Macross Frontier (Macross 25) general discussion [No Spoilers]

[cheesie]

Magnuskn, are there any liner notes published for episode 25?

[Tak]

Originally Posted by cheesie

Magnuskn, are there any liner notes published for episode 25?

Why do you want that?

Linear notes for 25 is a catalog of inspirations for not getting high

- Tak

[cheesie]

Tak : It's just that, I'm very interested to know what either Ohnogi or Kawamori has to say (and possibly the justifications) regarding the direction they've chosen for Episode 25. As it stands, Episode 25's script being entirely written by Kawamori poses an extremely high possibility that it conflicts against some of the many ideals Ohnogi were talking about in the previous liner notes, and it'll be great to read what both figures think about this clash. Most of the questions I have that went unanswered stems from this episode alone, really.

[magnuskn]

Not yet, they will be out some time after the associated fansub group of the Macross Generation forums will release episode 25.

[BetoJR]

Somehow, I can't wait to see what that brings out...

[magnuskn]

I know I am a bad person because of this, but I find the total silence from Ranka shippers... amusing.

[justavisitor]

I am a Ranka fan lol, not shipper XD The silence is due to the fact that we don't have much info for the movie...any news for the movie??

[Teletha]

No movie news, but we are mostly discussing the stuff magnus posted. What do Ranka fans think of the shocking revelation that Sheryl misunderstood Alto's feelings during the roof top scene?

[justavisitor]

I don't know other ppl lol, and I don't represent others but I have always been saying

1)It's nice to read extra stuff, but ultimately, a person doesn't really need to read interview to understand the series better
2)I don't represent others, but I have been saying, Alto has to love both Ranka and Sheryl in order for the LT to work...so Sheryl thought Alto doesn't need her, while Alto needs both girls (as we see in ep 25)...I have been saying that since day 1 lol, and I have read the stuff magnus posted (thx by the way), and I don't really feel surprised from it

That's an opinion from one Ranka fan XD

[DeX-kun]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I know I am a bad person because of this, but I find the total silence from Ranka shippers... amusing.

We appreciate all your hard work for the translations but it's material that doesn't have much info on Ranka I find Ohnogi's interpretation of Ranka interesting because it seems that her portrayal was misinterpreted, at least in my opinion.

Originally Posted by Teletha

No movie news, but we are mostly discussing the stuff magnus posted. What do Ranka fans think of the shocking revelation that Sheryl misunderstood Alto's feelings during the roof top scene?

Nothing much really, there were a lot of scenes in the series that were misunderstood. I'm pretty sure I've said this a couple of times before as well.

[Mei19]

*just read it* Good stuff. Kawamori amuses me. Thanks magnus!

Alto needs both girls because he's sirpimpalot I think episode 25 cleared that misunderstanding from Sheryl. Alto has love for her too apparently. Not just Alto, Ranka-chan too. The trolliangle is complete.

I've been meaning to ask. What are liner notes? Is this MBS radio with Bobby Margo still running? There was a Macross radio show with Alto, Ranka, Michael as hosts. But wasn't aware of this one. I'll be more active too if the news had more Ranka Lee in it. I've a a lot of questions about her character development with Alto and it'll be good if Kawamori or Ohnogi had a touch on that. We also need to confirm her escapade in 21, did she or did she not tell Brera-kun?? lmao What are the audience reactions when she betrayed Frontier and stuffs. Why did she keep saying Alto didn't hear her. I'm tired of speculations I want official commentaries now. Too bad we don't have access to those.

[Father Hentai]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I know I am a bad person because of this, but I find the total silence from Ranka shippers... amusing.

If you are pointing one of your finger into my direction because I have been very defensive about Ranka, then I have to dissapoint you

My computer(s) broke down but I'm back. I'll give ya a cookie for the translation. I also have some points to discuss but I'll keep quiet for now and let other start the discussion round

[raile]

I still found the whole idea of how Ohnogi had been saving up on that blank-named mini-script he had been obsessing for some time for years, not knowing when he'd ever use it or for what series, only to finally make use of it for Alto and Sheryl really really something. :P

[Teletha]

Originally Posted by DeX-kun

Nothing much really, there were a lot of scenes in the series that were misunderstood. I'm pretty sure I've said this a couple of times before as well.

