Kimi no Iru Machi (A Town Where You Live)

[astrallionheart]

Originally Posted by katsudon

if i remember correctly, even before eba catches haruto with nanami, she already wrote that letter in the giftbag..

Yeah Eba was breaking up with Haruto no matter what.

[Waven]

@mangaf_whatever: Wow, you're the new thing in condescendence here I suppose. 'Reasoning is invalid' , 'This is an eyesore' and 'you're in denial' are my favorites of your new post

Now with so much confidence in one's point of view I would've expected some strong arguments... I'm still looking for them.

Just a few points:

- 'Bored by the relationship' ? Where is this? Where does it say she's bored?

- Eba didn't (re)confess to have an answer to her confession, she did it to say goodbye, hence throwing the pendant in the lake as well as saying they wont see each other after this. Anything beyond that is not in the text and therefor mere speculation from your side.

- She wanted Kazama to die so she could go after Haruto? (that one's the icing ) So why breaking up all contact for two years then? Again, you make all this up while there is nothing in the source to actually confirm it. Kazama didn't want to take the risk of an operation, Eba merely respected his decision.

And mostly, who are you to decide that the notion of 'nobody's perfect" is just an excuse and doesn't apply here? Because it doesn't suit your argumentation? The characters represent people. People do mistakes. Every ... single ... one. If that is too realistic of a depiction for you then you might have had too idealistic expectations for a longrunning ShoRom series to begin with.

Your posts are full of unbacked interpretations that you present as facts but it's not working that way.

[Mentar]

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

when choosing a person over the other, someone would definitely get hurt.

Yep, that does happen. So you need to base your decision who you want to be with on whether or not someone else get hurt? This is obviously wrong.

yes, it isnt wrong to choose who you want to be with, but that reasoning is invalid because she created (intentionally or not) some "situations", and we'll encounter that later in this post...

I take it your argument is "she first seduced someone and then let him fall". The ONLY one who might have a faint justification for that is Haruto, and he's not complaining. So why are you?

-if she's bored with the relationship, then end it properly. not by a confusing letter
or cut communication without any notice.. -this would end up you(Haruto) asking "WHY?"

I already ceded to you that the letter wasn't the "best" way to do it. But that alone won't do - and if Haruto had found the letter right away - as intended - things wouldn't have been so problematic in the first place.

-read chapter 70 again, ... he explained things to her, the guy was serious and she believes him. -after settling things, then a break up? "why?"

Yep, it's been a really wonderful date. Haruto has been sighing and sulking through most of it (look at his face), and then saying "I was just thinking how hard long distance relationships are".

You can continue to harp on the HOW (it's the only criticism left), but I find it hard to condemn her for that alone.

-Did she really love Kazama or is she still thinking of Haruto?


i feel sorry for these guys..they are confused... and only eba knows the truth...

Kazama knows that Eba being with him isn't caused by romantic dreams, she has been rejecting him numerous times. Only when he played the card of "WISH OF A DYING FRIEND" she relented and agreed to be with him till the end.

Dying is a scary and lonely business. What Kazama wanted (and got) was her COMPANY during his last days, not a sex friend (hi Bonta-kun). Besides, we didn't hear a single complaint from him.

Haruto had no reason to be confused. She told him point-blank, multiple times, in no unclear terms: Stay away from me. Anything happening to him was his own responsibility.

actually my idea here is that Haruto said those things to lighten up Kazama for pitying himself, which means that's exactly what Haruto feels for him, "pity"...
if not, then this just means Haruto was telling the truth that Eba didnt just date him out of pity, so she has developed her feelings for kazama...
so who caused this confusion? still Eba... she keeps everyone hanging...

No, she did NOT. She was dating Kazama and told Haruto off. If she had been unclear here, you might have a reason to criticize her, but she drew a clear line.

this?: Eba's priority = Kazama > Haruto
i just said that this is what happened... she chose kazama over haruto... and now, she visits his workplace, she makes excuses to be alone with him, then she just confessed to him knowing he has Asuka...

...to say goodbye! That's the whole point!

She threw the trinket away, into the pond, and said: "Once we get back to Tokyo, I won't be seeing you anymore". She was about to come clean and call it quits. It was _Haruto_ who then jumped into the pool and begged her to reconsider, she was clearly shocked about this development.

talking about morals... she wanted to get Haruto back even if it is stealing from another girl... yes, it really depends on Haruto's answer, but still she did it... yes, she confessed and dont tell me she doesnt want an answer...

If that was supposed to be a ruse to wrest Haruto back, why does she look so shocked?

Feel free to believe that this was just a ploy to force Haruto's hand. If it had been Rin instead of Eba, then maybe. But not Eba, for crying out lout. This girl is as simple and non-scheming as it gets.

or was she just thinking back then when she dated Kazama that she will just try to win Haruto back after Kazama dies...yes, she expected him to die because she didnt force kazama to take surgery or rather just respect his decision which made Kiyomi angry.. yeah, morals...

After Kazama died, she told Haruto not to see each other again, so your initial suspicion looks very unfounded. And yes, she didn't force Kazama to take the surgery because IT WAS KAZAMA'S DECISION whether or not to do so. The surgery which KILLED him, by the way.

[Several repetitions of old points deleted]

First you create alot of really messed up ideas about Eba inside your head, and then you hate her for these delusions. You can't see that?

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

Originally Posted by night train

It's okay to express your opinion/feeling on topics but when you venture in to attacking fellow posters who disagrees with your view, you come off as an arrogant troll. Attacking and belittling other people's opinions/views on subjects does nothing to validate your points. It just makes your message to carry less weight to a point where it can be view as a rant.

i can see nothing wrong man... the "sigh" was just an expression that im tired repeating the same words that ive already posted before... it's not that he's the only guy in here that i explain things to... did i call directly any poster here that he's a "stupid jerk" or he's an "insane guy"?

what's wrong with saying "whatever reason you have...."? ... it's the same as "any options you present will have the same outcome...

