Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Character Creation and Discussion (second reincarnation)

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Arkeus

O.o?

So the individual author has no say, but should align with the majority?

No thanks.

Yes, it's important to have something that make sense.

No, we shouldn't all agree on the same power levels and abilities, as those aren't shown clearly, especially in those two mangas.

Mysef, i see the knights being *way* stronger than Kaede in HtH, and i don't see Eva as being out of range of some of the Nanoha cast either.

Hell, i was surprised that com said something about Nanoha needing to go Excellion mode in Kyoto arc (her own different style of magic should be enough to distract "Fate", and a basic Toral Break Seal Starlight Breaker should Seal the Demon).

Different people see different things in the same place, and it's difficult to say who is right when we don't really have the whole backstory.

We may try and fill in the holes, but it is more than plausible that we do it badly anyway :XD

I cant believe that PhoenixFlare's post has flown over everyone's heads because there are one part I fucking second.

Originally Posted by PhoenixFlare

Considering the effect of this sentence, Comartemis, it's very difficult to find any room for genial resolution for discussions, if any, in the future. Essentially, we all play in one big sandbox that is 7'Arcs's Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha. Whatever shortcomings present in their narration and/or canon, we follow regardless and, if possible, we find reasonable improvements for them.

If you are going to create an alternate sandbox that differs from that being played by the majority, it's rather difficult to settle any disputes since it's your sandbox, and anything in the current canon can be bent to fit it in, regardless of the significance of the change. In essence, what can and has been changed is the original canon, not yours. The thread accepts AUs, true, but only has a limited threshold before they no longer becomes the Nanoha that we recognize. At that point, discussions held are solely for the point of novelty, not for any enrichment of the original canon.

While I do believe that you try to bend as little as you can, there are times when we are whimsically at need to change things so that our works can go on. You can have spells that break the laws of physics, but because it's your sandbox, we can only touch, but not change them, unless you change them yourself.

This is where I fully agree. And the recent chat with the responsible of this crossover made me wonder why he need us and why he needs to come here and ask if he just gonna play by his own rules. It has NOTHING to do with some kind of clique shit or anything, for one, I refuse to bend over and accept references that are generally accepted by the thread and makes everyone go gaga (HOTBLOOD, the underlying need and pressure to make everything EPIC, demi-gods, gods bent on the destruction of humanity). So no, it has nothing to do with the evil plans of The Patriots in IRC. It's questioning, why asking for our opinion since he will just make up whatever he want in his own sandbox.

Now, I gonna go in a tangent. Months ago, I also came in this thread with the pretense to show how differently I see the Nanohaverse and what lies beyond Mid and Earth, and how Belka has come to existence (hell, I have started my own take on Ancient Belka in the first OCT, but I sorta give it up because apparently NO ONE GIVES A SHIT! Surely because it is not ZOMGEPIC enough). But as far as I am concerned, I tried my best to make it so it is still Nanohaverse. And maybe the one time I truly provoked a fuss was the inclusion of vampirism, but rather as a disease than something related to undead.

I wanted to see the nanohaverse as a universe where humans, or whatever alien race existed or still exists (Ynana, one of my OCs being the last of her kind), could only count on themselves and their own resources, where gods never existed. [Edit]Ok, the closest concept I has to gods is the Song of the stars, a concept I has gotten while reading about the concept of the leftover sound from the Big Band /end Edit.
I wanted to offer people alternative ideas not based on my own ideas, but based on the fact that humans alone and their history were fucking epic. Hell, Ancient Rome history was epic, the Thirty Years War in europe was horrible but offered lots of material for epic, so did the Great Discoveries, the French Revolution, World War I and World War II, the Vietnam. And all of that, men were the sole cause of it. Hitler, Torquemada, Emperor Xerxes, Catherine de Medicis were great templates for vilains. Thanks to that, entertainment industry is making great bucks with movies like 300, Polansky's The Pianist, Gladiator, or Saving the Private Ryan. Hell, Legend of Galatic Heroes has also taken a lot of inspiration from history.

There are also times I wonder if what I do is truly worth the effort, while some people are willing to read or listen my ideas, it seems that in general, my voice cannot be listened, maybe because I am not a Big Name. Hell, it seems I cannot be heard unless I get abrasive then I have the creeping feeling that whatever productive thing I have done gonna get ignored because "LOLZ ITS SHEBA THE JERKASS! NO IDEAS FROM HIM IS WORTH READING BECAUSE HE IS JUST A JERK!".
There are a lot of voices that deserves to be listened too, and lot of people who also came up with great characters, hell I love Noland so much that I wonder if it's alright to make him involved in some point in the history of one of my fictional settings, because there were a feeling and a flair I love about it. And for crying out loud, this character would have made the busters pull their hair off under other circumstances. Then again, whatever something is posted, it wont get noticed unless it is EPIC, outrageous, monstruously haxxed, and less than likely if the poster is not one of the staple posters of this thread. Worse, it get steamrolled like "Hey, it is cool..... *ZOMG *Insert the big name here*"

And just yesterday, I has the pleasure to talk with Flare and Esta about the concept of the True Names (Earthsea) and the Yakshas (I fucking mentionned in my ancient belka history as one of the earliest example of proto-Devices, and from which the ancient belkan Devices has been made, as answer. the good old arm race). It felt refreshing, you know, to have people ironing out and being heard. And before you label me as attention whore, I dare you to tell me that you did not post here with the intention to get noticed too.

And as I close the post, I have the feeling that this very post gonna fly over heads. Because I am just an unsignificant voice in the anonymous crowd.
So is it really worth the effort to vent off what I has on my heart for a long time? I say, fuck it.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Oh dear:

"I think this just got messy."

[Kha]

I agree with Sheba; out of recent memory, the only few times in recent memory this thread felt great was when Dkellis, PF and Aaron updated, Sheba and Tempest did their bit, and when we went off tangent on a Negiha xover crack run. The rest were either lulls, brief bursts of clarification and questions, interspersed with a lot of angst.

In terms of a community, it is alive. The veterans have become increasingly busy with our own lives, leaving the thread in the hands of the new. But there is no handover; there is only war. The OC thread is just dying.

Because how can she live, if we no longer believe in her?

[Keroko]

I'm... not sure what to say about this. I know I should say something on the subject, being one of the 'big names' here, but I'm really not sure what I should say. I know the thread isn't what it used to be, it hasn't been for a long time. Sure, ocasionally we have fun times, but all around its just not like old times.

Perhaps its the lack of new material, things were much more busy when we were still getting new material and ideas thrown at us. Perhaps its because we became too... strict. There were a lot more liberties we took in the past, and a lot of fun scenarios came out of it.

However, I am not planning to give up on the thread just because of this. If anything, I'll redouble my efforts to read and respond to every post that is made, to make sure every voice knows its heard.

[Aaron008R]

I was at a lost of words quite a bit before this as well...

This isn't really the type of problem one can solve easily with pleas or rules, since it involves several people and how they do interact in the thread.

I can't really count on myself on being able to relate properly to the shafted Cadians, since I kinda have the notability attached to my name due to being a veteran member.

Like Keroko said above, those are some reasons that might have caused this.

And also, I think that there's a lack of enthusiasm in Nanoha in general lately, which is rather inevitable since StrikerS ended quite a bit ago. The OC thread was in booming shape all that time ago because of the hype, which is one of the factors too. Only the more devoted enthusiasts of the series are expected to stay here if the newer members are to be spoken off. Hopefully, the Movie coming this winter should help boost up the interest level again.

On my side, I'm as busy as HELL. Which kinda explains a lot I hope. But still, to say the thread is dying is a little too soon to state. Like hell OC is just gonna die out just like that. Not on a long shot.