Fair enough. Yes, lots of misunderstandings. I can't recall who was the most vocal "this is a love confession and Sheryl's plane meant she knew he loved Ranka." fans though. I think many have gone into hiding when they didn't get their ideal end.

Ep. 25 notes might be more interesting for Ranka fans.

[magnuskn]

Indeed, raile. Kawamori can tell himself what he wants... Ohnogi did define the relationship between episodes 18 and 24. What Kawamori did was too little, too late... I guess he knew that he could not throw the relationships all the way back to a triangle. The momentum build up by Sheryl and Alto was so ludicrous, and Ranka was so far behind, that it was clear who would end up as a couple at the end. Ranka can be the "little sister" to Sheryls "older sister", but she won´t have Alto, except as another "big brother".

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Teletha

Fair enough. Yes, lots of misunderstandings. I can't recall who was the most vocal "this is a love confession and Sheryl's plane meant she knew he loved Ranka." fans though.

And it is interesting how quickly some of those opinions change. For people who can only read subtitles, it is easy to misunderstand the meaning, but for someone who can understand Japanese, well, its not that simple. Yet, even after conveying what may be lost in translation, it would appear hardcore shippers would rather believe in their own fabricated truths. That is fine, but now this is fact, deal with it.

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Indeed, raile. Kawamori can tell himself what he wants... Ohnogi did define the relationship between episodes 18 and 24. What Kawamori did was too little, too late... I guess he knew that he could not throw the relationships all the way back to a triangle. The momentum build up by Sheryl and Alto was so ludicrous, and Ranka was so far behind, that it was clear who would end up as a couple at the end. Ranka can be the "little sister" to Sheryls "older sister", but she won´t have Alto, except as another "big brother".

Look, its obvious that I am biased towards Ranka since the beginning, that is no secret, but Kawamori did not even attempt to make her more likable and instead, forged a rather repulsive character.

When Ohnogi pointed out that Kawamori had spoiled her, he was just pointing out the obvious. Consider how Ranka was set up, consider how, in many situations conveniences were just handed to her, not to mention this trend begun as early as episode 5. Now, after Ranka had been handed everything, Kawamori had the nerve to suddenly go, oh-shit, I am lost, and I don't know what else I can do with her. If that is not a failure on an epic proportion, I don't know what that is.

And remembered how it fared based on popular opinion? I only have one word, atrocious. For something this grand, Macross Frontier was at an all-time-low amongst polls and ratings. It did not pick itself up until Ohnogi came on board. I had nightmares thinking that Macross Frontier would end up just like Seven, and I was depressed thinking that this might be just the end to my childhood's favorite. After all, every Macross following PLUS fared poorly in numerous aspects, and I be damned if Macross Frontier ended the same way. Looking back, I am glad Ohnogi went on board. This man salvaged the franchise for the rest of us.

- Tak

[Natsuki Hyuga]

Originally Posted by Mei19

I've been meaning to ask. What are liner notes? Is this MBS radio with Bobby Margo still running? There was a Macross radio show with Alto, Ranka, Michael as hosts. But wasn't aware of this one.

That's because liner notes aren't exactly Radio show program I'm not really too sure about this, but someone told me that liner notes are usually commentary that is included in DVD/Blu-Ray version of certain series.

We also need to confirm her escapade in 21, did she or did she not tell Brera-kun?? lmao

Why do we need to discuss that anyway? It can be planned, it can be not planned, it could be bad execution phase. It's not like it change the plot anyway... And character portrayal wise, if it's not planned... Actually that just degenarate Ranka's characterization into "spontaneous girl" ...