"(if u dont understand ">", it means greater than)"
this is just a note, what if he dont understand? if he understands, then disregard it and move on to the topic...

please dont make things worse by posting something like this.. this is like putting words into their mouths... they might believe when you directly call me the "arrogant troll"...

i admit that i overdid it on the "common sense" thing... but that was just getting even with his arrogant post... some guys even call someone's post as a silly idea, some even says "you have a seriously strange morals" but u didnt bother to scold them... and here u are quoting and calling me an arrogant troll... did i call u names or something?

well, let's just focus on the Q and A's in this forum...

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

we will just give and take ideas, this is how we will enjoy the forum...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Yep, that does happen. So you need to base your decision who you want to be with on whether or not someone else get hurt? This is obviously wrong.

that is not what i meant. its normal that someone wins, someone losses.. haruto lost... that is why he's hurt... eba's choice..

Originally Posted by Mentar

I take it your argument is "she first seduced someone and then let him fall". The ONLY one who might have a faint justification for that is Haruto, and he's not complaining. So why are you?

this is getting far from my post... let's simply say her break up with haruto was hanging...

Originally Posted by Mentar

I already ceded to you that the letter wasn't the "best" way to do it. But that alone won't do - and if Haruto had found the letter right away - as intended - things wouldn't have been so problematic in the first place.

-so she made a bad decision using a letter. she could just say it face to face.
-that kissing scene should have been a dumping scene. but she selfishly wanted to do something "memorable" before dumping him.. also a bad decision.
-if haruto found the letter right away, the earlier he will come to "save" eba..

Originally Posted by Mentar

Yep, it's been a really wonderful date. Haruto has been sighing and sulking through most of it (look at his face), and then saying "I was just thinking how hard long distance relationships are".

You can continue to harp on the HOW (it's the only criticism left), but I find it hard to condemn her for that alone.

-That should have been the best time to dump him flat out, but instead, they have this lovey dovey scene... who would expect to be dumped after that.
-another proof of her bad decision

Originally Posted by Mentar

Kazama knows that Eba being with him isn't caused by romantic dreams, she has been rejecting him numerous times. Only when he played the card of "WISH OF A DYING FRIEND" she relented and agreed to be with him till the end.

-another bad decision
-she just caused kazama to pity himself more...
-she could have just advised kazama that his desperate action is not the best solution. i dont want to hurt your feelings, i dont want to hurt my current BF's feelings, and i dont want to lie to myself. she could also have avoided the break up with haruto and they'll meet in college or she can go back to hiroshima if she really wanted to...

IF haruto was a punk, he would have laughed at kazama, "dude, that was desperate, it's like blackmailing my girlfriend... hahaha".. but that would be harsh..

Originally Posted by Mentar

Dying is a scary and lonely business. What Kazama wanted (and got) was her COMPANY during his last days, not a sex friend (hi Bonta-kun). Besides, we didn't hear a single complaint from him.

-He's expecting something from her that only being a GF can give... like caressing, kissing, 2nd or 3rd base, or might be lucky and have sex...

-if he wanted company, she can take care of him as a friend.. you can date a friend, eat dinner with a friend, go swimming with a friend, going to a park with a friend, and many more.. but cant go to a love hotel with her and do the above...

-if Eba told him im currently dating someone in the first place, i dont think he'll insist. (another bad move for Eba)........his proposals happened before dumping Haruto, right?

Originally Posted by Mentar

Haruto had no reason to be confused. She told him point-blank, multiple times, in no unclear terms: Stay away from me. Anything happening to him was his own responsibility.

yeah, she told him go away multiple times because im pity dating this guy... nothing to be confused, right?

Originally Posted by Mentar

No, she did NOT. She was dating Kazama and told Haruto off. If she had been unclear here, you might have a reason to criticize her, but she drew a clear line.

-the links already served as a proof that they were both confused and they dont really know how eba felt for each of them...
-i also have answers above...

Originally Posted by Mentar

...to say goodbye! That's the whole point!

She threw the trinket away, into the pond, and said: "Once we get back to Tokyo, I won't be seeing you anymore". She was about to come clean and call it quits. It was _Haruto_ who then jumped into the pool and begged her to reconsider, she was clearly shocked about this development.

kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c138/14
kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c138/15
- what do you expect when you confess to a person? it is an "answer", correct?... she was actually hoping that haruto might love her back, so she's willing to wait for the answer... because if she only wanted to say goodbye, then there's no need for an answer... is this clear enough?

Originally Posted by Mentar

If that was supposed to be a ruse to wrest Haruto back, why does she look so shocked?

she was shocked because "this guy might love me back! i still got a chance!!"

Originally Posted by Mentar

Feel free to believe that this was just a ploy to force Haruto's hand. If it had been Rin instead of Eba, then maybe. But not Eba, for crying out lout. This girl is as simple and non-scheming as it gets.

not a ploy, but she was brave enough and gave it a shot...
and she succeed...(nice determination Eba!)
Haruto is mine!!!! (yeah, u did it!)
sorry asuka...i dont care if you'll cry a river... (uhhmm... ye..yeah...)

Originally Posted by Mentar

After Kazama died, she told Haruto not to see each other again, so your initial suspicion looks very unfounded. And yes, she didn't force Kazama to take the surgery because IT WAS KAZAMA'S DECISION whether or not to do so. The surgery which KILLED him, by the way.

[Several repetitions of old points deleted]

-does she expect that their relationship would last for more than a year? (no, he'll die)
-does she expect that his illness will cure itself without surgery? (no, he'll die)
-so what does she expect will happen after the 1 year life duration of kazama? (he'll die)

-if she respects kazama's decision, will he be able to survive? (no, he'll die)
-if she forced kazama to have surgery, will he be able to survive? (maybe he'll survive)

-so she really just waiting for him to die...

-if she will date haruto after kazama's death, then is it ok for kazama's mom? is it ok for Haruto? is it ok for Kiyomi? is it ok for Asuka? is it ok for the gang?
after all the mess she made, she expects everyone to just accept it?

