2008-08-19, 06:34 | Link #61 | |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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What I'm more concerned of is that this "we'll quickly sign a legal note that Funi may enforce our rights and send out mass C&Ds in our stead" approach will spread. Especially since a growing number of industry representatives seem to agree with the overall direction. Because if this gains traction and is only seen as a "success" by the licenceholders, things can get very ugly very quick. It's entirely up to them to defend their rights, let me be very clear about that. I only believe that doing so while not offering a credible alternative might be very harmful to us. That's what I'm warning of. |
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2008-08-19, 07:13 | Link #62 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
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In my opinion, anime distributors are not being honest at all. They are claiming that they decide to license a series based only on a few episodes.
In practice, they typically license only after an anime has finished airing, or in the case of long-running series such as Kateikyoushi Hitman Reborn!, they want to send C&Ds (not even licensing) two years after the show began airing. I think this is because they obviously look at download numbers, and specifically batch torrent downloads, before deciding to license a series. Because of this, their sales obviously suffer when they wait two years for some series to even start considering whether or not to license. This latest tactic of sending C&Ds is dangerous and could potentially blow up in their faces. They are basically saying: OK, from now on you should patiently await for about 1, 1.5 years to infinity for us to even license some titles, let alone publish them, and you'd better be thankful for it. In effect, they are asking for people to stop watching the anime they like for the (potentially) 1.5 - 2 years it takes for them to publish it, while maintaining the faith that they WILL BE licensed and distributed. Also, they assume that fansubs are only viewed in the regions of the world where they distribute them, which IMHO is not true. For example, in my country, there are a few DVDs of Akira and the like available, and they are around 40 USD a disc. |
2008-08-19, 07:25 | Link #63 | ||
Just call me Ojisan
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: U.K. Hampshire
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Posts like the one above are going to get deleted, so please get a clue what the purpose of this thread is for before posting. |
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2008-08-19, 08:02 | Link #64 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
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The first part of post was in reply to
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By the way, has there been an official announcement from d-rights and Enoki Films regarding these, and if so a link to it in English? |
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2008-08-19, 09:05 | Link #65 |
It's bacon!
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Up and to the Left
Age: 43
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FUNimation Talks Cease & Desists
http://www.mania.com/funimation-talk...cle_86894.html |
2008-08-19, 10:44 | Link #66 |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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From the referenced press release:
Industry watchers and anime fans have long known our stance on the unauthorized distribution of anime, especially prior to localization. The practices of illegal downloads and 'fansubbing' are very harmful to our Japanese partners and as part of the longstanding relationship between FUNimation and d-rights and Enoki Films, we have been asked to monitor and take action against unauthorized distribution of these titles. Because we believe that this will benefit the industry, we have agreed to do so." Good luck with that theory guys.... and I've yet to see any significant established harm to the japanese partners. Yes, they're perfectly within their rights.... just as a store owner may force me to leave the establishment for no apparent reason. However, there isn't any evidence that it will "benefit the industry".
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2008-08-19, 11:13 | Link #67 |
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2006
Age: 38
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Analogies...
As I've said earlier, DVD sales are down partly because of piracy that is shrinking the casual consumer market for home video (it's not just anime that's affected here). How this hurts the Japanese is the amount of money--upfront fees and royalties--that they can reasonably demand in licensing agreements. This revenue stream is by no means insignificant, considering a niche show like Bamboo Blade only cost about 130k per episode to produce. What they demanded for anime licenses in 2004 was most likely out of proportion, so prices had to go down, but piracy is another factor which lowers it even further down. Of course, we mustn't forget that Japanese still value the thought of having control over their content, so this might not be such a trivial point for them as everyone wants to make it. |
2008-08-19, 15:29 | Link #68 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
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And I believe the logic goes something like "If we can reduce the number of illegal copies floating around to begin with, people will have a harder time finding it and may instead resort to buying the product." Quote:
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2008-08-19, 17:22 | Link #70 |
AS Oji-kun
Join Date: Nov 2006
Age: 74
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I've always been a bit puzzled by the concern over reverse importation. All these series have been shown on television, so Japanese viewers can already watch, and record, this material themselves. (No one criticizes Konata-chan's anime recording habit in Lucky Star; if anything, it's treated like a normal occurrence.) Then there's the fact that the raws are also available on torrents. Fansubs don't change this situation.
