(CR) Sangatsu no Lion [anticipation]

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Haak

Seriously? Can't think of anyone else that would profit from it? This is on their official website by the way.

Yes, and? Umino Chica is a successful mangaka. She's famous, critically acclaimed, her manga sell very well. Sangatsu no Lion in particular is a famous, acclaimed, popular manga. There's no reason at all for her (or her publisher, for that matter) to go out of her way to pretend she's OMG SO HAPPY about an adaptation if she doesn't feel like that, not even for PR.

And for that matter, Shaft don't exactly need her endorsement either. They're also very successful, famous and well-regarded in the circles where they need to be famous and well-regarded. People who watch everything they do will watch this show, too; people who like the manga* will watch it anyway, just to see what Shaft do with it; people who have no horse in this race will check it out to see what the drama is about; casual viewers will not give a damn and either watch it or not depending on whether they're interested in the story or not. Either way, a lot of people are likely to watch their show anyway, with or without Umino Chica's endorsement. (*And for that matter a lot of people who like the manga don't really watch anime so they won't care about Shaft one way or another.)

Originally Posted by Haak

So you're telling me that she genuinely worships Shaft, that this is a dream come true and she would've refused any other studio? I think that requires far more explanation than a manufactured PR statement.

Why is it difficult to believe that she likes Shinbou and Shaft? A lot of people do. Why is she not allowed to love the shows she listed, just because she's Umino Chica and she's not supposed to like such a horrible studio and their horrible works? /sarcasm

Btw, I think you're taking her comment more seriously than it was intended, perhaps due to the loose translation from above. It's just along the lines of "oh wow, I love this guy's works so much, and I always wanted my manga to be one day adapted by his studio, and now it's happening! Wow, I'm so happy!" She doesn't say "worshipped", that's just the translator exaggerating (literally it just says she loves those shows directed by Shinbou "so very very much"). And she doesn't say she would've refused any other studio, she just says it was her dream for he manga to be adapted by Shinbou&Shaft, and if it wasn't to be she wouldn't have wanted an anime at all. (Note the nuance in tone.) And of course she's not just supporting Shinbou himself in the end but the whole project and the people working on it.

It's not an ode to Shinbou the Great, it's just an excited comment.

Again, I'm not a Shaft/Shinbou fan at all, and I'm also boggling at the news and the choice of studio, but let's not pretend there's some sort of grand conspiracy and the evil production team is holding a gun to the poor mangaka's head or something...

[HosannaExcelsis]

If someone was holding a gun to Chica Umino's head, they must have been holding it since 2013, when she drew an endcard for Monogatari Series Second Season:

[Haak]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Yes, and? Umino Chica is a successful mangaka. She's famous, critically acclaimed, her manga sell very well. Sangatsu no Lion in particular is a famous, acclaimed, popular manga. There's no reason at all for her (or her publisher, for that matter) to go out of her way to pretend she's OMG SO HAPPY about an adaptation if she doesn't feel like that, not even for PR.

And for that matter, Shaft don't exactly need her endorsement either. They're also very successful, famous and well-regarded in the circles where they need to be famous and well-regarded. People who watch everything they do will watch this show, too; people who like the manga* will watch it anyway, just to see what Shaft do with it; people who have no horse in this race will check it out to see what the drama is about; casual viewers will not give a damn and either watch it or not depending on whether they're interested in the story or not. Either way, a lot of people are likely to watch their show anyway, with or without Umino Chica's endorsement. (*And for that matter a lot of people who like the manga don't really watch anime so they won't care about Shaft one way or another.)

By that logic, there wouldn't be any point in having the adaptation or for either side to bother at all with any hyping because neither of them care. But the reality is that they do still care even if they're plenty profitable already. One manufactured PR statement is hardly going out of the way.

