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Old 2009-02-27, 16:36   Link #281
hakisak
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Give the man a cookie! That is what I have been saying all along. He has the least experience out of everyone. (Some achievement they have, overpowering him momentarily...)
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Old 2009-02-27, 16:48   Link #282
saravis
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Originally Posted by hakisak View Post
Hahaha.. *bleeds a little*

I am actually very serious...Just waiting for someone else who is also serious. Go ahead...get deep. Watch how serious I get. I spend, way to much time on it... (Don't complain about post length when I am, either)
Nah, I really don't have anything, unless its like I had said before. This is a sign, though a rather subtle one, that Ichigo is digging deeper and deeper into his Hollow side and when he digs too deep, Hichigo will climb over Ichigo (metaphorically) and announce his return. Something major is going to happen in this fight, it has to, we've had too much setup, expectations are too high, for it to just end up being a resolve victory. Ichigo is just going to keep pounding that brick wall until he is either broken and bruised or some solution shows itself. I wouldn't be surprised if when Hichigo does make his return that Ichigo accepts some sort of unification like with Zangetsu against Kenpachi. Its all just speculation on my part, who knows.
Oh and I almost forgot
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Old 2009-02-27, 16:48   Link #283
Lady Luna
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Exactly, hakisak.

Imagine Ichigo, if he was in a fight with Ulquiorra after a few years of work on his skills instead of his ability based on the fact that the has been flying by the seat of his pants from one fight to the next for the past several months of his life. I think he's doing a phenomenal job. What...has it been around 6 months? Or less? I'm not even sure what month it's supposed to be in the manga now, anymore.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:01   Link #284
Kyo69
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Things are getting very interesting. Ulquiorra lost his temper and Ichigo is already all beaten up. But I have a bad feeling about all of this. And when I say bad I mean Orihime dying or something like that. And as much as I hate to say it, Ulquiorra is probably going to die too.

The vizards will probably show up after this. Come to think of it, there's 5 captain-vizards and 6 evil guys in Karakura.

hakisak & Lady Luna whell, I think Ichigo is going to beat up Ulquiorra now. In all of his fights he's had near death experiences. It always looks incredibly bad at the begining but then he's somehow manages to make it.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:01   Link #285
Slayne
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Hollow Ichigo please. I need to hear (read) that cackle.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:13   Link #286
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I have the feeling that something terrible is going to happen to Orihime, espeically after Ishida's narritive. Hopefully it won't be like what happened to Hinata in Naruto, but I have the feeling it's going to be something of the sort or Kubo will have to change it so people don't think he's stealing from Naruto.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:19   Link #287
Kakashi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hakisak View Post
Give the man a cookie! That is what I have been saying all along. He has the least experience out of everyone. (Some achievement they have, overpowering him momentarily...)
Momentarily...as in 7 chapters?

Well done for saying that all along, it's a nice escape clause for every time he gets owned.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:20   Link #288
Casshern
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If it all comes down to his lack of experience then speed should be the last of his concerns. Instead of trying to keep up with his opponents' speed he would be saying "damn, I can't block a single attack because I have hardly any experience in swordfighting" or maybe "oh no, my getsuga tensho isn't powerfull enough because I haven't had years to master it" but instead it's the opponents speed that gives him trouble, which doesn't make sense because with tensa zangetsu Ichigo's speed should be his strongest point.

You're saying that these opponents have hundreds of years more experiance than Ichigo, and yet their swordfighting skill is the same while their speed is much greater than Ichigo's. It should be the other way around! I'm not trying to portray Ichigo as weak, I'm trying to say that the way Kubo is portraying Ichigo doesn't make any sense, at least not to me...

As far as I'm concerned, Tensa Zangetsu + shyunpo should be the fastest thing in bleach. I can understand having trouble keeping up with Grimmjow, since his release was also designed for speed, but what is Ulquiora's particular ability? Speed again?
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:26   Link #289
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Originally Posted by hakisak View Post
Give the man a cookie! That is what I have been saying all along. He has the least experience out of everyone. (Some achievement they have, overpowering him momentarily...)
If you think about it he has had quite a lot of experience, he trumped high level opponents, 3rd seats, normal shinigami, arrancar, hollows that all adds up in terms of experience so he isn't as inexperienced as you portray him.