Sadly, I don't think I can return back to how I used to go about my business here before,, reading almost everything anytime soon. But I do agree that one of the most important things for writers is the knowledge that what they write are being read in the first place. Comments are a big bonus. It's actually good that this point was brought up. It may not necessarily demand more proper attention to go around, but it's still a valuable piece of the puzzle on brightening OC up again.

[PhoenixFlare]

Originally Posted by Keroko

If anything, I'll redouble my efforts to read and respond to every post that is made, to make sure every voice knows its heard.

Which leads me to a point I'd like to make, if only on behalf of myself (as I'm not so sure how the others would look at it). There is a time when there's a lot of interesting stuff going on, and a simple post wouldn't suffice to as a response to everything. Hence, sometimes, I do backlog breakers.

But, I feel that (massive) backlog breakers are actually spreading out my attention into too many things at once, and the responses I give become lukewarm, fake, even seem made just for the sake of making a response. They become dull, repetitive, and noncommittal.

As an author and a forumer, I understand how responses can either be motivating or demotivating, so I pay careful attention to the words I use despite wanting to be as honest as possible. I try to avoid degrading lines, belittling words, and one-liners as responses simply because I believe the writers themselves put efforts, however much, into their works. Even if it's downright shoddy, they deserve encouragement to do better.

That is why I seldom comment on anything even though I do read them all. If my responses are forced so as to ensure that voices are heard, I am afraid that I would fall back on one-liners (the best, most neutral form of comments depending on how they are worded) most of the time, which, to me, are comments unworthy of the efforts authors put in. Simply said, I don't want to give comments just for the sake of comments. If I am going to give any, I want them to be sincere and understood, and let the authors know that I am actually appreciating his works.

I'm not really sure where I'm categorized, but if I'm one of the 'big names', I don't mind if you don't give comments at all, as long as you don't malign the works or consider them rubbish before you even give them a look. I appreciate silent comments more than one-liners or lukewarm comments, because I know that you've been reading them and that you find them good enough for your taste. That is not to say that if there's anything wrong with the fics, you should just keep your mouth shut and let the rot manifest further; I value criticisms just as well.

P/S: This is not to say all commentators giving me short comments or one-liners are bad. I know how to differentiate, don't worry.

[Kyral]

Reading all this makes me feel that I have to comment.

First off all: It seems that I have to apologize. I'm not good in commenting and most of it are 'one-liners'. I'm not good at constructive critique... most people get from me is a correction for the used german.

But I won't change my style of posting. I know if I would try to comment more it would only be temporarly. Soon I would fall back to my old style of posting... Nothing would be gained of that.

I'm also unable to read everything here (I think my brain would explode if I try ).

Hm... the NegimaxNanoha stuff going on here recently didn't really cought my interest. But I don't think that anything is wrong with that. We all have different things we like so it's not uncommon that some of us back off a little when stuff pops up we don't really find interessting.

So in my opinion the OC-thread is not in a crisis or something like that. It survived worse.

Just my opinion in that regard...

[Keroko]

Before I dive into the backlog, I'll say my piece on the current Negihaverse crisis.

First off, Comar, I agree with the others that saying 'this is my universe, I play by my rules' ruins the point of posting here at all. This place is to write and discuss concepts, stories and characters.

I don't agree that every character that would be concidered H4XXED by Nanohaverse standards immediately needs nerfing. These characers are established characters of that universe, changing them would be like changing Reinforce I because she is overpowered by Negimaverse standards. They are supposed to be powerfull characters. They aren't OC's, they are CC's, they are characters that are far more constricted by the storyline then OC's are.

However I also disagree with Comar's listing of Evangeline. Comar labels Eva as 'an ultimate SSS-ranked badass' but I ask, does Evangeline really deserve that rank?

To put it into perspective, all we've seen Eva do is throw around a few big spells, and the biggest we've seen her do was freeze a Demon Lord.

Hayate froze an entire airport.

No, Evangeline is far from SSS in my book. S-rank, maybe. SS-rank at most.

[Arkeus]

Sheba: All of those were good points.

I hadn't read phoenixflare's post, i was commenting on someone else that i thought was saying something like "We should all have the same view".

But, yes, coming here means we have got to listen too.

Hell, i doubt myself a lot, and when i will have a plan ready for my vision of nanoha in negiverse, i will try and see what people think.

I *Don't* want to write something that is no longer Nanoha.

On the other hand, what i meant was tha we don't have enough background to truly be *certain* of everything, so we have got to have original theories.

Hell, the thing i like most in reading fic is seeing how the author builds his world.

Having said that: Care to link to your previous post about your theory? Seems intriguing

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by dkellis

Spoiler for random:

Teana was sitting despondently in an island of solitude, uncaring of the bustle of aftermath that swarmed around the area.

Fate touched her shoulder gently. "Teana."

"I'm sorry about all of this, Fate," Teana mumbled.

"It's not your fault. We'll get her next time." Fate glanced at a particularly secretive clump of medtechs close to an unmarked van. "Is Subaru..."

"They said she'll be all right. She just needs some recalibration of her... her parts." Teana stood with some difficulty; Fate moved in to support her, but the younger girl shook her head, refusing the help. "Three of us here, and we couldn't stop a single fugitive from escaping."

"Not quite single," Fate corrected. "From Ginga's report, Sein was also helping Lowell. The trace isn't going very well, I'm afraid."

Teana leaned against the wall. "I'll be fine in a moment. There's probably a hundred more things more important for you to take care of than waiting for me to recover."

Fate looked uncertain. "Is there anything I can get you?"

"Answers would be nice," Teana muttered. "And some mouthwash."

"What was that?"

"Nothing." Teana tried to smile in what was theoretically a reassuring manner. "I'll be right here if you need me."

Fate picked her way through the wreckage. The local police had done a good job of keeping the ubiquitous reporters away from ground zero, citing emergency medical assistance for the unfortunate civilians caught in the battle. The last sonic bomb blast had temporarily deafened some, although full recoveries were expected. Shards of broken glass and the general chaos of crowd panic had done for the rest. No fatalities, and the most serious civilian casualty had been a broken arm. For an Over-S criminal threat, the injury list this time around had been surprisingly low. The brunt of the damage had been directed at the TSAB personnel, who were best able to withstand it.

There was a woman staring blankly at the ruins of the cafe where the fight had broken out. Fate blinked, as she tried to recall where she had seen her before; something about an old mission, a former partner or some such, except...

Oh, right.

"Mina!" Fate called out. "Mina, what are you doing here?"

Lumina Celeste, the Unyielding Ace, the Blade Breaker, the Mountain Cleaver, and freelance TSAB-affiliated contract mage, made no response.

Fate hesitated. "Mina?"

"Pray do not startle her," a deep voice emanated from the Device at Lumina's wrist. "She is in a very delicate state of mind at the moment."

Memory flipped a card. "Oh, hallo, Cyrus. What do you mean by 'delicate state of mind'?"

"They trashed my cafe," Lumina mumbled.

"Um," Fate said. "Yes, yes they did."

"I was out visiting my family for a few days, and they trashed my cafe."

"My sympathies."

"Now I'm not going to be able to show off my new waitress outfit, because they trashed my cafe."

Fate tried to think of an appropriate response to this. "I'm sorry?"

"This... this..." Lumina trembled in indignation. "This, this travesty, this utter disregard for the feelings and aspirations of others, this shall not stand! I will not have it! JUSTICE will be done, this I swear!"

"Oh dear," Cyrus said, approximating a remarkably convincing sigh despite not actually having any lungs. "If my recollection does not deceive me, you have worked with Milady before, Enforcer?"

"Yes, Mina was partnered with me for a mission once," Fate said, staring at the ranting young woman. "I don't remember her being so... dramatic."