Originally Posted by Mentar

First you create alot of really messed up ideas about Eba inside your head, and then you hate her for these delusions. You can't see that?

all my ideas werent messed up... i can even answer your posts with links as a proof... try to open your eyes.. dont read just to answer my post, but read to understand my post...

i'd be glad to hear from you again...


-----sorry for the double posting...no one has posted after 2 hours, so let this slip please...

[Mentar]

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

that is not what i meant. its normal that someone wins, someone losses.. haruto lost... that is why he's hurt... eba's choice..

So why did you list this as a "mistake"? As something that you would criticize her for? Hurting people because you can't (or opt not to) reciprocate someone's feelings IS NO MISTAKE.

-that kissing scene should have been a dumping scene. but she selfishly wanted to do something "memorable" before dumping him.. also a bad decision.

Good lord, he kissed her, not vice versa. It was her who pulled out of it. Should she have slapped him?

-That should have been the best time to dump him flat out, but instead, they have this lovey dovey scene... who would expect to be dumped after that.
-another proof of her bad decision

Have you ever been in a steady relationship? I can't understand how anyone could misunderstand this extremely awkward meeting with "lovey-dovey". This meeting was typical of "failing LD relationship, breakup imminent". Heck, it was even SAID OPENLY at the very end.

[about Eba agreeing to date Kazama]
-another bad decision
-she just caused kazama to pity himself more...

Excuse me, but this is complete BS. Kazama was cheery and glad. He never pitied himself one bit, in fact. Eba gave his final days _happiness_, that's clear as daylight.

If we can't even agree on what the manga depicts in the first place, how could we reasonably discuss it?

-she could have just advised kazama that his desperate action is not the best solution. i dont want to hurt your feelings, i dont want to hurt my current BF's feelings, and i dont want to lie to myself. she could also have avoided the break up with haruto and they'll meet in college or she can go back to hiroshima if she really wanted to...

And you seriously think that this would have made Kazama happier? ... wow.

-He's expecting something from her that only being a GF can give... like caressing, kissing, 2nd or 3rd base, or might be lucky and have sex...

Look dude, there's a difference between what YOU want and what Kazama wanted. Please be so kind to give a reference where he gives ANY indication of this. If what he had wanted would have been merely skinship and more, he could have had it any day via Kiyomi. What he wanted was to BE WITH HER in his final days.

yeah, she told him go away multiple times because im pity dating this guy... nothing to be confused, right?

She said that 1) she was dating someone else and 2) she had no intention to get back together with Haruto afterwards. Nothing to misunderstand at all. She never used the term "pity dating" either, not even in the remotest meaning.

- what do you expect when you confess to a person? it is an "answer", correct?

Wrong. For _closure_. She didn't appeal to him to drop Asuka or anything, she wanted to explain - unlike before, where her silence caused trouble - why she was not going to see him again.

... she was actually hoping that haruto might love her back, so she's willing to wait for the answer... because if she only wanted to say goodbye, then there's no need for an answer... is this clear enough?

Except that she never waited for an answer at all. She said that she still loved him, then she said that she wouldn't be seeing him anymore, and then she took off the trinket and threw it into the pond. She never asked him anything, and she never "waited for an answer" either. It's just in your head.

-so she really just waiting for him to die...

If this is his decision, then yes. What's so hard to understand about that? Especially since now that his friends pressured him into taking the risk, he ended up dying sooner than he would have otherwise.

-if she will date haruto after kazama's death, then is it ok for kazama's mom? is it ok for Haruto? is it ok for Kiyomi? is it ok for Asuka? is it ok for the gang?
after all the mess she made, she expects everyone to just accept it?

She didn't make a mess at all. She didn't cause any of Kazama's health or relationship troubles. She did what a dying friend wanted from her, and she stayed by his side until he died (which is a horrible burden, let me tell you that). Again, you're projecting some personal opinions on what could/should be done on the characters, completely ignoring what actually happened in the story. YOU may feel that Eba should have pushed Kazama to have the surgery (the Kiyomi stance), but KAZAMA had a completely different opinion on that.

Kazama died happy. His greatly enjoyed his final days with Eba, and the subsequent "contest" with Haruto, he openly said so. Blaming Eba for that feels pretty absurd.

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

[QUOTE=Mentar;3678490]So why did you list this as a "mistake"? As something that you would criticize her for? Hurting people because you can't (or opt not to) reciprocate someone's feelings IS NO MISTAKE.

kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c137/8
kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c137/9
kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c137/10
kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c137/11
here we go again... she made a mistake by choosing kazama over haruto, because if it isnt, she wont be in front of haruto confessing her feelings.... you see? it was her choice to dump haruto before, but she admits that she always love haruto.. things wouldnt be complicated if she just directly followed her heart from the start... not a mistake?she damn admitted already... dont push this topic anymore...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Good lord, he kissed her, not vice versa. It was her who pulled out of it. Should she have slapped him?

hello? they are lovers... huh? she should slap him if she doesnt like it... then dump him for good... are u really reading what ive been writing?

Originally Posted by Mentar

Have you ever been in a steady relationship? I can't understand how anyone could misunderstand this extremely awkward meeting with "lovey-dovey". This meeting was typical of "failing LD relationship, breakup imminent". Heck, it was even SAID OPENLY at the very end.

i'll share u a story...
when i was a junior, i have this gf, same school but she's 2 yr level lower than me. everyday was fun, until i get to college..i can only return home once every semester (school chosen by parents), so it was really hard for us by just a celphone and YM... i decided to finish a year in this college and transfer to a closer college, so i need to defy my parents.. but we only lasted the next 5 months after my transfer to a 5hr-distance-travel school, by ship, so i came only at weekends... it was really sudden that i dont have an idea.. all my efforts has gone to waste... i was very angry, even if we broke up, i was still coming home and visiting my old school as some of my old friends are also taking their navigation course there.i think u know how hard it is when you see her having fun with his new guy,right? i feel pathetic and became a bastard who flirt with girls just to have sex, but ofcourse u need to hide and avoid being seen.. funny thing is, my ex text me 2 times, wanting to patch things up, but i turned down both offers, i really tried to flirt with other girls and played as a caring bf...i havent move on until i developed my feelings to my friend (ive known her since 13) and became my wife...ah, my ex currently has a baby, but she's too ashamed to say who the father is... but we're friends, sometimes we chat, but having a dinner, my wife might kill me...

so, i know what is lovey dovey, lust, flirt, passionate, and a lot more in a boy-girl relationship... i really feel too old for this forum... its a higshcool/college time-frame manga..