(Yes you all just keep bugging my mind when you were arguing that )

What are the audience reactions when she betrayed Frontier and stuffs.[

... Why not visit Macross BBS, 2ch and the others? It's not like the producer would want to tarnish certain characters good name if their actions were probably the most controversial of all things. I mean, have you truly ever seen a director/producer/staffs comments about certain characters' bad reputation? *coughKazukicough*

P.S: Please don't give me tl;dr. This is just a common sense when the creator doesn't want to talk bad of her characters. I mean, it's not like we don't know about people's reaction, and the silence from "the fans feel for her" comment is really telling me something And no, I still think Ranka is one of the popular characters just... Less likened now after lotsa of episode fiasco? :'D

[raile]

The ironic thing is, even though Ohnogi salvaged the series, he is the one blamed for the shitty aspect of Macross Frontier. (A certain someone rants about that in MW)

[justavisitor]

Originally Posted by Tak

And it is interesting how quickly some of those opinions change. For people who can only read subtitles, it is easy to misunderstand the meaning, but for someone who can understand Japanese, well, its not that simple. Yet, even after conveying what may be lost in translation, it would appear hardcore shippers would rather believe in their own fabricated truths. That is fine, but now this is fact, deal with it.

So you mean all ppl who know japanese will have the same opinion as you?? I don't want to start any war here, but I think even japanese viewers will have diverse opinion on that scene in ep 23 right??

Well of course I can only read subtitle...I think Alto does talks about Ranka is important to him...Sheryl thinks Alto only loves Ranka, but Alto loves Ranka and Sheryl also...and he shows it in ep 24 (to Sheryl) and ep 25 (to Ranka and Sheryl)...it really doesn't contradict to anyone and I wonder why ppl say how some of those opinions easily change or ppl go on hiding because they don't have the ideal scene they want....Because Sheryl misunderstanding doesn't mean Alto has to love Sheryl only, he can love both girls, and since he cares about other girl, of course he can talk about that other girl (Ranka) in ep 23

just curious, again, no intention to start any war here

[Teletha]

Originally Posted by Mei19

Why did she keep saying Alto didn't hear her. I'm tired of speculations I want official commentaries now. Too bad we don't have access to those.

It's been a while, but I always thought that was obvious. She was saying he didn't understand her, didn't see she was suffering and didn't attempt to see past his anger to trust her and see what she was saying. He would rather point a gun at her then to listen to her when she ran away. This is the person he claims he wants to protect as well. Part of it was also she was singing solely for him and he never heard her song. He never made a move to acknowledge her feelings for him. The only person who truly understood her was Brera, not Alto.

Originally Posted by justavisitor

So you mean all ppl who know japanese will have the same opinion as you?? I don't want to start any war here, but I think even japanese viewers will have diverse opinion on that scene in ep 23 right??

Well of course I can only read subtitle...I think Alto does talks about Ranka is important to him...Sheryl thinks Alto only loves Ranka, but Alto loves Ranka and Sheryl also...and he shows it in ep 24 (to Sheryl) and ep 25 (to Ranka and Sheryl)...it really doesn't contradict to anyone and I wonder why ppl say how some of those opinions easily change or ppl go on hiding because they don't have the ideal scene they want....Because Sheryl misunderstanding doesn't mean Alto has to love Sheryl only, he can love both girls, and since he cares about other girl, of course he can talk about that other girl (Ranka) in ep 23

It's just convenient that people now admit that Alto loves Sheryl too. That's a pretty huge change. Even during episode 24 people were saying Sheryl had lost and Alto didn't have feelings for her while running after her when she said she wanted to end it. No, you don't have to have the same opinion, but it's pretty obvious that the scene was a misunderstanding and we shouldn't take Sheryl's view on what he meant as fact. She thought he loved Ranka and was staying with her out of pity, when that wasn't the truth at all. That is what Sheryl fans have been saying since the episode aired.

And saying people are going into hiding is just me being facetious. There were some more hardcore fans here who vowed to show us the truth of the Ranka x Alto end, only to fail time and time again. Then fail again here when the writer of the scenes disagrees with what they say.