"It comes and goes," Cyrus said sagely. "Mostly comes, these days."

"Mina!" A young man clambered over to Lumina's side. "Mina, I'm so glad you're here!"

"Thomas!" Lumina threw herself into the man's arms. "Look what they've done to our cafe!"

Thomas looked startled by the sudden addition of a theatrically sobbing woman in his arms, but he recovered somewhat when he saw Fate. "Um, good afternoon, Enforcer. Thomas Montero, proprieter of the, um, the recently-destroyed cafe."

Fate saluted. "Enforcer Agent Fate T. Harlaown. The Time-Space Administration Bureau will reimburse you for your losses, if you present an itemized list of-"

"Reimbursement is irrelevant!" Lumina interrupted. "It's also insufficient. What of the damages to our hearts, to our hopes and dreams? Oh woe, oh sorrow, oh despair..."

"Mina, it's not that bad," Thomas said. "The building's still standing, and we can replace everything, even without outside help. It'll take us maybe a week to get back up and running to full capacity, if even that long."

"The TSAB will-" Fate tried again.

"But we shall be strong!" Lumina exclaimed. She leapt up onto a lightpost, which creaked alarmingly under her weight. "We shall not let this tragedy bow our heads, but we shall use it to strengthen our resolve to administer Justice to the Evil that dares to strike at us!"

Thomas looked apologetically at Fate. "She's impossible to stop once she gets going."

"I've noticed."

"Have at thee, foul knave, villain, and rogue!" Lumina pointed dramatically. "I swear upon the Memory of the man whose livelihood you have just destroyed in your wanton rampage that I, Lumina Celeste, shall bring you to Justice!"

"I'm not dead yet," Thomas protested.

"For there is nothing greater than Justice in this Eternity, and you, Wicked and Unwholesome as you are, shall be as Nothing to the Virtue and Valour of our Just Cause! I refute thee and all thy works! Flee, flee as far as you can, and Know Ye that there will be a Reckoning, a Judgement so dire that the heavens themselves shall Tremble to hear, as I, Lumina Celeste, will Smite you down with my Power and Allies!" She shifted her finger to Fate. "Indeed, the Might of the TSAB is behind me, in the Person of Enforcer Fate T. Harlaown!"

Fate blinked. "Me?"

"Come, Fate, join me in my Quest to rid the dimensions of the Evil that has crawled out of its lair, this knife in the dark, this dark cloud on a moonless night, this wight, this ogre, this changeling! Together, we shall carry forth the Cause of Righteousness to All! For Justice!" She leapt from her perch.

Fate took an involuntary step backwards.

After the dust cleared, Lumina sat up from her botched landing, and managed, "That was mean, Fate."

"I'm sorry, it was just so sudden... are you all right?"

"Oh, this? It's nothing. I'm used to it."

"Yes, she is," Cyrus said drily.

"So!" Lumina shot to her feet. "What's our next move, Fate? How shall we deliver Justice to this fiend?"

"Um." Fate covered her mouth briefly, before composing her features into a professional mask. "I think we'd better brief you on our target first."

"Very well! Thomas, be not afraid, for I shall avenge you!"

"Like I said," Thomas mumbled weakly, "I'm not dead yet..."

But Lumina was already marching off towards Ginga and Teana. Fate shook her head in disbelief, and hurried after her.

I had a little Monthy Python flashback there.

So, she can get just as extreme as Amelia. I do wonder though, why was Sein helping the fugitive? She is one of the converted numbers after all, which means she's under watch too. There's gotta be a story behind this...

Originally Posted by Wild Goose

Also, I present the following spell to the Thread:

Jacket Disruptor: A special spell created by Leena Tokarev of Contractor Group O, Jacket Disruptor uses the combination of magic, sonic vibration and a physical strike to disrupt the defenses of a Barrier Jacket. This spell is primarily used by Leena to tear open Barrier Jackets of female targets for intense groping.



Anybody who is unhappy with this (admittedly outlandish) spell should direct their complaints to Professor ark, who through his math proved that barrier jackets can't defend against anything physical.

Primairy use: Intense groping. :3

I do like Leena.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

Beyond that, A's proceeds as normal until the very end, when Cyphus Kane inadvertently saves Reinforce from destroying herself and RH reveals herself as one of the legendary devices of the Einherjar, the bodyguards of the Belkan royal family. After that... well you'll have to wait until I can get everything sorted out with the first two seasons before I charge off into the dangerous territory of the StrikerS timeskip.

Raising Heart as a legendary device had me go -_-

You'd think the TSAB would have discovered that during their many maintenance rounds. Not to mention Raising Heart is a Mid device, how can it be a legendary device of Belkan bodyguards?

Originally Posted by Wild Goose

It's the principle of the matter, damnit! By Nanoverse standards Chief is fucking haxxed beyond anything existing - hell he can fucking take on the numbers with his bare hands - and I'm nerfing him and even now I'm seriously considering dropping the MJOLNIR and rebuilding chief as a pre-MJOLNIR version with minimal enhancements.

Out of curiosity, just how powerfull is Master Chief? I've only played the first game, so I don't have a firm grip on his skills and abillities, and from what I've seen of him I don't see him taking on the numbers with his bare hands.

Originally Posted by Estavali

These show some interesting info, like the DoB for the Numbers (pity not so for the rest ), their specialties (mainly for the House of Jail) and their current status.

A point to note is the "Ground of Present" comments for the 7 Numbers placed on probation. Cinque, Nove, Deici and Wendi are under Genya's supervision, while Sein and the twins were assigned to the Church (funny that Sister Schach is in-charge of watching Sein, the poor girl ). Their probation periods are also not the same, from Cinque's indefinite term (and tighter surveillance, perhaps due to her leadership role amongst the reforming Numbers) to Nove and Wendi's 10 years.

A note of surprise (for me) is Uno's strength rating. Her muscular power turns out to be rated at "A", the same as Due, Sein and Deici, instead of the weakest "B" rank like Quattro and Otto, the "casters" of the lot. Seems to me Uno might be able to put up a decent fight if she's forced to a corner.

That was very interesting data indeed, what caught my eye was Zest rank as a 'Old Belkan Knight' which suggests that learning and practicing Ancient Belkan is very much possible.

Originally Posted by Estavali

Hayate is obviously very much shorter than the rest of the adult cast . And all those posters make it look as if Nanoha has, errr.... better assets than she does (when Nanoha was mentioned in the aforementioned notes to have the smallest B amongst the Aces).

Suzuka is the reigning queen in that department.

Originally Posted by AdmiralTigerclaw

The exotic technique, is another way to excecute an antagonists approach to counter widely used magical attacks and styles. I fail to see the specific need for a specific item all the time, doesn't mean it's not entertaining and makes for a bit of a challenge when someone comes along with a technique that 'does the same thing', but in a 'different way'.

You're right, that was bland of me. >_< My apolagies.

Originally Posted by AdmiralTigerclaw

Incidently, the technique is actually quite unsafe to use against the established characters... mainly because half of them are prone to physical attacks the channelling cannot protect against. Imagine you're attacked by fate. She Trident Smashers you, you shake it off uneffected. Of course, since your defense is purely geared to counter heavy magic projectiles... she knocks your ass out the first time she clubs you with Bardiche directly. Seeing as most of your mana is going to controlling the channeling technique, and you have little for flying, and less for physical augments. (And thus, the need for someone using this technique to be a freakin' Jet Lee in martial arts prowess... That way, they don't get smeared by CQC experts.)

It needs a bit more risk then that... what are the effects of channeling higher grade magic? For example, say you're an AA ranked mage, and you butt heads with an S-rank Starlight Breaker. That means you currently have S-rank levels of magic flowing through your body, that's gotta leave some bad effects, right?