- and please open your eyes and reread that chapter again... they didnt even noticed that there's a lot of people watching them...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Excuse me, but this is complete BS. Kazama was cheery and glad. He never pitied himself one bit, in fact. Eba gave his final days _happiness_, that's clear as daylight.

- i already posted a link before, kazama said she only dated him out of sympathy...

Originally Posted by Mentar

If we can't even agree on what the manga depicts in the first place, how could we reasonably discuss it?

you are the one not agreeing even after seeing the links...

Originally Posted by Mentar

And you seriously think that this would have made Kazama happier? ... wow.

yes, he would be happy to see eba happy... rather than lying to him that she loves him... and by the way again, he didnt know she's currently dating Haruto while Kazama proposed... so, Eba not able to tell him this was already a big mistake...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Look dude, there's a difference between what YOU want and what Kazama wanted. Please be so kind to give a reference where he gives ANY indication of this. If what he had wanted would have been merely skinship and more, he could have had it any day via Kiyomi. What he wanted was to BE WITH HER in his final days.

look here, not all of the situations are drawn in the manga..it's like when Eba came back to tokyo for her grandfather's funeral but wasnt shown she attended, and her family didnt even mention there is a funeral, instead they said she is out with her friends... so dont ask for the impossible..

Kazama is more experienced with girls than u think he is... he knows what is dating a girl and being a friend to the girl... so asking Eba to be his girlfriend is not the same as asking her to take care of him as a friend... so, he's expecting something from her that "only a friend" could not give... am i not clear with this?

give me an example of what a GF can give u when "only a friend" cant give u...

and after all, he thought she was available... (links below can prove this)

Originally Posted by Mentar

She said that 1) she was dating someone else and 2) she had no intention to get back together with Haruto afterwards. Nothing to misunderstand at all. She never used the term "pity dating" either, not even in the remotest meaning.

-so, what is the reason why she dated kazama? you are even confusing yourself... i find it funny..
-kazama himself feel she was dating him out of pity (ive said this multiple times and posted a link)
kimi_no_iru_machi/v11/c091/5
kimi_no_iru_machi/v11/c091/6
kimi_no_iru_machi/v11/c091/7
kimi_no_iru_machi/v11/c091/8
kimi_no_iru_machi/v11/c091/9
-a lot was answered here, read it...

so, am i blurting nonsense here?

Originally Posted by Mentar

Wrong. For _closure_. She didn't appeal to him to drop Asuka or anything, she wanted to explain - unlike before, where her silence caused trouble - why she was not going to see him again.

ahem, she just said "okay, i'll wait".. please dont deny things so we can proceed and not circle around..

Originally Posted by Mentar

Except that she never waited for an answer at all. She said that she still loved him, then she said that she wouldn't be seeing him anymore, and then she took off the trinket and threw it into the pond. She never asked him anything, and she never "waited for an answer" either. It's just in your head.

do i have to post the link again about Eba waiting for an answer?
kimi_no_iru_machi/v14/c138/15
yes, this is just in my head, i draw this page...believe me...

Originally Posted by Mentar

If this is his decision, then yes. What's so hard to understand about that? Especially since now that his friends pressured him into taking the risk, he ended up dying sooner than he would have otherwise.

so, i am right that she already expected that he will die... she respected his decision, and what do you expect, he will live? ofcourse he will die, just wait after a year..
so what are u arguing me with? because this statement sounds like she's a bad person that's why you quoted this?BTW, i didnt say that she's hoping he would die so that he can get back to haruto again...

Originally Posted by Mentar

She didn't make a mess at all. She didn't cause any of Kazama's health or relationship troubles. She did what a dying friend wanted from her, and she stayed by his side until he died (which is a horrible burden, let me tell you that). Again, you're projecting some personal opinions on what could/should be done on the characters, completely ignoring what actually happened in the story. YOU may feel that Eba should have pushed Kazama to have the surgery (the Kiyomi stance), but KAZAMA had a completely different opinion on that.

a lot of mess happened in tokyo arc, it started when eba chose kazama without properly breaking up with haruto... these guys even competed for this girl... haruto was messed up and eba admitted what she did was horrible...links above..

and what was Kazama's decision? he took the surgery, hoping he can still live and try to win Eba evenly... he realized that it was a better choice afterall...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Kazama died happy. His greatly enjoyed his final days with Eba, and the subsequent "contest" with Haruto, he openly said so. Blaming Eba for that feels pretty absurd.

yeah, Kazama was happy, while haruto experienced a lot of shit...

[Bigspeed]

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

sigh, i feel sorry for your parents... God, give them strength..

i should have said that this "innocent guy" is also a friend of theirs... hwooo! damn, i need to be more elaborate so other minds could function...

asuka= innocent guy - victim
haruto= your friend - fool - selfish
friends= you - uhmmm...
hurt/dumped = punched

so what will you do in this situation? will u help punch the innocent guy? wont stop your friend cause u dont care, its their problem?



"ohhhh.... my poor son, we didnt brought you up like this" - parents

haruto has a change of heart, he knew he was guilty of his selfish actions and knew the outcome, that's why he cant face them or talk back... just accept it, dude...

Asuka was the victim (and a friend) and needs the support rather than haruto (even if he's a friend)



"ohhh...memory loss in your early age? maybe u forgot to drink ur milk, my son.. here, drink some more" - parents

check the nanami and hiroshima arc, eba's return to tokyo, haruto going to tokyo, and the last 30 chapters... that sums up mostly the whole manga, so reread it...

advice? he nearly punched akari for this and luckily ended up just pushing her aside.. he would rather take Rin's and Shiori's plots than advice from his childhood friends...



