Kenshin characters wouldn't stand much of a chance in Naruto's world with no "translations" of abilites that exist in both worlds. The way they "explain" things happening in Naruto are inhuman abilities, Kenshin keeps it relatively human. There is no real contest there. [Actually, I do think I said that but in many more words in my first posts of this thread]
2004-05-11, 22:04