Also Casshern, he is quite good when it comes to swordfighting, in fact he is almost a master in basic swordfighting, he had training with Urahara and all the sword fights he has had should mean that he has swordfighting mastered the thing is just swordfighting means shit unless its against someone like Nnoitora otherwise you will die against everyone else. Ulquiorra is quite fast and looking at how fast Stark is it could be as you get higher in ranks it grows.
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:38   Link #290
kk2extreme
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satan ulquiorra is awesome

ulq > byakuya for now
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:40   Link #291
saravis
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Originally Posted by Casshern View Post
If it all comes down to his lack of experience then speed should be the last of his concerns. Instead of trying to keep up with his opponents' speed he would be saying "damn, I can't block a single attack because I have hardly any experience in swordfighting" or maybe "oh no, my getsuga tensho isn't powerfull enough because I haven't had years to master it" but instead it's the opponents speed that gives him trouble, which doesn't make sense because with tensa zangetsu Ichigo's speed should be his strongest point.
Speed is his strongest point, but that doesn't mean his speed is better than his opponents. Speed is as much a part of training as ones capabilities with a sword.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cub-Sama View Post
If you think about it he has had quite a lot of experience, he trumped high level opponents, 3rd seats, normal shinigami, arrancar, hollows that all adds up in terms of experience so he isn't as inexperienced as you portray him.
I don't think that anyone here, at least I'm not, is saying that he doesn't have any experience, its just that he doesn't have anywhere near the experience of his opponents and when I mention experience, training should be mentioned as well. How long did he train with Urahara and Yoruichi, I don't remember the specific length, but I do remember it wasn't even a year, compare that to the enemies he has fought so far, even Renji, who went to school for the specific task of learning how to be a Shinigami. Look at Grim and Ulq, they obviously had to devour many hollows and menos, to achieve their status as either Adjuchas or VLs, how much experience did that earn them.

Whoops I forgot
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Old 2009-02-27, 17:49   Link #292
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Yes but defeating someone with more experience or even just battling with them by feeling the force of all their experience and what they know it should be like adding it onto your own because when fighting you learn new tactics etc...
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Old 2009-02-27, 18:01   Link #293
Justin Kim
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This completely changed my views upon Ichigo. Ichigo isn't dim -witted. He isn't too block - headed to understand everything. He's completely wise. Ichigo is a wise fighter, and a smart one too. He even caused Ulq to show an actual expressive feeling. Ulq's way of fighting is to mentally destroy his opponent before he kills him. The infuriation that is being expressed now currently, is obvious. Ulq is completely frustrated with Ichigo's arrogance, or rather he cannot admit that his tactics of mentally breaking down someone aren't working. It's just like the matrix if you think about it. The Smith has no clue why Neo will not stop fighting, it's only a viral program. Therefore, in relation to Ulq - Ichigo's true strength is revealed within this fight. Ulq cannot compensate nor understand Ichigo at all. Prior to Ulq's disbelief it is he, whom is losing the fight mentally. (This causes his madness). Ichigo is just really a good guy, a favorable character, one whom still has many abilities to unlock. Especially the way he can boost his exponential reiatsu when experiencing a form of resolve. Ichigo fights for his friends, not what he believes is right and wrong. He knows that he can't justify those two intermediaries. But seriously when reading this manga, one can actually account how many times Ichigo was beaten in the face by Ulq O_o. Like really, after all those blows Ichigo is still able to talk, and release his reiatsu at the tip of his sword. Hence, the explanation above of how Ichigo is a favorable character. Strong determination, never giving up, a perfect presentable portrayal of a true hero. Not one of those hyped up hero's that are ridiculously strong, and always good towards others. Ulq in fact is seriously losing it. I mean cmon he's already getting serious in this manga, that makes him lose more and more reiatsu. He's practically vulnerable now. (You can typically see why towards the end of the manga). Another factor to be accounted is, if Ichigo does - Hollow Ichigo will come out as promised... Since Ichigo can now put on the hollow mask under control, I wonder what Hollow Ichigo can do now. After all, Hollow Ichigo is just inner Ichigo but somewhat having a bit more battle experience in a barbaric form. Maybe Hollow Ichigo can form his hollow reiatsu into a sword, to increase his form even further. I would suspect that Ichigo's major strength is moderate strength with a crap load of speed. (His shunpo is rivaled with that of Byakuya, although that still remains uncertainty. Due to Byakuya's lack of fighting seriously. It's never shown what Byakuya actually does when he wants to fight an opponent seriously. His pride pretty much presents a kind of stale fight). Cub - Sama is right as well, an example that can be proven here is Ichigo's fight with Grimm. Ichigo was seriously under - powered during that fight, but eventually he learned his maneuvers or somehow his reiatsu increased a bit more. Ulq was later on able to admit that indeed Ichigo can hold his hollow form a very long time. So Ichigo gained a new skill in extending his hollow form longer. Now it seems that his hollow form is only removed, when the mask is cracked.
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Old 2009-02-27, 18:24   Link #294
saravis
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Originally Posted by Cub-Sama View Post
Yes but defeating someone with more experience or even just battling with them by feeling the force of all their experience and what they know it should be like adding it onto your own because when fighting you learn new tactics etc...
Not really, experience is gained through time and effort and only time and effort. You can't just absorb someone's knowledge and wisdom after victory, like some super power. One's experience is dependent on their own life and the interactions they have. Sure Ichigo is gaining experience through his fights, but that doesn't have anything to do with his opponents experience, its just a matter of the interactions he has and how he comes to understand them.
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Old 2009-02-27, 18:33   Link #295
DragoZERO
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Quite impressive. Perhaps the mental break down of Ulq will give Ichigo the chance he needs to defeat him. Maybe Innoue will go to him with Ishida and Ulq, in his anger, will go to attack her and then Ichigo gets his inner monologue with Zangetsu/Hichigo and destroys Ulq before he gets close to Innoue.