"ohhh, my son, stop watching cinderella and walt disney cartoons, try to go outside and find real experiences" - parents

-Cheating (cheeting)
1. Not faithful to a spouse or lover
2. Violating accepted standards or rules
3. A deception for profit to yourself
4. Deprive somebody of something by deceit
5. Defeat someone through trickery or deceit
6. Be sexually unfaithful to one's partner




"my son, i haven't seen your GF yet...do you have one?" - parents
of course they shouldnt be neutral... there was a victim of one's selfishness...and that victim is a friend.



"my son, u really got muscular, except it's only your right hand.. i understand.." - parents

it would really be impossible to put yourself in one's shoes if u havent experienced it or dont have an idea about it. why did u beat the other guy? cause you favored your bestfriend and u dont like it when someone call him names.. the fact u didnt care about your bestfriend hurting other people is that u yourself tolerate his foolishness... is this dumped girl your friend? u didnt support her when she's crying, depressed and alone? or u just dont care... as expected...



yeah, we should clear our mind first and include other factors before deciding, dont rush things like haruto did...



time heals a broken heart.. they moved on and asuka should too... also, good job to your friend siding with the broken-hearted, atleast that girl had some support and helped her make it thru that pain... but she also felt guilty that she caused him to be beaten up by ubecause he supported her... she must have thought that "i should be alone that time" so he wouldn't be beaten by u... unlike your bestfriend that dumped her, he got away clean, he has a bodyguard who thinks he is neutral...

"my son, you really got a good friend out there" - parent

I just wanted to let you know your wrong, I would go into detail why all of your posts are wrong but suffice to say its not needed because just like you need not explain to someone who owns a car why they own a car, I need not explain to someone who's obviously wrong why their wrong. Also I personally have gotten a virus from mangafox and know two others who have also gotten a virus so please stop posting links to their site. Just wanted to say I was offended by your post about my parents and all and reported you, I hope this doesn't come as a shock considering the offensive nature of your post. Also Please PLEASE take 5 extra minutes for each post and make it readable, your spelling errors and ridiculous sentences really make understanding you and your point hard.

Lastly, a word to all who try to read this users posts and refute his ideas, Lol Good Luck With That, might as well argue with your wall.

[Mentar]

You really don't get it, no. Probably my last reply (hopefully so).

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

here we go again... she made a mistake by choosing kazama over haruto, because if it isnt, she wont be in front of haruto confessing her feelings.... you see? it was her choice to dump haruto before, but she admits that she always love haruto.. things wouldnt be complicated if she just directly followed her heart from the start... not a mistake?she damn admitted already... dont push this topic anymore...

No, she did NOT admit that she "made a mistake", she apologized for making him suffer in the past. Can't you get it inside your head that there is a huge difference between both things? You're acting like you are a more unpleasant type of Haruto, and only see things through the eyes of "I HAVE BEEN WRONGED!!" - while seething with jealousy.

Yes, her actions have caused grief to Yamato, and she recognizes that and apologizes for it. At the same time, she has brought some happiness to a dying friend. Feel free to badmouth that all you want, I won't stand for that.

so, i know what is lovey dovey, lust, flirt, passionate, and a lot more in a boy-girl relationship... i really feel too old for this forum... its a higshcool/college time-frame manga..

To be polite, I won't comment on your personal experiences. Let's just say that if you consider the awkward final meeting of them before the Tokyo splitup as "lovey-dovey", I'm not in the least surprised that you were surprised when things broke for you, because you don't seem to read warning signs very well (no slight intended). So, we'll have to agree and disagree.

- i already posted a link before, kazama said she only dated him out of sympathy...

Of COURSE she did. And OF COURSE he knew about that - she had turned him down again and again, and he had to play the dying wish card to get her to give in. You seriously think that Kazama thought she'd suddenly fall in love with him romantically? For real?

The point is that even though Kazama KNEW it was out of sympathy right from the start, he STILL enjoyed and desired her presence. The feeling of having someone dear to you near you in your last days is an IMMENSE comfort. That's exactly why I've been saying for ages that you're misreading the Kazama-Yuzuki linkup. This isn't about a standard adolescent romance trying to get into each others' pants. This is about care and comfort of a dying guy, and a fulfilment of his wish. By doing so, she caused Haruto alot of pain, and she regrets that. But that does not change that she did a great deed for Kazama.

yes, he would be happy to see eba happy... rather than lying to him that she loves him...

That is only in your head because you misunderstand the relationship, Kazama never said that. He _always_ would have loved to win her over romantically too - yes - but even though he knew that she's not feeling for him like this too, he STILL pulled her to himself, and he STILL didn't "give her back". If he can't have her love him romantically, he'd STILL prefer her to be his girlfriend even without these feelings. If you were correct, he would release her. But you're wrong, and this is why he fights about her.

Kazama is more experienced with girls than u think he is... he knows what is dating a girl and being a friend to the girl... so asking Eba to be his girlfriend is not the same as asking her to take care of him as a friend... so, he's expecting something from her that "only a friend" could not give... am i not clear with this?

See above, you're simply wrong. If your logic were correct, he would behave differently and release her. Your initial position was that Yuzuki's decision made him miserable (which is obviously wrong).

give me an example of what a GF can give u when "only a friend" cant give u...

The feeling of having someone for who you're the focus of her life. Someone who deeply cares for you, and who is beside you when death is approaching. Eba visited him nearly daily for long hours and was there for him. This goes way beyond what "normal friends" do.

Your focus on sexual privileges in a relationship feels a bit disturbing to me, sorry.

and after all, he thought she was available... (links below can prove this)

...and he didn't care at all when he learned that she had a boyfriend when he pushed her. Did he release her? No. It's a completely moot point for him.

ahem, she just said "okay, i'll wait".. please dont deny things so we can proceed and not circle around..

