AnimeSuki Forums

tetsuo69 · 2006-06-14, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by RX-78GP04G Gerbera

Well from all the discussion in the little thread about whether or not Kira was a Newtype, it seems he is not and thus, could not normally control a DRAGOON system.

well it may not be offcial but he does displays the same abilities as rau/Mwu just that Fukuda havent made it official. we might get an awnser to that in the Movie as we never got any awnser as to why he felt minerva Crew in ep 12 when shinn went seed mode, the time in ep 23 with mwu,ep 32 again with mwu, ep 34 right b4 shinn stabs Freedom, ep 39 the NT C,E flash, and at the end of the series all those NT flashes and chatting with Rey via C.E newtype powers. while this may only be BS from Fukuda giving more abilities to kira but all this happen and for some reason. and if it didnt meant anything why isnt athrun having those flashes and feeling other people?

anywayz my question was if its official that Strike freedoms dragoons are the same as legend which dont need some1 like Rau or mwu .
so lets leave kira aside as it hasnt been official said that he isnt or is a newtype in the C.E timeline.

tritoch · 2006-06-15, 00:33

I like Funnels since when you want to transfer liquid stuff to another container using funnels is the easiest way.

Dragoons on the other hand, have no vertical tolerance and has jump range of 8. Observes wpn dmg and wpn element.

SNT1 · 2006-06-15, 00:41

^what... the hell >:P

Wikipedia (omfgwtf, burn me now) says Legend have a 'similar' DRAGOON system as S-F...

tritoch · 2006-06-15, 00:43

They do. Super DRAGOONs, Rey isn't special like Rau.

M_Flores · 2006-06-15, 01:38

BTW, what makes them Super DRAGOONS? Is the fact that they're longer or bigger make them more powerful?

tritoch · 2006-06-15, 01:43

Uhm. Isn't it because of the new technology that made DRAGOONs compatible with normal pilots i.e: no heighten spatialed awareness like Providence DRAGOONs system needs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wikipedia.com

”Super” DRAGOON units, each mounting one beam assault cannon. These units seem to use the newer ZAFT technology which allows pilots lacking enhanced spatial awareness to operate remote weapons.

On a similar note, does Akatsuki uses the Olde DRAGOON system or the "SUPER" DRAGOON system? Since the Akatsuki was developed in Seed and not in GSD.

C.A. · 2006-06-15, 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by tritoch

On a similar note, does Akatsuki uses the Olde DRAGOON system or the "SUPER" DRAGOON system? Since the Akatsuki was developed in Seed and not in GSD.

According to MAHQ, Akatsuki uses DRAGOONs, but at the same time the site also says legend uses DRAGOONs, only SF has Super DRAGOONs.

MagikalFly · 2006-06-15, 02:12

screw all that, bit mobile suits from X wins. Having control of an entire squadron of full on mobile suits...especially ones armed with satellite cannons.. Bits, funnels, and Dragoons can move and blast as fast and as much as they want but 15 satellite cannon blasts ain't nothing to f* with.

monster · 2006-06-15, 02:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagikalFly

screw all that, bit mobile suits from X wins. Having control of an entire squadron of full on mobile suits...especially ones armed with satellite cannons.. Bits, funnels, and Dragoons can move and blast as fast and as much as they want but 15 satellite cannon blasts ain't nothing to f* with.

In my opinion bit mobile suits are the least powerful compared to the other remote weaponries because they're just like having multiple mobile suits. And funnel/DRAGOON users have been shown to be able to deal with multiple large enemies. Also the satellite cannon takes time to charge, that's enough time for a funnel or DRAGOON to take a shot.

MagikalFly · 2006-06-15, 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by monstert

In my opinion bit mobile suits are the least powerful compared to the other remote weaponries because they're just like having multiple mobile suits. And funnel/DRAGOON users have been shown to be able to deal with multiple large enemies. Also the satellite cannon takes time to charge, that's enough time for a funnel or DRAGOON to take a shot.