Why is it difficult to believe that she likes Shinbou and Shaft? A lot of people do. Why is she not allowed to love the shows she listed, just because she's Umino Chica and she's not supposed to like such a horrible studio and their horrible works? /sarcasm

Why is it so difficult to make a point without it being twisted into a strawman? Did I say SHAFT was a horrible studio and that nobody should like them? Nope. Is it unfathomable that Umino would be a SHAFT fan? Not at all. I'd much rather believe that Umino has gone off her rocker than to think she's being forced into anything. I was originally more than happy to wait for a PV before making any judgements (and still am). But when a comment like that is released that really goes out of its way to emphasise how much of a perfect choice Shaft was and how much support she has, I couldn't help but think it might be trying to compensate for something. If that's down to a misleading translation then fair enough but I never said anything about holding a gun to a mangaka's head so please don't put words in my mouth.

And she doesn't say she would've refused any other studio, she just says it was her dream for he manga to be adapted by Shinbou&Shaft, and if it wasn't to be she wouldn't have wanted an anime at all. (Note the nuance in tone.)

I'm not seeing the difference but whatever...

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Haak

By that logic, there wouldn't be any point in having the adaptation or for either side to bother at all with any hyping because neither of them care. But the reality is that they do still care even if they're plenty profitable already. One manufactured PR statement is hardly going out of the way.

That's not the point I was making. Umino Chica is not someone who is in a situation to feel the need to fake enthusiasm and make up lies just to... well, for what reason, really? To comfort what is a relatively small segment of internet fandom that is going "omg nooooo Shaft is going to butcher this"? On the other hand, Shaft is also not a studio that needs to seek endorsement from the mangaka whose work they're adapting, just to assure the same relatively small and unimportant segment of fandom that it's going to be OK.

The manga will stay popular anyway, and people will watch the show anyway, and Shaft will do whatever they do, with or without Umino Chica's enthusiastic endorsement. So there's no point in her faking enthusiasm. (Plus, this being NHK and Sangatsu no Lion, the most likely main target of this show probably won't be otaku, at least not the sort who have Opinions about Shaft and Shinbou.)

Originally Posted by Haak

Why is it so difficult to make a point without it being twisted into a strawman?

Sorry, I was being sarcastic, I thought it was obvious... But what with people being all "ah, ye poor naive souls" and "Seriously? Can't you see this is all fake?" (paraphrased) and so on, apparently with complete conviction, toward others for not thinking that this is some sort of elaborate PR scam, it's hard not to get a bit too "into it". :P

Originally Posted by Haak

I'm not seeing the difference but whatever...

I can't help with that, then. Maybe someone will do a better translation that gets the tone and the actual meaning across.

[vaden]

Originally Posted by Haak

Frankly that statement sounded like North Korean propaganda to me.

Stop. Really, stop. This is such a poor comparison it makes me wonder if you know how either propaganda or business work.

Umino, as has been mentioned in other posts, is a massively successful artist. She could easily have refused to allow an adaptation if she didn't want one — the manga has been running for years and is quite popular, so one has to imagine that she's been approached and decided to hold off at least a handful of times. Besides, if you think this kind of discord between the production staff and the author of the original work can be kept out of sight for too long, you're willfully ignoring the examples brought up in this very thread of authors speaking out about what they see as poor treatment in adaptation.

Let's use Occam's Razor: How many people need to be in on this, but keeping their mouths shut, if (1) Umino's statement is genuine, and (2) Umino's statement is fabricated for marketing purposes? What benefit could lying confer to the anime, considering that both Umino and Shinbou already have solid reputations (and presumably cash flow), and any revelation would only do harm instead of good? In fact, if you're on staff, you have an incentive to leak any sign that things are going poorly, because gossip from behind the scenes of a show that's this high-profile is going to be quite in demand.

It's just so difficult to imagine anyone seriously thinking that Shinbo's "Monogatari" style would be a good fit for this story, as that comment seems to (worryingly) hint. That's probably the biggest give away to me. Not even the Shaft defenders on this forum have argued such a thing. Instead you've all suggested it would be toned down, practically admitting that such a combination couldn't work.

This has nothing to do with "SHAFT defenders" and everything to do with the poor assumption, brought into this discussion from the moment SHAFT was announced as the studio, that somehow a Monogatari Series rehash would be inevitable. Of course it's not. People are capable of doing more than one thing, and anime direction is not a linear spectrum with "normal" (whatever that means) on one side and Monogatari on the other. Yes, even with Shinbou.