Originally Posted by AdmiralTigerclaw

You ever watch Dune? Essentially, with direct contact, so long as the barrier doesn't fry you by overloading your ability to act as a conduit, you can push through it since you suck the energy out of it and disperse it into the atmosphere. Good for those quickly flung up barriers... bad if Nanoha's had a prep moment and thrown up a high level protection powered. (Because you're likely to microwave yourself before you push through.)

Imagine it Like thus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtCedI-q9vU

That's pretty much ignoring the barrier... compared to being totally unable to get through it with anything short of heavy brute force or overpowering penetration magic.

Eh, I'll stay away from this subject. We don't know enough about Barrier Jackets to confirm or deny this.

[XenahortCharybdis]

For the sake of *something I consider important* I'll refrain from doing anything altogether stupid in response to all this philosophizing. I suppose I'll just throw in my own thoughts, as though they actually matter or something

Originally Posted by Kha

This disagreement is exactly just one of the many reasons for disillusionment in the thread now. I'm already lost so much hope here. Something is wrong, we can sense it, but we've no idea what is it. :/

Hahaha.

Don't make it look so bleak. This isn't a job for Sherlock Holmes or something...I think we all know what it is, we're just having trouble phrasing it.

Originally Posted by Kha

Arkeus you're new here, this apathy is not like it used to be. It's the lack of... life that gets to me.

Hey, if a shitstorm gets kicked up every other week I think you should be expecting some of that to happen. For me I'm not all out of hope yet, I'm just pretty busy...and I think a lot of us are too.

Originally Posted by Evil Rick

He, sorry to say this, normally I just post here to add my OCs and Chapters of NROTU but something inside me says that I need to ask

Isn't this thread suposed to post exchange opinions about creations (OCs , fics, etc...) in order to improve on them and have big happy comunity of friends who only join and post because they like to create awesomes and nice stories?

Because recently I just see coments about "apathy" and "disillusionment", why this has happened here? It seems that now nobody coments happily about OCs or fics any more

EXACTLY! You've absolutely grasped the essence of it! You've changed! You're not the man you used to be! You're at least 10 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 times better now!

No, seriously, that's the way it's supposed to be! No calling a story awesome before it gets written, no personal flaming, no bringing of one's personal shit into the OCT, just honest quality criticism...you know, that kind of thing! I really think we needed it out blunt from someone else other than the usual people.

ALL HAIL THE RICK! THOU HAST RE-INSPIRED ME!

Kha, here's the answer to your problems (and your moodswinging): we're losing sight of the original idea of the OCT!

Originally Posted by Kha

I agree with Sheba; out of recent memory, the only few times in recent memory this thread felt great was when Dkellis, PF and Aaron updated, Sheba and Tempest did their bit, and when we went off tangent on a Negiha xover crack run. The rest were either lulls, brief bursts of clarification and questions, interspersed with a lot of angst.

In terms of a community, it is alive. The veterans have become increasingly busy with our own lives, leaving the thread in the hands of the new. But there is no handover; there is only war. The OC thread is just dying.

Because how can she live, if we no longer believe in her?

Hey, what handover? You're not planning on becoming like the person who isn't LK-Me right? There's no handover simply because no one bothered to handover! People don't care about the ethic of a writer, the rules concerning writing, there is no handover, Kha. This is no handover, because no one handed anything down.

You're one to talk about belief. If you wanna have a kid, make sure you're a responsible parent. Take that in whatever way you will.

Originally Posted by Keroko

I'm... not sure what to say about this. I know I should say something on the subject, being one of the 'big names' here, but I'm really not sure what I should say. I know the thread isn't what it used to be, it hasn't been for a long time. Sure, ocasionally we have fun times, but all around its just not like old times.

I wasn't there in the old times, but looking at the old material, I think it was great stuff

Originally Posted by Keroko

Perhaps its the lack of new material, things were much more busy when we were still getting new material and ideas thrown at us. Perhaps its because we became too... strict. There were a lot more liberties we took in the past, and a lot of fun scenarios came out of it.

True. What I really think is that people should be given their freedom; they deserve that much as their right and in terms of our respect for them as fellow writers, but my only fear is that we can't trust everyone to do what they should with their freedom, to have the sense to work within boundaries that are acceptable.

From the old times, I feel that it was because people were responsible with their ideas, and were open enough to take the criticism in their stride, instead of whining and complaining, to which I feel that if one can't rise above mere sentimentality to realize and objectivize as to what's really wrong, what isn't and what just needs tweaking, one shouldn't ask for honest criticism.

This, though, isn't the time to be nostalgic. And here I'm....kind of lost for words too XD

Originally Posted by Keroko

However, I am not planning to give up on the thread just because of this. If anything, I'll redouble my efforts to read and respond to every post that is made, to make sure every voice knows its heard.

Well said.

Originally Posted by Aaron008R

I was at a lost of words quite a bit before this as well...

This isn't really the type of problem one can solve easily with pleas or rules, since it involves several people and how they do interact in the thread.

I can't really count on myself on being able to relate properly to the shafted Cadians, since I kinda have the notability attached to my name due to being a veteran member.

“一针见血”...no?

(By the way, that term is synonymous to "hitting the nail on the head.")

Originally Posted by Aaron008R

Like Keroko said above, those are some reasons that might have caused this.

And also, I think that there's a lack of enthusiasm in Nanoha in general lately, which is rather inevitable since StrikerS ended quite a bit ago. The OC thread was in booming shape all that time ago because of the hype, which is one of the factors too. Only the more devoted enthusiasts of the series are expected to stay here if the newer members are to be spoken off. Hopefully, the Movie coming this winter should help boost up the interest level again.

Let's start praying, now shall we?

Originally Posted by Aaron008R

On my side, I'm as busy as HELL. Which kinda explains a lot I hope. But still, to say the thread is dying is a little too soon to state. Like hell OC is just gonna die out just like that. Not on a long shot.

It's just Kha. I swear it's just Kha.

Originally Posted by Aaron008R

Sadly, I don't think I can return back to how I used to go about my business here before,, reading almost everything anytime soon. But I do agree that one of the most important things for writers is the knowledge that what they write are being read in the first place. Comments are a big bonus. It's actually good that this point was brought up. It may not necessarily demand more proper attention to go around, but it's still a valuable piece of the puzzle on brightening OC up again.

Actually I think it's the comments that have kept us alive all this time. No, I say it is the comments that should be one of the things that keep us alive, rather than making OCT something that it really isn't.

For me, and I think for many, comments is synonymous to recognition. We can take that in a more, or less altruistic way. In the path of the less, it's like fuel to the ego, and food to our pride, proof that we're noticed. I suppose all people need that once in a while...In the path of the more, though, then I'd say it's like the way to improve, and stuff like that.

And if there's more comments, more honest, polite, well-deserved comments flying around, as well as willing acceptance of those comments...then I'm almost willing to bet that people will grow in their craft as writers, and perhaps pick up some wisdom as well, rather than just become more bigoted, vitriolic and altogether silly. Not that I don't enjoy a clash of verbal blades once in a while, as a matter of fact I love nothing more than to break another person's argument but well, keep it in good fun if it ever happens, and don't push it to some sort of totally overboard point, that just takes all the fun out of it.

Originally Posted by PhoenixFlare

Which leads me to a point I'd like to make, if only on behalf of myself (as I'm not so sure how the others would look at it). There is a time when there's a lot of interesting stuff going on, and a simple post wouldn't suffice to as a response to everything. Hence, sometimes, I do backlog breakers.

