2013-06-01, 21:37
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Link #2343 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
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Still feeling really sad for Senriyama even though I've already known the result beforehand.
 At first, I thought Awai's aim for first place and thus ignoring the chance to Ron from Himeko was too risky, but come to think of it, that was actually the right decision. If she Ron'ed from Himeko and (unexpectedly) missed the Kan Dora, the final score would be: Achiga: 111,500 Senriyama: 102,100 Shiraitodai: 99,500 Shindouji: 86,900 and Shiraitodai would get eliminated. Come to think of it again, if Shizu knew that Awai would only aim for first place, she wouldn't have to worry about being hit a Haneman from Awai and wouldn't have to do that thing (passing 1300 Ron in order to get 1100 Tsumo). Suppose that Shizu didn't do that, and the next turn Himeko still got Kazoe, the score before the final round would be: Achiga: 111,700 Senriyama: 102,600 Shindouji: 97,900 Shiraitodai: 87,800 If Awai directly wins a Haneman from Shizu, she will get second place by 100 points ahead of Achiga, but I'm pretty sure she won't do that even if she has a chance; she will try to get the first place instead. And if the game continues like before, after Riichi, Awai will immediately Ron from Himeko, thinking that it'll make her first place (100 points ahead of Achiga), but since she'll miss the Kan Dora, she'll get the third place; Achiga and Senriyama will advance. 
Last edited by seemmeriast; 2013-06-01 at 21:47. |
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2013-06-02, 00:28
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Link #2345 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Earth
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The kazoe yakuman that Himeko have is her only one and it happened on the second to the last round. And speaking of that. I still dislike that sequence. Let me add some thoughts to what Seemerias said. Let's start with Awai. The whole sequence showed us that Awai has an ego problem. Instead of going for the safer ron to Himeko, she opted for the riskier approach. Just because doing that will make her second.  The worse part as Seemerias said, if she actually did the logical thing and called a ron to Himeko, she'll fall to third place. As one of my favorite blog puts it, so "Awai wins because she's selfish and cocky?" Wth? >< Further realization will then set in that Shiraitodai, our nominal Final boss, almost missed the finals by hairbreadth and should have missed the finals without the contrivance.  I can almost forgive that sequence if it actually adds something positive. Like Shizu masterminded the whole thing, which the in-show audience seems to be implying. Remember that previous hand wherein Shizu passed a win to get a smaller one? If you looked at the score that Seemerias made, Shizu passing a win to get a smaller one didn't do anything to help their team. In fact, she would actually better served if she took the larger win because more points are always welcome, right?  If she did that, the net effect would be Awai thinking that she can ron Himeko which would then lead to Shiraitodai being kicked out of the tournament. No harmful effect to Achiga. In the end of this sequence we know:
So yeah. They did flesh out the players after all...
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2013-06-02, 05:45
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Link #2347 |
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Senior Member
 Author
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 42
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Here's my take on Shiraitodai (and I'm not just being tongue-in-cheek here):
I think that Teru's domination has made the rest of the team rusty. In other words, Teru either wipes out the competition before the rest of Shiraitodai can even play, or Teru gives them such a monumental lead that it's only natural for the rest of the team to play with ease and overconfidence the rest of the way. Shiraitodai probably hasn't had to put much actual strategy or thought into their matches for quite some time. They've just been obliterating the competition with a mixture of pure offense and hax powers. They've been successful at that for so long that they've probably forgot the meaning of the words "defensive mahjong".
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2013-06-02, 18:54
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Link #2349 | |
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Fax Caelestis
Join Date: Apr 2006
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This year they have 3 new players so it's no wonder they're not as dominant as their previous record would suggest. I really wonder why they switched up the positions. It doesn't seem like putting the Captain position in Awai's hands is a good idea. She's basically a more hack Yuuki what with her all offense, little defense strategy and unlike Yuuki, she hasn't been through enough difficulties to start to develop a more nuanced strategy.
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2013-06-02, 20:12
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Link #2350 |
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Moderate Haruhiist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Metro Manila, Philippines
Age: 42
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Correct me if I'm misremembering things from the manga, but Teru in the Vanguard was a relatively new thing -- as little as a single season really. Prior to the current season, she was in the Captain's position.
The change in positioning is likely due to the fact that there ARE newcomers on the team, as really she and Sumire are the only carryovers from the "champion" teams from two years prior.