What about range? It'll take time for a bit or funnel or dragoon to come close enough to hit. With the satcan's blast..it's so huge..you don't have to be EXACT on. Plus, when's the last time you saw a bit/fun/drag blow up an entire satellite? Or was it a colony, I forget. It's like a 9mm handgun. Sure it's fast and you can move easily with it but...against a missile...

C.A. · 2006-06-15, 02:35

I think the G-bits are extremely powerful, they're not just extra mobile suits. They are multiples of the newtype pilot. Imagine Amuro Ray with G-bits, it would pwn everything.

The G-bits are more than mobile suits because the mind can coordinate them with more accuracy than an army of mobile suits can coordinate an order. Also the G-bits are very agile and efficient, they are literally gundams, just different heads and have no cockpits. Having no pilot is also a bonus because you don't need to limit the movements of the mechs to the pilot's G-force limits etc. You can even say the pilot probably would pilot its own suit less effectively compared to the G-bits.

Vallen Chaos Valiant · 2006-06-15, 02:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagikalFly

What about range? It'll take time for a bit or funnel or dragoon to come close enough to hit. With the satcan's blast..it's so huge..you don't have to be EXACT on. Plus, when's the last time you saw a bit/fun/drag blow up an entire satellite? Or was it a colony, I forget. It's like a 9mm handgun. Sure it's fast and you can move easily with it but...against a missile...

I know it's never been done in any of the Gundam universes...

But how about an "Independence-day" style funnel-ram? A single funnel slamming into the muzzle of the charging cannon can potentially give the cannon user a bad day...

monster · 2006-06-15, 02:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagikalFly

What about range? It'll take time for a bit or funnel or dragoon to come close enough to hit. With the satcan's blast..it's so huge..you don't have to be EXACT on. Plus, when's the last time you saw a bit/fun/drag blow up an entire satellite? Or was it a colony, I forget. It's like a 9mm handgun. Sure it's fast and you can move easily with it but...against a missile...

Well I was talking about mobile suit fights, of course funnels can't destroy a colony (at least, not yet anyway).

And besides, range is not really a problem when the mobile suits are fast enough to get within range quickly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.A.

I think the G-bits are extremely powerful, they're not just extra mobile suits. They are multiples of the newtype pilot. Imagine Amuro Ray with G-bits, it would pwn everything.

The G-bits are more the mobile suits because the mind can coordinate them with more accuracy than an army of mobile suits can coordinate an order. Also the G-bits are very agile and efficient, they are literally gundams, just different heads and have no cockpits. Having no pilot is also a bonus because you don't need to limit the movements of the mechs to the pilot's G-force limits etc. You can even say the pilot probably would pilot its own suit less effectively compared to the G-bits.

That's true, but I still think their size difference does matter in this case. Other remote weaponries are also very fast and agile, and I'd think even more so because of their small sizes. The only possible advantage I can see for the G-Bits are their longer operative time but that won't matter much if the battle ends in a short enough time. Another thing about the size difference is that the G-Bits can't maneuver as much with the same number of Bits in a specified amount of space. And if what you say is true about a pilot being less effective in his own mobile suit, then that just gives more chance of an opening to get a shot at the controlling mobile suit.

C.A. · 2006-06-15, 03:03

Hmmm what I mean by pilots being less effective in their mobiles suits compared to the G-bits is that even if the pilot is optimum condition, the G-bits can perform better than himself.

The pilot doesn't become weaker while controlling the G-bits, but the G-bits having the potential to be stronger than the pilot. Of course that's if the pilot is capable of doing that.

G-bits besides being capable of dodging, they can also shield themselves(GX's G-bits have shields). They are capable of both ranged and melee attacks. They can probably even parry light sabre attacks. They can also shield the pilot themselves.

In the episode where Jamil first called upon the G-bits, we saw them took down an entire fleet alone. Jamil isn't at his prime too, he also had his newtype-phobia while doing that. If some top notch newtype like Amuro of Char used G-bits, it would be insane.

monster · 2006-06-15, 03:15

Actually the G-Bits have limited armaments. The ones for Leopard has 1 arm gatling, the one for Airmaster has 2 buster rifles, and the one for X has 1 beam saber and the satellite cannon. So while it's true a powerful newtype can do much damage and protect themselves with the G-Bits, I still think he/she can do more damage and better defense with Sazabi's bits, Providence DRAGOONs, Nu's fin funnels, or Akatsuki's turret system.