But, I feel that (massive) backlog breakers are actually spreading out my attention into too many things at once, and the responses I give become lukewarm, fake, even seem made just for the sake of making a response. They become dull, repetitive, and noncommittal.

Hence just compile a whole list of replies that you wanted to make. Ideas and thoughts, at least. It keeps things sincere because they retain the original idea, and then later on some more reflective add-ons...I try to do that, though I suspect half of them will never be written for real. Sigh.

For me the real problem about massive BBs is that they always end up shorter than the original checklist...so, so much shorter, and then I miss out on so many things. That's my only regret about preparing another BB...

Originally Posted by PhoenixFlare

As an author and a forumer, I understand how responses can either be motivating or demotivating, so I pay careful attention to the words I use despite wanting to be as honest as possible. I try to avoid degrading lines, belittling words, and one-liners as responses simply because I believe the writers themselves put efforts, however much, into their works. Even if it's downright shoddy, they deserve encouragement to do better.

I suddenly feel convicted of something again...Ack.

Originally Posted by PhoenixFlare

I'm not really sure where I'm categorized, but if I'm one of the 'big names', I don't mind if you don't give comments at all, as long as you don't malign the works or consider them rubbish before you even give them a look. I appreciate silent comments more than one-liners or lukewarm comments, because I know that you've been reading them and that you find them good enough for your taste. That is not to say that if there's anything wrong with the fics, you should just keep your mouth shut and let the rot manifest further; I value criticisms just as well.

P/S: This is not to say all commentators giving me short comments or one-liners are bad. I know how to differentiate, don't worry.

*cough**cough*cough*

Now I don't feel so bad anymore. You be cheating my feelings, Pee Effu. Me no like you.

*pouts*

Originally Posted by Kyral

Reading all this makes me feel that I have to comment.

First off all: It seems that I have to apologize. I'm not good in commenting and most of it are 'one-liners'. I'm not good at constructive critique... most people get from me is a correction for the used german.

It's a hell lot more useful than you think, Kyral. I'm sure the people who have received help before would say as much, so don't talk yourself into the basement over this. No point, and it just makes you look the worse for it.

Originally Posted by Kyral

But I won't change my style of posting. I know if I would try to comment more it would only be temporarly. Soon I would fall back to my old style of posting... Nothing would be gained of that.

I'm also unable to read everything here (I think my brain would explode if I try ).

Oh, there's a limit to everybody's mind...you're just speculating about blowing your head, I think my head's already blown up a long time ago. I think I'm already the walking dead, as a matter of fact

---------------------------------

As for me, I'll be attempting to post some work, the only trouble now being that I sporadically write this, and then that, and then that other thing and so on...which makes things, while overall rather fast, individually speaking really slow, so well I think my dilemma is clear. I've come to accept that different moods that people are in are more conducive for different kinds of writing, and different parts of a story, extreme inspiration not withstanding, of course.

I wish a fine time for you all in OCT, and I very much do hope to see it in peace and not pieces when I return, at least. In that regard, do your best.

Xena, out.

[Kha]

@Xena: You know how bad I am with wording emotions. I can't wrap my tongue around the source of apathy, but I do know that I have lost faith in the thread. Sometimes I feel like I'm not posting because I want to, but posting just to keep things going.

But Rick hit very close; losing sight of the thread's aim is just 1 part of the problem. A big part yes, but still only 1 part.

Posting here feels like a second job now, and that's sad. But I won't stop, cos maybe like how it went for WoW things might suddenly turn around, Cadia Zwei suddenly walks out of the hospital bed and scare the shit out of her doctor. I want to be scared the shit out of in this manner.


Anyway, let's try another topic:

@Keroko: Spoilered for Negima spoilers:

Spoiler for Chao's trap for Team Negi:

Is Keroko part of the group that gets sent 1 year into the future after leaving Eva's resort?

If she is, if she sees Negiha Kha horribly mutated by the plague into a full Death Knight, when she returns would she pursue the matter? Kha has been a wildcard up to that point, sometimes attacking their opposition and sometimes them, whatever he sees fit, acting as both a rival and an ally in different situations. What would her reaction be?

[Arkeus]

Originally Posted by Kha

@Keroko: Spoilered for Negima spoilers:

Spoiler for Chao's trap for Team Negi:

Is Keroko part of the group that gets sent 1 year into the future after leaving Eva's resort?

If she is, if she sees Negiha Kha horribly mutated by the plague into a full Death Knight, when she returns would she pursue the matter? Kha has been a wildcard up to that point, sometimes attacking their opposition and sometimes them, whatever he sees fit, acting as both a rival and an ally in different situations. What would her reaction be?

uh?

Spoiler:

Wasn't it a week? and what plague are you talking about?

[dkellis]

Spoiler:

Arisa scrambled for cover as more energy bolts flew in her general direction. The oversized sword on her back shifted awkwardly, and she angrily slapped it back into position. The ground shook with another nearby explosion, and she stumbled; cursing, she turned the fall into a roll, and skidded behind a sturdy-looking pile of rubble that used to be a meter-thick bulkhead.

"Glad you could join us," the silver-haired Enforcer said, far too cheerfully for someone who looked as badly injured as she did. One leg had been set in a makeshift splint, and she was clutching a cloth-wrapped object tightly to herself.

"Who the hell are you?"

"Ivey de Lorien, TSAB. The one with the stick is Reiz Astra, same." Reiz nodded nervously in greeting, gripping her quarterstaff Device tightly.

"Where's Hayate? Where's Fate? Where's Nanoha?"

"Ah, the Lieutenant-Colonel's whereabouts are unknown," Reiz said. "Which is, um, kind of the problem..."

"Hello there, my little chickadees!" A singsong voice floated through the wrecked corridors through hidden speakers. "Don't make me come look for you!"

"And who's that?" Arisa demanded.

"The infamous dimensional criminal Quattro, formerly of Scaglietti's Numbers, currently going solo," Ivey replied promptly. "Or so we believe, anyway. She appears to be entirely familiar with you, at least."

"Why? I've never even met her before!"

"Uh," Reiz said diffidently, "I didn't catch your name, ma'am."

"... until recently, I was just Arisa Bannings," Arisa muttered. "Now, I'm not so sure."

The ground trembled again. "Your arrival was either most fortuitous or most unfortunate," Ivey continued. "We certainly weren't expecting someone to teleport right into the middle of the facility."

"I'm sorry! I didn't know this was where Apollo wanted to send me!" Arisa shifted the sword's position on her back again. "He told me this was where Suzuka was..."

"Incoming!" Reiz was on instant alert, even as Ivey corrected, "Hold up, it's a friendly!"

Arisa blinked as a figure materialized out of invisibility. "Haven't I met you before... Subaru, wasn't it?"

Subaru gave her a quick grin. "That's right. It's been a long time, Arisa."

"What's happening here? Where's Nanoha?"

Subaru's face fell. "Nanoha... Nanoha hasn't been seen since, uh, since you left the 97th Non-Administered World. We think she went looking for you, but..."

"Well I certainly haven't seen her!" Arisa rubbed her temples. "Okay, wait. Calm down, I know I can get through this. What's our situation?"

"Tea sent me here to support the 37th," Subaru explained. "Erio's out looking for Cinque and Nove, and Caro and Vice are with Fate. Tea says she thinks she can get through whatever's jamming our mage communications, but it'll take a while. Uh, I didn't know you'd be here, Arisa, or I'd have asked Tea to keep in touch, so she could cloak you and bring you back as well."

"No funky magical telepathy, remember?" Arisa pointed out.

"Oh." Subaru blushed. "Oops."

"Who else is with Lanster?" Ivey asked.

"Ginga and Arf. I don't know where Inspector Acous or Sister Schach are. And Lieutenant-Colonel Yagami hasn't reported in at all, nor have the Wolkenritter." Subaru counted on her fingers. "I think that's all?"