Stop faking timelines. That was AFTER Haruto jumped into the pond and begged her with all his heart not to leave him. It was clearly NOT the outcome she expected. She planned to say goodbye, tell him the truth about her feelings, apologize for the grief she caused him, and then not see him again. Then she tossed the trinket in a symbolic act. It was only after Haruto completely freaked out and begged her to wait that she relented and said that.

so, i am right that she already expected that he will die... she respected his decision, and what do you expect, he will live? ofcourse he will die, just wait after a year..

Yes, and she felt that she OWED HIM, that is why she decided to respect his decision and stay with him till his death. What is making this so hard to get into your head?

so what are u arguing me with? because this statement sounds like she's a bad person that's why you quoted this?

The opposite. It makes her a GREAT person, someone who is able and willing to sacrifice happiness of her own to care for a dying friend she feels indebted to. For some reason you seem unable to accept that she can accept to become his girlfriend clear-eyed knowing that she doesn't romantically love him and never will, and that he's going to die in one year. Because this is DOING HIM GOOD. You think that it caused him pity. Which is why you don't understand what was happening.

yeah, Kazama was happy, while haruto experienced a lot of shit...

Well, that's a complete reversal from your initial position, let me quote you from earlier:

-another bad decision
-she just caused kazama to pity himself more...

Haruto had a clear case of "bad luck" in unfortunate circumstances. Eba recognizes that. Still, doing what she did (care for Kazama) is nothing at all to be ashamed of. And Haruto isn't even blaming her. Only the hater faction is.

[Johnny]

I actually think Kazama had more fun with Haruto visiting him when he understood Haruto didn't hold no ill will toward him then both Eba and Kiyomi put together. Maybe because Haruto was the only one being wholly earnest with himself I think that's the phrase I'm looking for describes it...

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

Originally Posted by Bigspeed

I just wanted to let you know your wrong, I would go into detail why all of your posts are wrong but suffice to say its not needed because just like you need not explain to someone who owns a car why they own a car, I need not explain to someone who's obviously wrong why their wrong. Also I personally have gotten a virus from mangafox and know two others who have also gotten a virus so please stop posting links to their site. Just wanted to say I was offended by your post about my parents and all and reported you, I hope this doesn't come as a shock considering the offensive nature of your post. Also Please PLEASE take 5 extra minutes for each post and make it readable, your spelling errors and ridiculous sentences really make understanding you and your point hard.

Lastly, a word to all who try to read this users posts and refute his ideas, Lol Good Luck With That, might as well argue with your wall.

saying you're wrong but can't present any links..now, who's the one making things up?

"someone who's obviously wrong"? you can't even back up your words... show me some links. i, on the other hand, showed some proof (links).

mangafox doesnt have a virus, don't make things up to make me look bad. there are thousands of readers in there, and it is one of the biggest manga forums, if mangafox really have viruses, people shouldn't be there reading their manga to avoid viruses... (To admins, i'm sorry for using another website's name, but i need it for my explanation)

browse your posts again and check who's the one who started to use vulgar words and insulted ideas... actions have consequences... if you insult me or my idea, then i'm more experienced in insulting a person... i admit i insulted you, but don't come clean that you started it...

Bigspeed
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
2011-07-01, 04:47 Link #7986
2011-07-01, 04:50 Link #7987

this are your posts... where's the 5 extra minute you're talking to?

you quoted this before:
"eba taught her that" - directed at Haruto though a minor misspelling(for others reading the forum)
is this what your referring about the mispelling? and u even try to insult me there to the other readers... (which backfired)

verb: teach -present tense
taught -past tense
"i teach them martial arts" -present tense
"i taught them martial arts" - past tense

yes, i am not an english-major teacher and english is not my 1st language. i'm a bit lazy putting apostrophes and writing words in shortcut... i often write "because" as "cause" to make it shorter but they actually have different meaning so let it slide...

Lastly, you just told the whole forum to isolate me... wow... good job...

[KLGChaos]

Man, this has degenerated into nothing but a flame war.

Everyone please keep the personal attacks to yourself. This is a forum for discussion, not for calling each other names. It's not helping your cases any... and please remember that 95% of everything here is opinion. There's no real right or wrong way to look at it (unless you're posting something that was actually said in the manga and completely twisting it). People have their own views on relationships, break ups, etc. You don't have to agree with them, but at least keep it civil.

[Bigspeed]

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

saying you're wrong but can't present any links..now, who's the one making things up?

"someone who's obviously wrong"? you can't even back up your words... show me some links. i, on the other hand, showed some proof (links).

mangafox doesnt have a virus, don't make things up to make me look bad. there are thousands of readers in there, and it is one of the biggest manga forums, if mangafox really have viruses, people shouldn't be there reading their manga to avoid viruses... (To admins, i'm sorry for using another website's name, but i need it for my explanation)

browse your posts again and check who's the one who started to use vulgar words and insulted ideas... actions have consequences... if you insult me or my idea, then i'm more experienced in insulting a person... i admit i insulted you, but don't come clean that you started it...

Bigspeed
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
2011-07-01, 04:47 Link #7986
2011-07-01, 04:50 Link #7987

this are your posts... where's the 5 extra minute you're talking to?

you quoted this before:
"eba taught her that" - directed at Haruto though a minor misspelling(for others reading the forum)
is this what your referring about the mispelling? and u even try to insult me there to the other readers... (which backfired)

verb: teach -present tense
taught -past tense
"i teach them martial arts" -present tense
"i taught them martial arts" - past tense

yes, i am not an english-major teacher and english is not my 1st language. i'm a bit lazy putting apostrophes and writing words in shortcut... i often write "because" as "cause" to make it shorter but they actually have different meaning so let it slide...

Lastly, you just told the whole forum to isolate me... wow... good job...

your quote "Eba taught her that" was something I took from your posted because it is infact taught Him that which i pointed out for others. Dude this whole thread is about opinions, which means linking something we have all read gets you no proof, just Quote it, if your lieing and you get caught you just lose your credibility.