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2008-08-19, 18:37 | Link #71 | |||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
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1) They are not going to C&D all shows for a while and there are going to be more and more legal alternatives as we go along. 2) The R1 industry already complains that after a show has ended, the audience just runs off to another show giving them a very small window of time to actually be able to capitalize off the fansub crowd. Therefore, what's stopping them from doing the same with a C&D or the title getting licensed? Ex: All the people brand new to the slayers series can watch the first season on FUNi's youtube channel. (Mostly rhetorical question and half-serious example, I'm well aware of the answer.) For split season shows (Geass/00), the majority of the fandom stops caring about the show between seasons and yet suddenly they can't do it when there is an artificially split season. (Desire to be current, etc.) Quote:
I won't even bother debating the streaming point since I know your position on it except saying that youtube h.264 HQ, niconico mp4 HQ, or southparkstudios or similar should be perfectly fine quality for anyone currently watching SD fansubs. Most shows are not HD and most of Japan does not watch them in HD, and yet people complain as if everything exists in HD. (Ex: Druaga ) Also, $200 a month for DVDs? I don't think anyone is asking people to spend that much. 5 series will cost $40/month at $2/ep which is the going online price for SD DTO episodes. (Note: Since people don't seem to be clear on it, my position is not everyone must buy the DVDs. It's "Put your money where your mouth is if you like a series".) Quote:
Also, re previous post, Narutofan and Tazmo's other sites. Last edited by bayoab; 2008-08-20 at 05:15. Reason: Late ninja edit to fix memory of ADV |
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2008-08-19, 22:17 | Link #72 |
Rare Spawn
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belgium, land of the waffle
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The fact is, pushing out a C&D to fansubbers, while people are not offered an alternative will only lead to one thing...
Mentar's prediction #1, which has come true already today...whoever the people are behind subbing one of these shows now are 100% unknown. Same remark I made in the beginning, everything will go underground, which is going to work against the goal of these C&D notices! A solution to the current situation is something that needs to be worked out between rights holders and the "fans", not a one sided attempt to sidestep the problem. edit: To clarify, in my opinion, there is a big difference between licensing a series and sending a C&D to fansubbers. I always thought a series getting licensed by a company was a nod towards the community that the series are coming out and to knock off the fansubbing...it's not confrontational, while a C&D is imho very much so. |
2008-08-20, 15:20 | Link #74 | |
Senior Member
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-Tofu |
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2008-11-22, 16:48 | Link #75 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
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New waves of C&D letters are going out. What appears to be covered so far:
D.Gray-man (All - FUNi is the licensor). Soul Eater (for MFI) Eva Rebuild 1.0 (for NTV) There are supposedly at least 5 more titles. Last edited by bayoab; 2008-11-22 at 19:08. |
2008-11-22, 17:14 | Link #76 | |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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I'm not totally horrified since I suspect there's a huge chance of Soul Eater being licensed and its had almost several dozen episodes put out ....
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Update: yeah... lots of torrents suddenly have gone missing :P
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Last edited by Vexx; 2008-11-22 at 23:05. |
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2008-11-22, 22:32 | Link #77 |
Hina is my goddess
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Are they determined, stupid, or just trying to show they want to do anything about the problem. Thing is, this essentially changes nothing. In a few weeks anonymous fansubs will release and stream the series. This wont stop people. What crunchy and the makers of naruto did, will. They provide a legal form in a way they can make money, and the funsubbers respect them and shut down.
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