Code Geass R2 - Episode 9 Discussion / Poll

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

Plus if we go back to season 1, when Suzaku had him detained in Lancelot, Lulu could of gave the command like "Obey my every command, now LIVE!!"

I think it's more of "In the heat of the moment", cause really, he's about to be blown to kingdom come in any second, he probably just shoot the first thing that came to his mind

[Lowell1025]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Oh take the patent if you want, I don't care.

So....basically if the assumption that this hasn't been explained away is correct, we can say this is a massive plot hole?

Alright, now that I've said that, time to seat back and watch the Geass Defenders Cavalry make another charge at me again, I guess? And expect more negs, while I'm at it. >_>

Great! I love watching stampedes Just make sure your seat is made of titanium so you'll last long enough put up a good show

You don't have to take it as a plot hole. If everything needs to goes extreme like that then more than 98% of novels and shows also have huge plot hole in them.

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

I think it's more of "In the heat of the moment", cause really, he's about to be blown to kingdom come in any second, he probably just shoot the first thing that came to his mind

Well the scene I described can be made possible and very believable though, since Zero and Suzaku was having a short chat and when Lulu gave the order, although the situation is tense Zero's not. I can imagine my scene fit in quiet well.

[Ascaloth]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

Great! I love watching stampedes

You don't have to take it as a plot hole. If everything needs to goes extreme like that then more than 98% of novels and shows also have huge plot hole in them.

Quite true, and it's always plausible that it simply hasn't occurred to Lelouch to try using the Geass that way too. Although it's been a pretty long time for him to overlook such a possible use for a supposed genius like he is... >_>

[KrimzonStriker]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Great, I bring this up in the Spoilers and Speculations thread as a possibility, and next thing I know everyone's quoting it. -_-"

But yeah. Why not that particular command? Has he tested something like that before?

It's not a plot hole, we debated something like that a while ago. I believe the general assumption was Lelouch's own personality, he detests making someone obey him for longer then he needs too, which is why he won't give an order like that which would bend a person to his will completely. Back during the Lost Colors game when the main character pulled a maneuver similar to the one you suggest on Suzaku Lelouch ended up shooting him for it because he couldn't stand the thought of Suzaku obeying him unless it was of his own will >_>

[Lowell1025]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Quite true, and it's always plausible that it simply hasn't occurred to Lelouch to try using the Geass that way too. Although it's been a pretty long time for him to overlook such a possible use for a supposed genius like he is... >_>

Yeah bummer....but since we are already ignorant enough of so many imperfect things in real life, why not ignore a few more

[KrimzonStriker]

We don't need to ignore it, we brought the topic up before if you actually follow this forum completely and the above post by me was the basic conclusion for it if you care to read <_<

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

Well the scene I described can be made possible and very believable though, since Zero and Suzaku was having a short chat and when Lulu gave the order, although the situation is tense Zero's not. I can imagine my scene fit in quiet well.

Actually, Zero was freaking out (Maybe not exactly, but you get the idea). He was yelling anything he could to get through to Suzaku.

[KrimzonStriker]

Is anyone going to actually read and assimilate what I just posted?

[Lowell1025]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

We don't need to ignore it, we brought the topic up before if you actually follow this forum completely and the above post by me was the basic conclusion for it if you care to read <_<

That argument only apply to Suzaku.

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Actually, Zero was freaking out (Maybe not exactly, but you get the idea). He was yelling anything he could to get through to Suzaku.

hum....you are right, he was leaning more toward what you described. Darn XD

[Ascaloth]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

Is anyone going to actually read and assimilate what I just posted?

Here, how about this for an answer;

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/imag...Large%2026.jpg
"Checkmate, you win."

I really can't be bothered to continue arguing with you.

EDIT: I fail at thumbnails. -_-

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

hum....you are right, he was leaning more toward what you described. Darn XD

There there now, nobody's perfect XD

[Lowell1025]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Here, how about this for an answer;

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/imag...Large%2026.jpg
"Checkmate, you win."

I really can't be bothered to continue arguing with you.

EDIT: Give me a moment while I go figure out how thumbnails work...

More chess.....T_T

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

There there now, nobody's perfect XD

OooOOOo So you've also stared at phone pad wondering why the "AC" button was not on there?

[KrimzonStriker]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

That argument only apply to Suzaku.

And why is that? Have you seen Lelouch do that with anyone he's Geassed before? So why can't this work for anyone else as well? What stops it from applying? And can you give me an alternative answer for everyone else? Doesn't it fit his personality to have a Geass that enforces his will but a character that re-frames from doing so, needing power to fight power in order to protect the weak and all that >_>

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Here, how about this for an answer;

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/imag...Large%2026.jpg
"Checkmate, you win."

I really can't be bothered to continue arguing with you.