C.A. · 2006-06-15, 03:26

Well, one thing is that none of us will probably ever know how exactly bits/funnels/DRAGOONs work.

1. Does the pilot think: shoot at head, right arm, left leg, backpack thrusters. And the funnels will sort themselves out and attack these parts without 2 of them executing the same command?

2. Or does the pilot have to think this way: no.1 shoot head, no.6 shoot right arm, number 3 shoot left leg, no 4 shoot backpack thrusters.

No matter how it works, it seems to be too much work for humans, or is it in this way that only newtypes can use funnels/ bits? Besides their psychic/telepathic abilities to sense over a distance, do their have faster and more efficient brains that can work multiple units together?

If G-bits work as described in no.1, the pilot probably would just need to think this way: shoot nearest target, use beam sabres when enemies are close, dodge when you(G-bit) are attacked, block any beams coming in my direction. Sounds like how AI in RTS games work.

Well, we don't know how these stuff works.

monster · 2006-06-15, 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.A.

Well, we don't know how these stuff works.

In the word of my friend Teal'c: "Indeed!"

lighthand · 2006-06-15, 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Well DRAGOONS can't be used on EARTH, bits can...Atleast the ones in Gundam X could, can't remember if the funnels were ever used on EARTH though in UC...Which ever one can be used on Earth is better because you have no limitations in it's usage (Like LEGEND does)...You don't have to always fight in space to use one of your more potent attacks...

Trying to remember if Ple vs. Ple2 in ZZ used bits or funnels in that fight that took place on Earth...., hmmm....

hmm... good point about the funnels. I too can't remember if funnels can be used on earth. But like i said it looks way way cooler than the dragoons.

lighthand · 2006-06-15, 09:13

I don't think the G-bits can really be compared to either the funnel OR dragoon. If it was to be compared I'll say it's more like the mobile dolls of Gundam Wing (albert MDs).

JanthraX^ · 2006-06-15, 09:50

What is the actual reason for DRAGOON's not being used on earth. Is it that they dont have enough manuvering thrusters to have fly in an atmosphere?

2006-06-15, 02:35	Link #31
C.A. Absolute Haruhist! Artist Join Date: Mar 2006 Age: 36	I think the G-bits are extremely powerful, they're not just extra mobile suits. They are multiples of the newtype pilot. Imagine Amuro Ray with G-bits, it would pwn everything. The G-bits are more than mobile suits because the mind can coordinate them with more accuracy than an army of mobile suits can coordinate an order. Also the G-bits are very agile and efficient, they are literally gundams, just different heads and have no cockpits. Having no pilot is also a bonus because you don't need to limit the movements of the mechs to the pilot's G-force limits etc. You can even say the pilot probably would pilot its own suit less effectively compared to the G-bits. __________________ No longer a NEET so I'll not be online as often. Ignore gender and kick sexuality to the curb! I'm a big mecha fan, who keeps playing the SRW series. When I say 'My god...', god refers to Haruhi-sama. My art album updated 11th May 2013, Science. Deviant Art: http://ca0001.deviantart.com/

2006-06-15, 03:03	Link #34
C.A. Absolute Haruhist! Artist Join Date: Mar 2006 Age: 36	Hmmm what I mean by pilots being less effective in their mobiles suits compared to the G-bits is that even if the pilot is optimum condition, the G-bits can perform better than himself. The pilot doesn't become weaker while controlling the G-bits, but the G-bits having the potential to be stronger than the pilot. Of course that's if the pilot is capable of doing that. G-bits besides being capable of dodging, they can also shield themselves(GX's G-bits have shields). They are capable of both ranged and melee attacks. They can probably even parry light sabre attacks. They can also shield the pilot themselves. In the episode where Jamil first called upon the G-bits, we saw them took down an entire fleet alone. Jamil isn't at his prime too, he also had his newtype-phobia while doing that. If some top notch newtype like Amuro of Char used G-bits, it would be insane. __________________ No longer a NEET so I'll not be online as often. Ignore gender and kick sexuality to the curb! I'm a big mecha fan, who keeps playing the SRW series. When I say 'My god...', god refers to Haruhi-sama. My art album updated 11th May 2013, Science. Deviant Art: http://ca0001.deviantart.com/