And I don't know what you mean by you can think of a "million things more reasonable".Your argument would be that there is one thing more reasonable (that she's telling the truth). Anything else would mean that she's being dishonest which is as exactly reasonable as what Enzo is saying.

If you take figurative language this literally, I'm beginning to understand why you're having difficulty interpreting Umino's comments.

[ahelo]

Wow @SHAFT hate. Though the source material and the production studio obviously don't seem to mesh very well at first glance (or 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th) and while I am a pretty huge fan of both, I just can't process how it'll work well. I love SHAFTs little tricks here and there but would that work with something as restrained as Sangatsu no Lion where I would probably want as little directional interference from the source material as much as possible BUT everyone's judging way too much right now.

I'd like to think this material is insanely heavy for SHAFT to f*ck up. And I have never seen SHAFT team up with NHK so obviously everyone know even the studio that this is something out of their comfort zones. I'm nervous but at the same time excited on what's to come.

Originally Posted by moodie

it seems like ppl are just projecting their own hate

yes she likes shaft and they chose shaft

i don't get whats so hard to understand. do ppl even know how anime gets made?

besides they are many manga out there that the author refused for anime adaption because it didn't fit their vision

^^Definitely this. Just because the author has made some of the most exquisite manga in the past decade does no way mean her taste in anime/manga would be the same. Also Chica Umino does seem to be a weird artsy person so looking back, hey why not SHAFT after all.

[moodie]

while it isnt confirmed...just looking at the history with nhk shows it tends to be 2 cour series so im guessing we might have another shaft 2 cour series soon. hopefully it can pull viewership because nhk series dont tend to sell much. im very curious to see which in house character designer they will use. my guess is Nobuhiro Sugiyama.

sorry i bumped this even tho there isnt any news im just a fan of shaft.

[kuromitsu]

NHK don't exactly need to worry about ratings and sales. I mean they're NHK. Chances are that Sangatsu no Lion is going to be pretty popular, though.

(Phi Brain got 3(!) 25 episode(!!) series.)

[com_gwp]

Originally Posted by ahelo

Wow @SHAFT hate. Though the source material and the production studio obviously don't seem to mesh very well at first glance (or 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th) and while I am a pretty huge fan of both, I just can't process how it'll work well. I love SHAFTs little tricks here and there but would that work with something as restrained as Sangatsu no Lion where I would probably want as little directional interference from the source material as much as possible BUT everyone's judging way too much right now.

I don't understand the direction you're pulling this in.

EDIT: Slowpoke post.

[kyuudere]

Key Visual :

http://3lion-anime.com/

[Guardian Enzo]

Rarely with an oncoming anime have I prayed so hard for a miracle. That 1% chance Shinbou won't fuck this up is a thin thread to cling to, but I can't help but grasp at it.

[MeoTwister5]

Well there's fidelity to the original designs and no signs of SHAFT-isms on that key visual so... yay?

Maybe this will be the show where SHAFT can prove that they can also NOT be SHAFT.

[moodie]

HOLY SHIT THIS IS BEAUTIFUL.

I can always count on shaft for amazing character designs. Lets see this baby in motion. Hope the staff is announced soon. Hate seeing the random Shaft hate but hey this is the internet. I am excited beyond belief because this is shaft.

[Guardian Enzo]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

Well there's fidelity to the original designs and no signs of SHAFT-isms on that key visual so... yay?

Maybe this will be the show where SHAFT can prove that they can also NOT be SHAFT.

There were times in the hazy past when Shinbou wasn't so consumed in the ourobouros of self-aware pandering that he produced stuff with a whiff of the original material intact - Natsu no Arashi and Soredemo Machi wa Mawatteiru come to mind (I liked both a lot). I just think the evidence suggests with the commercial success SHAFT has become such a caricature of itself that such moderation is no longer possible. I guess Sangatsu - an incredibly popular source material with a distinctive voice of its own - will be the true test.