There was a great rhythmic rumbling, as though an impressively large number of boulders decided to tumble down the same incline at once.

"Oh, right," Subaru added, in the sudden silence after. "You're surrounded by a lot of drones."

Ivey stared at her. "Be precise, Nakajima. How many, and what sort?"

"The ginormous ball types," Subaru said, "and maybe fifty of them?"

"What-" Arisa clamped her hands over her mouth. In a lower voice, she said, "What? Is that woman mad?"

Ivey grimaced. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in it."

Reiz poked her head above the safety of the wall, and ducked down just as quickly. "Yes, we're definitely surrounded." She checked her cartridges. "I'm almost spent."

"Me too," Subaru admitted. "This was supposed to be a quick extraction, but I didn't expect so many drones here."

"I think it's safe to say that Quattro knows exactly where we are," Ivey said.

Arisa unslung her sword. "Then it's down to a fight."

"No offence, Miss Bannings, but do you actually know how to use that thing?"

"Well enough." Arisa dug through her belt pouch. "What are those things weak against?"

"Physical trauma, mostly," Reiz said. "Magic doesn't work too well against them, unless you overload their anti-magic field."

Arisa slotted the cylinder into the hilt. "The next time I see Nanoha, I'm going to hit her, again. This is not the normal life that I wanted."

The hidden speakers crackled to life again. "I have you completely surrounded," Quattro announced. "Give up the book and I might let you crawl away alive."

"Book?" Subaru said, puzzled. "What book?"

Ivey coughed. "It's a long story." She carefully unwrapped the object she had been holding, just enough to reveal the unmistakeable crest on the front of the book.

Arisa and Subaru stared. "Why," Arisa asked softly, "are you holding onto the Book of Darkness?"

"As I said, it's a long story."

"It's a fair deal," Quattro continued unseen. "You won't find a better offer anywhere else!"

Ivey's laugh had an edge to it. "Uh, no," she called out. "No means no, equals no. Twice I state: I refuse you, I deny you. And three times I say and done: bite me, Quattro."

"Can that Quattro woman even hear us?" Arisa said.

"I have no idea," Ivey admitted, "but that felt good."

"Wait, I think I'm getting something," Subaru said, holding a hand to her head. "Tea's trying to tell me... reinforcements? And a signal. We're supposed to wait for a signal, and then get out of here."

"What reinforcements?" Reiz asked.

"What signal?" Arisa wondered.

"I AM THE LOOSE CHANGE IN THE VENDING MACHINE OF JUSTICE!"

"That signal," Ivey noted, as the sound of a hundred energy blasts impacting on an impenetrable barrier made it almost too loud to think. Above her, Lumina Celeste, the Unyielding Ace, flared incandescent as she poured all her magical power into the shield protecting the group.

Reiz and Arisa quickly bundled Ivey onto Subaru's back. Subaru made sure that Ivey was secure, and gave Arisa a nod of thanks. "Mach Calibre, go!"

"Can you escape by yourself?" Reiz asked Arisa.

"Technically, I've never really gotten the hang of all the zipping around and-"

"Never fear!" a voice from ground level exclaimed. "One rescue coming up!"

Arisa swung her sword on reflex, and almost decapitated the head and torso poking out of the ground.

"Hey, watch it!" Sein yelled.

"Sein? I thought you were working against us!"

"Uh, no. Very, very no." Sein grabbed Arisa's arms. "Explanations later! Dive now!"

The last thing Arisa saw was Reiz's astonished face, just before the ground swallowed her.

[Jimmy C]

Spoiler for yes:

It was just a week.

Please reread properly, Kha.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Kha

Then again, all that lack of height went to where it matters. According to Tsuzuki's notes, Hayate has the largest 3-sizes.

Uh...

Originally Posted by Estavali

Hayate is obviously very much shorter than the rest of the adult cast . And all those posters make it look as if Nanoha has, errr.... better assets than she does (when Nanoha was mentioned in the aforementioned notes to have the smallest B amongst the Aces).

So is that way she uses such immense attacks? To compensate for her lack of-

*is Stalight Breaker'd*

Originally Posted by Kha

I agree with Sheba; out of recent memory, the only few times in recent memory this thread felt great was when Dkellis, PF and Aaron updated, Sheba and Tempest did their bit, and when we went off tangent on a Negiha xover crack run. The rest were either lulls, brief bursts of clarification and questions, interspersed with a lot of angst.

In terms of a community, it is alive. The veterans have become increasingly busy with our own lives, leaving the thread in the hands of the new. But there is no handover; there is only war. The OC thread is just dying.

Because how can she live, if we no longer believe in her?

I do feel that this thread has lost...something in the recent times. All this arguing and bickering like some 4-year olds takes away all the fun this once was when I first fell into the OC void. The haxxbusting back then seemed so much more...calm and understanding. Especially with ideas being thrown around and discussed. Ideas that would be given would EVOLVE within the thread and become something wonderful. Now...I just don't know. Now I find myself skipping over too many posts because all the arguing and ridicule in them. What has happened I wonder...what has happened...

Originally Posted by Kyral

First off all: It seems that I have to apologize. I'm not good in commenting and most of it are 'one-liners'. I'm not good at constructive critique... most people get from me is a correction for the used german.

Oi, no need to apologize . Don't go all 'Shinji' on us now.

Originally Posted by Kyral

But I won't change my style of posting. I know if I would try to comment more it would only be temporarly. Soon I would fall back to my old style of posting... Nothing would be gained of that.

Damn right you had better not change . Stay true to yourself or feel the wrath of SLB. And I may not be an angst fan, but I make the exception for you . So get back to writing more angst!!

*punts*

[stormturmoil]

Originally Posted by dkellis

Spoiler:

Arisa scrambled for cover as more energy bolts flew in her general direction. The oversized sword on her back shifted awkwardly, and she angrily slapped it back into position. The ground shook with another nearby explosion, and she stumbled; cursing, she turned the fall into a roll, and skidded behind a sturdy-looking pile of rubble that used to be a meter-thick bulkhead.

"Glad you could join us," the silver-haired Enforcer said, far too cheerfully for someone who looked as badly injured as she did. One leg had been set in a makeshift splint, and she was clutching a cloth-wrapped object tightly to herself.

"Who the hell are you?"

"Ivey de Lorien, TSAB. The one with the stick is Reiz Astra, same." Reiz nodded nervously in greeting, gripping her quarterstaff Device tightly.

"Where's Hayate? Where's Fate? Where's Nanoha?"

"Ah, the Lieutenant-Colonel's whereabouts are unknown," Reiz said. "Which is, um, kind of the problem..."

"Hello there, my little chickadees!" A singsong voice floated through the wrecked corridors through hidden speakers. "Don't make me come look for you!"

"And who's that?" Arisa demanded.

"The infamous dimensional criminal Quattro, formerly of Scaglietti's Numbers, currently going solo," Ivey replied promptly. "Or so we believe, anyway. She appears to be entirely familiar with you, at least."

"Why? I've never even met her before!"

"Uh," Reiz said diffidently, "I didn't catch your name, ma'am."

"... until recently, I was just Arisa Bannings," Arisa muttered. "Now, I'm not so sure."

The ground trembled again. "Your arrival was either most fortuitous or most unfortunate," Ivey continued. "We certainly weren't expecting someone to teleport right into the middle of the facility."

"I'm sorry! I didn't know this was where Apollo wanted to send me!" Arisa shifted the sword's position on her back again. "He told me this was where Suzuka was..."

"Incoming!" Reiz was on instant alert, even as Ivey corrected, "Hold up, it's a friendly!"

