2010-02-02, 04:43 | Link #1241 | |||||
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Hoooo boy.
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Furfur or Zepar. We don't know which is female. In any case, Shannon isn't Beatrice. NO ONE is specifically a single Beatrice, although I believe that Shannon was the one playing witches with Maria on Rokkenjima and the one who signed the letters. Admittedly, I have no real evidence for my theory other than "Shannon believes in magic" and "Shannon lives on/near Rokkenjima, and is thus in an easier position to solve the epitaph and find the gold, as well as dress up for Maria when she visited the island." In other words, it's a matter of convenience. But I don't go around shoving the theory in other people's faces. Not that you act like that, of course. Quote:
And what you're suggesting is that Kyrie created Little-Sis-Beato to love Battler in her place... and that she refers to him as "Battler-san" when they're in private. Um. Quote:
"I can explain Umineko perfectly!" is what you're basically saying here. No, you can't. Not a single thing I've seen in your theory is conclusive. Not a single thing I've seen in any theory here is conclusive, but at least some of them approach some measure of sense. If you want an alternative supposition, check out Renall's Love Killer theory. Quote:
Second... well. Shkannon doesn't necessarily mean DID in the way most people are using the term. Kanon, for instance, could have died long ago, and Shannon could be impersonating him either out of respect, out of grief or to get double pay, or something else like that. (He would have had to have died before Gohda was hired, though, since Shkannon easily explains one of the mysteries in Notes from a Certain Cook.) Somewhere along the way, Shannon may have deluded herself into believing that Kanon is still alive or that her faith brought him back somehow... we do know that she believes in magic. Shannontrice is classic DID though, if you go by the description of how she was created in Ep6. As for Shkannontrice... well, yeah, that's rather far-fetched. Finally, the Rokkenjima Murders don't necessarily have to be because of Battler and the horse... rather, Shannon could be a part of a group of murders (read: the servants) and having only agreed to go along with them because of the rejection and despair she felt from Battler's disappearance. It doesn't have to be about money... again, the Love Killer theory offers what I think is the best motive I've ever heard on this board. The rest is just IT'S OVER GUYS, I HAVE THE MORAL HIGH GROUND, so I won't respond to it. But that's what you want, right? |
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2010-02-02, 06:00 | Link #1242 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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I am tired to argue with someone like you.
BTW, for your information Sayo, which can be interpreted as 34, and the 34th demon (from the lesser key of Solomon) is Furfur. And Yoshiya, Yo 4, shi 4, ya, 8, 4+4+8=16, and the 16th demon is Zepar. That's why I said Shannon is Furfur. Additionally, Zepar has been using masculine form of "I" when "he" was addressing "himself". I did not create these, I read it from Umineko wiki.
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Last edited by ijriims; 2010-02-02 at 07:43. |
2010-02-02, 12:14 | Link #1245 | |
The Great Dine
Join Date: Feb 2009
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2010-02-02, 12:21 | Link #1246 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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Of course, hint is not certain at all. But are you going to disregard everything but red truth or gold truth because only they are certain?
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2010-02-02, 12:25 | Link #1247 | |
The Great Dine
Join Date: Feb 2009
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2010-02-02, 12:36 | Link #1248 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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But anyway, it was kind of important for them to be Shannon or Kanon since it implied Shakanon (a male dressing like a female). And by extension to the fight between them and Beatrice, it pointed us to Shakanontrice. I have to say it is a major deal now.
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2010-02-02, 12:51 | Link #1250 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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The problem for Erika being non-existent is: it was said in red that she beheaded the fives (amazing, a 1x teenage girl had the strength to behead five people)...unless Erika here was the name of the knife....
Or someone had to argue that furniture is not human....
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2010-02-02, 13:30 | Link #1251 | |||
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Regardless of her presence in the game, though, we can be certain she was never on Ange's (the real) Rokkenjima... the chances of her surviving her fall (being pushed?) off the boat were next to nothing. |
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2010-02-02, 14:53 | Link #1252 | |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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I said earlier that Erika didn't exclude herself from "all other people" when confirming everyone's locations, but that's not necessarily true. It's probably also reasonable to think that Battler automatically assumed she was excluded. But in that case, we've been completely fooled: since the names of the people in the cousins' room weren't listed, that means any one of them can escape so long as that person is "Erika"! |
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2010-02-02, 15:44 | Link #1253 |
Kupo
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sleeping
Age: 32
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Eh, there've been much worse manipulations of red text for the purpose of explaining something, in my opinion, and it's consistent with the way "humans" have been counted before. But it's all up to personal taste *shrugs*.
I like LyricalAura's theory. And if you can believe that all red texts referring to Kanon mean the Kanon alternate personality of Shannon, then you can certainly also stretch that and believe that all red texts referring to Erika mean the Erika/detective alternate personality of somebody else. Battler perhaps? (partially kidding, but it would actually work pretty well...Kanon too)
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2010-02-02, 19:02 | Link #1255 |
do you know ベアトリーチェ様?
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 35
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If Erika is something that transfers between characters ("detectiveness"), then it's possible that in EP1-EP4 the detective's authority can actually transfer as well. That is, her introduction is hinting at the possibility that Battler is (1.) not the only detective but also (2.) not always the detective.
Since we're headed in this direction, it's worth thinking about. |
2010-02-02, 19:08 | Link #1256 | |
The Great Dine
Join Date: Feb 2009
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2010-02-02, 19:22 | Link #1257 | |
The unlucky one
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hiding
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2010-02-02, 20:18 | Link #1258 | |
do you know ベアトリーチェ様?
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 35
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Incidentally, if people are discussing what to do in a situation, people end up going with somebody's suggestion, but not always the same person, right? The reason people always listen to Erika is because she's whoever came up with what was perceived as the "best idea" at the time (and consequently was the detective). |
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2010-02-02, 20:21 | Link #1259 |
Kupo
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sleeping
Age: 32
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The red text in EP5 regarding her "addition to the person count" is suspiciously evasive, too. All it says about the actual count is that besides her, it's the same. And as for "Furudo Erika only increases it by one person." - what did she increase? Maybe Bern and Lambda were talking about the personality count. Lambda even calls her an "extra character who appears for the first time this round". An alternate personality of somebody else/the collective family that took over for Battler?
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2010-02-02, 20:27 | Link #1260 |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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We know that Erika killed the five people who died in the first twilight of Episode 6, and the detective may not be the culprit, so whoever she was representing at the time couldn't have been a detective. That's not to say she doesn't also get to act as a mouthpiece for the best idea at the time like k//eternal said, but we shouldn't assume that means whoever she's representing is a detective in the Knox sense, at least in Episode 6. It sounds reasonable to make her a roving detective ball in Episode 5 though, since she got red text to that effect.
On the subject of Episode 5, there was a similar "all other people" usage to pin down the people in the dining room at midnight. We can extract one of those and move them to the guesthouse under cover of Erika using the same method I described before. EDIT: I wonder if we can use Knox 3 to rule out people as culprits if we can figure out who Erika was standing in for when she took actions as the detective. |
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