[moodie]

To be fair we havent even seen a PV to be making any judgements. Shaft is known for accurate character designs. If Naoyuki Tatsuwa (nisekoi, soredemo, koufuku) is directing this than we can expect something tame from shaft. If we get a group effort from shaft like the good ole days we can expect something wacky. But based on the source its probably going to be a tame adaption.

[MeoTwister5]

Well I have a love-hate thing with his work. My experiences with Shinbou work tend to be radically different from majority of people because my very first Shinbou show was, strangely enough, Starship Girl Yamamoto Yohko. That was back in the late 90's. In my experience so far I haven't met anyone who can claim the same.

And because that show is one of my more closet favorites of my growing up years even today that I usually don't admit to other anime watchers, I can never really say that I don't like his work. SGYY already showed a lot of his style (the titular character also... twists her neck around a lot, not to mention the flat and wide static shots) before he became famous so... yeah.

[Dragonria]

Studio and Director already posted somewhere in page 02

Character Design: Sugiyama Nobuhiro
Art settings: Yasuhiro Nakura
Art Director: Seiki Tamura
Sound Director: Toshiki Kameyama
Music: Yukari Hashimoto
Production: 3-gatsu no lion anime Production Committee

[ahelo]

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

There were times in the hazy past when Shinbou wasn't so consumed in the ourobouros of self-aware pandering that he produced stuff with a whiff of the original material intact - Natsu no Arashi and Soredemo Machi wa Mawatteiru come to mind (I liked both a lot). I just think the evidence suggests with the commercial success SHAFT has become such a caricature of itself that such moderation is no longer possible. I guess Sangatsu - an incredibly popular source material with a distinctive voice of its own - will be the true test.

I get the worry, even if I'm a SHAFT fan, but on the plus side, SHAFT hasn't adapted anything in the past 5 years that warranted them to go tame in terms of visuals/animation until now. I seriously doubt SHAFT is stupid enough (well..) to disrespect this kind of material. Seeing the staff list so far (it's actually pretty impressive?? I can't wait for Yukari Hashimoto's soundtrack) makes me a little more confident that SHAFT knows what its doing.

All in all, I say, let's just wait for a PV before we can judge further (actually I don't really care, the manga is too precious for me not to watch this adaptation + I actually love SHAFT).

[Soliloquy]

Lately I have avoided the recent offerings of Shaft because I'm also not too fond of the too much shinboism in his work either. But I want to give them the benefit of the doubt that they can restrain themselves when necessary. Judging by that staff list, I think they realise that the source material "Sangatsu No Lion" probably comes close to "Natsu No Arashi" bit more introspective and earnest without hardly any wacky and off-the-wall atmosphere.

So far Shaft has mostly adapted Monogatari series which if I'm not mistaken even the source material is wordy and quite otaku-pandering in nature. Thus, Shaft had the complete freedom to adapt the series however they want and make a lot of profit while doing that. Now they have established their brands to the wider audience, they don't have to pander to the particular demographic. I already am thinking that Shaft will give the full respect to the source and adapt it to match the same atmosphere of the manga. What I'm really worried about is how the casting will look like. I really hope instead of casting the usual uber-famous seiyuu, they explore the seiyuu pool more.

[DragoonKain3]

I haven't watched any of the Monogatari's save the first one, but as a manga reader, I've been relatively happy in how Nisekoi didn't feel so much like 'shaft'. Believe me, I've always had a personal disdain against Shaft/Shinbou ever since Tsukuyomi (I believe I've always likened his works as Powerpoint Presentations ), but seems like he has mellowed out a bit recently.

Not only that, but this is an NHK series. If anything, I'm actually glad Shinbou is directing (yeah I can't believe that's coming from me) considering I've been bored to tears from all NHK series since... well... the first LogHora in 2013. I'm not expecting a masterpiece like IMO Beast Player Erin, but at least I don't think it will be a disaster. Hopefully Shinbou spices it just a bit. XD

So yeah, colour me hyped about this series. Never touched a page of the manga, but I've always believed it will get an anime as Umino's next big hit. With the departure of Saekano till next year, this has become my most anticipated anime barring Macross Delta. Glad to see that it's airing date has been set.