Arisa blinked as a figure materialized out of invisibility. "Haven't I met you before... Subaru, wasn't it?"

Subaru gave her a quick grin. "That's right. It's been a long time, Arisa."

"What's happening here? Where's Nanoha?"

Subaru's face fell. "Nanoha... Nanoha hasn't been seen since, uh, since you left the 97th Non-Administered World. We think she went looking for you, but..."

"Well I certainly haven't seen her!" Arisa rubbed her temples. "Okay, wait. Calm down, I know I can get through this. What's our situation?"

"Tea sent me here to support the 37th," Subaru explained. "Erio's out looking for Cinque and Nove, and Caro and Vice are with Fate. Tea says she thinks she can get through whatever's jamming our mage communications, but it'll take a while. Uh, I didn't know you'd be here, Arisa, or I'd have asked Tea to keep in touch, so she could cloak you and bring you back as well."

"No funky magical telepathy, remember?" Arisa pointed out.

"Oh." Subaru blushed. "Oops."

"Who else is with Lanster?" Ivey asked.

"Ginga and Arf. I don't know where Inspector Acous or Sister Schach are. And Lieutenant-Colonel Yagami hasn't reported in at all, nor have the Wolkenritter." Subaru counted on her fingers. "I think that's all?"

There was a great rhythmic rumbling, as though an impressively large number of boulders decided to tumble down the same incline at once.

"Oh, right," Subaru added, in the sudden silence after. "You're surrounded by a lot of drones."

Ivey stared at her. "Be precise, Nakajima. How many, and what sort?"

"The big rolly ball types," Subaru said, "and maybe fifty of them?"

"What-" Arisa clamped her hands over her mouth. In a lower voice, she said, "What? Is that woman mad?"

Ivey grimaced. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in it."

Reiz poked her head above the safety of the wall, and ducked down just as quickly. "Yes, we're definitely surrounded." She checked her cartridges. "I'm almost spent."

"Me too," Subaru admitted. "This was supposed to be a quick extraction, but I didn't expect so many drones here."

"I think it's safe to say that Quattro knows exactly where we are," Ivey said.

Arisa unslung her sword. "Then it's down to a fight."

"No offence, Miss Bannings, but do you actually know how to use that thing?"

"Well enough." Arisa dug through her belt pouch. "What are those things weak against?"

"Physical trauma, mostly," Reiz said. "Magic doesn't work too well against them, unless you overload their anti-magic field."

Arisa slotted the cylinder into the hilt. "The next time I see Nanoha, I'm going to hit her, again. This is not the normal life that I wanted."

The hidden speakers crackled to life again. "I have you completely surrounded," Quattro announced. "Give up the book and I might let you crawl away alive."

"Book?" Subaru said, puzzled. "What book?"

Ivey coughed. "It's a long story." She carefully unwrapped the object she had been holding, just enough to reveal the unmistakeable crest on the front of the book.

Arisa and Subaru stared. "Why," Arisa asked softly, "are you holding onto the Book of Darkness?"

"As I said, it's a long story."

"It's a fair deal," Quattro continued unseen. "You won't find a better offer anywhere else!"

Ivey's laugh had an edge to it. "Uh, no," she called out. "No means no, equals no. Twice I state: I refuse you, I deny you. And three times I say and done: bite me, Quattro."

"Can that Quattro woman even hear us?" Arisa said.

"I have no idea," Ivey admitted, "but that felt good."

"Wait, I think I'm getting something," Subaru said, holding a hand to her head. "Tea's trying to tell me... reinforcements? And a signal. We're supposed to wait for a signal, and then get out of here."

"What reinforcements?" Reiz asked.

"What signal?" Arisa wondered.

"I AM THE LOOSE CHANGE IN THE VENDING MACHINE OF JUSTICE!"

"That signal," Ivey noted, as the sound of a hundred energy blasts impacting on an impenetrable barrier made it almost too loud to think. Above her, Lumina Celeste, the Unyielding Ace, flared incandescent as she poured all her magical power into the shield protecting the group.

Reiz and Arisa quickly bundled Ivey onto Subaru's back. Subaru made sure that Ivey was secure, and gave Arisa a nod of thanks. "Mach Calibre, go!"

"Can you escape by yourself?" Reiz asked Arisa.

"Technically, I've never really gotten the hang of all the zipping around and-"

"Never fear!" a voice from ground level exclaimed. "One rescue coming up!"

Arisa swung her sword on reflex, and almost decapitated the head and torso poking out of the ground.

"Hey, watch it!" Sein yelled.

"Sein? I thought you were working against us!"

"Uh, no. Very, very no." Sein grabbed Arisa's arms. "Explanations later! Dive now!"

The last thing Arisa saw was Reiz's astonished face, just before the ground swallowed her.

And now after all this Thread angst, Dkellis to the rescue with well plotted and written character interaction and possibly the best intervention Line I have read in weeks

albeit it damn near killed me through too much laughter!

"I AM THE LOOSE CHANGE IN THE VENDING MACHINE OF JUSTICE!"

This is what Cadia Zwei needs more of!


Honestly, I think it's good to see more short story snippets being posted, because it's something we can get behind.

While I'm not necessarily railing about the existence of AU 'Canon's, the truth is, something so involved and far-reaching can seem, well, a bit nebulous and too big and clouded to really get a grip on; it's not something we can immediately read, enjoy and comment on...

more than that, as we've seen with ATC (sorry for the namedropping, but you're the best example I could think of) there is a big difference between reading the outline of something and reading that same concept put into theory...

I know I was one of the people alarmed by some of the concepts ATC proposed for his works...but the moment I read them actually integrated into his work, in proper context, those fears were proven unfounded. In proper context, they were proved well developed and thoughtful.

Now, before anyone reaches for the quote button in outrage, I know I'm being a hypocrite here; I hardly post anything, and when I do, most of it is HAXX-laden AU's. That's just me, I'm afraid...I'm not good at restraining myself, and I'm not good at long stories...I can do scenes, sometimes, but can't join them together. So I don't.

But sometimes, I feel the need to get something written down, get it out of my system...and then I'll write it up, and post it (it took a long time before I was confident enough to do that though, and I had to have something on the board already related to tie into before I was happy to stop lurking and start posting)

But once I'd done it, once I'd stepped off the precipice and found I could fly, I ended up doing it more...and while they were all problematic pieces, they all fulfilled a need to express something for me, and everyone here accepted that and let them go for what they were; without a HaXXbusting crackdown, without a long dragged out debate on the nature of the Nanohaverse in whatever AU 'Canon' was fashionable at the time.

I really appreciated that.

That's why, even though I'm never likely to be the most prolific poster, I will continue to stick with the thread, (even though that does occasionally end up with me starting fights): It's my only way of saying Thank you, to everyone here, for being awesome enough to listen without judgeing when I needed it.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Originally Posted by Keroko

I


It needs a bit more risk then that... what are the effects of channeling higher grade magic? For example, say you're an AA ranked mage, and you butt heads with an S-rank Starlight Breaker. That means you currently have S-rank levels of magic flowing through your body, that's gotta leave some bad effects, right?

Waste Heat. Channeling high level stuff means excess heat remember? Tank S rank magics and you stand a good chance of microwaving your insides. I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure doing the same thing to your internal organs you do to a hotdog is NOT good for your health.

[Comartemis]

Originally Posted by Keroko

First off, Comar, I agree with the others that saying 'this is my universe, I play by my rules' ruins the point of posting here at all. This place is to write and discuss concepts, stories and characters.

