AnimeSuki Forums

Seitsuki · 2012-05-12, 05:15

Native born ;-;

Even my imouto who went back for a few years can read/write better than me..

Flere821 · 2012-05-12, 05:33

On a side note... I think I can safely say I'm mostly fine with names now, after going back to some illustrations and looking up at the list of people ^^; Let the discussion flow

Spoiler for pics with names:

tsunade666 · 2012-05-12, 07:01

the names aren't translated -_- aren't those the one in the 9 school arc? or what ever the name is the arc.

Kleeyook · 2012-05-12, 08:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flere821

On a side note... I think I can safely say I'm mostly fine with names now, after going back to some illustrations and looking up at the list of people ^^; Let the discussion flow

Spoiler for pics with names:

1st pic:

Shiba Tatsuya (the MC, 1st year E class. A course 2 (poor student) being label as "Weed")

Shiba Miyuki (the imouto, 1st year A class. Tatsuya's little sister in the main course "Bloom")

2nd pic is from the Monolith Code event when Tatsuya's team of 3 weeds face against the Crimson prince' team.

2nd pic from left to right, background:

Yoshida Mikihiko (1st year E class. Tatsuya's classmate)

Shiba Tatsuya

Saijou Leonheart (1st year E class. Tatsuya's classmate)

Ichijou Masaki (Crimson Prince,the heir to the Ichijou clan in 1st year from 3rd high school)

Kichijoji Shinkurou (Cardinal George, the child genius in 1st year from 3rd high school)

2nd pic from left to right, foreground:

Shiba Tatsuya

Ichijou Masaki

Hiyohiyo · 2012-05-12, 11:17

For those Chinese translations that don't transliterate the names, but rather copy the kanji directly, I've always been curious how people read them in their head. Do they read the Chinese (which sounds strange) or look up the Japanese pronunciations? What do you guys do?

Chaos2Frozen · 2012-05-12, 11:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hiyohiyo

For those Chinese translations that don't transliterate the names, but rather copy the kanji directly, I've always been curious how people read them in their head. Do they read the Chinese (which sounds strange) or look up the Japanese pronunciations? What do you guys do?

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking- You know that some Kanji characters are Chinese characters right

?

Hiyohiyo · 2012-05-12, 11:43

I'm very aware, in fact, that's the source of my question

Let me clarify things a bit. When Chinese translators translate light novels, there are two methods for translating Japanese names (which are in kanji, i.e. Chinese characters). The first is transliteration, where they choose Chinese characters' whose sounds, in aggregate, sound like its Japanese equivalent.

The other method is to copy the kanji directly. In this case, while it's clear that the string of characters you've encountered is a name, speaking from a Chinese point of view, the reading of those characters is very strange. That is to say, when you sound out the names in Chinese, they're not only nothing like their Japanese counterparts, they're odd even from a purely Chinese standpoint.

Hence my question

whsie · 2012-05-12, 15:30

^ Yes, you are correct. I read it directly in Chinese and there will be a difference in the pronunciation. That said, there will be SOME similarity. As in, if you were to tell me the Japanese pronunciation and if I were to look at the name, I could see why they're the same name. However, if I were to only look at the translated name and try to pronounce it in Japanese, I would fail badly.

If you've seen some of my works (nothing full scale), I SUCK at names. In matter of fact, I have received quiet a bit of tack in the past for completely butchering names. This is why I now NEVER use a name unless I see another poster use it first. It's why I still call the Cardinal George the Cardinal George because I have never quite gotten down the name.

It has gotten to a point that if I were to translate a portion of a novel, I would first google translate the name in Japanese and see how it sounds before I write it down. It's much safer that way.

EnigmaticAxiom · 2012-05-12, 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by whsie

^ Yes, you are correct. I read it directly in Chinese and there will be a difference in the pronunciation. That said, there will be SOME similarity. As in, if you were to tell me the Japanese pronunciation and if I were to look at the name, I could see why they're the same name. However, if I were to only look at the translated name and try to pronounce it in Japanese, I would fail badly.