2006-06-15, 03:26	Link #36
C.A. Absolute Haruhist! Artist Join Date: Mar 2006 Age: 36	Well, one thing is that none of us will probably ever know how exactly bits/funnels/DRAGOONs work. 1. Does the pilot think: shoot at head, right arm, left leg, backpack thrusters. And the funnels will sort themselves out and attack these parts without 2 of them executing the same command? 2. Or does the pilot have to think this way: no.1 shoot head, no.6 shoot right arm, number 3 shoot left leg, no 4 shoot backpack thrusters. No matter how it works, it seems to be too much work for humans, or is it in this way that only newtypes can use funnels/ bits? Besides their psychic/telepathic abilities to sense over a distance, do their have faster and more efficient brains that can work multiple units together? If G-bits work as described in no.1, the pilot probably would just need to think this way: shoot nearest target, use beam sabres when enemies are close, dodge when you(G-bit) are attacked, block any beams coming in my direction. Sounds like how AI in RTS games work. Well, we don't know how these stuff works. __________________ No longer a NEET so I'll not be online as often. Ignore gender and kick sexuality to the curb! I'm a big mecha fan, who keeps playing the SRW series. When I say 'My god...', god refers to Haruhi-sama. My art album updated 11th May 2013, Science. Deviant Art: http://ca0001.deviantart.com/ Last edited by C.A.; 2006-06-15 at 03:44.

2006-06-15, 00:33	Link #22
tritoch 神 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Chi-town	I like Funnels since when you want to transfer liquid stuff to another container using funnels is the easiest way. Dragoons on the other hand, have no vertical tolerance and has jump range of 8. Observes wpn dmg and wpn element.

2006-06-15, 00:41	Link #23
SNT1 r0x0rz j00r b0x0rz Join Date: Jan 2006	^what... the hell >:P Wikipedia (omfgwtf, burn me now) says Legend have a 'similar' DRAGOON system as S-F...

2006-06-15, 00:43	Link #24
tritoch 神 Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Chi-town	They do. Super DRAGOONs, Rey isn't special like Rau.

2006-06-15, 01:38	Link #25
M_Flores Count of Monte Dorifto Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Isla De Monte Dorifto	BTW, what makes them Super DRAGOONS? Is the fact that they're longer or bigger make them more powerful?

2006-06-15, 02:12	Link #28
MagikalFly Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	screw all that, bit mobile suits from X wins. Having control of an entire squadron of full on mobile suits...especially ones armed with satellite cannons.. Bits, funnels, and Dragoons can move and blast as fast and as much as they want but 15 satellite cannon blasts ain't nothing to f* with.

2006-06-15, 03:15	Link #35
monster Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	Actually the G-Bits have limited armaments. The ones for Leopard has 1 arm gatling, the one for Airmaster has 2 buster rifles, and the one for X has 1 beam saber and the satellite cannon. So while it's true a powerful newtype can do much damage and protect themselves with the G-Bits, I still think he/she can do more damage and better defense with Sazabi's bits, Providence DRAGOONs, Nu's fin funnels, or Akatsuki's turret system.

2006-06-15, 09:13	Link #39
lighthand MSZ-006 Zeta Gundam Join Date: May 2006	I don't think the G-bits can really be compared to either the funnel OR dragoon. If it was to be compared I'll say it's more like the mobile dolls of Gundam Wing (albert MDs).

2006-06-15, 09:50	Link #40
JanthraX^ Ace Archer Join Date: Jan 2006 Age: 36	What is the actual reason for DRAGOON's not being used on earth. Is it that they dont have enough manuvering thrusters to have fly in an atmosphere?