[Manga] Chapter 515 Discussion

[Rahan]

Originally Posted by Fran~

Just go to Kakashi Gaiden and see how Minato Team acts and how Konoha's yellow flash did things. I think that is the way Kishi will do things here. With thousand of soldiers and not only 1 on 1s.

Well, Kishi is already queuing the 1 on 1 fights ... This is not going to be Kakashi Gaiden for sure.

1vs1 or 1vs2 that can't be avoided

Neji + Hinata vs Hizaishi
Shikamaru (+ Chouji ?) vs Asuma
Shizune vs uncle Danny
Gaara vs his father
Sasori vs Kankurou
Kurotsuchi and her father against her brother Deidara
Suigetsu vs Zabuza (Yes Kishi will waste time bringing back Suigetsu to the spotlight)
Juugo vs Kimimaro

That's already one third of the zombies who are due medium sized fights (3/4 chapters long). And those zombies are among the less important ones. The likes of Itachi, Nagato, Hanzou, Yagura will get bigger and longer fight.

[Fran~]

As i said.... isn't like those battles would be boring...
If we think about it, isn't like we don't know the outcome of those battles, the point is, the way that outcome will happen.

Come on... Neji+Hinata vs. Hizashi?... Hyuuga's combat style is by far one of the coolest. The few seconds that Hinata faced Pain, it wasn't bad.

The thing that Kishi must avoid to not become this in the KT's Arc from Bleach, is the extend of the battles. But... Ninja's skills are way more eyecatching than Shinigami's skills.

[Knjaz]

Kabuto the Lord of the Dead? Kabuto the Necromancer? Kabuto the Lich King?))) how should we call him now lol.

Anyway, awesome chapter.

[Rahan]

Originally Posted by Fran~

As i said.... isn't like those battles would be boring...

Well, some of them should be good. The problem, and I repeat it since it was apparently not clear in my first post is not that there are irrelevant side fights, but the queue of 25 irrelevant side fights that will take forever to resolve.

25 !
You guys don't seem to realize it. This number is even more ridiculous than Konan 600 billions of explosive tags.

[Kafriel]

^I'm expecting team matches and off-screen fighting, that should get it down to 8, depending on the zombie army's strength.

[Fran~]

Hmmm... when the sand invaded konoha we saw a lot of battles in a short period of time, i will give Kishi some credit... even in Pain's Arc, the extension of battles weren't that long (not like Bleach, to stick to the point). OTOH SS Arc had a lot of battles, but they were more or less the same:
Ichigo vs. Ikakku
Ichigo vs. Renji
Ichigo vs. Kenpachi
Ichigo vs. Byakuya

I think we get the point Kubo

Here we will have a different array of powers, styles and skills... so...

Kishi please don't let me down

[Mr. DJ]

Originally Posted by Fran~

yes... that is Danzou...

Hanzo but yeah...I thought they said he was just in hiding? unless I read a wrong scan...kinda hard to believe for him to die off screen to Pain when he took on Jiraiya, Tsunade and Orochimaru and won.

[Fran~]

Ahh... my bad there

[Poetic Justice]

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't believe Kishi only does 1vs1. He does them better than team battles and they do often slowly disassemble to duels, but Team 10 vs Hidan/Kakuzu was an example of a team fight, as was Sasuke/Naruto vs Zabuza or Danzou's henchmen vs Madara or Team Raikage vs Sasuke.

Most of the fights in the series have been 1 vs 1, Team 10 vs hidan/kazuku was actually just shikamaru/hidan and naruto/kazuku. The others were just cameos without a complete result. Kishi has never demonstrated that he can write good team battles anyway.

Also, why is fanservice inherently seen as bad? Aren't you supposed to please your base?

Fanservice not bordering on the lines of ludicrous nonsense is fine with me, I was actually fine with only the akatsuki being revived, This us just a whole new level of stupidity.

You make it sound like anyone who likes this turn of events is just as brainless.

You're jumping to conclusions there.

Users like Dede and many others have been very critical of disaffecting the original genin teams at the start of Shippuuden. Shikamaru might have been spared, but the rest suffered a big hit in terms of presence. I remember several people being displeased by the fact that the story now seemed like it was constantly revolving around Sasuke.

There were a ton of better ways to focus on other characters without resorting to zombie mode,It all comes back to Kishi's horrible planning for the story. When you write yourself into a corner like he had, And realised that he's near the end of the series and has to give the old characters a final farewell fight. It leads him to end up relying on this cheap mode of writing.

[Haak]

I'm going to remain optimistic. I think Kishimoto is good enough to make it into a massive war without making it into a a shit load of 1v1 fights. The reason that I say this is that the only new thing 1v1 fights will have to offer is the emotional impact on the good guys. If Kishimoto wants to make these fights interesting for everyone then he's going to have to create new techniques for all the characters and i think that'll be a massive challenge for him, that's entirely unneccessary.

However, if he does go with the 1v1 fights, i will be severely disappointed. He will have turned the manga into another Bleach.

[james0246]

^It need not be "horrible planning", Kishimoto could actually think this is good storytelling/fun action, and he could have planned this all along.

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by james0246

^It need not be "horrible planning", Kishimoto could actually think this is good storytelling/fun action, and he could have planned this all along.

What about all of Kishi's previous statements in interviews where he says he doesn't really consider where the plot will be headed in the future??

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Poetic Justice

What about all of Kishi's previous statements in interviews where he says he doesn't really consider where the plot will be headed in the future??

Plot is character and story, and we all know Kishimoto has no idea why the characters act, but he has generally been quite consistent with the story. Kabuto's story is a long one, but it can end quite well with the current machination of a Snakeman with primo summoning abilities.

[Bombo]

I'm so excited after reading this chapter...

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by james0246

Plot is character and story, and we all know Kishimoto has no idea why the characters act, but he has generally been quite consistent with the story. Kabuto's story is a long one, but it can end quite well with the current machination of a Snakeman with primo summoning abilities.

I really don't think he intended for kabuto to use shinra tensei to revive so many old characters back when kabuto was first revealed to have absorbed Orochimaru.

[james0246]

^Kabuto was always as malicious a Scientist as Orochimaru, and he is a consummate researcher/investigator (as is Orochimaru). Once he added Orochimaru to the mix, which came with a similar set of ideas as well as some unique abilities/techniques, you get Kabutomaru and the use of Edo Tensei.

For me at least, it all tracks and follows in a consistent manner that lends credence to the notion it was always planned (and if it wasn't, it was still well put together).

[Kafriel]

I'm still expecting Kabuto's plot to go Castlevania and have an eventual Orochimaru takeover. Perhaps reviving this many wasn't part of the original plan, but the akatsuki could have been; that was Kabutomaru has control of Madara's former organization and knows his innermost secrets, might as well stab him in the back while he's at it.

[Shiryuu]

The match-ups are pretty much confirmed. The reason Kabuto wanted Yamato's info is so he knows which zombie will mess with the named characters minds.

[Fran~]

Kabuto is looking revenge, that's all, he even brought that casquet to Madara who got disturbed...

wanna bet who is in that casquet?.

[Marvx360x]

Anyone feeling a Yondaime vs Naruto here? If all the Kages got resurrected that means Yondaime got aswell since he never made it in during the Chuunin exams.