EDIT: I fail at thumbnails. -_-

Unlike Lelouch, I don't re-frame from snatching victory no matter how it's handed to me and then stomping on my opponent when he's down in order to make him regret it

[Lowell1025]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

And why is that? Have you seen Lelouch do that with anyone he's Geassed before? So why can't this work for anyone else as well? What stops it from applying? And can you give me an alternative answer for everyone else? Doesn't it fit his personality to have a Geass that enforces his will but a character that re-frames from doing so, needing power to fight power in order to protect the weak and all that >_>



Unlike Lelouch, I don't re-frame from snatching victory no matter how it's handed to me and then stomping on my opponent when he's down in order to make him regret it

From what you described, he'd try to sway and convince those people to put their guns to their heads and shoot themselves. He would not geass them to do it, cuz that way they didn't do it out of their own will

Hey wait a minute...why am I taking this stampede for Ascaloth *runs off*

[KrimzonStriker]

Originally Posted by Lowell1025

From what you described, he'd try to sway and convince those people to put their guns to their heads and shoot themselves. He would not geass them to do it, cuz that way they didn't do it out of their own will

Hey wait a minute...why am I taking this stampede for Ascaloth *runs off*

Notice that he had them kill themselves instead of forcing to obey his will forever or something. In this case, Geass is nothing more then a weapon, such a thing would be no different if he had shot them himself, which in a sense is what he did. To kill someone, or for Lelouch to use Geass in the way he does is a means of disregarding a persons will, but not as a means of enforcing or enslaving them or else he would have made it out to be much longer then what he normally commands, at the same time the option is still open for him but he refuses to utilize it, can you give a better explanation?

Ah, you ran, a wise decision in any event

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

Great, I bring this up in the Spoilers and Speculations thread as a possibility, and next thing I know everyone's quoting it. -_-"

But yeah. Why not that particular command? Has he tested something like that before?

Sunrise didn't say it outright, but the hint from known answers that were given is that enslaving people isn't a line Lulu is willing to cross. Geass is just one of the many tools Lulu has, and he doesn't want to depend on it.

Think of the alternative; Without this mental restriction, Lulu could simply enslave everyone and anyone he meets and overwhelm Britannia through sheer numbers. That would not make much of a story, and also makes Lulu entirely unsympathetic.

[Kaze]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

Notice that he had them kill themselves instead of forcing to obey his will forever or something. In this case, Geass is nothing more then a weapon, such a thing would be no different if he had shot them himself, which in a sense is what he did. To kill someone, or for Lelouch to use Geass in the way he does is a means of disregarding a persons will, but not as a means of enforcing or enslaving them or else he would have made it out to be much longer then what he normally commands, at the same time the option is still open for him but he refuses to utilize it, can you give a better explanation?

Ah, you ran, a wise decision in any event

*Steps in*

Well, the girl that he made make markings on the wall every day,
And maybe Suzaku's "live" geass?
And a weapon, yeah that's true, but he doesn't always kill the persons he geasses, like the shopkeeper he forced to sound the alarm in ep 3

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Nourredine

*Steps in*

Well, the girl that he made make markings on the wall every day,
And maybe Suzaku's "live" geass?
And a weapon, yeah that's true, but he doesn't always kill the persons he geasses, like the shopkeeper he forced to sound the alarm in ep 3

You are just nit-picking, especially since you know full well what we mean.

People who don't die when Geassed are only so for very specific reasons. In the case of procuring items or single simple commands, the Geass ends when the action is complete.

As for carve-tan, to be honest Lulu wasn't actually expecting her to carve forever. Anyway, she is living a relatively normal life right now, with the inconvenience of needing to be under restraints during night time. I am not justifying it or anything, just saying it is the only command of its type Lulu intentionally gave because he wanted to know what it would do.

And I refuse to talk about the "Live" Geass. You know very well it wasn't done to enslave anyone, so that was pointless.

[Kaze]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

You are just nit-picking, especially since you know full well what we mean.

Ah, you got me
I was just trying to go with the mood though

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

As for carve-tan, to be honest Lulu wasn't actually expecting her to carve forever. Anyway, she is living a relatively normal life right now, with the inconvenience of needing to be under restraints during night time. I am not justifying it or anything, just saying it is the only command of its type Lulu intentionally gave because he wanted to know what it would do.

Lelouch was testing how long the effect would last, he was expecting it to last long, but I guess not this long

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

And I refuse to talk about the "Live" Geass. You know very well it wasn't done to enslave anyone, so that was pointless.

Helping another could also be seen as hurting the other.

Lelouch wanted to help Suzaku (Very, very simplified explanation)
but Suzaku wanted to die in the line of duty, but now he ends up saving his life each time, it could be seen as "enslavement" in Suzaku's eyes though, but Let's just stop it at that, no point in 3 pages long quote wars

[KrimzonStriker]

Originally Posted by Nourredine

Helping another could also be seen as hurting the other.

Lelouch wanted to help Suzaku (Very, very simplified explanation)
but Suzaku wanted to die in the line of duty, but now he ends up saving his life each time, it could be seen as "enslavement" in Suzaku's eyes though, but Let's just stop it at that, no point in 3 pages long quote wars

Doesn't this sound like something your best friend or your mom would do because they care? Often times people don't know what's best for you because they aren't you, but at the same time can you really say you know what's best for you on every aspect of your life?

But yes, let's stop, I'm getting kind of tired of this myself