If you've seen some of my works (nothing full scale), I SUCK at names. In matter of fact, I have received quiet a bit of tack in the past for completely butchering names. This is why I now NEVER use a name unless I see another poster use it first. It's why I still call the Cardinal George the Cardinal George because I have never quite gotten down the name.

It has gotten to a point that if I were to translate a portion of a novel, I would first google translate the name in Japanese and see how it sounds before I write it down. It's much safer that way.

I got most of those names (Cardinal George, for example) from the light novels, but yes, I know what you mean. I always use the translator, but there are times when the actual pronunciation of the name does not match the character's name at all. I don't know how it is pronounced, but I believe Mayo's name is one such example, since after the kanji, it had (mayo) written in parenthesis afterwards. Personally, I think if you're translating JP --> CH, you should retain not the sound but the meaning of the name, since they put a lot more emphasis on the meaning of the name than those from a western audience. Well, that is probably a worthless opinion since I'm only using machine translations

Flere821 · 2012-05-12, 19:36

I read the names in Chinese and not Japanese, hence I have problems when people are using romaji names like Tatsuya when I'm used to reading it in Kanji and not know which one it was (Hence digging up the illustration so I can tell which name is spelled what in english/romaji)

kuroishinigami · 2012-05-13, 02:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by whsie

Well, Chinese as a whole is considered a more difficult language. Now, if you learned Chinese earlier and longer than Japanese, then yeah, there might be something wrong.

@kuroishinigami

Assuming the translator is competent, there should be minimal difference between the Chinese and Japanese version (as in within a 3%-5% margin of error). As someone noted before, about 1/5th of the characters are Chinese though they occasionally have different meanings. More importantly though, Chinese and Japanese are closely related, meaning that there is minimal syntax, diction, and sentence structure changes. By comparison, Japanese -> English or Chinese -> English requires a complete reordering and often times a whole new rewriting of the original text to capture the original text's meaning.

Now, if the translator isn't so good, then we may have more errors. But that holds true for any type of translations.

I said the finer points, something like usage pronouns, diction usage to show the difference in social standing in the character's mind, and all the other small things that add to the nuance in the conversation and subtly show what the character's state of mind is, which will almost certainly get lost in translation because well, there's just no such perfect equivalent in the language that the original source going to be translated in.

Surely, Chinese, and probably Korean, translation is the closest you can get to Japanese, and maybe content wise, everything is perfectly translated into Chinese/Korean, but for me, when reading a fiction book, it's not only the content that's important, but also the choice and flow of words as well(well, the content importance is 75%-80% though

). Granted, this is nothing like Shakespearian classic or something, but I still enjoy it much more in its original language, which is why I urge Chaos(and everybody else interested in light novels) to learn Japanese so he can enjoy it much more

Sorry for the rant, back to the topic though, I can say I'm surprised I enjoy the series this much considering with the number of novel series I juggled and the non fiction book I read, I usually can't remember most of the term used in a fantasy novel like this(I think Index is the only other fantasy novel with huge setting that I follow) and end up not enjoying it too much. I guess it has to do with the low number of volume available currently(only following the published version).

I still wonder what's the author's next plan is though, considering he made the main character this strong. The author either has to make an even stronger enemy, nerf the main character, or make some kind of gimmick/situation to nerf the main character temporarily when facing the enemy(some kind of hostage situation, or maybe a jammer strong enough to weaken only Tatsuya but not the enemy) to make the fight not one sided. So far, it's still good because the author is just starting to unravel little by little how strong Tatsuya is, but sooner or later, the author will have to advance to the next step and start to do a not-one-sided battle. I'm really looking forward to it since this is the first work by this author that I read

Chaos2Frozen · 2012-05-13, 03:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuroishinigami

Surely, Chinese, and probably Korean, translation is the closest you can get to Japanese, and maybe content wise, everything is perfectly translated into Chinese/Korean, but for me, when reading a fiction book, it's not only the content that's important, but also the choice and flow of words as well(well, the content importance is 75%-80% though

). Granted, this is nothing like Shakespearian classic or something, but I still enjoy it much more in its original language, which is why I urge Chaos(and everybody else interested in light novels) to learn Japanese so he can enjoy it much more

There's something wrong if I have to suffer through months of language studies before enjoying a 2 day read

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuroishinigami

Sorry for the rant, back to the topic though, I can say I'm surprised I enjoy the series this much considering with the number of novel series I juggled and the non fiction book I read, I usually can't remember most of the term used in a fantasy novel like this(I think Index is the only other fantasy novel with huge setting that I follow) and end up not enjoying it too much. I guess it has to do with the low number of volume available currently(only following the published version).

I've pretty much studied all the terminology so far... If anything, that's half the fun.

But you're right, it's not like I can turn it on for every setting-heavy story.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuroishinigami

I still wonder what's the author's next plan is though, considering he made the main character this strong. The author either has to make an even stronger enemy, nerf the main character, or make some kind of gimmick/situation to nerf the main character temporarily when facing the enemy(some kind of hostage situation, or maybe a jammer strong enough to weaken only Tatsuya but not the enemy) to make the fight not one sided. So far, it's still good because the author is just starting to unravel little by little how strong Tatsuya is, but sooner or later, the author will have to advance to the next step and start to do a not-one-sided battle. I'm really looking forward to it since this is the first work by this author that I read

There are other ways around it- Let the MC keep his nukes but create a situation where brute strength alone would not solve the problem. That is to say, you don't need to nerf his powers, just make it not the solution to your problem.

This is where as a fanfic writer, my favorite plot device comes in- the wondrous and ever versatile 'Politics'

With politics, you have the perfect excuse to avoid using the simplest and logical solutions for any problem.

orpheus2 · 2012-05-13, 09:03

I have to ask.

Spoiler for MC power:

sandhy88 · 2012-05-13, 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by orpheus2

I have to ask.

Spoiler for MC power:

He can regenerate the body by reading the history of the body.

But he cannot regenerate the soul.

So, if the person already dead, when regenerate just a body without soul (corpse).

Just like Mirai Nikki.

orpheus2 · 2012-05-13, 09:15

Ah, thanks for the clarification.

I thought the protagonist was borderline god. Good to know that he has limits.

Kleeyook · 2012-05-13, 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by orpheus2

I have to ask.

Spoiler for MC power:

Spoiler for the MC's ability:

Chaos2Frozen · 2012-05-13, 09:30

^

Erm yea... I don't think he needs to know that last part in detail... =_=

Quote:

Originally Posted by orpheus2

Ah, thanks for the clarification.

I thought the protagonist was borderline god. Good to know that he has limits.

Not much of a 'limit' given everything else he can do though.

E=mc^2 is way too h4xx already.

reccaryu · 2012-05-13, 12:53

Watched the latest AC episode again and just noticed they had Mahouka Kouko no Rettousei on a billboard across the window from where Haru is talking to Aqua Current... It looks like the cover of the first light novel.

larethian · 2012-05-13, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mentar

Uuuuuu...

Mahouka done by Sunrise with a Sunrise style budget, that would be _awesome_ ^_^

Larethian, any news on whether or not your efforts to get a proper group to scanlate Mahouka Koukou no Yuutousei were successful?

EDIT: (Reason behind my question: I might feel compelled to call in a couple of favors from my fansubbing times to prep a layman scanlation if no reputable group feels like doing it)

The same group who's scantalating rettousei is up for it but they need a translator. Seitsuiki, are you up for it? It's easier than rettousei from what I see, and you get lots of Miyuki.

(and honestly speaking, if you can translate a LN, you can translate a manga with one eye closed)

Seitsuki · 2012-05-13, 21:36

Miyuki?

Seriously, you needed to ask?