Mangafox has given me a virus, I'm not going to dispute this, use links at own risk, if you want to be safe then use the site your familiar with and the chapter/page hes refering to.

I merely stated that your impossible to discuss with because you may as well be reading others posts backwards, if english isn't your first language all the more reason to take the time to make sure you get your point across instead of a jumbled mess.

Also when I say take 5 minutes, I mean take 5 minutes too make your posts readable and understandable, not make posts 5 minutes worth of work, not to mention that you can`t tell how much time someone spends on a post.

I looked back at my posts and I don't see me being rude to you anywhere, insulting ideas? This is a conversation the fact you think anything which denys your ideas being right is insulting means you don't belong on the forum.

Telling the forum too isolate you? I say that trying to talk to you is silly because you continue to say, "are you even reading my post" which i assure I read then reread before I go to reply, I look at it from your point of view*, but do you read anyone elses post? or do you click Quote then spray denials too anything which "insults" your ideas.

Just btw your story earlier about dating a girl while in college I've read it 3 times and have NO IDEA at some parts at what your saying, absolutely none.

"browse your posts again and check who's the one who started to use vulgar words and insulted ideas... actions have consequences... if you insult me or my idea, then i'm more experienced in insulting a person... i admit i insulted you, but don't come clean that you started it..."

Just because you asked for proof before here you go, "then i'm more experienced in insulting a person" What? this doesn't make sense, "i admit i insulted you, but don't come clean that you started it" are you saying I should come clean that I started the insults? either way I didn't. Also forum rules state that you shall not insult others, this doesn't mean if you get pushed you can push back, this means if you get pushed report him and have him banned.

And about making things up about Mangafox to make you look bad, I honestly mean no malice towards you when I said that, It doesn't disprove any of your ideas too say your link is dangerous, but REALLY I have gotten a virus from Mangafox, its not a case of slandering you, its just the truth.

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

@ Mentar
actually i'm also tired of circling around, so this is my last post so we can move on...

-all of these arguments started about eba's mistakes, and these quotes are straying and just prolonged it all... these mess were caused by eba's timidness and poor decisions. that's the reason we put our personal views on what she could have done to avoid these (e.g. She could have just told kazama that she's dating a guy in Hiroshima, then she could have avoided hurting haruto and pity date kazama)... if we dont put our personal views, then read the manga silently and say "ok, there's drama"... and also, if we will just use the "nobody is perfect" reasoning, then again, read the manga silently and just say "ok, i've read it", because no one can answer that...

Originally Posted by Mentar

No, she did NOT admit that she "made a mistake", she apologized for making him suffer in the past. Can't you get it inside your head that there is a huge difference between both things? You're acting like you are a more unpleasant type of Haruto, and only see things through the eyes of "I HAVE BEEN WRONGED!!" - while seething with jealousy.

Yes, her actions have caused grief to Yamato, and she recognizes that and apologizes for it. At the same time, she has brought some happiness to a dying friend. Feel free to badmouth that all you want, I won't stand for that.

i understand your explanations.. still, she chose apple over a banana. while eating the apple, she thinks of banana and how tasty it is... now that she can't eat banana, she's crying "i really liked banana from the start"...

Originally Posted by Mentar

To be polite, I won't comment on your personal experiences. Let's just say that if you consider the awkward final meeting of them before the Tokyo splitup as "lovey-dovey", I'm not in the least surprised that you were surprised when things broke for you, because you don't seem to read warning signs very well (no slight intended). So, we'll have to agree and disagree.

there was no warning, even her close friends were shocked... so i received a lot of support from her friends(she's in the experimentation stage), more than her... so, u misread me...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Of COURSE she did. And OF COURSE he knew about that - she had turned him down again and again, and he had to play the dying wish card to get her to give in. You seriously think that Kazama thought she'd suddenly fall in love with him romantically? For real?

The point is that even though Kazama KNEW it was out of sympathy right from the start, he STILL enjoyed and desired her presence. The feeling of having someone dear to you near you in your last days is an IMMENSE comfort. That's exactly why I've been saying for ages that you're misreading the Kazama-Yuzuki linkup. This isn't about a standard adolescent romance trying to get into each others' pants. This is about care and comfort of a dying guy, and a fulfilment of his wish. By doing so, she caused Haruto alot of pain, and she regrets that. But that does not change that she did a great deed for Kazama

That is only in your head because you misunderstand the relationship, Kazama never said that. He _always_ would have loved to win her over romantically too - yes - but even though he knew that she's not feeling for him like this too, he STILL pulled her to himself, and he STILL didn't "give her back". If he can't have her love him romantically, he'd STILL prefer her to be his girlfriend even without these feelings. If you were correct, he would release her. But you're wrong, and this is why he fights about her.

but because eba didnt told kazama that she has a BF (another mistake), that made the situation different...
Kazama's POV - i will have this girl, she's available, it wont hurt other people..

if he knewshe was dating someone, there will be a change on his POV.
it would be possible that he will think eba was already happy with his current BF and i don't want to ruin it...

Originally Posted by Mentar

See above, you're simply wrong. If your logic were correct, he would behave differently and release her. Your initial position was that Yuzuki's decision made him miserable (which is obviously wrong).

you assume that haruto was not involved with eba... eba is thinking of haruto while she's with Kazama, but it's her choice... what kazama doesnt know, is that eba is thinking of another guy... not until haruto told him...

my logic was correct about what a gf and a friend can do. he's expecting from eba some things that she can do as a GF and cannot do as a friend... if not, then just being a friend is ok...

Originally Posted by Mentar

The feeling of having someone for who you're the focus of her life. Someone who deeply cares for you, and who is beside you when death is approaching. Eba visited him nearly daily for long hours and was there for him. This goes way beyond what "normal friends" do.

Your focus on sexual privileges in a relationship feels a bit disturbing to me, sorry.

...and he didn't care at all when he learned that she had a boyfriend when he pushed her. Did he release her? No. It's a completely moot point for him.