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2013-06-02, 20:13
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Link #2351 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Earth
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Quote:
They haven't switched position. Teru has been heavily implied to be the vanguard of Shiraitodai especially last year. Sumire has been the second player for that tournament as well. To be honest, if the two of them has not been nerfed, the combination of both they're abilities will put Shiraitodai as the top team. Perhaps not in this tournament which I'm beginning to think is one of a kind but in the previous tournament. And as much as I'm disappointed in Awai, she's technically the 2nd strongest in Shiraitodai. I can imagine putting Takami and heck Seiko in Awai's position and Shiraitodai will be in more dire straights when the captain rounds come up. Besides I have to admit, even with Awai's ridiculous decisions taken account, her power was still strong enough that the bulk of the captain round was pretty much 2 (Ryuuka, Himeko) vs. 1 against her. The one problem that Shiraitodai has, I think, is the team selection strategy. The one where they build their team on some sort of "theme." In this case, offence. Not only it makes their team entirely predictable. You get a very inflexible approach to a problem. The one thing they should do when they get boat loads of points from Teru's massacre was defend those points or kill another team quickly so the match will end. Since they can't do the latter due to their team strategy for this round and their opponents' own strength. They need to do the former but they have also proven to be unsuitable to this "defense" thing because most of their players are offense oriented. Thus, we have this match...
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2013-06-03, 02:46
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Link #2352 |
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Critical fanboy
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Anywhere with anime and anime discussion is fine
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The problem I see with most Shiraitodai players are they tend to rely too much on their hex thus limitting their flexibility, that and Seiko and Awai's defense are not that strong. Seiko relies to much on terminal and horner tiles discards when defense, and Awai's overusage of richi. In Awai's case, it's understandable since she didn't expect Ryuuka and latter Shizu to become a threat.
Another thing, it's seems Shiraitodai opperates in the very different manner from Kiyosumi. While Kiyosumi tries to hide their players ability by finishing the game asap, Shiraitodai tries to collect as much data from their opponents by drawn out the match to the captain round. The former strategy is good for throwing out element of surprises to caught the opponents off guard, but not good for clever players who can quickly improvise their playstyle and strategy. The latter is riskier, but good for getting the grip of your opponents, but the same can be said with your opponents. Actually, it's quite fortunate that Shiraitodai found out their weaknesses in the semi and still manage to advance, so they can perform better in the finals. Last edited by teja208; 2013-06-03 at 03:06. |
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2013-06-07, 02:15
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Link #2353 |
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=^^=
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: 42° 10' N (Latitude) 87° 33' W (Longitude)
Age: 45
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http://tenhou.net/0/?log=2013060715g...-2e19128d&tw=2
The very first hand. That's how Saki vs Awai may turn out.  
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2013-06-11, 18:14
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Link #2355 | |
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Fax Caelestis
Join Date: Apr 2006
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2013-06-11, 18:54
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Link #2356 |
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Moderate Haruhiist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Metro Manila, Philippines
Age: 42
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Yep, people forget that Teru WASN'T always the Vanguard, and her current position is only as recent as the Spring placings (where Senriyama became 2nd overall). Prior to Awai, she played in the Captain's chair, so there is some merit to the theory that Shiraitodai's current line-up was influenced by most of Teru and Sumire's old team either retiring or graduating.
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2013-06-11, 22:13
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Link #2357 | ||
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Earth
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Forgive me. But, I'll just be a tiny bit stubborn about this.
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I think people are forgetting there are two tournaments. One is of course the Interhigh and the other the unnamed Winter/Spring Tournament. Teru wasn't definitely the vanguard when Toki joined Senriyama for the Winter/Spring tournament. Remember, Toki joined after the Interhigh. This is why Teru and Toki only battled it out for this current tournament. Anyway, I do agree that Teru could have been the captain player or any other position except Vanguard for this particular tournament. But, do note, that it is a change of the normal line-up for Shiraitodai which has been explicitly said in the text. But, for the last year Interhigh, it has been heavily implied that Teru was the vanguard. But, even if it was not the case, one of the position that Teru could not be in is the Captain. Remember what Ryuuka said when she narrated how the team lost to Toki? That they were already behind by so much points before her turn came to play. Ryuuka was the captain in the last year interhigh and that line implied Miyanaga Teru played a position before captain. I chose Vanguard for Teru's position in the last year's interhigh primarily because of Shindouji. Mairu is the vanguard player last year and implied to have lost badly to other aces. We know that Teru has used her magic mirror on Mairu before. So yeah. So in summary, if you don't want to read the text. For last year's tournament Teru's position is: Interhigh = Definitely not the Captain, heavily implied to be the Vanguard. Winter/Spring Tournament = Definitely not the Vanguard, Shiraitodai has a change of lineup.
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2013-07-01, 06:12
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Link #2359 | |
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Yuri µ'serator
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: FL, USA
Age: 36
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1 Yuu 2 Shizuno 3 Ako 4 Kuro 5 Arata Though that's my opinion on their mahjong ability .
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| mahjong, nopan, seinen, sport, yuri |
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