Character Discussion - Kallen

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Stretch5920

most of what they learned was true. Yeah, it was a bit onesided, but somehow I don't think Lelouch saying "um, yeah about euphy, my bad" is gonna cut it. Plus Lelouch didn't really care anymore. He was ready to die. He just did what he had to free Kallen of any suspicions.

Lelouch had it coming.

but the question is
does he still have it coming (after losing everything)

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

but the question is
does he still have it coming (after losing everything)

Everything he is losing is because of himself. No one else is to blame.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Everything he is losing is because of himself. No one else is to blame.

you mean everything he lost
not losing
becouse at this point he has nothing left
so under these conditions where he already lost everything
does he still have more coming to him

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

you mean everything he lost
not losing
becouse at this point he have nothing left
so under these conditions where he already lost everything
does he still have more coming to him

At this point? No. He can't lose anything else. So he has nothing else coming at him really. Hell, if he just stops being a dick, he can actually GAIN things again.

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Kallen said that because she wasn't in the meeting room. Remember what happened when SHE first found out who Zero really was? She ran off and left him at Suzaku's mercy because she was upset, pissed, and shocked. Why the fuck should the Black Knights be any different?

I agree man. Look at the suituation they're in. I mean they leader has lied to them, twisted their hopes and objectives for his own benefit, cause of Euphie's massacre, and if they turn him in they get Japan back.

one man<<<<<<<<<<one nation

[Stretch5920]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Hell, if he just stops being a dick, he can actually GAIN things again.

I really don't get why Lelouch can't understand this. It's not Rocket Science. Nunnally's, Kallen's, Suzaku's, Euphie's and Shirley's words just go in one ear and out the other. I'm gonna facepalm if C.C says it and he listens.

[MonkeyDude]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Kallen said that because she wasn't in the meeting room. Remember what happened when SHE first found out who Zero really was? She ran off and left him at Suzaku's mercy because she was upset, pissed, and shocked. Why the fuck should the Black Knights be any different?

I'll bite...

Well granted that the Black Knights aren't exactly made up of 17 year old girls who are in love-love with Zero... I would like to think that adults who hold a seat of power in a representative army of a coalition would rationalize things rather than act impulsively based on their emotions. The betrayal would have happened sooner or later, but at least let the man get a word in before you place him in front of a firing squad.


Since Lelouch pretty much waved a death flag near the end of the episode, I doubt Kallen x Lelouch would actually happen...but damnit girl you will not let that man enter the gates of hell as a virgin!

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

I agree man. Look at the suituation they're in. I mean they leader has lied to them, twisted their hopes and objectives for his own benefit, cause of Euphie's massacre, and if they turn him in they get Japan back.

one man<<<<<<<<<<one nation

The last part is insane.

BK could have continued without Zero with difficulty. But striking a deal with Britannia is shooting their own foot.

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

I'll bite...

Well granted that the Black Knights aren't exactly made up of 17 year old girls who are in love-love with Zero... I would like to think that adults who hold a seat of power in a representative army of a coalition would rationalize things rather than act impulsively based on their emotions. The betrayal would have happened sooner or later, but at least let the man get a word in before you place him in front of a firing squad.


Since Lelouch pretty much waved a death flag near the end of the episode, I doubt Kallen x Lelouch would actually happen...but damnit girl you will not let that man enter the gates of hell as a virgin!

the evidence was right in front of them and lulu did get to talk, in which he called them pawns

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

I'll bite...

Well granted that the Black Knights aren't exactly made up of 17 year old girls who are in love-love with Zero... I would like to think that adults who hold a seat of power in a representative army of a coalition would rationalize things rather than act impulsively based on their emotions. The betrayal would have happened sooner or later, but at least let the man get a word in before you place him in front of a firing squad.

He could have talked his way out of it if he wanted to. All he did was aggravate them even more when he said he used them all as pawns. He wanted to die. It is just that simple and he had NO way to wiggle out of this one. They are still human and still have feelings themselves. They put everything they had into trusting Zero and he turned around and spat on their faces with what they learned. How would you react if a friend of yours did that to you?

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

The last part is insane.