Kiyomi could have visited her everytime if he wanted to...

kazama didnt care because when haruto came, kazama already has the upperhand, the choice was already made, he was chosen over haruto... so why would kazama return eba back to haruto?

Originally Posted by Mentar

Stop faking timelines. That was AFTER Haruto jumped into the pond and begged her with all his heart not to leave him. It was clearly NOT the outcome she expected. She planned to say goodbye, tell him the truth about her feelings, apologize for the grief she caused him, and then not see him again. Then she tossed the trinket in a symbolic act. It was only after Haruto completely freaked out and begged her to wait that she relented and said that.

read that chapter again... her real motive was to confess to haruto that she is inlove with him... you confess, you expect an answer... if she just wanted to say goodbye, even if haruto would say "i also love u" she will still go... so, she's expecting for an answer... that pendant thing has nothing to do with her real motive...

Originally Posted by Mentar

Yes, and she felt that she OWED HIM, that is why she decided to respect his decision and stay with him till his death. What is making this so hard to get into your head?

yes, that was her decision.. is there something wrong that she knew he will die?
people overreacted when i said that, "maybe she's just waiting for Kazama to die and just win haruto back again"... - i understand that this sounded very evil..

but look here, she respected his decision that he will die and take care of him until that time, so she knew there will be no future for both of them so they will just wait for his death and she'll be available again... now, she returns to haruto and confess hoping for a "yes" (this is what we call trying to win back, and she won)...

Originally Posted by Mentar

The opposite. It makes her a GREAT person, someone who is able and willing to sacrifice happiness of her own to care for a dying friend she feels indebted to. For some reason you seem unable to accept that she can accept to become his girlfriend clear-eyed knowing that she doesn't romantically love him and never will, and that he's going to die in one year. Because this is DOING HIM GOOD. You think that it caused him pity. Which is why you don't understand what was happening.

Well, that's a complete reversal from your initial position, let me quote you from earlier:

Haruto had a clear case of "bad luck" in unfortunate circumstances. Eba recognizes that. Still, doing what she did (care for Kazama) is nothing at all to be ashamed of. And Haruto isn't even blaming her. Only the hater faction is.

yes, kazama was happy, not because she was his GF, but because they supported him till death...not only eba but all his friends...

you're so called girlfriend doesnt love you, are you happy with that?

as ive said before, if Eba was just honest with kazama, there was no pity date, no break up with haruto, no pretendings... kazama, haruto, eba, kiyomi, and asuka were just happy that time because they considered everything for a dying guy...

[mangaf_cksdotcom]

@Bigspeed

dude, i provide links to help you understand my points. even it is written in that page, you still won't acknowledge it... and mangafox is a very familiar site.

we don't have all the time to write this posts, so we try to write when we are available. if there were misspellings or misuse of pronouns, it is not a very big issue and you can just replace it with those words in your mind... no need to cry over it.

when you started insulting a person, tendency would be a payback and expect it to be meaner... now you're acting all innocent and "i reported" stuff, it makes me wanna puke... so, stop insulting then people will also stop insulting you..

if you have problems with my ideas, try to give me the page number or the chapter, i'll look myself...

i'm also surprised that it is valid to post an entirely personal attack... again, you started it... and maybe you'll report me again for this and act like the victim...

i wont answer any personal arguments from you anymore... feel free to comment on KNIM, not how my grammar and spelling works...

[Tactics]

I'm almost scared by how things developed until now

Let's try to cooling down at first.

Why there's no poll like "Who's your favorite boys/girls ?" until now ?

[Lexxus]

Originally Posted by Tactics

I'm almost scared by how things developed until now

Let's try to cooling down at first.

Why there's no poll like "Who's your favorite boys/girls ?" until now ?

What's more I like to see is "Who's your most hated character?" lol

[Bigspeed]

Originally Posted by mangaf_cksdotcom

@Bigspeed

dude, i provide links to help you understand my points. even it is written in that page, you still won't acknowledge it... and mangafox is a very familiar site.

we don't have all the time to write this posts, so we try to write when we are available. if there were misspellings or misuse of pronouns, it is not a very big issue and you can just replace it with those words in your mind... no need to cry over it.

when you started insulting a person, tendency would be a payback and expect it to be meaner... now you're acting all innocent and "i reported" stuff, it makes me wanna puke... so, stop insulting then people will also stop insulting you..

if you have problems with my ideas, try to give me the page number or the chapter, i'll look myself...

i'm also surprised that it is valid to post an entirely personal attack... again, you started it... and maybe you'll report me again for this and act like the victim...

i wont answer any personal arguments from you anymore... feel free to comment on KNIM, not how my grammar and spelling works...

I agree with the know more personal arguements so here will be my last post, I ask that you just read it and understand my POV.

The mangafox thing if you use it without problem all the power too you I've had virus problems in the past I think we can agree to disagree.

About the grammer and things, I really dont mind you = u or because = cus the main problem is when I read it and it reads like "Walking back I was fesitival fun"
is this walking back to a fun festival? or walking back home from a fun festival? It really does make a difference, It isn't an attack on your ideas, it just makes it hard for me to read and understand your ideas.

I read all of my posts I DID NOT INSULT YOU, I Didn't, You openly attacked me with the whole parents thing and then you claimed I started it when I did no such thing.

An attack post? I was informing you that I was offended and was assuming you might apologize but instead you act like a kid and say " well he started it " When I didn't Granted the last sentence may have been abit rude but it really is the feeling I get from talking to you.

And while I'm here KNIM, while rereading my posts I reread yours and what you say changes as it goes, from Eba is useless, to Eba made a mistake, to Eba unintentionally confused Haruto, Read them yourself if you don't believe me, Then a again for all I know these might just be the misspellings and words I need to fix in my head, either way It shows your points are not very strong.

[AcroDave]

Spoiler for Chapter 142:

Hold her hand! HOLD HER HAND!!! Dammit Haruto!

Ahhhhhghgh..... Eba is so cute.

[cmgmcmg]

[QUOTE=AcroDave;3680578] Eba is so cute.

By far the best thing said in the past couple of posts :P