2012-05-12, 05:15	Link #821
Seitsuki Onee! Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Auckland, NZ	Native born ;-; Even my imouto who went back for a few years can read/write better than me.. __________________ thanks to Patchy ♥

2012-05-12, 05:33	Link #822
Flere821 Lurker Join Date: Aug 2010	On a side note... I think I can safely say I'm mostly fine with names now, after going back to some illustrations and looking up at the list of people ^^; Let the discussion flow Spoiler for pics with names: http://img165.poco.cn/mypoco/myphoto/20111201/11/5515191620111201113458015.jpg http://pic.wenku8.cn/pictures/1/1159/38167/45248.jpg

2012-05-12, 07:01	Link #823
tsunade666 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: In my room	the names aren't translated -_- aren't those the one in the 9 school arc? or what ever the name is the arc. __________________ To A certain Lonely Hero

2012-05-13, 09:03	Link #833
orpheus2 Pleased to Meet You Join Date: May 2012 Location: Philippines	I have to ask. Spoiler for MC power: From what I could understand from the MC's power, does that mean he has control of life and death? What I am saying is that if he fully degenerated a person, does that mean he can also fully regenerate that same person?

2012-05-13, 21:36	Link #840
Seitsuki Onee! Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Auckland, NZ	Miyuki? Seriously, you needed to ask? __________________ thanks to Patchy ♥

2012-05-12, 11:17	Link #825
Hiyohiyo Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2008	For those Chinese translations that don't transliterate the names, but rather copy the kanji directly, I've always been curious how people read them in their head. Do they read the Chinese (which sounds strange) or look up the Japanese pronunciations? What do you guys do?

2012-05-12, 11:43	Link #827
Hiyohiyo Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2008	I'm very aware, in fact, that's the source of my question Let me clarify things a bit. When Chinese translators translate light novels, there are two methods for translating Japanese names (which are in kanji, i.e. Chinese characters). The first is transliteration, where they choose Chinese characters' whose sounds, in aggregate, sound like its Japanese equivalent. The other method is to copy the kanji directly. In this case, while it's clear that the string of characters you've encountered is a name, speaking from a Chinese point of view, the reading of those characters is very strange. That is to say, when you sound out the names in Chinese, they're not only nothing like their Japanese counterparts, they're odd even from a purely Chinese standpoint. Hence my question

2012-05-12, 15:30	Link #828
whsie Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Seattle and Houston... sleeping in a car.	^ Yes, you are correct. I read it directly in Chinese and there will be a difference in the pronunciation. That said, there will be SOME similarity. As in, if you were to tell me the Japanese pronunciation and if I were to look at the name, I could see why they're the same name. However, if I were to only look at the translated name and try to pronounce it in Japanese, I would fail badly. If you've seen some of my works (nothing full scale), I SUCK at names. In matter of fact, I have received quiet a bit of tack in the past for completely butchering names. This is why I now NEVER use a name unless I see another poster use it first. It's why I still call the Cardinal George the Cardinal George because I have never quite gotten down the name. It has gotten to a point that if I were to translate a portion of a novel, I would first google translate the name in Japanese and see how it sounds before I write it down. It's much safer that way.

2012-05-12, 19:36	Link #830
Flere821 Lurker Join Date: Aug 2010	I read the names in Chinese and not Japanese, hence I have problems when people are using romaji names like Tatsuya when I'm used to reading it in Kanji and not know which one it was (Hence digging up the illustration so I can tell which name is spelled what in english/romaji)

2012-05-13, 09:15	Link #835
orpheus2 Pleased to Meet You Join Date: May 2012 Location: Philippines	Ah, thanks for the clarification. I thought the protagonist was borderline god. Good to know that he has limits.

2012-05-13, 12:53	Link #838
reccaryu Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012	Watched the latest AC episode again and just noticed they had Mahouka Kouko no Rettousei on a billboard across the window from where Haru is talking to Aqua Current... It looks like the cover of the first light novel.