That it is. I have no problems with accepting ideas and such proposed by my fellow Cadians, make no mistake, though there are elements I would much rather simplify to keep things from getting too complicated. See my reaction to the recent Magitech debate on supercharged melee spells for an example. The problems come about when people start treating a universe-in-progress as if it absolutely has to conform to some standard or another; Sheba saying that Negiha somehow "isn't Nanoha" anymore because I crossed it over with Negima, as if doing so somehow makes it entirely unrecognizable from the series we all know and love, or people insisting that Eva's too powerful and needs to be toned down despite the fact that she's already an established character and has a distinct role to play in the fabric of the Negima part of the story.

Last night on IRC, Sheba told me to take Negiha to the fanfiction thread because apparently it doesn't adhere to his standards of what a Cadian universe should be like, and I told him where he could stick his standards because I'm doing something different.

From what I've seen of the local color, there is a significant hesitation to mess around with the canon timeline in all but the most minor ways. Note how the most popular timeline--Kerocanon--barely deviates from canon in any very significant way despite the addition of several OCs right at the start of the story. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't hold the timeline to be sacred in some way; maybe that's because I'm still relatively new here.

Sheba may have a point about how Negiha belongs on the fanfiction thread and not here, but I'm not convinced because at heart I'm trying to do the same thing the rest of you are doing; Comacanon may be an AU with lots of stuff that Nanoha canon doesn't have, but it still adheres to most-if-not-all of Cadia's rules, and it's intended to be a shared universe, which is a big part of the reason why I continue to work on it here instead of on the fanfiction thread or on Fukufics.

I don't agree that every character that would be concidered H4XXED by Nanohaverse standards immediately needs nerfing. These characers are established characters of that universe, changing them would be like changing Reinforce I because she is overpowered by Negimaverse standards. They are supposed to be powerfull characters. They aren't OC's, they are CC's, they are characters that are far more constricted by the storyline then OC's are.

THANK YOU! FINALLY, someone gets what I was trying to get across!

To put it into perspective, all we've seen Eva do is throw around a few big spells, and the biggest we've seen her do was freeze a Demon Lord.

Hayate froze an entire airport.

No, Evangeline is far from SSS in my book. S-rank, maybe. SS-rank at most.

There are also more than a few indications that we haven't seen Eva fighting at anywhere near her full strength. Remember, this is the same girl who invented Magia Erebea; can you even begin to imagine what kind of Epic Pwnage she could dish out if she ever bothered to actually use it?

Raising Heart as a legendary device had me go -_-

You'd think the TSAB would have discovered that during their many maintenance rounds. Not to mention Raising Heart is a Mid device, how can it be a legendary device of Belkan bodyguards?

I've been working under the impression that RH was never a TSA device, but one that was handed down through the Scrya clan. Otherwise how would Yuuno have gotten his hands on it? Is there a Devices 'R Us somewhere on Mid where you can go and pick out your very own military-grade Intelligent Device for the low low price of $29.99?

And don't forget that Mid and Belka were once competitors as 'most prevalent magic style'. I can see a Mid mage being a bodyguard in a Belkan court, albeit under unusual circumstances.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kha

Posting here feels like a second job now, and that's sad. But I won't stop, cos maybe like how it went for WoW things might suddenly turn around, Cadia Zwei suddenly walks out of the hospital bed and scare the shit out of her doctor. I want to be scared the shit out of in this manner.

I still fully enjoy posting here, maybe I'll start bringing somewhat of the 'crazy' back into the thread when I fire up the new version of Uomo (poor guy gets Rebuilt so many times ) This time with more Nove and even somewhat of a trap-disarnament. That, and I'll finaly start writing kinship, a story fully focussed on the Sentoukijin in Nanoha.

Originally Posted by Kha

Anyway, let's try another topic:

@Keroko: Spoilered for Negima spoilers:

Spoiler for Chao's trap for Team Negi:

Is Keroko part of the group that gets sent 1 year into the future after leaving Eva's resort?

If she is, if she sees Negiha Kha horribly mutated by the plague into a full Death Knight, when she returns would she pursue the matter? Kha has been a wildcard up to that point, sometimes attacking their opposition and sometimes them, whatever he sees fit, acting as both a rival and an ally in different situations. What would her reaction be?

Week. And there hardly is enough time to see him do anything, methinks.

Originally Posted by dkellis

Spoiler:

-snip-

Sein's reaction was golden. I knew there was somewhat of a story behind it. And we get to see some Arisa, a rare thing to happen in the OC-thread, but much apreciated.

Originally Posted by AdmiralTigerclaw

Waste Heat. Channeling high level stuff means excess heat remember? Tank S rank magics and you stand a good chance of microwaving your insides. I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure doing the same thing to your internal organs you do to a hotdog is NOT good for your health.

No, not really. Okay, no problems here, I was a bit concerned that this skill would allow mooks to block Starlight Breakers, but that's been ironed out.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

That it is. I have no problems with accepting ideas and such proposed by my fellow Cadians, make no mistake, though there are elements I would much rather simplify to keep things from getting too complicated. See my reaction to the recent Magitech debate on supercharged melee spells for an example. The problems come about when people start treating a universe-in-progress as if it absolutely has to conform to some standard or another; Sheba saying that Negiha somehow "isn't Nanoha" anymore because I crossed it over with Negima, as if doing so somehow makes it entirely unrecognizable from the series we all know and love, or people insisting that Eva's too powerful and needs to be toned down despite the fact that she's already an established character and has a distinct role to play in the fabric of the Negima part of the story.

Last night on IRC, Sheba told me to take Negiha to the fanfiction thread because apparently it doesn't adhere to his standards of what a Cadian universe should be like, and I told him where he could stick his standards because I'm doing something different.

From what I've seen of the local color, there is a significant hesitation to mess around with the canon timeline in all but the most minor ways. Note how the most popular timeline--Kerocanon--barely deviates from canon in any very significant way despite the addition of several OCs right at the start of the story. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't hold the timeline to be sacred in some way; maybe that's because I'm still relatively new here.

Sheba may have a point about how Negiha belongs on the fanfiction thread and not here, but I'm not convinced because at heart I'm trying to do the same thing the rest of you are doing; Comacanon may be an AU with lots of stuff that Nanoha canon doesn't have, but it still adheres to most-if-not-all of Cadia's rules, and it's intended to be a shared universe, which is a big part of the reason why I continue to work on it here instead of on the fanfiction thread or on Fukufics.

*scratches head* Well, in my opinion this belongs in both threads, really. But then, most of our works do. The difference is that this is the place where we hammer out the worlds, characters, and settings, while the fanfiction thread is where the stories eventually end up.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

There are also more than a few indications that we haven't seen Eva fighting at anywhere near her full strength.Remember, this is the same girl who invented Magia Erebea; can you even begin to imagine what kind of Epic Pwnage she could dish out if she ever bothered to actually use it?

All the more a reason not to go off on a wild tangent and blindly slap a SSS label on her. We don't know what she's capable off.

And Nanoha invented Starlight Breaker, which does virtually the same thing as Magia Erebea, except Starlight Breaker fires it of in one beam of pure destruction, while Magia Erebea uses the absorbed magic as something similar to a Belkan Reinforcement spell. Just food for thought.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

I've been working under the impression that RH was never a TSA device, but one that was handed down through the Scrya clan. Otherwise how would Yuuno have gotten his hands on it? Is there a Devices 'R Us somewhere on Mid where you can go and pick out your very own military-grade Intelligent Device for the low low price of $29.99?

The fact that the TSAB's generic devices are Raising Heart type devices pretty much confirms Raising Heart was a standard TSAB device prior to her powerups, methinks.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

And don't forget that Mid and Belka were once competitors as 'most prevalent magic style'. I can see a Mid mage being a bodyguard in a Belkan court, albeit under unusual circumstances.

A bit too... convenient, don't you think? A Mid version of the story sounds better, or at least more believable.