That would be awesome. lol.
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Old 2009-02-27, 18:40   Link #296
Cub-Sama
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Not really, experience is gained through time and effort and only time and effort. You can't just absorb someone's knowledge and wisdom after victory, like some super power. One's experience is dependent on their own life and the interactions they have. Sure Ichigo is gaining experience through his fights, but that doesn't have anything to do with his opponents experience, its just a matter of the interactions he has and how he comes to understand them.
Actually it does, if you was to fight a skilled swordsman whilst you are a newbie, they have experience by analyzing their attack patterns you should learn how to react to certain attacks, be able to mimic certain things such as how you defend. You will learn from the way they fight, as well as adapting which will help you later on.

Like Ichigo through his previous battles with Ulquiorra was able to analyze him, see attack patterns, adapt and learn how to defend accurately.

Like have you ever played or done something like play fight or play a sport and your friend does something you can't do you try to mimic it or learn how to stop them from using it against you,which is why you learn more from doing than hearing.
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Old 2009-02-27, 18:51   Link #297
AceD
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dont think i noticed anyone say this but...the last bleach chapters

# 341. The Envy
# 342. The Greed
# 343. The Gluttony
# 344. The Pride
# 345. The Sloth
# 346. The Wrath
# 347. The Lust

Full metal alchemist anyone? there all homunclous :|
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Old 2009-02-27, 19:16   Link #298
Kyo69
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They are the 7 deadly sins or something like that. Don't know much about it.
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Old 2009-02-27, 19:31   Link #299
Mr Hat and Clogs
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Full metal alchemist anyone? there all homunclous :|
>.< It's a religious reference...
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Old 2009-02-27, 19:32   Link #300
Thewanderer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voracious Hollow View Post
dont think i noticed anyone say this but...the last bleach chapters

# 341. The Envy
# 342. The Greed
# 343. The Gluttony
# 344. The Pride
# 345. The Sloth
# 346. The Wrath
# 347. The Lust

Full metal alchemist anyone? there all homunclous :|
Could say they're Digimon, too. Personifications of the 7 deadly sins aren't unheard of, so manga chapters named after them certainly isn't strange IMO.
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