BK could have continued without Zero with difficulty. But striking a deal with Britannia is shooting their own foot.

after seeing freya?

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

after seeing freya?

Freya has nothing to do with it. Striking a deal with Britannia means severing themselves from the Chinese and Indian allies. This also means BK would be too weak to be a threat to anyone, so they wouldn't be able to keep Japan even if they tried.

Trying to bargain for a deal when you just threw all the cards you have away is suicide. Japan is lost to them either way. If BK lose military capability, there is no need to give them anything at all.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Freya has nothing to do with it. Striking a deal with Britannia means severing themselves from the Chinese and Indian allies. This also means BK would be too weak to be a threat to anyone, so they wouldn't be able to keep Japan even if they tried.

Trying to bargain for a deal when you just threw all the cards you have away is suicide. Japan is lost to them either way. If BK lose military capability, there is no need to give them anything at all.

*sigh* I posted it a page ago, but I will post it again anyway...

Again, you still seem to think that 1) The UNF will know the details, 2) would CARE, 3) wouldn't just fold up and try to make any type of peace treaty they can with Britannia after learning of FLEIJA, or 4) wouldn't agree with the BK's. Your views are too one-sided here I am afraid.

[MonkeyDude]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

the evidence was right in front of them and lulu did get to talk, in which he called them pawns

Originally Posted by Orga777

He could have talked his way out of it if he wanted to. All he did was aggravate them even more when he said he used them all as pawns. He wanted to die. It is just that simple and he had NO way to wiggle out of this one. They are still human and still have feelings themselves. They put everything they had into trusting Zero and he turned around and spat on their faces with what they learned. How would you react if a friend of yours did that to you?

You don't interrogate someone by using a firing squad, multiple spotlights, and some Britannian guy filming the whole thing as if you were already dead. They were even willing to shoot down Kallen along with Zero before he even called them pawns. Add to the fact that he called them pawns in the first place just so Kallen wouldn't have to die with him. Schneizel played his cards right and paranoia has set into the ranks of BK where they can't even distinguish from friend or foe anymore.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Orga777

*sigh* I posted it a page ago, but I will post it again anyway...

Again, you still seem to think that 1) The UNF will know the details, 2) would CARE, 3) wouldn't just fold up and try to make any type of peace treaty they can with Britannia after learning of FLEIJA, or 4) wouldn't agree with the BK's. Your views are too one-sided here I am afraid.

Why would they NOT care?

BK just unilaterally stopped the war on Britannia!

The UNF was created to fight Britannia. If they don't care about how BK suddenly gave up fighting, what are they fighting for?

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Why would they NOT care?

BK just unilaterally stopped the war on Britannia!

The UNF was created to fight Britannia. If they don't care about how BK suddenly gave up fighting, what are they fighting for?

Actually I think their goal was to stop Britannia from getting bigger

[MonkeyDude]

Originally Posted by Orga777

*sigh* I posted it a page ago, but I will post it again anyway...

Again, you still seem to think that 1) The UNF will know the details, 2) would CARE, 3) wouldn't just fold up and try to make any type of peace treaty they can with Britannia after learning of FLEIJA, or 4) wouldn't agree with the BK's. Your views are too one-sided here I am afraid.

This is assuming that Schneizel would keep his end of the bargain. The BK representatives of the meeting pretty much decided to abandon everything else just so they can have their little Japan back. I don't know about you, but I would obviously be pissed as the appointed second-in-command (Xingke) that I wasn't notified about all of this. Xingke would probably say NEVER just because Britannia tried to take his loli away

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

This is assuming that Schneizel would keep his end of the bargain. The BK representatives of the meeting pretty much decided to abandon everything else just so they can have their little Japan back. I don't know about you, but I would obviously be pissed as the appointed second-in-command (Xingke) that I wasn't notified about all of this. Xingke would probably say NEVER just because Britannia tried to take his loli away

Well the original goal of the BK was to get Japan back

[Stretch5920]

http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=70165

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

Actually I think their goal was to stop Britannia from getting bigger

And how exactly does the fact that the Japanese BK members quiting the war going to stop Britannia getting bigger? The deal is to spare Japan; there is nothing stopping China and India from being attacked.